So FFXIVFollow

It's ok, just drink a couple more beers and it'll either make sense or you'll get distracted.

"Stone Vigil is the one with the frost dragon, right?" - Check.
"There's little room for error" - Check.
"and way more movement than makes a healer happy." - Check.

Yep, you got it, that's Stone Vigil.

Nah. It's the fact that right now a lot of people are saying that Warriors are broken, which leaves Warriors on the defensive and always explaining why they are fine. I don't know the mechanics, but someone was saying that you just have to let a Warrior Tank sit at about 80% health so he/she can use the skills they get. What I do know is that they seem to bend but not break.

So, it was the Maz instinct kicking in. It's the same reason you chose feral druid back in TBC. It's because innately you must know that playing a Warrior will lead to hours and hours of frustration and keyboard smashing.

Yeah, but I think we're saying the same thing, other than that I wouldn't use the word "vastly."

EDIT: do I have it backwards? Does Marauder = PLD or does Marauder = WAR? I thought PLD was sword and board and Marauder was axes. I don't do the tanky-tank thing so I know nothing about them other than what it's like healing them.

If I have it backwards, then what the hell Maz? How did you make the less frustrating choice?



Edited, Oct 11th 2013 4:47pm by cynyck

You guys make FFXIV sound like a piece of **** game.

When I did Stone Vigil, we got to the last room before the last boss, the one withe the ice spirits and three dragons, we wiped there because the ice spirits were just raping with their constant spell spam. Aside from that it was a pretty easy dungeon, all the bosses went down on the first try. Garuda is a real *****, if you don't have a PLD to tank and a good healer, you might as well not even bother.

I joined up with a FATE group in Bluefog and we raided the mine while no FATEs were going on to finally get my last two levels to 50 and then went on to finish the main storyline. Having 8 person parties made things much easier, the last couple dungeons were almost a joke compared to how much trouble I had with Garuda. Right now I'm power leveling my Carpenter. It's at 35 right now and I've got a decent amount of materials I'll need to spam the next set of leves.

I liked Stone Vigil.

Well, a lot of the problems do come down to RNG.

Stone Vigil includes a LOT of void zones, set randomly, and they linger.

The dragon has one attack where he blankets 1/2 of the map with frost. Which he uses right when he's also filling the map with miniature, circular voidzones (that have a very small window to dodge). Because the boss will choose one side of the square room to use it on, you have to stay in the middle of the map to have a chance of avoiding it. But the middle of the map is where the voidzones are.

There were times where I ended up locked behind a wall of unavoidable zones, just because that's where they happened to form. Eating the smaller ones is better than the big one, but they still really hurt. And as a healer, I couldn't do anything but hope my tank lived through that phase with my Regen up.

So while I agree that consistent failure to avoid ground aoe is a problem with the dps, I can't really blame people on Stone Vigil unless they are particularly bad.

The RNG is actually a big problem right now, IMO, particularly for unavoidable damage. Garuda has this one really strong targetted AoE attack, where it hits the player and anyone around them. It's not something someone nearby could realistically avoid if they were a melee.

But so I had points where Garuda would use it on my tank, use it on a melee dps, use it on the tank, use her local-area aoe on the tank, and all the while be auto-attacking the tank.

That's a ton of damage that just isn't avoidable any way except by not having a melee dps, period. Which does, in fact, make Garuda a MUCH easier fight, because it vastly reduces the healing needed for DPS (everyone gets to space out, so the AoE hits one person), and because it vastly lowers the risk of the tank going down too fast to heal.

Oh, she also has this wonderful targeted attack in P3 which I watched one-shot a geared Warrior tank from around full health. My Pld tanks lived through it.

Ha, healing is definitely an issue. I don't know about how Sch healing is, but the group I had without a melee dps was a huge reduction in the amount of healing I had to do.

Then again, melee dps give you the dps limit break, so it might even out.

That said, there's no way in hell I'd do that fight with a Warrior AND melee dps. Getting me to do it with a Warrior would be hard enough...

Yeah. It's not even remotely acceptable as of right now. For their self-healing mechanics to matter, traige healing HAS to be in place. And even then, they need to not be in danger of being 1-shot by the RNG.

Imo, the distance between Pld and War doesn't actually need to be nearly so huge for them to feel like really different tanks. Just having a bias one way or the other (self healing or mitigation) is going to be a big enough change on the healer and the tank to make them justifiable, even if the actual math is pretty close.

This is an interesting thread on reddit in which warriors, paladins, white mages, and scholars all weigh in. My take on it is that as warriors are getting better gear they are better able to tank, paladins are otherwise marginally better because they require a little less healing which allows the healer to dps some, and warriors, paladins, white mages, scholars are lazy, bad, not doing their job, don't know how to play - just mix and match the class with the insult for maximum entertainment.


Actually, the ffxiv reddit forum is getting somewhat better - not because of the mods but because of some self-policing of the vitriol. The ffxivtc forum is a better place for stat and strat discussions though.

Yea, not sure why the conversation is happening here and not at least in =22. The FFXIV forums here are about as good as the old FFXI forums, which is to say not at all, but I'd agree that the conversation doesn't really belong here.