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#52 Apr 08 2012 at 11:11 AM Rating: Decent
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The only people who'll be interested in a Tea Party acolyte as VP are the already converted.


My impression of his current staff, and he's not McCain, he'll delegate this decision pretty much entirely, is that they'll only do this if they're in real real trouble when the decision has to be made. Which is unlikely, I'd think. You have to feel that Romney's current numbers with women are near a bottom, and that's the reason he'd lose the election if it were held today. He has to tack back to the center a lot on social issues to have any chance, which he'll probably do successfully.

At that point, he probably has different weaknesses. You can rule out some people now, of course, can't be another Mormon. Probably can't be someone else from the Northeast, probably can't be a woman because of the comparisons to Palin. You'd want to shore up the brown vote if you could, Marco Rubio sounds good, but it's crazy early to speculate. No idea if he'd even be interested.
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#53 Apr 08 2012 at 11:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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I guess some of the buzz is moving over to Rob Portman now. I won't pretend to be any Portman expert -- he has a resume that makes one say "Who? Oh... huh... I guess he sounds good".

Which is probably what Romney needs from a VP pick.

Huh. I was going to link to Portman's bio and this article was the top hit. Makes a case for it, anyway.
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#54 Apr 08 2012 at 1:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
I guess some of the buzz is moving over to Rob Portman now. I won't pretend to be any Portman expert -- he has a resume that makes one say "Who? Oh... huh... I guess he sounds good".

Which is probably what Romney needs from a VP pick.

Huh. I was going to link to Portman's bio and this article was the top hit. Makes a case for it, anyway.

Ohio represent!

/gang signs
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#55 Apr 08 2012 at 2:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
Aside from Gbaji, what's the half-life of a conservative (US flavor) poster around here? Two months?


Longer than all of you.
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#56 Apr 08 2012 at 2:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
I guess some of the buzz is moving over to Rob Portman now. I won't pretend to be any Portman expert -- he has a resume that makes one say "Who? Oh... huh... I guess he sounds good".

Which is probably what Romney needs from a VP pick.

Huh. I was going to link to Portman's bio and this article was the top hit. Makes a case for it, anyway.



The picture caption was great. "While Tim Pawlenty provided a back rub" just about sums up his role. Smiley: laugh

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#57 Apr 09 2012 at 7:06 AM Rating: Good
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NPR Political editor Ken Rudin is running a contest for picking Mitt's running mate. He claims there will be prizes.

Who Will Be Romney's Running Mate?
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#58 Apr 09 2012 at 8:00 AM Rating: Good
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Sorry, I got side-tracked over the weekend.

What's the thread about now?
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#59 Apr 09 2012 at 8:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Longer than all of you.

I meant one who bothers to post about politics more deeply than blanket bitching about the air and space programs.
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#60 Apr 09 2012 at 8:27 AM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Longer than all of you.

I meant one who bothers to post about politics more deeply than blanket bitching about the air and space programs.


I've been around for a while, but only recently started posting in the Asylum. I don't think I'm going anywhere any time soon.

I also won't argue with everything anybody says, so I think that may help keep me from getting scared off.
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#61 Apr 09 2012 at 8:30 AM Rating: Good
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I'd imagine that if gbaji went away, you'd see more conservative posters expressing their views.
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#62 Apr 09 2012 at 8:33 AM Rating: Good
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Sorry, I got side-tracked over the weekend.

What's the thread about now?

Don't be fooled by the fluff. This thread is still about Mitt's mate. Smiley: mad
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#63 Apr 09 2012 at 9:03 AM Rating: Good
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Sir Spoonless wrote:
I'd imagine that if gbaji went away, you'd see more conservative posters expressing their views.


This is the poisoned well syndrome. Gbaji has been so fervent about posting his conservative views, that he has poisoned the well for everybody else. Even if someone agreed with him completely, they would be afraid to post because he has everybody else riled up against conservatives with his overbearing way of posting. For being a conservative, he sure isn't conservative with his words.

Oh, and back on the topic of the thread, I have never heard of that guy the article Joph linked is about.
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#64 Apr 09 2012 at 9:04 AM Rating: Good
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
because he (gbaji) has everybody else riled up against conservatives with his overbearing way of posting.
You give him too much credit.
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#65 Apr 09 2012 at 9:08 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
because he (gbaji) has everybody else riled up against conservatives with his overbearing way of posting.
You give him too much credit.


Maybe you give everybody else too little credit for being able to have a reasonable conversation with people who think differently than them. Or maybe I'm delusional.. Who knows?
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#66 Apr 09 2012 at 12:20 PM Rating: Good
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
because he (gbaji) has everybody else riled up against conservatives with his overbearing way of posting.
You give him too much credit.


Maybe you give everybody else too little credit for being able to have a reasonable conversation with people who think differently than them. Or maybe I'm delusional.. Who knows?

Well, like you said before - you're new here.
#67 Apr 09 2012 at 12:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Smasharoo wrote:
Marco Rubio sounds good, but it's crazy early to speculate. No idea if he'd even be interested.

He says he's not but, again, it's early April. I think the interest levels of a few potential VPs won't be real until we're closer to the convention and they see what sort of shape Romney is in. The up-n-comers won't want to hitch their wagon to a falling star and be embarrassed come November.
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#68 Apr 09 2012 at 2:51 PM Rating: Default
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Duke Lubriderm wrote:
gbaji wrote:
For example, I thought that the key platform of the Tea Party *was* fiscal conservative.
It was, I think. It got hijacked by all the racists, gay bashers, and pretty much other of the rest of the republican party that doesn't want to compromise on anything ever.


So you've been to a lot of Tea Party rallies then? Or this is just your perception based on what some liberal media source told you?
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#69 Apr 09 2012 at 2:56 PM Rating: Good
Bigdaddyjug wrote:

I also do see Romney picking a woman as his running mate simply because of the circus that has surrounded Sarah Palin for the last 4 years. As you said, it seems the left and the leftist media have a special place in their hearts for launching attacks against female conservatives.


You know, I see conservatives complain about this a lot. Both sides are just as guilty. Conservatives and Fox News viciously attacked Hillary too, y'know. I think this particular issue has more to do with a lot of men in power not wanting to share that power with women, than left vs. right.

For what it's worth, the main thing that bothered me about Sarah Palin was that she's a moron. Although I will admit, the amount of times I read or saw someone talk about how they wanted to sleep with her was pretty disturbing too, but that wasn't her fault. I mean seriously, when Joe Biden makes you look stupid, that's pretty sad.

Given what sort of things Mitt has been saying for the last year or so, I would not consider him to be a moderate conservative. He used to be, for sure. But as someone else mentioned, he tries way too hard to pander to the extreme conservatives of the party, which is something McCain was guilty of as well. Frankly I wouldn't consider any of the Republican candidates to be moderates. If you support personhood bills, that essentially make birth control illegal, if you think Pres. Obama is a socialist, if you openly declare your disdain for gay people, etc., you are not a moderate you are a right wing nut job.
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#70 Apr 09 2012 at 2:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mitt Romney said he's severely conservative. So he's either severely conservative or he's a liar Smiley: smile
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#71 Apr 09 2012 at 3:02 PM Rating: Good
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That's what the liberal media wants you to think.
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#72 Apr 09 2012 at 3:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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It might have been the lamestream media filter. I'll have to check my Palin Twitter feed for the true story.
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#73 Apr 09 2012 at 5:32 PM Rating: Good
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Liberals only like smart women.

We're all over Elizabeth Warren. She's my pretend grandmother now. Smiley: nod
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#74 Apr 09 2012 at 6:29 PM Rating: Decent
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We're all over Elizabeth Warren. She's my pretend grandmother now.


She's going to lose, badly. As impossible as it seemed to find the one candidate who could possibly lose to Brown in this election, we did. Her staff is a fucking nightmare mess of true believers and policy people.
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#75 Apr 09 2012 at 7:48 PM Rating: Decent
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catwho wrote:
Liberals only like smart women.


And smart women are all liberal, right?
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#76 Apr 09 2012 at 8:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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You betcha *wink*
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#77 Apr 09 2012 at 8:27 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
You betcha *wink*


Honestly, these days a woman would have to be pretty dumb to vote Republican.

Doesn't mean there aren't smart conservative women out there, but at the rate the Republicans keep stuffing their feet into their mouths over the contraceptives issue, a lot of them are likely to just stay home in protest in November.
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#78 Apr 09 2012 at 11:10 PM Rating: Good
I don't know if I'd go so far as to say they'd have to be dumb. Deluded is perhaps a better word for it. Or maybe they just don't care about reproductive rights. But for the most part, I'd have to agree that female Republicans make about as much sense as gay Republicans.
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#79 Apr 09 2012 at 11:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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Nah. All it takes is a lifetime of seeing liberals as evil and/or deluded, and a sense of duty regarding voting. I've known people on both sides of the aisle who would vote a straight ticket if Shai'tan himself were on the ballot.

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#80 Apr 10 2012 at 12:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Longer than all of you.

I meant one who bothers to post about politics more deeply than blanket bitching about the air and space programs.


Those are important! And don't forget the blanket bitching on critical infrastructure needs such as transportation and investment in technology and how our research money has been cut to the bone, my less than popular views on proper application of military force and when to extricate oneself from a country, Security and intel matters, Missile defense, and the occasional economic matter. Other aspects of politics I do have distinct oppinions on, but I try to limit myself to areas of political discussions where I have relevent factual input and sufficient subject knowledge to make and maintain a point. Other aspects, you aren't going to change the minds of the "true believers" anyways, so why bother rehashing the same arguments? Besides, sometimes I just want to shout "STOP HELPING!" at certain people...

So, a brief rundown of my political beliefs for anyone that cares:
1. I don't believe in marriage benifits for same sex couples.
2. I don't believe in marriage benifits for opposite sex couples. Why should us single people get screwed on our taxes?
3. If you are on welfare for an extended period of time for any reason other than major medical issues, you should be reporting to a government job site every single workday day until you find a job. There are thousands of miles of park trails that need clearing and maintaining on national forests. Government agencies need additional data entry and processing capabilty, or at least manual labor. Yes you should get time off to look for jobs, but paying people to do nothing is not cost effective.
4. Funding for our transportation infrastructure needs to be increased at the federal level to what it was in the 1950's and 1960's. Power infrastructure, water infrastructure, rail, data, gas, our deepwater ports all need to be repaired and upgraded. Right now there are zero west coast ports that can accomodate the draft of a post panamax cargo ship for example.
5. The space program is important, fully fund it. We need a heavy lift rocket capable of orbiting large objects at a reasonable cost, and once we have that, we need to start construction of a skyhook / orbital teather now that we have materials that meet the requisite tensile strength.
6. Military spending is important. Most of our larger surface ships are ageing. Especially the cruiser fleet. CG(X) needs to be revived and built. The Ford class carrier program, dispite cost overruns resulting from the development costs of CG(X) being folded into it needs to be accellerated to retire the nimitz fleet faster, due to the Billions per year in operating cost savings per ship. F-35 is overrated, we need more F-22's, we need a carrier variant F-22. we probably need more drones but they don't really replace manned combat aircraft at this time, etc. Plenty mroe where those came from.
7. The education system is underfunded, and college tuitiion is out of control, however college tuition assistance should be merit based, rather than due to ethnicity and the fact that some people don't know how to use birth control and have 50 kids. We shouldn't be rewarding that! see: "idiocracy"
8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but that choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.
9. Birth control programs, sex education, public education etc. programs that can be shown to result in overall lower costs to society should be implemented to the fullest.
10. The U.S. government should have no records of anything related to myself other than census records, birth records, tax records, employment records relating to tax purposes, and whatever else I choose to voluntarily provide, unless a judge has issued a warrent for additional information on specific cases; it should also be illegal for corporations to maintain massive profiling databases. 11. If it isn't national security, infrastructure, defence, research, education, economy or space, the government should stay the hell out of interfering with it. The govenrment shouldn't care who is sleeping with who for example.
12. Bailing out major corporations with taxpayer funds can be effective, but not at rediculous levels that mortgage the country for generations to come and eventually result in a debt load higher than total GDP for the next millenium or so. John Maynerd Keynes has much to answer for.
13. It's a @#%^ing plant, dig it up and move it over to the left a few feet so we can build the interchange. if it's an endangered animal, it will probably move out of the way before you pave over it, and if not, did we really need one of those anyways? Environmental protection is all well and good and should be persued, but some of the absolute asenine crap that people have to go through to get anything done these days is the main reason why things cost so much more to build than they did even adjusting for material cost prices.
14. Copyright law is horribly broken. we prosecute people for software license violations, when we don't even have a legal definition of what actually constitutes proof of ownership of a software license. Patent law is horribly broken. The Digital millenium copyright act is a travesty. Our supreme court is headed by technologically illiterate nincompoops.
15. the war on drugs is a massive failure due to operating under restricted warfare rules similar to vietnam. we know where they are growing the stuff, we know where they are making it. Wipe them out. Any country that doesn't is contributing to the problem. Double the coast guard budget overall, Nuke Colombia from orbit, Tell Canukistan to lock down their ports better or we will, etc.
16. All of the remainign republican candidates are @#%^ing disasters and will hand the election uncontested to Obama.
17. Obama's birth certificate is likely legitimate, he's probably not a secret muslim jihadi in communication with aliens, and he is an absolute disaster for this country. Though palin / mccain might have been worse, especially if mccain kicks the bucket.
18. The "Tea Party", whatever the origional intents were, was hijacked by radical elements early on and no longer represents any form of mainstream demographic.
19. Dinosaurs are awsome, evolution happened, I think there probably is room for some sort of influence or oversight from some sort of higher being, though I realize that is hypocrytical in certain aspects. I also try not to make a huge deal over my religous beliefs, especially in regards to politics beyond stating that the seperation of church and state should be absolute.
20. Jimmy Carter was the worst president of all time.

There, does that pretty much cover it?
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#81 Apr 10 2012 at 1:20 AM Rating: Excellent
TL;DR.
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#82 Apr 10 2012 at 2:25 AM Rating: Good
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
3. If you are on welfare for an extended period of time for any reason other than major medical issues, you should be reporting to a government job site every single workday day until you find a job. There are thousands of miles of park trails that need clearing and maintaining on national forests. Government agencies need additional data entry and processing capabilty, or at least manual labor. Yes you should get time off to look for jobs, but paying people to do nothing is not cost effective.
7. The education system is underfunded, and college tuitiion is out of control, however college tuition assistance should be merit based, rather than due to ethnicity and the fact that some people don't know how to use birth control and have 50 kids. We shouldn't be rewarding that! see: "idiocracy"
8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but that choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.
11. If it isn't national security, infrastructure, defence, research, education, economy or space, the government should stay the hell out of interfering with it. The govenrment shouldn't care who is sleeping with who for example.
15. the war on drugs is a massive failure due to operating under restricted warfare rules similar to vietnam. we know where they are growing the stuff, we know where they are making it. Wipe them out. Any country that doesn't is contributing to the problem. Double the coast guard budget overall, Nuke Colombia from orbit, Tell Canukistan to lock down their ports better or we will, etc.
3. I can agree to that, just not for a full week. Something like 2 or 3 days a week makes sense to me. Also add that you have to apply to jobs and can't say no to a job you applied for and provide proof of applications etc once a month to continue to receive welfare.
7. I'd be fine with tuition assistance being partially merit based, but only if going to college/university is affordable for anyone without accruing a crippling debt in the process.
8. While I don't like abortion, sh*t happens and the option should be there regardless. Especially with the high amount of teen pregnancies you guys have.
11. Add healthcare to that. Insofar that the government should guarantee that nobody dies because they can't afford medical bills. Keeping people healthy and productive is good and universal healthcare reduces cost of healthcare overall.
15. The war on drugs is indeed a massive failure, fighting harder isn't going to make it any better either. It'll just cost way more money and lives. Instead, legalize soft drugs, control them and tax the sh*t out of them, lots of extra income for the state, reduced spending and less people in prison, lower use of soft drugs, a larger gap between soft drugs and the much more damaging hard drugs, controlled quality and gangs lose a big ass part of their funding.

I can see your point for most things though, whether I agree with them or not.
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#83 Apr 10 2012 at 2:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Stuff
Kao's my kind of conservative on most points. Some I disagree with, others I like only when slightly altered, but generally I like what he said there and would like to subscribe to his newsletter.

His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Instead, legalize soft drugs, control them and tax the sh*t out of them, lots of extra income for the state, reduced spending and less people in prison, lower use of soft drugs, a larger gap between soft drugs and the much more damaging hard drugs, controlled quality and gangs lose a big ass part of their funding.
I'd love to see us do that, but then use the money from it to fund what war on drugs remains afterward. Kao style, but perhaps a bit less severe.
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#84 Apr 10 2012 at 6:04 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Instead, legalize soft drugs, control them and tax the sh*t out of them, lots of extra income for the state, reduced spending and less people in prison, lower use of soft drugs, a larger gap between soft drugs and the much more damaging hard drugs, controlled quality and gangs lose a big ass part of their funding.
I'd love to see us do that, but then use the money from it to fund what war on drugs remains afterward. Kao style, but perhaps a bit less severe.
Use the money to treat addicts first, no persecution, a roof over their heads and help in finding a job if they agree to get clean. Go after the producers after taking away as much of their market as possible.
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#85 Apr 10 2012 at 6:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
because he (gbaji) has everybody else riled up against conservatives with his overbearing way of posting.
You give him too much credit.
Yea, it's not his overbearing way of posting./ It's his blind craziness. He'll start on a good point, one I agree with and then go off on some strange tangent trying to rationalize it and lose me entirely. And since he typically posts in the evening (for me), I'm not here to jump in early enough and by the time I'm on and read through the thread, I've got no interest in his original point.
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#86 Apr 10 2012 at 6:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?

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#87 Apr 10 2012 at 8:24 AM Rating: Good
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Elinda wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?



If you read the whole #8, in any other case the woman made a choice to engage in the baby-making act. In the case of rape, they did not. That is the difference.
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#88 Apr 10 2012 at 8:31 AM Rating: Good
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I'm curious if having sex while using contraceptives counts as engaging in activities that result in a baby as well because if not then abortion should be ok in those situations as well. And I can't say that having sex with a 1-4% chance of becoming pregnant if you have regular sex using that kind of contraceptive is engaging in an act that results in babies.
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#89 Apr 10 2012 at 8:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?



If you read the whole #8, in any other case the woman made a choice to engage in the baby-making act. In the case of rape, they did not. That is the difference.


I suspect, though I could be wrong, that Elinda is wondering something like this:

If someone is against abortion, presumably it's because they believe that it's murder. If that's the case, but they also believe that abortion should be allowable in cases of rape, are they not then suggesting that said murder is "okay" in cases of rape? Does the woman's lack of choice in the pregnancy warrant murdering an innocent?

Something like that.

Edited, Apr 10th 2012 10:35am by Eske
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#90 Apr 10 2012 at 8:37 AM Rating: Good
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
I'm curious if having sex while using contraceptives counts as engaging in activities that result in a baby as well because if not then abortion should be ok in those situations as well. And I can't say that having sex with a 1-4% chance of becoming pregnant if you have regular sex using that kind of contraceptive is engaging in an act that results in babies.


I can't speak for Kao, but the difference to me is the consentual sex, not the attempt to make a baby.
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#91 Apr 10 2012 at 8:37 AM Rating: Good
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Rape babies have less value. Duh.
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#92 Apr 10 2012 at 8:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
Rape babies have less value. Duh.


Joph, if they haven't produced sufficient value (ie: money) to be able to not be aborted, then they, somewhat by definition, have not "earned" the right to not be aborted.
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#93 Apr 10 2012 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?



If you read the whole #8, in any other case the woman made a choice to engage in the baby-making act. In the case of rape, they did not. That is the difference.


I suspect, though I could be wrong, that Elinda is wondering something like this:

If someone is against abortion, presumably it's because they believe that it's murder. If that's the case, but they also believe that abortion should be allowable in cases of rape, are they not then suggesting that said murder is "okay" in cases of rape? Does the woman's lack of choice in the pregnancy warrant murdering an innocent?

Something like that.

Edited, Apr 10th 2012 10:35am by Eske


Oh I understand. But I also understand nobody should be forced to raise a child that is a product of rape. Could you imagine the legal implications if for some reason the rapist wasn't convicted? He could sue for custody, sue for child support. I think that is the reason a lot of people who are usually pro-life see the benefit in allowing abortions in the case of rape pregnancies.
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That's pretty much the best ninja edit ever.


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#94 Apr 10 2012 at 8:43 AM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Joph, if they haven't produced sufficient value (ie: money) to be able to not be aborted, then they, somewhat by definition, have not "earned" the right to not be aborted.

Have all of my rate-ups.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#95 Apr 10 2012 at 8:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Oh I understand. But I also understand nobody should be forced to raise a child that is a product of rape. Could you imagine the legal implications if for some reason the rapist wasn't convicted? He could sue for custody, sue for child support. I think that is the reason a lot of people who are usually pro-life see the benefit in allowing abortions in the case of rape pregnancies.


A murder of convenience, no doubt.
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#96 Apr 10 2012 at 8:45 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Joph, if they haven't produced sufficient value (ie: money) to be able to not be aborted, then they, somewhat by definition, have not "earned" the right to not be aborted.

Have all of my rate-ups.


Aw, shucks. Smiley: blush

You teed that one up for me, all I had to do was swing.
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#97 Apr 10 2012 at 8:46 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
He could sue for custody, sue for child support. I think that is the reason a lot of people who are usually pro-life see the benefit in allowing abortions in the case of rape pregnancies.

Oh, nonsense. It's a pure appeal to emotion. They want to ban all abortion but are unwilling to take the approval hit by saying a woman who just went through rape should have her situation compounded regardless of what they actually believe.
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#98 Apr 10 2012 at 8:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?



If you read the whole #8, in any other case the woman made a choice to engage in the baby-making act. In the case of rape, they did not. That is the difference.


I suspect, though I could be wrong, that Elinda is wondering something like this:

If someone is against abortion, presumably it's because they believe that it's murder. If that's the case, but they also believe that abortion should be allowable in cases of rape, are they not then suggesting that said murder is "okay" in cases of rape? Does the woman's lack of choice in the pregnancy warrant murdering an innocent?

Something like that.

Edited, Apr 10th 2012 10:35am by Eske


Oh I understand. But I also understand nobody should be forced to raise a child that is a product of rape. Could you imagine the legal implications if for some reason the rapist wasn't convicted? He could sue for custody, sue for child support. I think that is the reason a lot of people who are usually pro-life see the benefit in allowing abortions in the case of rape pregnancies.
There are lots of kids with parent(s) that don't want them or without proper parents or no parents at all, but we don't kill them. Besides, there is no shortage of people wanting to adopt babies.

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#99 Apr 10 2012 at 8:58 AM Rating: Decent
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Elinda wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Elinda wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:

8. Abortion, except in the case of rape or medical emergancy is wrong. Yes, Women have a choice, but a woman's choice ends after they make a decision to engage in activities that result in a baby.

#8 rankled me......

Why does being raped make abortion ok?



If you read the whole #8, in any other case the woman made a choice to engage in the baby-making act. In the case of rape, they did not. That is the difference.


I suspect, though I could be wrong, that Elinda is wondering something like this:

If someone is against abortion, presumably it's because they believe that it's murder. If that's the case, but they also believe that abortion should be allowable in cases of rape, are they not then suggesting that said murder is "okay" in cases of rape? Does the woman's lack of choice in the pregnancy warrant murdering an innocent?

Something like that.

Edited, Apr 10th 2012 10:35am by Eske


Oh I understand. But I also understand nobody should be forced to raise a child that is a product of rape. Could you imagine the legal implications if for some reason the rapist wasn't convicted? He could sue for custody, sue for child support. I think that is the reason a lot of people who are usually pro-life see the benefit in allowing abortions in the case of rape pregnancies.
There are lots of kids with parent(s) that don't want them or without proper parents or no parents at all, but we don't kill them. Besides, there is no shortage of people wanting to adopt babies.



Yes, I was going to add that putting the baby up for adoption is a better solution in my opinion, but I forgot to. Although, in that case, despite Joph thinking the argument is rubbish, the father rapist could sue for custody and prevent the mother from putting the child up for adoption, leading to a long and drawn out legal battle that will not be good for the mother or the child.

Never mind, disregard. Misread Joph's post.


Edited, Apr 10th 2012 10:06am by Bigdaddyjug
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#100 Apr 10 2012 at 9:06 AM Rating: Default
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.Smiley: dnp

Edited, Apr 10th 2012 5:16pm by Elinda
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#101 Apr 10 2012 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Elinda wrote:
I'm not buying it. The whole anti-abortion argument is based on a fetus having the right to live.

It has zero to do with how the fetus was made.
Not necessarily. Some people, mostly crazy people mind you, think being forced to have the baby is the punishment the girl deserves for being a 'ho. Because sex is for making babies, not pleasure. And since they're not calling a poor raped girl a 'ho, it makes perfect sense not to force her to have the baby.
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