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Do you HATE THF? DWI @ 83?Follow

#1 Aug 27 2010 at 1:47 PM Rating: Good
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Really!!!!!!???


Really!!!!!!???


DWI at 83!!?? What is the point? Why tell us you are giving us Dual Wield and then give us Dual Wield I at 83?

I am really tired of you kicking THF in the balls. If you don't do something right and give us sometihng actually useful this update, I really think I might quit. I'm tired of waiting around for you to get it.

I won't be playing FFXIV either. I'm tired of this **** and I'm tired of you not listening to us.
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#2 Aug 27 2010 at 1:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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With your name I thought you would be happy with this update.
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#3 Aug 27 2010 at 3:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, seriously, this is the worst practical joke they've played on the job, in my eyes. Despoil was really bad, taking away yokodama was sucky but understandable, removing the TP floor was junk... but this? This is just inexcuseable.

Square-Enix, have you not heard all of the thieves wishing for Dual Wield nearly on par with what Dancers receieved? Why is thief not deserving, because they have Treasure Hunter? My god, if you want it so much, take it- I'd rather have dual wield than treasure hunter any day if it meant people would stop viewing the job solely as an item obtainer. Yes, I absolutely love gaining items and stealing equipment from monsters, but not when my usefulness in other areas becomes tainted.

There is absolutely no reason why Thief should not receive atleast up to Dual Wield 3 before level 76.
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#4 Aug 27 2010 at 4:59 PM Rating: Default
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What changes about the job? You actually got something, nothing was taken away. I can understand you're ***** about not getting something good, but hey, atleast it's not a nerf.

Edited, Aug 27th 2010 6:59pm by BlackyLakshmi
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#5 Aug 27 2010 at 5:09 PM Rating: Good
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Not nerfs that don't add anything always feels like burning money. You just paid someone a fat pay check to write code nobody wanted. Imagine if everyone could do that. Just sit at home and write print loops and get 2 000 dollars a month.
#6 Aug 27 2010 at 6:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm positively giddy over all the stuff that my mage jobs are getting. I mean, I'm bouncing in my chair here, debating which one I wanna level to 85 first. It's a hard choice!

But THF . . . I just can't excited over this. We're still gonna be stuck subbing NIN or DNC depending on the situation. Nothing has really changed at all.

SE doesn't know what they want THF to do. We're wandering in the dark, lost, without any direction.

At least we're better off than the NINs, though. People still want at least 1 of us in each alliance.
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#7 Aug 27 2010 at 6:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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KnivesJonquil wrote:
Why is thief not deserving, because they have Treasure Hunter? My god, if you want it so much, take it-
My thoughts exactly.
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#8 Aug 27 2010 at 6:33 PM Rating: Good
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BlackyLakshmi wrote:
What changes about the job? You actually got something, nothing was taken away. I can understand you're ***** about not getting something good, but hey, atleast it's not a nerf.


The boss gives me a rock. He gives everyone beside me gems, but I get this little pebble. Nothing was taken away, but that doesn't change the fact that I was given something that doesn't help me in the slightest. Now imagine this happens three times in a row, and you'd start to wonder why you're being shunned too.

Nothing changes about the job, and that's the very center of the problem. 90% of the thieves on each server will continue to use ninja and dancer as support jobs, in part because they offer DW traits higher than 1. It's not a nerf, but it's an extreme disappointment when we've been looking forward to our own dual wield trait for years. Instead, we're essentially being given nothing while everyone else gets something. BLM and NIN finally get more spells, BST atleast gets their TP trait, but Thief... we're "gifted" a lesser version of a trait we've essentially had this whole time through using other jobs. It's insulting.
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#9 Aug 27 2010 at 6:53 PM Rating: Good
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KnivesJonquil wrote:
BlackyLakshmi wrote:
What changes about the job? You actually got something, nothing was taken away. I can understand you're ***** about not getting something good, but hey, atleast it's not a nerf.


The boss gives me a rock. He gives everyone beside me gems, but I get this little pebble. Nothing was taken away, but that doesn't change the fact that I was given something that doesn't help me in the slightest. Now imagine this happens three times in a row, and you'd start to wonder why you're being shunned too.

Nothing changes about the job, and that's the very center of the problem. 90% of the thieves on each server will continue to use ninja and dancer as support jobs, in part because they offer DW traits higher than 1. It's not a nerf, but it's an extreme disappointment when we've been looking forward to our own dual wield trait for years. Instead, we're essentially being given nothing while everyone else gets something. BLM and NIN finally get more spells, BST atleast gets their TP trait, but Thief... we're "gifted" a lesser version of a trait we've essentially had this whole time through using other jobs. It's insulting.


No, BST got awesome jugs last update I would say. This sTP thing might be nice, but those jugs.. Man it's awesome what agood BST can do with those. BLM got lolabyssea parties which resolved a lot (Not all) of what they were unhappy about. (Rest in pieces you ****** god **** toucans, mwahahahha!)

I would say NIN is the other melee in need of an update besides us now, due to the /DRK nerfs. (Sorry, NIN could DD respectably and NIN/DRK tank HNMs before so I thought it was a decent balance, and I respect NINs who thought they needed an update before) Make them a good DD or a good tank. Make THF a good DD or an honest utility job.

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#10 Aug 28 2010 at 6:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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You know, at first i thought of making a few snide posts at THF's for all this drama but... Looking at it now it really is unfair.
Square-Enix you need to do something about this, make THF have the same Dual Wield ability as a DNC.
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#12 Aug 28 2010 at 11:45 AM Rating: Good
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Fynlar wrote:
Good Lord people, just keep subbing /NIN or whatever and shut your ******* ***** mouths.

The trait's going to keep scaling up with more levels.


Let's say it does. Okay, great! Now, what about all of the thieves leveling from 1-90, or whenever they may intend to scale up the Job Trait? It's still really unfair.

For the record, telling a big mob of frustrated people to "shut your ******* ***** mouths" is never tactful.
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#13 Aug 28 2010 at 1:43 PM Rating: Decent
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Let's say it does. Okay, great! Now, what about all of the thieves leveling from 1-90, or whenever they may intend to scale up the Job Trait? It's still really unfair.


Unfortunately, a lot of jobs don't get to be awesome until higher levels. My PUP really thinks that Ventriloquy and Role Reversal should be standard abilities obtained well before merit level. The game doesn't agree with him, though.

Quote:
For the record, telling a big mob of frustrated people to "shut your ******* ***** mouths" is never tactful.


Read the OP again for me and tell me if you think it sounds tactful.

Edited, Aug 28th 2010 3:44pm by Fynlar
#14 Aug 28 2010 at 2:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Fynlar wrote:
Good Lord people, just keep subbing /NIN or whatever and shut your ******* ***** mouths.

The trait's going to keep scaling up with more levels.


Ahhahhaaha. Thanks Fyn. I needed a laugh.
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#15 Aug 28 2010 at 7:03 PM Rating: Default
Even if THFs had DW, they'd still sub NIN for shadows anyway so what's the big deal? You'll get DWIII at 90 as THF/NIN anyway.
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#16 Aug 29 2010 at 3:52 AM Rating: Good
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TheHolyDragoonSeraphus wrote:
Even if THFs had DW, they'd still sub NIN for shadows anyway so what's the big deal? You'll get DWIII at 90 as THF/NIN anyway.


The big deal is that THF does need something. This was supposed to be the time. The opportunity for new direction with the level increase.

The big deal is that when we saw that they were ACTUALLY giving us dual wield we got excited. It showed that SE was, indeed, giving us something that was actually a useful and meaningful increase in damage. It showed a direction to look to in this whole "Is THF a DD job or a support DD or what?" Identity crisis that SE seems to have with us.

They didn't even half *** this one. It is ENTIRELY reasonable to expect that we will only get DWII by 99. Something that will be outshined by /NIN by that point.

The big deal is that they are still wasting developement time giving us useless crap like DWI at 83 when we NEED something useful.

It's not even fun any more to make jokes about how SE is intentionally ******** with us.



Edited, Aug 29th 2010 5:55am by ThiefKiller
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#17 Aug 29 2010 at 4:00 AM Rating: Good
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I'll give you guys points for the very good comparisons, and I'll admit, you're right.

However, this is the exact attitude RDM's had last update, now they get Saboteur, a new enfeeble and Refresh II. Jobs can and will get tweaked as long as SE still supports the game. Be a bit more patient, your time'll come sooner or later. There's still at least three more updates to go if SE follows the current trend.
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#18 Aug 29 2010 at 5:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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Of course you can question how fun it will be to require to level a job to 99 before you become useful.

Not that much of a deal for people who keep their jobs leveled, but a new player picking THF and being told "don't worry, at level 99 you'll start to shine" will probably change job instantly.
#19 Aug 29 2010 at 5:36 AM Rating: Decent
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Of course you can question how fun it will be to require to level a job to 99 before you become useful.

Not that much of a deal for people who keep their jobs leveled, but a new player picking THF and being told "don't worry, at level 99 you'll start to shine" will probably change job instantly.


Thieves have other qualities, I would imagine, or are you implying the job is useless until a decent update? Thieves aren't getting much, and I can see why you'd view Despoil as a practical joke, but barring TH, Thieves can still manage hate to an extent and I see them put out good WS numbers more often than not. It's not like THF is the new loljob.

As for the new player thing, it's only natural that every job gets better traits and abilities as the level increases. If he's not willing to level THF to 99 because the job isn't interesting before that, I'd hardly call said player a loss for the Thief community.
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#20 Aug 29 2010 at 5:57 AM Rating: Good
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Thieves can still manage hate to an extent


No one cares about that. The game has not needed enmity control for many many years. Our enmity manipulation tools are not useful enough to warrant a party slot for them.

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I see them put out good decent WS numbers more often than not.


Our WS numbers are decent at best and are tied to our SATA timers (and positionability..is that a word?) to be respectable. Positional DD abilities were relevant in 2004 when you never did anything without a tank. They are not effective now. SE keeps adding this positional garbage too. I really feel bad for NINs. They keep adding events that involve large groups that don't need tanks but keep forcing me to run circles around a constantly spinning mob just to try to deal decent damage while trying to sneak in a trick attack on a DD before he jumps out of the way or just moves because that spot of dirt didn't suit him.

Quote:

It's not like THF is the new loljob.


This isn't new lol. THF has been at lolstatus for a long time now. And its becuase of things like this. The game has evolved and THF has not.

All I have ever had is patience. It's just running out.

Edited, Aug 29th 2010 7:58am by ThiefKiller
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#21Seedling, Posted: Aug 29 2010 at 9:39 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) You should. All the good devs are working on it. The version updates to level 80 and 85 have obviously been done by the B-team.
#22 Aug 29 2010 at 10:12 AM Rating: Good
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ThiefKiller wrote:
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Thieves can still manage hate to an extent

No one cares about that. The game has not needed enmity control for many many years. Our enmity manipulation tools are not useful enough to warrant a party slot for them.

SE do. They did add some enmity management spells for SCH (and they had one song for BRD nobody use).
They add some new jump abilities for DRG that decrease enmity with shared timer with another jump ... that does exactly the same thing :-3
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#23 Aug 29 2010 at 10:50 AM Rating: Good
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BlackyLakshmi wrote:
I'll give you guys points for the very good comparisons, and I'll admit, you're right.

However, this is the exact attitude RDM's had last update, now they get Saboteur, a new enfeeble and Refresh II. Jobs can and will get tweaked as long as SE still supports the game. Be a bit more patient, your time'll come sooner or later. There's still at least three more updates to go if SE follows the current trend.


Which isn't to say none of the listed won't be our own personal Despoils. It's a start toward something possibly better (Opinions on Refresh **** aside), but SE's baby step attitude is something that has treated RDMs relatively poorly over the years, be it from job specific updates to keep things fresh (Not Refreshed :p) or equipment to help with the roles we do believe we're lacking in (tank neutering aside).

I'm still on the wait and see camp for THF. The job is in my top three (which fluctuates based on my mood) and I don't feel it's all literal doom and gloom with the update itself taking nothing despite the suggested frugal giving. Job bias is certainly a concern everyone faces to some degree at some point throughout FFXI, but I think a lot of times the problem isn't being #1 DD so much as it is chances at potential utility are sub-par or outright useless.
#24 Aug 29 2010 at 1:03 PM Rating: Default
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I didn't even bother reading any of this thread past the OP.

Save your frustration (whining) until the last level rise has occurred.

Way back when, the level cap was 50. THF didn't have Assassin yet at that point.

Let's say the level cap rose to 55, and all the THFs lost their damned minds. With what was still coming further down the road at 60, wouldn't you say those who screamed and cried were being total idiots?

I would.

Put down your pitchforks and have some patience.

Edited, Aug 29th 2010 12:03pm by Speedly
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#25 Aug 29 2010 at 5:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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Speedly wrote:
I didn't even bother reading any of this thread past the OP.

Save your frustration (whining) until the last level rise has occurred.

Way back when, the level cap was 50. THF didn't have Assassin yet at that point.

Let's say the level cap rose to 55, and all the THFs lost their damned minds. With what was still coming further down the road at 60, wouldn't you say those who screamed and cried were being total idiots?

I would.

Put down your pitchforks and have some patience.


You really should read a thread before commenting.

Thief didn't have Assassin back when the level cap was at 50 because they didn't need it. Other jobs were also starting out, and if anything Thief was actually more powerful at level 50 back when the level cap existed than it is now because of Yokodama and the TP floor.

Being patient is becoming too hard in regards to this game. We have a right to be up-in-arms when updates only come every 3-4 months and Square continually ignores jobs. The only thing people can say is "maybe they'll address the issue next update," because Square never comes right out and talks directly about fixing player concerns unless they get international attention. It's a constant game of uncertainty, and that's why people are so upset. "Have some patience?" How long do you expect people to be patient for? I was patient until Despoil came; not anymore.
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#26 Aug 29 2010 at 5:55 PM Rating: Decent
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KnivesJonquil wrote:
You really should read a thread before commenting.

Thief didn't have Assassin back when the level cap was at 50 because they didn't need it. Other jobs were also starting out, and if anything Thief was actually more powerful at level 50 back when the level cap existed than it is now because of Yokodama and the TP floor.

Being patient is becoming too hard in regards to this game. We have a right to be up-in-arms when updates only come every 3-4 months and Square continually ignores jobs. The only thing people can say is "maybe they'll address the issue next update," because Square never comes right out and talks directly about fixing player concerns unless they get international attention. It's a constant game of uncertainty, and that's why people are so upset. "Have some patience?" How long do you expect people to be patient for? I was patient until Despoil came; not anymore.
And yet, there are jobs that have it worse than thf.
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#27 Aug 30 2010 at 3:01 AM Rating: Default
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have a right to be up-in-arms

It's a video game. If it's so terrible that your blood pressure is rising over something so ridiculous, please play something else. And that's not a "quit whining and GTFO" I'm trying to lay upon you, I'm just saying that if you're really that angry over something so insignificant in the big picture of life, then maybe it's time to choose something more tame.

Sure, it sucks. But really, it is at worst a minor inconvenience to your life, and there are MUCH more important things to be "up-in-arms" about.

Edited, Aug 30th 2010 2:02am by Speedly
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#28 Aug 30 2010 at 3:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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I find it also amusing that SE appears to be giving thf yet ANOTHER magical wind based weaponskill. <_<;;; (That's probably also AoE, has terrible damage potential, and of course, doesn't stack with sneak attack/trick attack)

Honestly, Is thf supposed to be Wind Mage and the name got lost in translation or something? :x
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#29 Aug 30 2010 at 9:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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Speedly wrote:
Quote:
have a right to be up-in-arms

It's a video game. If it's so terrible that your blood pressure is rising over something so ridiculous, please play something else. And that's not a "quit whining and GTFO" I'm trying to lay upon you, I'm just saying that if you're really that angry over something so insignificant in the big picture of life, then maybe it's time to choose something more tame.

Sure, it sucks. But really, it is at worst a minor inconvenience to your life, and there are MUCH more important things to be "up-in-arms" about.

Edited, Aug 30th 2010 2:02am by Speedly


That is actually my argument for making things less painful. People say I'm crazy when I say make campaign exp based on time. But it is a game, right? What about spending less hours grinding is negative?

Sometimes I just think majority of players think FFXI is a beauty contest, and there can only be one winner.
#30 Sep 01 2010 at 9:15 PM Rating: Default
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Low delay on daggers combined with triple attack and double attack..... please.... Not to mention all the haste you can wear on thf. You thfs are better off cause your tp gain wont get haxed and you will still attack like crazy. Ill be suprised if you can even tell a difference without a 3rd party program. Even when i use the trait on on my blu **** i double attack so much there is almost no delay thats noticeable cause i never stop swinging. Yall all tripping off nothing and most of you will still sub nin anyway for shadows. Be glad your not a nin our most unique trait is being given to everyone and we already climing an uphill battle.
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#31 Sep 01 2010 at 9:49 PM Rating: Decent
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Low delay on daggers combined with triple attack and double attack..... please.... Not to mention all the haste you can wear on thf. You thfs are better off cause your tp gain wont get haxed and you will still attack like crazy. Ill be suprised if you can even tell a difference without a 3rd party program. Even when i use the trait on on my blu **** i double attack so much there is almost no delay thats noticeable cause i never stop swinging. Yall all tripping off nothing and most of you will still sub nin anyway for shadows. Be glad your not a nin our most unique trait is being given to everyone and we already climing an uphill battle.

Line breaks, dude.
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#32 Sep 01 2010 at 10:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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AlternativeOne wrote:
Be glad your not a nin our most unique trait is being given to everyone and we already climing an uphill battle.

I'm really tired of reading this. It just smacks of bitterness over something rather trivial. Being "unique" as far as native dual wield was concerned didn't make NIN more powerful before, and losing that uniqueness hasn't hurt them more. It's like complaining about your hood ornament when your tires are flat.
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#33 Sep 01 2010 at 10:39 PM Rating: Decent
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svlyons wrote:
AlternativeOne wrote:
Be glad your not a nin our most unique trait is being given to everyone and we already climing an uphill battle.
I'm really tired of reading this. It just smacks of bitterness over something rather trivial. Being "unique" as far as native dual wield was concerned didn't make NIN more powerful before, and losing that uniqueness hasn't hurt them more. It's like complaining about your hood ornament when your tires are flat.
Well it actually does make nin slightly less useful for the one thing it was still useful for: subjobs.


And if giving other jobs dw was what those jobs needed to be more useful than nin, that would make nin less useful. It might not actually be worse, but relative to other jobs, it's worse, which is really the same as being worse. But yeah, in this case nin wasn't useful anyway, so nothing of value was lost.
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#34 Sep 02 2010 at 7:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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'Other jobs have it worse' means what exactly and why?

"You broke my arm!"
"Well just be glad your not a paraplegic!"
"That doesnt make it hurt less, doesnt make me feel any better, nor is it helpful/constructive in any way to the current situation"

We get it. Nin needs help. Go make your own thread instead of sh*tting on our parade jeez. No one said nin isnt in the same sinking boat, nor that nin doesnt also need help. SE has ignored a couple jobs and nin+thf are 2 of em.

(one of) the problems with Thf DW one is that it literally does nothing. "Oh well you will just /nin /dnc anyway so stop complaining". THATS THE POINT. SE paid some programmers to write this sh*t and it quite literally will have ZERO effect in any way shape or form because our best offense and best defense (and arguable best utility via stealing hate and blink tanking, kiting, etc) are ALL based on /nin. Its as good as giving us nothing with additional effect: salt in the wound. This is worse than giving nothing because it is nothing tied with a slap in the face. At least despoil (no matter how sh*tty) actually added something to the job, even though that nothing was garbage. This was in a sense worse than nothing because it is a morale hit while adding no actual benefit of any kind. The ONLY benefit to native DW is the ability to stick our lovely TH+1 knife in our offhand during 1st floor salvage because we CANT /nin yet. Thats it.

This update is about as awesome as:

SE:Ninja will receive new powerful magic next update!
Players: OMG FINALLY! HOlY CRAP i cant wait!!!
Patch Notes: Ninja has received the spell blink.
Players: RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 9:47am by Banalaty
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#35 Sep 02 2010 at 7:41 AM Rating: Decent
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SE paid some programmers to write this sh*t and it quite literally will have ZERO effect in any way shape or form because our best offense and best defense (and arguable best utility via stealing hate and blink tanking, kiting, etc) are ALL based on /nin.
/war is a pretty common sub for hnm.
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#36 Sep 02 2010 at 7:56 AM Rating: Good
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/war is a pretty common sub for hnm.


Since when? 2003? Lets list the wide array of endgame content that meet these following criteria for going thf/war:
A: does not have AOES that are blink-able
B: a mob people actually allow melees to melee
C: Are actually HARD enough mobs that zerk/DA would actually do more damage than DW3 (weaker mobs DW outshines /war for DD)
D: let the thf in before 5% so they can "do their job" of tagging the mob while letting a DD with actual DD potential on high end mobs take that slot the other 95% of its life because Thf simply cant do the same damage as other DDs on high end mobs no matter what they sub.
E: Will not be doing anything else immediately before or after that also requires /nin (doing more than 1 event back to back. 1 that requires /nin, the other which one 'could' /war)

Go ahead. Ill wait.

I personally cant recall off the top of my head the last time i went thf/war to anything that wasnt fafnir so I could voke claim. I think it was a Kirin about 1.5 years ago.

Edit:
TLDR Thf/war is largely impractical and still struggles to beat /nin in overall DD while sacrificing any semblance of defense.

Now Thf with DW3 native would open up a world of hurt /war but sacrifice defense. fair trade. One could also thf/drg and combine hate steal with hate shed and nice 25% haste builds. Or /sam and be more effective. Or /drk and get a 30%+ attack speed boost and put out OK damage on a zerg besides just sticking feint+TH. DW would unbind us from /nin as the best sub for everything and give us a huge new toolbag to fit niche situations across the board more effectively which we cant when we are bound to /nin for everything and changing subs gives to little and costs to much.

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 10:04am by Banalaty

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 10:06am by Banalaty
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#37 Sep 02 2010 at 8:15 AM Rating: Good
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It's not like it matters really. As long as mobs gain TP from our attacks to the degree that they do, the very idea of a THF meleeing an HNM (besides to apply Treasure Hunter) makes even the most hardcore healer wet his pantaloons. Whether this concern is valid or not I leave to the more scientific among us, but this is certainly the perception at the very least.

The real issue is that they need to do something to make 1-hand/Dual Wield a more viable from of damage dealing against strong mobs. Not more viable than 2-hand, but certainly better than it is now. They either need to lower the "risk" involved from allowing 1-hand/Dual Wield to melee(Subtle Blow doesn't seem to accomplish this), or make the damage they deal worth the potential risk. And I mean visibly worth it in order to shatter any doubt.
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#38 Sep 02 2010 at 8:20 AM Rating: Decent
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A) most mobs do not
B) What exactly wouldn't you melee? Tiamat?
C) Hence why i said for hnm
D) Who the **** brings 19+ people to anything anymore?
E) Sure.
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#39 Sep 02 2010 at 8:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
As long as mobs gain TP from our attacks to the degree that they do, the very idea of a THF meleeing an HNM (besides to apply Treasure Hunter) makes even the most hardcore healer wet his pantaloons.
A party of dds will feed 100 to in all of 2 seconds, tp feed doesn't mean jack sh*t, unless you're not using any melees.

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 10:21am by ThePsychoticOne
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#40 Sep 02 2010 at 8:43 AM Rating: Good
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ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Quote:
As long as mobs gain TP from our attacks to the degree that they do, the very idea of a THF meleeing an HNM (besides to apply Treasure Hunter) makes even the most hardcore healer wet his pantaloons.
A party of dds will feed 100 to in all of 2 seconds, tp feed doesn't mean jack sh*t, unless you're not using any melees.

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 10:21am by ThePsychoticOne



OK, well that's good to know. So now what can be done about the second paragraph of my post? How do we make 1-hand/DW just as viable as 2-hand without trivializing 2-hand?
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#41 Sep 02 2010 at 10:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Camiie wrote:
How do we make 1-hand/DW just as viable as 2-hand without trivializing 2-hand?

Could just give NIN, THF and BLU access to a 2 handed weapon with at least A- skill rating.
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#42 Sep 02 2010 at 11:44 AM Rating: Excellent
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Dev1: "Let's give THF a 'Great Dagger' so they can have the 2H mod and better HNM WS!"
Dev2: "Wouldn't that be called a sword?"
Dev1: "Who are you again?"
Dev2: "Oh, I'm Hiro.."
Dev1: "You're fired."
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#43 Sep 02 2010 at 2:05 PM Rating: Good
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Camiie wrote:
ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Quote:
As long as mobs gain TP from our attacks to the degree that they do, the very idea of a THF meleeing an HNM (besides to apply Treasure Hunter) makes even the most hardcore healer wet his pantaloons.
A party of dds will feed 100 to in all of 2 seconds, tp feed doesn't mean jack sh*t, unless you're not using any melees.

Edited, Sep 2nd 2010 10:21am by ThePsychoticOne



OK, well that's good to know. So now what can be done about the second paragraph of my post? How do we make 1-hand/DW just as viable as 2-hand without trivializing 2-hand?


You seem to be missing that regardless of how balanced they are, nobody is going to care for the weaker alternative. Only way to make people stop caring, is to make all weapons identical and all DDs identical. Might not be fun, but there won't be whining.
#44 Sep 02 2010 at 2:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Mellowy wrote:
Camiie wrote:
ThePsychoticOne the Prohpet wrote:
Quote:
As long as mobs gain TP from our attacks to the degree that they do, the very idea of a THF meleeing an HNM (besides to apply Treasure Hunter) makes even the most hardcore healer wet his pantaloons.
A party of dds will feed 100 to in all of 2 seconds, tp feed doesn't mean jack sh*t, unless you're not using any melees.
OK, well that's good to know. So now what can be done about the second paragraph of my post? How do we make 1-hand/DW just as viable as 2-hand without trivializing 2-hand?
You seem to be missing that regardless of how balanced they are, nobody is going to care for the weaker alternative. Only way to make people stop caring, is to make all weapons identical and all DDs identical. Might not be fun, but there won't be whining.
Of course there would be whining, it'd just be about how every job is identical, instead of how nin/thf/etc are ****** jobs.
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#45 Sep 02 2010 at 2:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mellowy wrote:
You seem to be missing that regardless of how balanced they are, nobody is going to care for the weaker alternative. Only way to make people stop caring, is to make all weapons identical and all DDs identical. Might not be fun, but there won't be whining.



I think we're sorta on the same page actually. The way I see it is that while different DD jobs may use a different style of combat or style of play, they should ultimately arrive at the same result without any penalty from choosing one over the other. Pick the style you want, play and gear it to its fullest, and you're just as good at killing things as the guy doing the same with a different style. That would be ideal IMO. Will that ideal become reality or even be attempted at this point or ever? Obviously not. To be honest, there's probably a lot in the community who'd be upset if this did become the case. Not that I'd understand anyone thinking that way, but /shrug.
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#46 Sep 03 2010 at 3:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Please disregard this thread. SE FINALLY fixed despoil and that's pretty much what we needed.

Nothing to see here.
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#47 Sep 03 2010 at 3:55 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Please disregard this thread. SE FINALLY fixed despoil and that's pretty much what we needed.


Trash ability is still trash
#48 Sep 03 2010 at 4:22 AM Rating: Good
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Fynlar wrote:
Quote:
Please disregard this thread. SE FINALLY fixed despoil and that's pretty much what we needed.


Trash ability is still trash


ya think?
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#49 Sep 03 2010 at 4:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Why do you think I said it? Obviously it must be what I thought.
#50 Sep 07 2010 at 10:15 PM Rating: Good
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Come on, Square! You can still give us something completely awesome at the last second. You guys have given us fantastic storylines since the game's release, so fixing some battle issues should be nothing for you- especially with the battle director at the helm now!

I have faith in you.
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#51 Sep 08 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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Had to chime in based on the OP subject and reading the posts:

I still gear and play THF and it is currently, as of finishing 2 separate trial daggers for it, one of my best all around geared jobs (note, i said best geared, not my 'best' job)

That being said and once again reading a "Treasure Hunter" comment seeing that is how a majority of people like seeing us as, I still to this day have not, nor will i ever gimp myself by wielding a dagger with a job trait that no one can prove with some degree of respectable accuracy that it even works. If i worked hard to make myself two magian trial daggers, you sure as **** better believe im equipping those rather than a dagger that costs an average of 50k-100k in the AH.

If there's no spot for such a THF that actually cares about the overall effectiveness of his job (you fill in that blank there...) instead of the-now-realistically-possible-abyssea75+THF just to equip a **** knife and glove combo for a lame *** TH ability, then forget it, I'll just bring my DRG, because i'm sure as **** not "gonna come x job" in a developer/player community that doesn't respect one of my faves.

If this is the role that Square has decided on taking THF down on, then so be it and let them continue trolling their playerbase, not JUST the THF's, and losing customer faith, because it sure doesn't seem like we'll be getting any love anytime soon, perhaps by 99 maybe, but even I'm starting to lose faith there as other jobs have been pushed to the side along with THF.

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