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Barack Obama will win the 2012 electionFollow

#252varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 8:15 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Joph,
#253 Apr 01 2011 at 8:17 AM Rating: Excellent
The more you alienate the moderates the smaller your base grows
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#254 Apr 01 2011 at 8:28 AM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Except that the bill that they passed in the House contains the $61B in cuts that the Dems in the Senate are getting upset about. What internal process occurred among the GOP to arrive at that number is kinda unimportant, isn't it?


Not if you want to pretend they were compromising with the Dems in order to get to that $61B from $100B.

I mean, it was your argument that started the whole thing, after all...
#255 Apr 01 2011 at 9:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
It's not the fringe if we're the majority.

The Tea Party is not the majority by any measure: caucus size, popularity, whatever. They're just very loud and very good at running over the rest of their party.

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the Dems having 23 seats up and the GOP only 9 we're looking at a major shift.

Only a handful of those are considered competitive. There won't be any "major shift" regardless since the GOP will still control the House. At worst (from your perspective), the Democrats retain control of the Senate. At best, the Democrats filibuster every single bill that comes through and forces the GOP to collect 60 votes which they won't have. And Gbaji will cry about how unfair it is now that the Democrats are filibustering.
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Belkira wrote:
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#256varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 9:39 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Jophed,
#257 Apr 01 2011 at 9:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
Actually at the best nothing gets done the price of gas continues to rise and Obama loses the presidency next year and the GOP then controls all 3 branches.

No, I meant the best realistic option.
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And you're insane if you don't think the GOP can pick up 10 seats from the Dems.

Might want to double check your math there.

Edited, Apr 1st 2011 10:47am by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
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#258varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 9:49 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Jophed,
#259 Apr 01 2011 at 10:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
I expect you to honour our 50$ bet.

Oh, don't worry about that. I have no problem asking for money :)
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Belkira wrote:
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#260 Apr 01 2011 at 1:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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Speak Boehner continued paving the way towards accepting the $33B compromise today, explaining at a press conference that it would cost more to shut down the government than to keep it running.

This was not a message being delivered to Democrats and independents. This was a straight justification to the Tea Party and apology for delivering half of what they demanded. Meanwhile Republicans in the Senate are getting upset at the Tea Party hold-outs, saying that they're hurting the GOP position for the debate on entitlement reform and the debt cap; that the public will be burnt out and impatient with them before they get to the fights that actually matter.

But you and Gbaji just keep on saying that the GOP isn't worried and it's the Democrats who are scared of how poorly they'll be viewed.
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#261varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 1:45 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Jophed,
#262 Apr 01 2011 at 1:52 PM Rating: Excellent
Except that people didn't vote for the GOP to do nothing. They want action and when that doesn't happen they won't be happy.
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#263 Apr 01 2011 at 1:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
partisan article

lulz
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Sorry Mr. Bolton

The singer or the walrus faced failed diplomat?
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but wanting to cut less than 1% of the budget isn't exactly "die-hard" anything.

If you're doing the math against the entire budget, someone needs to explain the concept of "discretionary spending" to you. Someone besides me though.
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Belkira wrote:
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#264varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 1:54 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Xarus,
#265 Apr 01 2011 at 1:55 PM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:


I can tell you the citizens of TN won't be happy with Alexander for this and people like me will spend money on whoever his tea party rival will be when he comes up for election.

Matter of fact i'm sending him a scathing e-mail right after this post.


I must say, I'm actually happy that Varus is taking this action. Good for him for sticking up for what he believes in, and trolling actual people who affect these decisions instead of trolling just us forum-goers.
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#266 Apr 01 2011 at 1:58 PM Rating: Good
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LockeColeMA wrote:
varusword75 wrote:


I can tell you the citizens of TN won't be happy with Alexander for this and people like me will spend money on whoever his tea party rival will be when he comes up for election.

Matter of fact i'm sending him a scathing e-mail right after this post.


I must say, I'm actually happy that Varus is taking this action. Good for him for sticking up for what he believes in, and trolling actual people who affect these decisions instead of trolling just us forum-goers.
I hope he remembers not to use his spell check, otherwise the Senator won't believe he's from his district/constituency/whateveryoucallit.
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#267varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 2:03 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Locked,
#268varusword75, Posted: Apr 01 2011 at 2:04 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Ugly,
#269 Apr 01 2011 at 2:42 PM Rating: Default
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Belkira the Tulip wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Except that the bill that they passed in the House contains the $61B in cuts that the Dems in the Senate are getting upset about. What internal process occurred among the GOP to arrive at that number is kinda unimportant, isn't it?


Not if you want to pretend they were compromising with the Dems in order to get to that $61B from $100B.

I mean, it was your argument that started the whole thing, after all...


Huh? It's a "compromise" with what they think they can pass in the Dem controlled Senate. You get that, right? I mean, I suppose the House could have passed a bill which cut 1.7 Trillion dollars from Obama's proposed budget as a starting point and then negotiated from there, but it does kinda make sense to do some preliminary analysis and have some meetings with the guys in the other party and in the house prior to putting pen to paper and voting in a budget bill.

That's why I keep saying that the amount the GOP has proposed is already a compromise. And it's a pretty darn huge one if you take into account recent spending increases.
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#270 Apr 01 2011 at 2:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Huh? It's a "compromise" with what they think they can pass in the Dem controlled Senate. You get that, right?

Right. So you agree that the healthcare bill was a massive compromise with the Republicans versus the single-payer option some people were asking for (and the House passed). Strange that every time you cried that the Democrats wouldn't compromise, you never once mentioned this. Very, very strange indeed.

Hahaha... what a tool. Never change, Gbaji.

Edited, Apr 1st 2011 3:54pm by Jophiel
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#271 Apr 01 2011 at 3:06 PM Rating: Good
Wait, it's a pre-compromise? Hahahahaha, what a joke.
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#272 Apr 01 2011 at 3:15 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Belkira the Tulip wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Except that the bill that they passed in the House contains the $61B in cuts that the Dems in the Senate are getting upset about. What internal process occurred among the GOP to arrive at that number is kinda unimportant, isn't it?


Not if you want to pretend they were compromising with the Dems in order to get to that $61B from $100B.

I mean, it was your argument that started the whole thing, after all...


Huh? It's a "compromise" with what they think they can pass in the Dem controlled Senate. You get that, right? I mean, I suppose the House could have passed a bill which cut 1.7 Trillion dollars from Obama's proposed budget as a starting point and then negotiated from there, but it does kinda make sense to do some preliminary analysis and have some meetings with the guys in the other party and in the house prior to putting pen to paper and voting in a budget bill.

That's why I keep saying that the amount the GOP has proposed is already a compromise. And it's a pretty darn huge one if you take into account recent spending increases.


Smiley: lol
#273 Apr 01 2011 at 3:18 PM Rating: Default
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Jophiel wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Huh? It's a "compromise" with what they think they can pass in the Dem controlled Senate. You get that, right?

Right. So you agree that the healthcare bill was a massive compromise with the Republicans versus the single-payer option some people were asking for (and the House passed). Strange that every time you cried that the Democrats wouldn't compromise, you never once mentioned this. Very, very strange indeed.


Lol. You're kidding, right? I know it's April 1st and all, but this is a bit over the top, even for you.


I'll give you a hint why your response makes no sense: The bit about the GOP starting at a position of cutting 1.7 Trillion dollars wasn't just pulled out of thin air. It's the amount that the proposed budget is over budget. Thus, that's the amount of money the Democrats are over spending and makes it a reasonable starting point is to reduce spending by. Cutting that much makes us "even".


As opposed to the "sky's the limit" comparison you're trying to make. Not even a good effort really, even by your standards.

Edited, Apr 1st 2011 2:19pm by gbaji
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#274 Apr 01 2011 at 3:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Backpedal!! Backpedal!! BACKPEDAL!!!!!!!


Hahahahahaa... too funny. Yeah, you're not a partisan hack at all!

Hey, I noticed you're still trying your best to avoid answering where it is you get your news from.

Edited, Apr 1st 2011 4:23pm by Jophiel
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#275 Apr 01 2011 at 3:58 PM Rating: Default
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I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph. Unlike you, I don't sit around regurgitating what others are saying. I'm looking at what you are saying, finding it to be lacking in sense, and pointing out the glaring problems (and stating a few opinions of my own along the way of course).


Here's the deal, in case you're still confused. I'll put it in really simple terms:

When you are doing something "new", that's a new cost. Like spending money on "green jobs", and health care, and god knows what other incredible wastes of money the Dems have been spending money on over the last two years. A "compromise" when doing something new would be to give up something that already exists. So if say a group of people (lets call them "Democrats") want to spend a trillion dollars on some new stuff they think is critically important, that same group should perhaps give up a trillion dollars of spending on other stuff that they already talked us into spending. That way they have to pick which thing they think is *really* important before making us (the taxpayers) pay for their stuff.


But the Dems haven't been doing this. And there's this other group (we'll call them "Conservatives") who have been warning all along that if you keep spending new money on new things, without reducing the amount of money you're continuing to spend on the old things, eventually you'll run out of money and get yourself into trouble. Yes, this is a pretty common sense sorta thing, which most people learn after their first run-in with a credit card in college, but the Dems for some reason forgot that lesson and insisted on doing this anyway. Now we're in financial trouble and the conservatives are trying to come up with things that the Dems should have give up on spending to make up for all the new spending in the first place. Now, to be anywhere near fiscally sane, the amount given up should equal the amount they added, right? But the Dems aren't going to stand for that! Nosirreee! They want to keep spending more money (Bad Dems!). So want to pretend that the new amount of spending isn't really new. It's just normal spending. So we have to compromise from a position of not cutting anything instead of one in which we cut an amount equal to what they increased the spending by.


Is there anyone who really thinks that makes any sense? Really? Because that's what you're arguing here. And yes, I'm well aware of all the wrangling that politicians do over this, but at the end of the day, what matters is that we're spending more than we can afford and have to cut that spending. The amount the GOP put into the house bill is a drop in the proverbial bucket, but it's giving us a really good idea of just how unwilling the Dems are to do anything to take responsibility for all that money they spent. If they're fighting this hard over 61 billion dollars, how on earth are we ever going to make up for the trillions of dollars they've spent over the last few years?



I'd add a prediction, but of course we all know that Obama promised us that our taxes wouldn't go up. Hmmm....
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#276 Apr 01 2011 at 4:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.

Well, that certainly explains why you keep getting basic facts of the debate wrong. I'm not sure you should be so proud of being ignorant but I guess that's more your problem than it is mine.
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Belkira wrote:
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#277 Apr 01 2011 at 5:00 PM Rating: Default
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You're the one who seems to think those things matter. I'm making a more general observation about how the public will view the issue. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter how the house arrived at the bill they passed with its 61 Billion in cuts, or what various conversations members of both parties in the Senate have had along the way. If there is a shutdown, all the public will see is that the Dems refused to cut even a measly 61B from the budget. In the context of the massive spending they've done over the last few years and the massive amount the budget is already over, that's what's going to matter.


You do get that by *not* paying attention at all to what the wonks are saying and just looking at the situation at hand, I'm more likely to see the issue as the public will see it than you are, right? What I see is the Dems unwilling to compromise on what certainly appears to be a relatively tiny amount of money for things that arguably shouldn't be funded with taxpayer money in the first place. The rest of the back and forth which you seem to think is so important isn't really going to enter most people's thought process on this.
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#278 Apr 01 2011 at 5:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
You're the one who seems to think those things matter.

Yeah. I'm such an elitist thinking that facts are something good to have when debating a point. Good call.
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I'm making a more general observation...

...based on your admitted complete ignorance and, really, just basically what you really, really wish will happen.

Look, I think it's great for you that you've convinced yourself that ignorance is the way to go. For one thing, it reinforces that I don't have to take you seriously. For another, maybe you're happier this way. The part where you try to insist that it's superior to drawing a conclusion based on facts is a little weird but I'm guessing you've already established that a fact-based argument isn't going to work in your favor so an anti-intellectual approach is the best thing you have going.
Quote:
I'm more likely to see the issue as the public will see it

You're definitely my go-to guy for unbiased, non-ideological thinking.

Edited, Apr 1st 2011 6:19pm by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#279 Apr 01 2011 at 6:19 PM Rating: Decent
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gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
Stating the obvious. /golfclap
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#280varusword75, Posted: Apr 04 2011 at 12:24 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Jophed,
#281 Apr 04 2011 at 12:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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Usually my mom. She's a pretty good "man on the street" barometer.

She NAILED the "I was leaning towards McCain until he brought that idiot Palin on board" thing.
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#282varusword75, Posted: Apr 04 2011 at 1:22 PM, Rating: Unrated, (Expand Post) Jophs mom;
#283 Apr 04 2011 at 1:33 PM Rating: Good
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varusword75 wrote:
yeah you're moms a stupid wh*re, like most liberal women.


I have no idea why you think it's ok to say **** like this. I guess because everyone here thinks we need you to keep the blood flowing. It's disgusting.
#284 Apr 04 2011 at 1:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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varusword75 wrote:
you're moms a stupid wh*re

Now, now... don't get all saucy just because a 61 year old middle class white woman is more politically adept than you.

Also, she knows how to properly use the possessive form of "you" and apostrophes to show contractions.
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Belkira wrote:
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#285 Apr 04 2011 at 2:03 PM Rating: Decent
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varusword75 wrote:
LMAO...yeah you're moms a stupid wh*re, like most liberal women
Stay classy.
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Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#286 Apr 04 2011 at 2:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Trying to push buttons is all Varus has left.
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Belkira wrote:
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#287 Apr 04 2011 at 2:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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Thing is, we've seen all his tricks.
#288 Apr 04 2011 at 2:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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I dunno, Nadenu, Forum=4 mom remarks are pretty innovative.

Wait.. what? It's not 2004? Never mind then.

In other news, Boehner is caving to the Tea Party and denying that he was reaching any agreement on the budget.

In other, other news, Obama started his re-election campaign today so I'm one step closer to my fifty bucks.
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#289 Apr 04 2011 at 2:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Trying to push buttons is all Varus has left.
That's all he ever had.
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#290 Apr 04 2011 at 4:51 PM Rating: Decent
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bsphil wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
Trying to push buttons is all Varus has left.
That's all he ever had.

He keeps pounding that big shiny brass button but fails to realize that it is the doorknob.
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#291 Apr 04 2011 at 4:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Usually my mom. She's a pretty good "man on the street" barometer.

She NAILED the "I was leaning towards McCain until he brought that idiot Palin on board" thing.

Now Joph, should you really be using the term "nailed" in reference to your own mother??
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#292 Apr 05 2011 at 12:13 AM Rating: Decent
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Debalic wrote:
Now Joph, should you really be using the term "nailed" in reference to your own mother??

Yeah, he was coming into a hairy situation there. That's a whole mess of innuendo you wouldn't want to enter. One errant word and he'd **** it up. And if she were to accidentally read that comment I bet she'd stroke out.
#293 Apr 05 2011 at 1:09 AM Rating: Good
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#294varusword75, Posted: Apr 05 2011 at 9:24 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Jophed,
#295 Apr 05 2011 at 11:30 AM Rating: Decent
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varusword75 wrote:
Jophed,

Quote:
Trying to push buttons is all Varus has left.


It's all there is.
Don't worry, we know.

But, the first step towards recovery is admitting you have a problem, so there's that at least.
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Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#296varusword75, Posted: Apr 05 2011 at 1:31 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) phil,
#297 Apr 05 2011 at 2:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Trying to push buttons is all Varus has left.


Try harder, v.
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#298varusword75, Posted: Apr 05 2011 at 2:49 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Debo,
#299 Apr 05 2011 at 2:52 PM Rating: Good
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varusword75 wrote:
Debo,

The editorial "trying".

Have you tried a voice command keyboard?

They still suck from what I hear.
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#300 Apr 06 2011 at 6:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Well, the Speaker of the House should start calling Gbaji and asking for his political advice because he seems to have a different opinion.
Political Wire wrote:
House Speaker John Boehner is warning Republican lawmakers that Democrats would "win" politically if there's a government shutdown "and the GOP would suffer a political catastrophe if the federal government runs out of money at the end of this week," Politico reports.

Said Boehner: "The Democrats think they benefit from a government shutdown. I agree."

Boehner's one-week continuing resolution was shot down by pretty much everyone and he's increasingly feeling the pinch. He made the completely asinine statement the other day that he wouldn't pass a budget that couldn't get 218 Republican votes, brushing off promises by Democratic leaders that they could provide votes to cover for hard-right defections and allow a bipartisan compromise to pass.
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#301 Apr 06 2011 at 8:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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I feel a little sorry for Boehner these days. He's on the hot seat, no doubt.

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