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#52 Dec 20 2011 at 5:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well if I ask some of the religious extreemists I kill millions of lives every time I have a ****. I suppose that would make sense too, considering how I don't view them as human anyways. Smiley: tinfoilhat

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<insert random crap in a vain attempt to raise your e-tough rep>


Whatever you say princess. I wouldn't kill you but putting a bullet in one of your kneecaps certainly would make me feel better. Or even better, damage your spinal cord along the C1-C7 vertebrae leaving you permanently disabled and required to live off of the social security that you so despise.
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#53 Dec 20 2011 at 5:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Completely removing the legal aspect of it, I don't think I would have a problem doing it, or living with myself after it.

If it were a person who threatened my daughter, that's a different story.

Growing up with severe clinical depression and being manipulated by the few people you can trust, in addition to the constant exposure to violence in the neighborhood, can leave a person pretty dead when it comes to the pain and suffering of others.

I know a lot of people who have died, including family. I don't think I've had an emotional response to it since I was about 14 or so. I still feel emotions like everyone else, but empathy isn't one of them. At least it hasn't been for about as long as I can remember.

Indifference can be a scary thing.
#54 Dec 20 2011 at 6:03 PM Rating: Good
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varusword75 wrote:
or I was a skinny little white boy

I was a skinny little *redhead* white boy. So there.


Was?

Edited, Dec 20th 2011 7:05pm by Debalic
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#55 Dec 20 2011 at 6:11 PM Rating: Good
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varusword75 wrote:
Debo,

Quote:
Could? Easy enough


lol...doubtful.



Now how many street fights have I been in...let's just say more than a handful. During these fights i've been hit in the head with a pool cue, hit in the head with those thick crystal ash trays, been hit in the back with a brick, had a little mexican wanna be gangsta try and stab me in the head in the passengers side of my buds jeep back in tx years ago. Fortunately i've won most of my fights and only have a few scars to show.

I'm always on guard.


I've always suspected that you've been hit in the head a few times.
#56 Dec 20 2011 at 6:28 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think that dehumanization comes in part from blame shift.

There is much research done on what controlling power and little accountability add up to, the most famous examples I can think of are the Milgram's Obedience to Authority Experiment, and the Stanford Prison Experiment. The Stanford one in particular got so nasty it had to be shut down.

Several psychologists have repeated the Milgram experiment, and it shows that if you can get someone to hurt someone even just a little (while your superior accepts liability) you can eventually get that person to inflict serious pain to someone under similar circumstances.
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#57 Dec 20 2011 at 7:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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Milgram & Co skated pretty close to that line just by running the experiments for as long as they did.

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#58 Dec 20 2011 at 8:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
I've played a lot of Team Fortress 2 so I'm pretty sure that's prepared me. I'd be all "pew! pew! lol ur *** n00b lrn2ply".


:o You should play on the [no heroes] servers so I can kill you. (If I find the time to get on what with school and skyrim. Well.. no more school until the 23rd of January so weeee.)
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#59 Dec 20 2011 at 9:01 PM Rating: Good
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Nice try, though.
Were you looking for reality from a varus post? Smiley: dubious
Just consistency.


Yeah; I'm [img=LOL]ing, too.Smiley: clown

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varusword75 wrote:
Eskse,
or I was a skinny little white boy living in apartments packed with spicks and n*ggers who don't care about anything other than trying to pick on the little white kid. Some of us had to learn to fight at a young age to survive.

Wanna check my high school rep just ask anyone from south tx about the bluff.


Careful, keep adding to that backstory and the fiction is going to start toeing the line of believability.
He's like...a Later Day Stephen King!
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#60 Dec 20 2011 at 9:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty ****** up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.
#61 Dec 20 2011 at 9:22 PM Rating: Good
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.

She said she was sixteen. Sixteen year old girls are pretty fucked up in general. Sixteen year old boys aren't much different, for that matter.
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we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#62 Dec 20 2011 at 9:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Varus, We've been over this. Many times now. It's getting old. Are you really that ******* stupid, or are you just trying to **** me off by making more work for me? If so, please see question 1. It's simple. If we tell you "Don't use this word on our forums" and you continue to do so, you go away. Same thing with "don't post pictures of your ***** on the forum", etc. There are very few landmines that will get you yelled at in the Asylum. That happens to be one of them. You know this, and you still did it anyways, so whats the deal here?

If in a week or so you feel like e-mailing me an explanation for why you can't seem to follow very simple and straightforward rules that you have had multiple chances on, and what you are going to do to ensure it never happens again, then we'll talk. Until then, Mute issued, indefinite at this point. Don't bother making another account.

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#63 Dec 20 2011 at 9:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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Aww. Smiley: frown
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#64 Dec 20 2011 at 10:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Varus, Mute issued, indefinite at this point. Don't bother making another account.

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#65 Dec 20 2011 at 10:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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The only other idiot who needs to see the Big Bad Administrator schpeal is already perma-banned.

Send a PM next time.
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#66 Dec 20 2011 at 10:25 PM Rating: Good
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but getting to watch kao verbally spank someone is so much fun! It's like watching simon cowell berating someone, but without the "...I ******* hate simon cowell" after taste. Whether or not it includes the tight shirts depends on your personal preference. I like to imagine Kao in the tight black shirt, with the head&neck of the dragon in his avatar(s), and after he finishes berating them, he reaches over and gobbles them up.
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#67 Dec 20 2011 at 10:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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It puts the mute on the varus, or it gets the whips again.
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#68 Dec 21 2011 at 12:03 AM Rating: Excellent
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Demea wrote:
The only other idiot who needs to see the Big Bad Administrator schpeal is already perma-banned.

Send a PM next time.


I dunno, I rather enjoy knowing that Varus is muted, because it allows me the pleasure of picturing his juvenile form sitting there frothing at the keyboard ranting about bros, hos and ballin on the inner city streets all the while frantically wishing he could reply to any and every discussion with "Obama and the liberals keep @#%^in wit my sh*t, yo!"

Edited, Dec 21st 2011 12:04am by BrownDuck
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#69 Dec 21 2011 at 5:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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Demea wrote:
The only other idiot who needs to see the Big Bad Administrator schpeal is already perma-banned.

Send a PM next time.

Be more of a grump next time.
#70 Dec 21 2011 at 6:02 AM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
Milgram & Co skated pretty close to that line just by running the experiments for as long as they did.



I think those experiments were quite a valuable social service, in addition to their role in determination of psychological principles. The people who took the 'teacher' role received a measurable amount of real learning, plus it illuminates a rather effective teaching technique.

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#71 Dec 21 2011 at 6:23 AM Rating: Good
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Thumbelyna Quick Hands wrote:
I didn't have a problem hitting someone with a car.

Nor when I stabbed him.

Oh wait. I stabbed him first then hit him with a car.

It was 2 separate incidents, and he knows that he ****** me off both times.

Smiley: lol Young love.

Well hello Stephanie Plum.
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#72 Dec 21 2011 at 6:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
i've been hit in the head with a pool cue, hit in the head with those thick crystal ash trays, been hit in the back with a brick.

This may hep explain a few things.
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#73 Dec 21 2011 at 6:59 AM Rating: Good
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If I was a squirrel, I'd totally go into Lub's house and fuck his sh*t all up. I'd be all "Go get me some more beer nuts, *****, so I can bury them in your couch. Also, your PS3 doesn't seem to work any more. Probably because I chewed all the wires. Fuck you."
Sounds like my dog, just replace beer nuts with half eaten rawhide strips.
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Edited, Mar 21st 2011 2:14pm by Darqflame Lock Thread: Because Lubriderm is silly... ~ de geso

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#74 Dec 21 2011 at 7:01 AM Rating: Good
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.


I had been operating under the assumption that there wasa fair bit of hyperbole involved. if not then yeah, that's pretty ****** up.
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#75 Dec 21 2011 at 7:09 AM Rating: Good
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.
I was a mess as a teenager, and I started physical fights with my boyfriend a few times before I got ahold of myself. I'm thoroughly ashamed of myself in retrospect, but It's important that there is an explanation, which is not an excuse. Firstly, I had a lot of extremely poor modelling, and almost no modelling to help me have positive skills in handling problems and problematic emotions. Emotional/mental illness very often kicks in properly in your late teens, and that's when my genetic birds came home to roost in at least two different ways. Firstly Borderline Personality Disorder. Secondly POS which messed my hormonal balance right up. Both of those things were desperately not helpful in the absence of any emotional skills. But there's no question I abused my boyfriend. It's no excuse I had no other way to express the despair and frustration I felt during those domestic fights.

No, I haven't killed anyone. Do I think I could? I believe in the force +1 rule. It makes sense to me. If someone imminently threatened my life or some innocent other, I could kill that person. Knowing myself, I strongly suspect I wouldn't feel bad about it. In fact it's a strong possibility I'd never feel in any way bad about it. AT the same time, my community theoretically encompasses the whole world. I've bumped up against some unexpected prejudices, which I've had to strip out of myself. Everyone is "in the circle". Ideally each individual judged on their own merits, although I do classify people into cultural subgroups when they share certain beliefs or behaviours.

I've had to undergo a lot of training to overcome my mental problems. This includes training in Assertion, and Saying No. I believe I'm less susceptible than average in relying on authority figures, both near and far, to take up my moral burden. I'm strongly in the habit of assessing a situation from first principles, and making my own decisions and assessments. This has put me in minority positions frequently vis a vis Australian politics, and friends' and relatives' and professionals' opinions. I believe strongly in civil disobedience, and I have once removed my youngest sister temporarily from my mother's house.

At the moment I think that Mulims occupy the same social scapegoating niche that Jews occupied before the holocaust. Most western politicians are merrily using these scapegoats without thought. I think the majority of the population has fallen for the groupthink scapegoating. I believe there is a sizable minority who hasn't, who wish desperately for the civil story to be different, but who are swamped by the size and vehemence of the most popular media and the prevailing political winds.
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#76 Dec 21 2011 at 7:28 AM Rating: Good
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Tarub wrote:
I think that dehumanization comes in part from blame shift.

There is much research done on what controlling power and little accountability add up to, the most famous examples I can think of are the Milgram's Obedience to Authority Experiment, and the Stanford Prison Experiment. The Stanford one in particular got so nasty it had to be shut down.

Several psychologists have repeated the Milgram experiment, and it shows that if you can get someone to hurt someone even just a little (while your superior accepts liability) you can eventually get that person to inflict serious pain to someone under similar circumstances.

I listened to most of the interview. The author did explain that dehumanization is not so much to justify actions, but to facilitate them. In fact he went on to say that the psychological techniques used to facilitate a soldiers ability to kill other humans can be pretty detrimental to the soldier. The diagnosis, and subsequent treatment of PTSD is basically flawed, as it's purpose is not to re-humanize.

He also spoke with deep concern about physical dehumanization that is innate in remote killing (unmanned drones).
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#77 Dec 21 2011 at 7:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.


I had been operating under the assumption that there wasa fair bit of hyperbole involved. if not then yeah, that's pretty @#%^ed up.

I used to hit my boyfriend a lot and I tried to run over him once. It was kind of standard behavior in my circle, and I kind of thought most teen relationships were that way.
#78 Dec 21 2011 at 8:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Until then, Mute issued, indefinite at this point. Don't bother making another account.
Do you have any idea what you've done? You've just made ******* the focal point of everyone here now because you took away this ******. ***** you and your Grinchy ways. You just ruined my Christmas.
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#79 Dec 21 2011 at 8:24 AM Rating: Excellent
What word did varus use? I'm guessing it's the one that starts with N, but you never know.

What is the list of 'never use' words, anyways?
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Edited, Mar 21st 2011 2:14pm by Darqflame Lock Thread: Because Lubriderm is silly... ~ de geso

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#80 Dec 21 2011 at 8:40 AM Rating: Good
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Uglysasquatch wrote:
You've just made ******* the focal point of everyone here now because you took away this ******.
He's still not alphatard.
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#81 Dec 21 2011 at 8:44 AM Rating: Excellent
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Nadenu wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.


I had been operating under the assumption that there wasa fair bit of hyperbole involved. if not then yeah, that's pretty @#%^ed up.

I used to hit my boyfriend a lot and I tried to run over him once. It was kind of standard behavior in my circle, and I kind of thought most teen relationships were that way.


Yeah, teen relationships are pretty ****** up. Smiley: frown
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#82 Dec 21 2011 at 8:45 AM Rating: Good
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Nadenu wrote:
I used to hit my boyfriend a lot and I tried to run over him once. It was kind of standard behavior in my circle, and I kind of thought most teen relationships were that way.

Australian teens are a little older than American teens before they can get their learners permit, and then they have to log over a hundred driving hours in all weather conditions and size of roads, with an adult, licence companion, before they can sit for their probationary licence. So we're more likely to start driving alone after high school, than during it. Using a car for teenage angst purposes isn't common here. If an adult tried mowing someone down, even at really slow speed, prison would be pretty inevitable. The only exception would be if you were being attacked and car escape was your only safe option.


On the other hand, Australian teens can start buying alcohol and drinking in public at least 3 years before their American counterparts. So we do dumb alcoholic related **** earlier. The only thing stopping the combined commencement of driving and public alcohol consumption from being a real disaster is the heavy duty booze buses used by police to alcohol breath-test entire road traffic populations at random times amd places on holidays and party nights out. There's now a pretty big culture of leaving your car overnight and taking a taxi home, or crashing at a mates place, if you're over the limit to drive home.
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#83 Dec 21 2011 at 8:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Duke Lubriderm wrote:
What word did varus use? I'm guessing it's the one that starts with N, but you never know.

What is the list of 'never use' words, anyways?

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#84 Dec 21 2011 at 8:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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#85 Dec 21 2011 at 8:56 AM Rating: Good
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Duke Lubriderm wrote:
What word did varus use? I'm guessing it's the one that starts with N, but you never know.

What is the list of 'never use' words, anyways?


That one and another that starts with an s. It was a lovely post.
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#86 Dec 21 2011 at 9:06 AM Rating: Good
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Nadenu wrote:
Demea wrote:
The only other idiot who needs to see the Big Bad Administrator schpeal is already perma-banned.

Send a PM next time.

Be more of a grump next time.

Bah, humbug.
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#87 Dec 21 2011 at 9:11 AM Rating: Good
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Coming back to the thread, The only time I seriously injured someone was in fact around the same time (15).

It was definitely the combination of being young and angry and the situation. Now I'd call a policeman I know ,explain exactly what happened, and take pleasure in watching the guy rot for many years. Back then though, wooden bat to the car, and then to his chest when he came outside to confront.

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#88 Dec 21 2011 at 9:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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Lady Jinte wrote:
but getting to watch kao verbally spank someone is so much fun! It's like watching simon cowell berating someone, but without the "...I @#%^ing hate simon cowell" after taste. Whether or not it includes the tight shirts depends on your personal preference. I like to imagine Kao in the tight black shirt, with the head&neck of the dragon in his avatar(s), and after he finishes berating them, he reaches over and gobbles them up.

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#89 Dec 21 2011 at 9:41 AM Rating: Good
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Tarub wrote:
Coming back to the thread, The only time I seriously injured someone was in fact around the same time (15).

It was definitely the combination of being young and angry and the situation. Now I'd call a policeman I know ,explain exactly what happened, and take pleasure in watching the guy rot for many years. Back then though, wooden bat to the car, and then to his chest when he came outside to confront.


Maturity kicks ****.
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#90 Dec 21 2011 at 9:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Aripyanfar wrote:
Tarub wrote:
Coming back to the thread, The only time I seriously injured someone was in fact around the same time (15).

It was definitely the combination of being young and angry and the situation. Now I'd call a policeman I know ,explain exactly what happened, and take pleasure in watching the guy rot for many years. Back then though, wooden bat to the car, and then to his chest when he came outside to confront.


Maturity kicks ****.


Although to be fair, "I totally called my friend Eric" doesn't have quite the same punch to it as "I hit him with a bat"




Edited, Dec 21st 2011 8:50am by Tarub
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#91 Dec 21 2011 at 10:28 AM Rating: Good
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I dunno, really. It's a hard question. My gut says no--I've kinda always assumed that if I was drafted into a war, I'd be nothing but cannon fodder or support, because I can't see me ever being useful with a weapon.

I don't think I'd take well to dehumanization efforts, either. I feel bad killing bugs (even though I totally think they deserve to die).
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#92 Dec 21 2011 at 10:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Nadenu wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
I think I may be in the minority here, but it sounds like what Thumb did is pretty @#%^ed up.

And I'm almost certain that if a male poster had said he'd done any of those things, someone would've labeled him an abuser.

Maybe it's just me.


I had been operating under the assumption that there wasa fair bit of hyperbole involved. if not then yeah, that's pretty @#%^ed up.

I used to hit my boyfriend a lot and I tried to run over him once. It was kind of standard behavior in my circle, and I kind of thought most teen relationships were that way.


Yeah, teen relationships are pretty @#%^ed up. Smiley: frown

A girl I knew in high school took a dump on the hood of her boyfriend's car. I agree: teenagers can be pretty crazy.

Although I think that incident had more to do with the girl herself than all teenagers being a little out of whack.
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#93 Dec 21 2011 at 11:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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Backstory to my little episodes with my ex:

The drama in that relationship was pretty insane. I won't get into details, but the relationship was very volatile. Many things happened during those 2 separate incidents that culminated in into me hitting him with the car and stabbing him with a fork. I will admit to a bit of hyperbole was involved in my post, but a car and a fork were involved. My actions came out of the height of passions and emotions during the situations.

Immediately after both times, did I feel regret? Yup. I freaked out in the only way that a crying hysterical 16 year old girl can do. What did my ex do? Hug me and we made up and we happily rolled along again.

I will say that he and I are still friends, we are on very good terms, and we tease the **** out of each other on what he and I have done to one another during those years. "Remember when you hit me with the car?" "Yeah, well, remember when you left me in the middle of the canyon with just my shoes?" Was our relationship abusive? Oh yeah it was. But we (for lack of a better word) thrived on that and the drama it created. I can say that our relationship left a mark on both of us, in that we realized what was right and wrong in a normal, healthy relationship.

ETA: Back to the original idea for this thread, I'll say that it would have been more worrisome if I didn't have some kind of emotional reaction to what I did. Lack of self-control was more a factor than behavior devoid of humane feelings.

Edited, Dec 21st 2011 9:18am by Thumbelyna
#94 Dec 21 2011 at 11:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
Samira wrote:
Milgram & Co skated pretty close to that line just by running the experiments for as long as they did.



I think those experiments were quite a valuable social service, in addition to their role in determination of psychological principles. The people who took the 'teacher' role received a measurable amount of real learning, plus it illuminates a rather effective teaching technique.




They were fascinating. As is so often the case, "fascinating" does not equal "ethical".

Milgram and Zimbardo arguably did not realize just how devastating their experiments would be to the participants. However there is no excuse for the lack of monitoring of those effects, and for letting the experiments continue in the face of their subjects' distress.
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#95 Dec 21 2011 at 1:42 PM Rating: Good
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The experiments are harrowing. That's kind of the point, thats the way to teach that type of thing.

If the test subjects were not told after the fact that it wasn't real, that I'd see as a breach of ethics. I could see the role for some post procedural cooldown being offered for subjects who wanted it.
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#96 Dec 21 2011 at 3:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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They were told afterward, of course. The point is that damage was done during the experiments.

I don't know the extent of the trauma, but I don't dismiss the point that there was trauma.

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#97 Dec 21 2011 at 7:00 PM Rating: Good
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I think the trauma would take place in reconciling their psyche after it's conclusion, without a proper cooldown. I'd be somewhat interested in running experiments to see where the damage is caused.
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#98 Dec 21 2011 at 10:03 PM Rating: Decent
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As far as the topic goes, I don't think I'd be able to kill anyone, in any situation. I tend to talk myself out of situations or just flee, and I would guess a situation where I'd have to possibly kill someone would go the same way.
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#99 Dec 22 2011 at 1:48 AM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
I think the trauma would take place in reconciling their psyche after it's conclusion, without a proper cooldown. I'd be somewhat interested in running experiments to see where the damage is caused.


I'd be somewhat interested in seeing how people behave when told they have to experiment on others in order to see what kind of conduct damages the subject of an experiment, and that this is necessary for scienctific understandng.
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#100 Dec 22 2011 at 5:05 AM Rating: Good
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Kavekk wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
I think the trauma would take place in reconciling their psyche after it's conclusion, without a proper cooldown. I'd be somewhat interested in running experiments to see where the damage is caused.


I'd be somewhat interested in seeing how people behave when told they have to experiment on others in order to see what kind of conduct damages the subject of an experiment, and that this is necessary for scienctific understandng.


Well, first we assign the experiment management to TLW, and then we assign some control experiment managers....
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#101 Dec 22 2011 at 8:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yes, I could, came very close once, but in the end I held my temper and told the young man "god loves you, go in peace".

Wouldn't bother with any posters on this site, something about worth of effort.


My nephew is a police officer. He had to use a taser on someone violent and uncontrollable. The person went into cardiac failure. I've talked to him about it and he says he is bothered but the other persons actions were more responsible for the death. (It was a situation that was close to "suicide by cop".)
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