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Iraq.... What do you think?Follow

#27 Jan 12 2004 at 12:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Lol. Yes, Totem, you shall be my King. And we shall have many children, ones that are witty, and also like **** jokes.

Skeet
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#28 Jan 12 2004 at 1:18 PM Rating: Good
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So, just to be clear here:

I spell very poorly.
You're a moron.

I could use spellcheck.
You...

Oh well, I guess you can hold out for gene therapy or brain transplants or something.
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#29 Jan 12 2004 at 1:29 PM Rating: Decent
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Or I can keep goading you into posting responses and learn how to be the mostest inteligentiest person through osmosis.

Good that very would be.

Hey! Working already it is! Much you thank very! Forget generosity never I will your.

Skeet




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#30 Jan 12 2004 at 1:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Skeet, dude that was great. I think you are channeling Yoda, who no one can dispute is wise.

Not so much after the prequels, but still.
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#31 Jan 12 2004 at 2:26 PM Rating: Good
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That's alright, just ignore the reports that blister agent mortar shells have been found-- allegedly
I'm not ignoring it, just that until some more information comes out I'm not real impressed by it.

They're a dozen and a half shells presumably from a war two decades ago. Well before any sanctions existed. They look to have been buried at least ten years. The slips them inside of the sactions era, but if they're 15+ years buried then they're back outside again. They're leaky, obviously not in great shape and look to have been abandoned. This does not make me tremble at Iraq's mighty WMD programs prior to the war.

Really, right now it seems just as plausible that they got stuck in the ground during the war and forgotten about as opposed to being some hidden WMD weapons cache. I'd guess there's some decrepit American landmines in Vietnam buried somewhere -- doesn't mean we have an active program of landmining Vietnam.

Mind you though, I lack all the information and haven't seen much more than what was in the linked new stories. So I refrain from saying "Hahahaha! Stupid Bush!" but at the same time, I'm hardly ready to say "Gasp! Proof that Iraq was a threat to the free world with its powerful weapons!"

By "the war", I mean the Iraq-Iran war not the recent invasion

Edited, Mon Jan 12 14:29:00 2004 by Jophiel
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#32 Jan 12 2004 at 2:40 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:

Or I can keep goading you into posting responses and learn how to be the mostest inteligentiest person through osmosis.

Good that very would be.

Hey! Working already it is! Much you thank very! Forget generosity never I will your.

Skeet

Ineed. If only I would catch on to your 533kr17 plan and stop posting, I'd prove you wrong.

Or, alternately, I could recognize it for what it is: a feeble attempt to save face. In that case I'd just keep posting, forcing you to respond like a trained monkey who knows only one trick.

Again post will you because my ***** you are.

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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? ***. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#33 Jan 12 2004 at 2:58 PM Rating: Decent
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sorry got waylaid was kinda enjoying myself too

Ok back to the original reason i flamed Skeet

IF you read my original post ANY human being would have found it obvious that i was talking about sept 11th as it was the only date that i refered to in the post. My point was that you didn't read the post for the content you just looked for mistakes in my Grammer/Spelling or whatever and instead of posting a responce like Murth, you sought to ridicule in an effort to make yourself sound clever.

Murth dude i respect your loyalty, patriotism and zeal but honestly if you think an attitude like that will stop people raining bombs like that on your head you are very much mistaken. I would hate to see america bombed again just because it refused to look beyond it own pride and see what the root cause of the issue was. and your right America is great i agree so don't take this as an Anti America post because it's not.

I also agree with Totem that it will never happen because money talks and thats both sides Arabs and US. palastine will not except Israel for the same reason that Murth will never except that America is wrong to start a war on a country because of a group <That are Anti Saddam by the way> that happen to share the same ancestors bombed 1 building <and i don't mean to trivialise it at all it was and still is one of the most horrific act since WW2.>
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#34 Jan 12 2004 at 3:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Murth dude i respect your loyalty, patriotism and zeal but honestly if you think an attitude like that will stop people raining bombs like that on your head you are very much mistaken. I would hate to see america bombed again just because it refused to look beyond it own pride and see what the root cause of the issue was. and your right America is great i agree so don't take this as an Anti America post because it's not.



or we could bomb the living **** out of people and say

"see what happenms when you annoy us?"
"now go away or i shall taunt you a second time"


i dont believe we should constantly be fighting in the middle east.
i believe we should nuke the whole area from isreal to iran and turn it into a giant gas station.
#35 Jan 12 2004 at 3:24 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Posted by Smashypoo
Ineed.


Hmmm. Freudian Slip?

Ok, if you need it, I'll give it to you.

Quote:
Again post will you because my ***** you are.


Ditto. Tag, you're it.

Skeet





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#36 Jan 12 2004 at 3:24 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
i dont believe we should constantly be fighting in the middle east.
i believe we should nuke the whole area from isreal to iran and turn it into a giant gas station.

And then proceed to poison ourselves slowly by using the radioactive gas?
Or maybe you'd like to use it to kill off all the annoying people in Asia, as well.

Edited, Mon Jan 12 15:39:33 2004 by Atomicflea
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#37 Jan 12 2004 at 3:32 PM Rating: Good
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Murth, King of Bards wrote:

or we could bomb the living **** out of people and say
"see what happenms when you annoy us?"


And they will find a way to respond. Seriously, Murth, you really cannot believe that bombing the "****" out of other nations is a viable solution, can you?

Smiley: oyvey Think, McFly, think!
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#38 Jan 12 2004 at 4:07 PM Rating: Decent
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sorry got waylaid was kinda enjoying myself too


Kudos, I too enjoy getting way laid.

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IF you read my original post ANY human being would have found it obvious that i was talking about sept 11th as it was the only date that i refered to in the post.


Last time I checked, a new paragraph usually signifies a new thought/idea. Since you mentioned you are in the armed forces of some sort, I thought that perhaps you knew of a date that I was not aware of. I won't lie and say I am up to date with all of the current events.

You can say "I only type like **** because I'm chatting on a forum and it doesn't have to be perfect" but the fact still remains that saying Sept 11th in one paragraph, then mentioning 11/7 in another isn't going to make sense to everybody.

I could have assumed you meant Sept. 11th, but what you have to say is barely worth reading through, let alone pondering over typos/ill-thought out ideas.

Like I said before, think about what you are trying to say, maybe try reading over your post before hitting the submit button, and lets have a "grown-up" discussion.

Skeet
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#39 Jan 12 2004 at 4:19 PM Rating: Good
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Think, McFly, think!


well yes i was being a little exagerative in my way of dealing with the issue.

but seriously im tired of a good chunk of our national budget going to helping the isreali's and dealing with the "your better then us, so your evil and must die" mentality of the Middle East.

honestly i dont care anymore get over it.

our money could do much better things then dealing with these **** idiots
like curing cancer
or curing (sort of) albinism (so i can drive **** it ! )


#40 Jan 12 2004 at 5:22 PM Rating: Good
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I personally believe these shells, as theorized, to be part of an old, long-forgotten cache that was accidentally scrounged up and not part of any active warfare program. But, due to the pretenses, the blame-laying and overall incompetence, we need these shells to represent the justification for the war.

I still hold to my original opinion on what to do with the Middle East: nuke the place, turning it into one giant sheet of glass. If we want the oil, we can just drill through the glass. If not, well, just turn it into an amusement park. Imagine it; warring religious groups of the 20th century preserved for all eternity in solid glass. That's the best place for em.
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#41 Jan 12 2004 at 6:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Sheesh! Skeeter. Tarv. Lighten up you two!

When I read Tarv's post, it was pretty clear in context that 11/7 was at typo and that he meant to type 11/9. Since he said he was European, it was obvious (to me anyway) that he was writing in day/month style. From there it's kinda easy to figure out what he meant.

However, Skeeter is right that it would have been much easier to simply say: "Oops. I typoed and wrote 11/7 instead of 11/9". The issue would have been resolved at that point...


As to the relevance of finding the mortars? Questionable. Logically, it should prevent some of the criticism of Bush's pre-war statements. Unfortunately, most folks don't use logic when arguing a stance like that so it's probably not going to matter anyway.

The UN resolutions were very clear. Iraq was to dismantle its current bio/chem weapons under UN inspection. It was also to cease any further development of such weapons. The stated intent of the resolutions was to prevent Iraq from using such weapons either on its own citizens or on their neighbors. It was pretty obvious from Iraq's actions that they didn't intend to stop building and using such weapons, and hoped that if they dragged inspections on long enough, the UN would get tired of looking and go away. There's ample evidence of ongoing research into new bio/chem and nuclear weapons even after the resolutions were passed. What Bush was most criticised about wasn't the painstaking buildup of evidence of Iraq's lack of compliance with the resolutions, and the obvious reasons for that lack of compliance. The big criticism was that Bush said: "We know they have WMD" (WMD in that context being bio/chem weapons), yet we've yet to find a single bio/chem warhead.

Note that the interpretation is specifically literal in the critic's eye. Having all the evidence of ongoing research and development of WMD is irrelevant (and has in numerous arguments even on this board). All that matters is whether there are any physical weapons in Iraq. Now that we've found some, that line of attack should dissapate somewhat.

Of course, the hardline critics will then make the argument that the weapons found certainly weren't in condition to be used and didn't constitute a threat to the US or anyone else (cept maybe someone digging in the wrong part of the desert I suppose). But people like that simply wont be satisfied until someone actually attacks them personally on their own front lawn, with the aformentioned weapons. And even then, they'll attempt to rationalize it by blaming some sort of oppression that makes the attackers not responsible for their own actions...


The point is that these weapons indicate the intent of the Saddam regime. The whole reason the resolutions were passed was due to a percieved willingness to use bio/chem weapons on folks with little or no care given to anyone's wellbeing except those in control in Iraq. They're damned either way in this case. If the weapons were buried prior to the resolutions and had been forgotten, then they respresent a complete disregard for anyone's safty (and indicate a system of hiding weapons with little or no records of their locations). If they buried it after/during the resolutions, then it shows a desire to keep their weapons, even old crappy ones, rather then give them up as required by the UN.
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#42 Jan 12 2004 at 7:15 PM Rating: Good
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Please. So if back in the 80's, Private Abdullah goes and says "We'll bury these shells here and be able to use them later when the Iranians come near our position", digs a hole, buries some mortar shells and that night is killed in an ambush with his fellow soldiers, that means Iraq is willfully hiding weapons of mass destruction? Or it means that Iraq is being negligent in their handling of chemical weapons? Because, right now, that scenario is just as likely as some malicious intent. I suppose there's never been an abandoned cache of American weapons in any of our wars. If some kid in Vietnam finds a box of grenades hidden in the jungle where American forces died back in the 70's, that means the United States must be punished, right? What about those unexploded bits from cluster bombs?

The only thing the shells prove right now is that Iraq had a chemical weapons program in the 80's (provided the liquid proves to be a blister agent). That's hardly earth shattering news. Anything beyond that is guesswork until further evidence comes out.
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#43 Jan 12 2004 at 7:38 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Please. So if back in the 80's, Private Abdullah goes and says "We'll bury these shells here and be able to use them later when the Iranians come near our position", digs a hole, buries some mortar shells and that night is killed in an ambush with his fellow soldiers, that means Iraq is willfully hiding weapons of mass destruction? Or it means that Iraq is being negligent in their handling of chemical weapons?


More the latter then the former, but yes ( hehe ). Why the **** is "Private Abdullah" in charge of handing expensive chemical warheads? Especially to the point of being the sole person in charge of deciding where they are stored, with no records involved and no accounting of the weapons. Those are the sorts of weapons that most countries keep very carefully locked up, and if for some reason were to need/want to use them, would have serious controls on their use.

That's one of the reasons why the UN resolutions were passed. If we are to believe the "Private Abdullah" scenario, then that's probably the best argument for how those weapons could easily end up in terrorist hands that I've yet heard. I'm sure Private Abdullah knows he can sell those weapons for big cash on the black market. If the regime has no controls for tracking their chem/bio weapons, then how the **** are we to expec that they *aren't* going to end up in some random persons hands. Clearly, if they can be buried in the sand and "lost" for 15-20 years, they can also be buried in the sand, and dug up a few months later when a sale is made. I don't think it's hard to draw a nice dotted line here...


If the "Private Abdullah" schenario is not what's going on, then what is? Was this their method of storage and disposal of these weapons and materials? Yet more violations. Yet more reasons for concern. And it begs the next question: If these weren't "lost", then what were they? And why weren't they recorded and tallied as the UN required? Where are the "real" records then?

That's the whole point here. They are either keeping good track of their stuff, or they aren't. If they are, then they very clearly deliberately lied and falsified records in order to keep their weapons hidden from the UN inspectors. If they didn't, then the exact conditions that the US (and other nations) are concerned about in terms of the likelyhood of these weapons falling into terrorist hands are substantiated. Either way, this find goes a long way towards justifying the actions taken in Iraq.




Quote:
I suppose there's never been an abandoned cache of American weapons in any of our wars. If some kid in Vietnam finds a box of grenades hidden in the jungle where American forces died back in the 70's, that means the United States must be punished, right? What about those unexploded bits from cluster bombs?


There's a huge difference between ordinance "lost" in a battle area, and ordinance buried a hundred miles away from where the combat was happening. There's also an issue of what country the weapons were found in. The same regime has been in control of Iraq (and the area where the weapons were found) for the entire time period in question. This isn't a case of one military leaving unexploded stuff around when they were forced out of an area. This stuff wasn't "lost" on accident. It was "lost" on purpose. The only question is "why?". And even then, as I detailed above, it doesn't really matter.

Quote:
The only thing the shells prove right now is that Iraq had a chemical weapons program in the 80's (provided the liquid proves to be a blister agent). That's hardly earth shattering news. Anything beyond that is guesswork until further evidence comes out.


It says that they had a weapons program (which we knew). It also says that they either kept horrible records of the wherabouts of said weapons, or they deliberately concealed/destroyed such records in violation of the UN resolutions. Either one justifies the action taken in Iraq. More importantly, it justifies them for the exact reasons given. Either scenario leads us to either Iraq desiring to hide their weapons from the UN, or a likelyhood of such weapons falling into random (terrorist) hands, or both. While this isn't a huge smoking gun, it's more then we've found to date.
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#44 Jan 12 2004 at 7:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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[i]Ditto. Tag, you're it. [i]

Skeet





[/blue] And you call me an idiot [/blue]
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#45 Jan 12 2004 at 7:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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[i]Ditto. Tag, you're it. [i]

Skeet





And you call me an idiot!!!
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#46 Jan 12 2004 at 8:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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It is possible for you to be an idiot all on your own, yes.
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#47 Jan 12 2004 at 8:28 PM Rating: Good
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Why the **** is "Private Abdullah" in charge of handing expensive chemical warheads? Especially to the point of being the sole person in charge of deciding where they are stored, with no records involved and no accounting of the weapons
Replace "Private" with something else if you wish. Seriously, someone has to carry them around. Someone has to put them somewhere. I'm guessing said someone didn't walk around with a radio saying "Ok.. now I'm walking by the big rock. Ok, I'm at the big rock. Now I'm walking to the sand dune..." These weren't "warheads", they were mortar shells. Small, portable weapons made to be carried into battle by foot soldiers and fired from a portable launcher. Christ, you act like we found a thermonuclear warhead off an ICBM or something.

Quote:
This isn't a case of one military leaving unexploded stuff around when they were forced out of an area. This stuff wasn't "lost" on accident. It was "lost" on purpose
You know this how? That's right.. you're guessing. Honestly, there's currently no evidence one way or the other. The very simple fact is that right now no one knows the exact history of the cache and until someone can prove its history one way or the other, it means very little. Unless you have concrete evidence of anything else, you're just making stuff up.

It's kind of ironic how you could condemn a government for not keeping perfect track of all its munitions during a war. I mean, this is America where we misplace hard drives with nuclear secrets and lose anthrax and ebola samples even during peacetime.
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#48 Jan 12 2004 at 8:47 PM Rating: Good
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Just wanted to add:
Quote:
There's a huge difference between ordinance "lost" in a battle area, and ordinance buried a hundred miles away from where the combat was happening

Speaking in Baghdad, U.S. Gen. Mark Kimmitt said the rounds did appear to be blister agents.

"The age of those would indicate that those were probably 10 to 20 years old," he said, adding their location near the border with Iran made it likely they were used in that war.


Doesn't sound like they were hidden a hundred miles from combat to me. Or to the army.

However, I'll also add from the same story:
Adnan Khalifa, an Iraqi who lives near the sealed-off area, told a Danish TV2 reporter in Basra that he helped bury the mortar shells three years ago. "We also dumped some of them in the river," he said.

If that holds true, I'll be happy to admit that there's more to this than what it appears at first blush.
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#49 Jan 12 2004 at 8:52 PM Rating: Decent
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And you call me an idiot!!!


Actually, IIRC, I don't call you an idiot.

***** *****?

Yes.

Moron?

Yes.

Inbred?

Yep.

But I have yet to call you an idiot.

Though 99% of the forum does.

Idiot.

Make that 100% of the forum.

Skeet
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#50 Jan 12 2004 at 11:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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As long as you dig the point that I made, just that much deeper. Smash, Taco, and many others have said it. You are a worthless post farmer. Your wit wouldn't fill a thimble, and your dire need of attention is only barely out done by Thundra. Thundra, atleast, has the dignity to make her trolling amusing. Yours?? I would say its a bit more on the "hey look at me, I'm a loser" side. To each their own, but I do have to say,


Idiot:id·i·ot ( P ) Pronunciation Key (d-t)
n.
A foolish or stupid person.
A person of profound mental retardation having a mental age below three years and generally being unable to learn connected speech or guard against common dangers. The term belongs to a classification system no longer in use and is now considered offensive

does describe you quite nicely.


But why stop there? I mean, there are so many...


stupid stu·pid ( P ) Pronunciation Key (stpd, sty-)
adj. stu·pid·er, stu·pid·est
Slow to learn or understand; obtuse.
Tending to make poor decisions or careless mistakes.
Marked by a lack of intelligence or care; foolish or careless: a stupid mistake.
Dazed, stunned, or stupefied.
Pointless; worthless: a stupid job.

ignorant ig·no·rant ( P ) Pronunciation Key (gnr-nt)
adj.
Lacking education or knowledge.
Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge: an ignorant mistake.
Unaware or uninformedlunatic


lu·na·tic ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ln-tk)
adj.
Suffering from lunacy; insane.
Of or for the insane.
Wildly or giddily foolish: a lunatic decision.
Characterized by lunacy or eccentricity




And, to top it all off, I think you have to be the most unoriginal, self-entertained, irritating twit to ever post on these boards. Your demise can not come soon enough for me. I really hope you like running with sharp objects, because the sooner you rid yourself from these boards, the sooner the other miriad of idiots that have joined in your origy of dumbness will either shape up, or ship out.

You bring a whole new meaning to the word stupify!

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#51 Jan 13 2004 at 12:19 AM Rating: Default
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If you have a dictionary open, you could at least have spelled myriad, orgy and stupefy correctly.

Now it's time for a crash course in basic english.

Quote:
As long as you dig the point that I made, just that much deeper.


Presumably you're saying that he's only proving the point. However, whatever you are trying to say is lost due to the fact that your sentence structure is the envy of three-year olds everywhere. Your sentence is the equivilent of "I is smarter than."

Quote:
Smash, Taco, and many others have said it.


In other words, the "I'm a dumbass but these people think you are one too! So there!"

Quote:
Your wit wouldn't fill a thimble, and your dire need of attention is only barely out done by Thundra.


Wow, a thimble? That's small! Sadly, however, you failed to follow through, as you should have done. An example pertaining to you;

"Maybe if you stopped fu[b][/b]cking your cousin's half-inch long wang and cleaned the *** out of your face long enough to read you'd understand what I was saying."

See? It's so simple!

Quote:
Thundra, atleast, has the dignity to make her trolling amusing. Yours?? I would say its a bit more on the "hey look at me, I'm a loser" side.


In other words, the "I'm still a dumbass, she's a dumbass, but you're even MORER of a dumbass!" argument.

Quote:
And, to top it all off,


We cower in fear of the culmination of you're stunningly witty and effective assault upon the very bastions of our existence.

Quote:
I think you have to be the most unoriginal, self-entertained, irritating twit to ever post on these boards. Your demise can not come soon enough for me.


So sayeth the poster who's been acknowledged as more dangerous to a suicidal person than a razor blade, a glass full of Drano and a loaded pistol combined.

Quote:
You bring a whole new meaning to the word stupify!


As mentioned above, it's spelled stupefy.
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