Would you return the Gold Medal?Follow

So - if it was you, would you return it, knowing that you didn't actually earn it, but you've had it for a while and it feels like yours?

Often times a juding error results in a loss or a win for an athlete or a team. Sports are played within a specific frame of rules, and Hamm won within those rules.

To rescind the medal in any way would deface the sport by leading to second-guessing every single decision. The three judges agreed at the time, but there was no mechanism provided within the framework to review their decision.

The International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) should never have issued the letter. They should have suspended the judges, and left it at that. If they want to provide for a method of review within the framework a la the NFL challenge, then so be it.

But to take away from the accomplishment an athlete has worked his entire life for is irresponsible and reprehensible.

The only thing I would send back would perhaps be a nice cheese to go along with all the whine.

Damn homophones.

Edited, Fri Aug 27 15:13:56 2004 by Ditiris

Hell no i wouldnt give it back. This is why i hate gymnastics. Your performance can take second stage to how the judges thought you did or any mistakes they made.

Only American's would even consider not giving it back.

Gee, I didn't earn it, but they gave it to me, it's mine now!

What the **** is wrong with you people? Of course he should give it back.

Then again, I'm not a gay midget twin, so I really can't see his point of view.

What the @#%^ is wrong with you people? Of course he should give it back.

Sure, and we'll all find out who the real winner is after six to seven years of review.

The system needs to be changed to allow for the correction of the imperfection of the judges. The current system doesn't, plain and simple.

It's not that he didn't earn it, his scores were higher I thought.........it was the level of difficulty on the Korean's perfomance that was downgraded!?!?!?!?!?!?

Yes, it was a mistake by all three judges, which cannot be reversed, under their own ruleset. The judges gave a starting value of 9.9 on his parallel bars routine, a tenth lower than he received for the same set in team qualifying and finals.

Awarding him the medal, would not solve the problem. Changing the rules to allow further review, would.

So what does the score from team qualifing and finals have to do with the all-around?

I don't understand why you're asking this, as from your post you seemingly already understand.

Nonetheless, the starting scores should all have been the same. For some reason he was given a starting score of 9.9 in the finals rather than the two 10.0 values he had been given previously. The correct starting value was 10.0.

No here is even pointing out that the Koreans are the ones who initially failed to address the starting difficulty value.

Teams can make an "inquiry" about a start value, but it must be done no later than one event after the routine in question, according to gymnastics rules.

Because different routines have different levels of difficulty. The way scoring works in gymnastics is that they start by giving you a score and then deduct points for mistakes you make in your routine. If all routines had the same starting score, then someone could get the "best" score by just perfectly executing a very simple routine.

The point being made is that his routine was exactly the same as one he'd done a couple times earlier and which was given a starting difficulty of 10. For whatever reason, a mistake was made and his routine was given a starting difficulty of 9.9 instead when he did it in the all around competition. Thus, his score was inherently .1 points lower then it should have been.


The problem is that there are rules for that too. As stated earlier, the team has a set amount of time to point out errors and get a reassessment of the points. The Koreans failed to do that. By every rule of the competition, Hamm won. End of story. Of course he shouldn't have to give up his medal. Once it's awarded to him, the only thing that can cause him to lose it is if his drug tests pop positive or something. When the medal ceremony is conducted that means that all scores are final. If you had an issue with a score before that, you should have brought it up then, not waited until the next day.


And if we're going to talk about second guessing scores, upon review of the film it's been found that the judges made a second mistake. They missed a 2/10ths deduction in the same routine the Korean athlete made. If we were going to go after the fact and reassess scores, he'd actually have a lower relative score then he got, and might not even have gotten the bronze.


It's all silly anyway. Scores are final at a set point according to the rules of the competition. After that point, you can ***** about it, and you can blame the judges for it, but you can't go back in time and rescore the event.

Pfffft. Not a chance. The gold is Hamm's and the responsibility is on the IOC for picking quality judges. Besides, the Americans said they'd've agreeed to a joint gold medal ceremony, but the manner in which the IOC went about pressuring Hamm was underhanded.

Totem

No. They wouldn't. They would have protested it at the appropriate time, and they would have expected action to be taken. But they would not have demanded that someone's who's already been awarded the medal give it up because they feel their guy should have won it instead.

Sometimes, the rules and the judgements don't fall in your favor. That's just part of being involved in any sporting event. I'd be saying the exact same thing if conditions were reversed. It's not about wanting your guy to win, it's about respecting the process. If the process is flawed, or fails for some reason, then you address that problem and fix it. But you don't penalize the players for it after the fact. If we start down that road, then you open up a whole mess of problems to deal with.

heh. this kinda reminds me of micheal phelps giving up his relay spot...

NOW if micheal phelps was doin gymnastics instead of hamm, im sure HE would give it back...anyways..

nah, once its been given to him, like smasharoo sed, giv it bak with integrety or just keep it

The gold medal goes to the best.. There can only be one "best"..



I would feel the same way..

I have watched alot of these Olympics and during that time I saw why the Korean didn't win gold twice. During the Parrallel bars your only allowed to do 4 holds. He did a fifth one right before he jumped off. The proved to the world that infact Paul Hamm does deserve the gold medal. The so called "Judging error," is in the past. Paul Hamm deserves what he won.

Now in another competition, the high bar. I can't remember his name but he was Russian. He did an amazing routine, and the anoucer even said, "That was the best high bar routine of all time." He recieved a score of around 9.725 which put him in third place. The crowd started to boo, and they didn't stop. The head of the judging council dude, was so embarrassed buy the miss scoring of the judges he chose. The Malasian judge scored the routine at a 9.6 and the Canadian judge scored it at a 9.65. And a quote from the expert anouncer, "Those are impossible scores, he didnt even make ONE mistake."

Paul Hamm was now put in a weird position, he was up next but he couldnt go till the crowd settled down. After they changed the Russian's score to a 9.76(keeping him in third) the crowd still wouldnt stop. Paul Hamm had to get the Russian to come up and settle the crowd down. And after he did Paul Hamm went, after an average routine Paul got a score of 9.87 leaving him in first place. Possibility of making him explain another gold medal. The Italian went up had an even better routine than the Russian but scored the exact same as Hamm. In a tiebreaker the Italian won.

Hamm won silver and the Russian was left with nothing. The Russian than said that he will never compete in another event hosted by the IOC. By the way the Russian had won 12 previous Olympic medals.

J to the R O C

Yeah, cause that French guy was bribed.

Ok, I would probably not return it, because I worked hard for it, and I wouldn'r give it up because some judges are stoned.