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Reddit, Violentacrez, and Internet AnonymityFollow

#1 Oct 19 2012 at 9:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Warning: some language below is NSFW.

I thought this was an AWESOME article, and I'm a little ashamed it took me almost a week to hear about it (then again, I never go to Gawker). Long and short of it: one of Reddit's most notorious trolls, Violentacrez, had his identity outed with a bit of amateur sleuthing (according to the article, the author was told his real name by someone the guy knew, then listened to voice recordings from Reddit and the person by the name IRL, and finally just up and asked him). Since the posting of the article on the 12th, the guy has lost his job and Reddit seems up in arms, with a fierce pro-freedom of speech versus anti-pedophilia war going on. Some choice quotes from the article (which is here if you want to read it: http://gawker.com/5950981/unmasking-reddits-violentacrez-the-biggest-troll-on-the-web )

Quote:
I first became aware of Violentacrez last year, when controversy erupted over a section, called "Jailbait," that Violentacrez had created on Reddit dedicated to sexualized images of underaged girls.

Unlike Jailbait, which apparently sprung from a sincere interest, many of Violentacrez's most offensive subreddits were created just to enrage other Reddit users.

Some of the sections Violentacrez created or moderated were called:

Chokeabitch
@#%^jailbait
Rapebait
Hitler
Jewmerica
Misogyny
Incest

I asked if he regretted anything he had posted, now that he'd be found out. No, he said. "I would stand by exactly what I've done."

In 2010, Violentacrez hosted a legendary "Ask Me Anything" thread"—the same Q & A feature Barack Obama took part in last month. He was asked what was the creepiest thing he'd done "IRL" and delighted readers with a tale ripped out of Penthouse letters. "That'd be a tough call," Violentacrez wrote, "Perhaps oral sex with my 19-year-old stepdaughter." It was completely consensual, he claimed in the post, and went on to brag about how awesome it had been in graphic detail.

This happened over ten years ago, Violentacrez claimed. When his then-wife, the girl's mother, found out, she "got mad, then got over it," Violentacrez wrote. He says they were married for ten more years.

I asked if everything he and his son had said in their AMAs were real. As far as he could remember, he said, it was.

Both offline and online he could be either a creepy uncle, or a loyal friend and helpful guide. Violentacrez had a surprising number of friends on Reddit, for someone who once created an entire subreddit dedicated to pictures of dead teenage girls (Picsofdeadjailbait). He helped organize IRL meet-ups, where he showed up in a t-shirt with his zombie logo on it, and told everyone there to call him "VA." Attendees agreed to blur his face in any resulting pictures before posting them to Reddit. Brutsch is an internet minister, and he said he once married a pair of Redditors in real life, though they only knew him by his "clean" handle: mbrutsch.

One longtime Redditor I spoke to talked about Violentacrez with the warmth of an old college friend.

"He's a really a good guy," she said. This user was in the Arlington area for business once, and she stopped by Brutsch's house for lunch. "He has the manners of a Southern gentleman," she said. "A bunch of neighborhood kids were over playing at his house."


Anyway, it brings up a good point about how fleeting anonymity can be. You probably don't want to take your privacy for granted... and if you troll people, you might want to think twice about if you'd be comfortable with it coming out in real life!

Edit: And for the sake of discussion, what do people think of this? Should the guy have expected to remain anonymous? Is his freedom of speech impinged if he lost his job as a result of his outing?

Edited, Oct 19th 2012 11:51am by LockeColeMA
#2 Oct 19 2012 at 9:59 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah, it's a pretty disgusting read. It was a struggle for me to finish the Gawker article.

A few things:

- The guy seems like an amalgamation of all the things that are wrong and horrifying about the internet.

- Freedom of speech does not apply to employment.

- While I believe (generally) in a very loosely governed internet, there's no inherent right to anonymity here, and nobody on Reddit should be surprised/indignant when someone's identity is outed elsewhere (this seems to be their official policy now, which I agree with)

- It's not illegal to take or post upskirt shots of women? How? Why? This seems wrong.

Edited, Oct 19th 2012 12:01pm by Eske
#3 Oct 19 2012 at 10:00 AM Rating: Decent
My opinion: Don't post anything on the internet you wouldn't stand up for IRL.
#4 Oct 19 2012 at 10:03 AM Rating: Good
It depends on what his job was, honestly. 90% of jobs can be done properly even if the dude is a jail-bait-loving creep.

however.... any of the following careers probably have him justified in losing his job:

- Higher up in Girl Scouts USA
- Photographer of children's underwear
- Elementary/Middle/High School Gym Teacher
- Head coach of a youth girl's swimming and/or soccer league
- Pediatrician
#5 Oct 19 2012 at 10:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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I haven't read the article yet but the upskirt thing seems like it's at least illegal in some places. First Google hits for "arrested shoe camera"

Man tapes woman under skirt using shoe camera, arrested
Man accused of using shoe camera to try to take photos up woman's dress
Canastota man arrested for unlawful surveillance using shoe camera
Scarborough shoe camera incident a rare case of a Maine peeper going high-tech

So on and so forth...

Edited, Oct 19th 2012 11:06am by Jophiel
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#6 Oct 19 2012 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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LockeColeMA wrote:
And for the sake of discussion, what do people think of this?
I think Gawker doesn't know what trolling is.
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#7 Oct 19 2012 at 10:11 AM Rating: Decent
Eske Esquire wrote:
It's not illegal to take or post upskirt shots of women? How? Why? This seems wrong.


I read an article several years ago about this. The premise was that if you're in a public place, the reasonable expectation of privacy is much lower. Putting a camera in your shoe tip and sticking it under womens' dresses would violate that expectation, but simply taking a picture from a few feet away at a low angle might not.
#8 Oct 19 2012 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
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LockeColeMA wrote:
Should the guy have expected to remain anonymous? Is his freedom of speech impinged if he lost his job as a result of his outing?
No and no.

If he'd wanted to stay anonymous he could have. It wasn't the site that outed him, but just another reader doing a bit of an investigation.

Secondly, no one stopped him from speaking. His employer is free to unemploy him. He's free to continue posting crap on the internet.

Listening to the guy on Anderson Cooper it's amazing that he can't seem to see what, if anything, he's done that was wrong or unethical.

He was pretty proud of his trolling award. Smiley: oyvey




Edited, Oct 19th 2012 7:24pm by Elinda
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#9 Oct 19 2012 at 12:19 PM Rating: Good
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BrownDuck wrote:
My opinion: Don't post anything on the internet you wouldn't stand up for IRL.

Would you apply the same to browsing?
#10 Oct 19 2012 at 12:25 PM Rating: Decent
Allegory wrote:
BrownDuck wrote:
My opinion: Don't post anything on the internet you wouldn't stand up for IRL.

Would you apply the same to browsing?


I'm not sure I understand. I would not visit any sites I found morally reprehensible, anonymously or otherwise, if that's what you meant.

Generic **** would be an exception to the statement above, mostly because *I* don't find vanilla pornography to be reprehensible. Private, perhaps, and not something I'd like to share with friends around a case of beer or a Thanksgiving dinner, but not exactly reprehensible.
#11 Oct 19 2012 at 12:28 PM Rating: Good
Don't post child **** if you don't want to attract attention to yourself, got it.
#12 Oct 19 2012 at 12:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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BrownDuck wrote:
Private, perhaps, and not something I'd like to share with friends around a case of beer or a Thanksgiving dinner, but not exactly reprehensible.

This reminded me to contact the turkey farm about getting a fresh bird for Thanksgiving. Thanks!
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#13 Oct 19 2012 at 12:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Huh, so that's what happend to Magi.
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#14 Oct 19 2012 at 5:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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Guy's a pig. I can't seem to summon any pity for him for losing his job.

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#15 Oct 19 2012 at 7:16 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't see anything wrong with what he did. Smiley: dubious Nor do I see anything wrong with him being ousted. His identity was obtained through completely valid/legal means. It'll be a shame if he loses his job because of it, but it's something he should have expected to happen should he ever get ousted.



Edited, Oct 19th 2012 9:19pm by Deadgye
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#16 Oct 20 2012 at 1:49 AM Rating: Decent
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And here the best I can do is find varus's PII. I doubt outing him would garner me even this much fame.
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#17 Oct 20 2012 at 9:22 AM Rating: Good
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Possession of child pornography is a felony, and if you commit a felony in front of hundreds of thousands of people, you're probably gonna lose your job. Also, meeting people on the internet and requesting them to blur your face in photos isn't really 100% protecting your identity. This guy is an ****** but he's probably making enough money on the press circuit for this to have been a blessing in disguise. I even use that term facetiously because if he's on Anderson Cooper and ****, he doesn't give a **** about people knowing who he is.
#18 Oct 20 2012 at 9:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm not sure what he did rises, as it were, to the level of child ****. As I understand it he was taking young girls' photos from their Facebook pages and reposting them. Still creepy as hell.

The upskirt shots might be actionable, dunno.
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#19 Oct 20 2012 at 9:42 AM Rating: Good
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Speaking of which, I notice Youtube now makes people post comments using their real name.
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#20 Oct 20 2012 at 9:47 AM Rating: Good
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Real name based on what you entered as your real name, and you can still opt out at this time.
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#21 Oct 20 2012 at 10:39 AM Rating: Default
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Bad troll is bad. Deserves what he got. Regardless of whether or not he did it to rile people up, you must be prepared to accept the consequences, both in your Elife and your Real life.

I hate these new hipster trolls.

Edited, Oct 20th 2012 12:40pm by rdmcandie
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#22 Oct 20 2012 at 12:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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It always amuses me how many people equate "freedom of speech" to "consequance-free speech"
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#23 Oct 20 2012 at 12:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Pumpkin Lörd Kaolian wrote:
It always amuses me how many people equate "freedom of speech" to "consequance-free speech"

Yeah, like the WBC should be made to take a beating or two during their funeral protests without getting all lawsuit-y.
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#24 Oct 20 2012 at 12:49 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm actually kind of shocked that with the amount of biker gang counter protests they have pissed off so far that their cars haven't been blowing up on a regular basis.
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#25 Oct 20 2012 at 2:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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Guenny wrote:
Possession of child pornography is a felony, and if you commit a felony in front of hundreds of thousands of people, you're probably gonna lose your job.


That's all well and good, but he never posted child pornography. If you had bothered to read the article, you would know that. You would also know that he went out of his to keep child pornography off of Reddit. In fact, nothing he did was illegal in any way. Morally reprehensible, sure, but not illegal.
#26 Oct 20 2012 at 4:05 PM Rating: Good
Guy was exposed as a creep & is using "free speech" as a defense.

Sorry dude, your free speech is limited when you're exercising it on a private website. Especially when you use your "free speech" to go out of your way to be an obnoxious pervert.
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