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Isn't it time we raise Protect V to match its tier?Follow

#1 Sep 05 2011 at 11:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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The protect line of spells go up in amounts of +15 every tier except when you hit 5. Then it becomes a paltry +5 for no adequately explained reason. Even as a White Mage with capped merits it will not become the +70 defence it should be. Shell at least is more inline with the bonuses gained with regular tiers, and with merits actually exceeds that! This is why its arguably the most useful of the two to cap merits on.

With the level cap continuing to rise and more difficult content being released to make full use of those extra levels, isn't it high time we made the adjustment and allow players to get the expected bonus from this?
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#2 Sep 06 2011 at 1:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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Still won't make the spell particularly useful, but sure, why not.

IMO, additional Protectra merits should have given it a slight -PDT effect instead of more defense (especially the paltry amount that they currently give). Even -1% per point would have at least made it possibly worth considering; as is, anything more than one point is utterly worthless.
#3 Sep 06 2011 at 10:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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Fynlar wrote:
Still won't make the spell particularly useful, but sure, why not.

IMO, additional Protectra merits should have given it a slight -PDT effect instead of more defense (especially the paltry amount that they currently give). Even -1% per point would have at least made it possibly worth considering; as is, anything more than one point is utterly worthless.

I personally agree with adding Physical damage reduction to Protectra Merits. It could be done in lieu of raising its defense bonus. Make the basic Protect V and Protectra V spells grant 70 defense, and allow merits to grant a reduction to damage taken. That way, Paladins, Red Mages and Scholars benefit from the raised defence bonus, and white mages continue to get a reason to cap this spell on their merits.

I'm sure even SE realise that Protect V is barely worth the extra MP to cast as it stands.
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#4 Sep 06 2011 at 11:55 AM Rating: Good
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Fynlar wrote:
Still won't make the spell particularly useful, but sure, why not.

IMO, additional Protectra merits should have given it a slight -PDT effect instead of more defense (especially the paltry amount that they currently give). Even -1% per point would have at least made it possibly worth considering; as is, anything more than one point is utterly worthless.



I agree, except the entire protect line should, with merits enhancing it further. Good idea.
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#5 Sep 06 2011 at 12:22 PM Rating: Default
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Fynlar wrote:
Still won't make the spell particularly useful, but sure, why not.

IMO, additional Protectra merits should have given it a slight -PDT effect instead of more defense (especially the paltry amount that they currently give). Even -1% per point would have at least made it possibly worth considering; as is, anything more than one point is utterly worthless.

I don't know about that. Giving -PDT with Protect sounds more like something RDM (or maybe even SCH) should be have. I wouldn't be against WHMs being able to do the same thing along side RDMs and SCHs. But it seems strange to me that only WHMs would get a boost like that.
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#6 Sep 06 2011 at 5:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
I don't know about that. Giving -PDT with Protect sounds more like something RDM (or maybe even SCH) should be have. I wouldn't be against WHMs being able to do the same thing along side RDMs and SCHs. But it seems strange to me that only WHMs would get a boost like that.


IDK, it only made sense to me because Shellra merits does the same thing with MDT. WHMs are capable of a notably stronger Shell effect than the other jobs.

WHMs can also get a stronger Protect, except this time the difference is completely unnoticeable and is never worth the extra merits.
#7 Sep 06 2011 at 9:43 PM Rating: Default
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Fynlar wrote:
Quote:
I don't know about that. Giving -PDT with Protect sounds more like something RDM (or maybe even SCH) should be have. I wouldn't be against WHMs being able to do the same thing along side RDMs and SCHs. But it seems strange to me that only WHMs would get a boost like that.


IDK, it only made sense to me because Shellra merits does the same thing with MDT. WHMs are capable of a notably stronger Shell effect than the other jobs.

WHMs can also get a stronger Protect, except this time the difference is completely unnoticeable and is never worth the extra merits.

I agree that it makes sense from a purely WHM Group 2 Merit perspective. But most jobs have crappy Group 2 Merit options. I would rather keep this merit option relatively crappy rather than increasing the gap between WHM and the other healer/support mages.
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#8 Sep 06 2011 at 10:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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svlyons wrote:
Fynlar wrote:
Quote:
I don't know about that. Giving -PDT with Protect sounds more like something RDM (or maybe even SCH) should be have. I wouldn't be against WHMs being able to do the same thing along side RDMs and SCHs. But it seems strange to me that only WHMs would get a boost like that.


IDK, it only made sense to me because Shellra merits does the same thing with MDT. WHMs are capable of a notably stronger Shell effect than the other jobs.

WHMs can also get a stronger Protect, except this time the difference is completely unnoticeable and is never worth the extra merits.

I agree that it makes sense from a purely WHM Group 2 Merit perspective. But most jobs have crappy Group 2 Merit options. I would rather keep this merit option relatively crappy rather than increasing the gap between WHM and the other healer/support mages.

White Mages are the only job capable of casting Protectra. Scholar's can fake it using Accession, but it does not cast like Protectra (Uses single-target animation only) and it uses a strategem charge each time. Thus WHM is the only job which can obtain the entire line of Protect and Shell spells. This makes sense because it is traditionally a healers job to not only restore HP but to reduce damage in the first place.

I'm not entirely sure why you think Protect is a RDM's domain. They might get higher enhancing magic, but that's only because they boast many different magic spells to enhance their own personal ability in combat. They actually have relatively few spells which are cast upon a target. The most notable ones are Refresh and Phalanx II, the latter you only get via merits.

RDM is a largely a very selfish job (The class, people, not the player). The bulk of its enhancing spells are self-target only. They're the only job to get single target barspells and gain spells. Somehow this doesn't shout to me as being a likely candidate for a spell designed to benefit the team as a whole.
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#9 Sep 07 2011 at 1:30 AM Rating: Good
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Glitterhands wrote:
I'm not entirely sure why you think Protect is a RDM's domain.

I don't think Protect is a RDM's domain. -PDT also isn't an aspect of Protect to begin with.

Glitterhands wrote:
They actually have relatively few spells which are cast upon a target. The most notable ones are Refresh and Phalanx II, the latter you only get via merits.

Phalanx II is precisely the reason why I felt that a spell giving -PDT is more **** for RDM than WHM.
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#10 Sep 07 2011 at 6:56 AM Rating: Good
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Vote Yes on this... was unaware V was such a small boost over IV.

If anything, Tier potency should raise MORE at higher levels for obvious reasons.

At a MINIMUM, should be consistent... (unless WHM is to be given a trait or merit to exclusively boost without changing spell effect itself)

... just curious, does Cureskin scale appropriately ?
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#11 Sep 07 2011 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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... just curious, does Cureskin scale appropriately ?


Not sure what you mean here. Cureskin strength at default is 25% of whatever your Cure would have healed (meaning, if you cast a Cure that would have healed 400 but the target was only missing 40 HP, he still gets a 100-HP Cureskin anyway). It caps at 300, so Cures for more than 1200 will not strengthen the Cureskin effect any further.

Using an upgraded AF3 body will increase the proportion and potential cap of Cureskin, but this actually reduces the required Cure amount necessary to hit the cap. AF3+1 body makes Cureskin strength 30% of what you heal for and ups the cap to 350, meaning a Cure of 1167 is needed to hit the cap. AF3+2 body makes it 35% and caps at 400, meaning a Cure of 1143 is needed to hit the cap.
#12 Sep 10 2011 at 3:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Cureskin strength at default is 25% of whatever your Cure would have healed


Yea, thats what I was wondering.
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