Colorado Shooting and...Follow

Panicked civilians with firearms always make situations like that better. How foolish of me to think otherwise!

The vast majority of people who obtain a concealed carry permit go through enough training that they're one of the few people who aren't panicked in a situation like that.

Got any data to confirm this or are you just talking out of your ***?

Someone always makes that argument. From what I understand (which is all second hand and coming from this story), Colorado has some pretty lax laws in this regard. Apparently CO also has unrestricted open carry laws. I had heard someone say earlier that a patron could have brought a shotgun or rifle into the theater if they wanted, so I guess that's where that comes from.

According to this site, your training just needs to be a handgun training class within the last decade. Count me doubtful that that qualifies someone to stay cool and collected in this situation. Of course, this guy was dressed to be shot at and opened his attack with a gas canister so I rather doubt another gun going off in a crowded panicked theater would have helped things.

Edited, Jul 21st 2012 12:39pm by Jophiel

So apparently the trailer for "Gangster Squad" was supposed to be pulled from "Dark Knight Rises." There's a scene where a bunch of gangsters shoot through a movie screen and open fire on a room full of movie-goers.

When The Man and I went to see Dark Knight last night, that trailer was shown. I didn't know it was supposed to be pulled, my husband told me when it started.

I understand why they wanted it pulled... but I'm not sure that it matters. Seeing that trailer didn't make me writhe with disgust at the theater for showing it. It didn't make me burst into tears for the people who had been killed. It didn't make me hate Warner Brothers. It didn't make me storm out of the movie. Had my husband not mentioned that it was supposed to be pulled, I probably wouldn't have really connected the two, honestly.

I was curious what other people here thought about that. Do you think that trailer should've been pulled, and our theater (who apparently didn't get the memo way out here in the Pacific) is horrible for showing it?

Seems like an obvious thing to do in and around Denver or wherever else people may know any of the victims personally. Beyond that it seems like a mostly politically correct thing to do and not a particularly big deal.

That wouldn't be a lucky shot. That would be a miracle. It doesn't matter how calm you are, you're still in a theater with hundreds of other people panicking; Running and screaming and bumping into each other and into you. You're also in an extremely dark room with tear gas in the air. Most likely not enough to incapacitate you, but certainly enough to irritate your eyes and skin. And your target, in that dark room, is wearing dark clothes. Not a huge problem in a vacuum because the gun muzzle certainly is bright enough, but couple it with the other factors and the fact that he's gotta shoot first before you can get a bead on him and hope you can calculate well enough to hit him. Also most people don't really carry heavy duty pistols when they have a concealed carry permit, which means they're not exactly known for their dropping power. Here's some hindsight as well: The gunman was apparently wearing a ballistic vest and helmet.

I'm sorry for your sister but get your head out of your *** if you think that someone carrying in that theater would have magically ended the rampage. The most likely outcome would have been he'd have at best injured and panicked the gunman into spraying the entire fucking theater even more.

From what I've seen/heard/been told, the gas was thrown in the front of the theater, right in front of the screen. The gunman left then came in a side door next to the screen. Having him between the gas and the projector would have made a very nice silhouette to shoot at. And he was spraying the AK "like a sprinkler" is the quote reported. 100 round drum, 70 hit, some multiple times. I didn't hear about the shotgun or Glock being fired, only that he had them. So his hit rate was probably in the range of 90+%. Any distraction, even a 9mm to the vest, may have been enough of a distraction to save lives.

I know for a fact that if I went through gun training and got a permit, I would still panic and be totally useless. I am a wimp when it comes to things like this. Having a gun on me wouldn't have helped anyone. The only way I *might* ever be able to shoot a gun and have it be a useful gesture is if someone broke into my house and a member of my family was in danger.

Well, this certainly explains why nothing ever happens on the gun laws front. People like you are more worried about pointing fingers than anything else. Great job!

Fun Fact: Assault Weapons are Permanently banned in the state of Massachusetts.

Guess which Presidential candidate who signed that into law? Hint: Not the black guy.

And from what little bit I have heard about the theater in question, it was a "gun-free" zone. So a law-abiding citizen wouldn't have carried anyway.

How lax or strict the conceal carry laws are in Colorado is a moot point, as the guy didn't carry the weapons into the theatre normally. He exited through the emergency exit, went to his car, geared up and came back in. Whether someone else with a concealed carry permit and weapon could have stopped him is debatable. Sorry, I don't think all that uber training you get in that class is enough, as others have said it's not all that involved. Mostly it's just training about the particulars of where you can and can't carry a concealed weapon. I know, I looked into it and nearly signed up for a class last year.

Maybe some of the guys I've met at local gun ranges that participate a lot in shooting competitions and the like might be more likely to remain calm in that situation. Still, as others have said, between the panicked masses, tear gas, and full body armor of the scumbag, I'm not all that sure it would have helped. We can speculate all we want, but the fact is no one in there was equipped to do so anyway.

I saw a link to the Onion the other day that was pretty accurate as to how it will all play out.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/sadly-nation-knows-exactly-how-colorado-shootings,28857/

While satire, it's pretty spot on really.