Are the Atheists or the Religious a bunch o' fools?Follow

He was saying that by looking at a cultures Fairy Tales you can learn quite a bit about that culture. What things are important to them. What they believed. What things were "good", or "bad" in their society. However, the underlying fact is that he's asuming that the Tales are generated by the people (not the other way around). Thus, the tales tell us about those people.

See the parallel? The tales in the Bible are made up stories that tell us a lot about the ancient Jews. We can figure out what kind of people would make up those kinds of stories, and that has value. They are no more true then any other set of fairy tales.

The Jews didn't start with a bible and God, and that made them the way they were. They developed a set of rules and ideas, and then created the Bible and God to record them and legitimize them. This is the same process that all early cultures did. The Babylonians had a whole processsion of gods that were created by each set of rulers and embodied the ideas of the culture at the time. Same with the Egyptians. Same with the Mayans. Same with every ancient culture we've ever studied.

So why accept that Ra is a fictional Egyptian God, but Yehweh is "real"? That's the point I'm making. There is no reason to other then one's own belief. And that belief was instilled purely because someone else with belief told you it was true. You've seen absolutely no more evidence of the existence of God then you have of the existence of Thor, but many people believe in one but not the other. Why?


So no. Agnostics and Athiests are not fools. Quite the opposite. They're the realists. Religious people are the fools. They've been "fooled" into believing something which has absolutely no basis. They've been "fooled" into following a set of doctrinal rules that serve no one but the leaders of the church they belong to. The've been "fooled" into giving money and donating time to said church. And worse of all, they've been "fooled" into letting the leaders of said religion make their choices for them. What movies are ok to watch, what words are ok to speak, what thoughts are ok to think...

To give someone else that much control over your own thoughts is foolish.

Runaway!!!!!! HEHE.

I never ran from god.. how could I, he was never no where to be found when I was an innocent child lookin for him!

But as Smasharoo said, believing in HIM is the same as SANTA.

Anyways, if the god thingy werks for you, and it helps you to get thru life, great! I do fine without it!

BTW... I devoted my youth, to studies of theology, in the end, I knew the truth, I became like Soloman. The more he learned, the more he knew he knew nothing at all! Soloman, the utimate agnostic! If he even existed! :)

End of transmision...

[snipping a lot of the gobbledegook]



Man, most of this is incoherent, but let's try to tease some meaning out of it. Why is life a miracle? As a biologist, it seems pretty straightforward to me.




Uhhh, no, they don't. There's no such thing as an aura. What was it someone else called it? Ah, yeah, New Age Psychobabble. No auras. None. Nowhere. Deal.



Man, how can you be wrong about so many things? The pituitary is NOT designed to pick up vibrations. Your EARS pick up vibrations. Pacinian corpuscles in your skind pick up vibrations. You pituitary secretes hormones.




No it isn't.



Who says that? Care to provide a reference?



They sure can- if the animal is a human with a compass. Did you know that if you put migrating birds in a planetarium and rotate the image of the night sky by 90 degrees, the birds attempt to migrate east instead of north? So they know which way they are supposed to go, based on what they see. But they have no idea of where "north" is. Straightforward explanation; no magic required.

(snip the rest of the mumbo jumbo)

Let's just sum the rest of this up with one little thing: if you can really demonstrate any of this stuff- just one little thing- James Randi will make you a millionaire. And you can even see the money ahead of time.

My favorite thing about the whole God/No God debate....is one day.....we'll know for sure.....and one side is gonna look really ******* dumb.

Also, one is based on ancient books that people have based their worship on for millions of years. I have friends from all kinds of religions and we discuss our religion openly and no one calls the other stupid or a fool or anything. I don't know why the people here can't do the same. I'm not criticising your beliefs even though the ones calling me a fool don't believe in anything.

As for having the same kind of faith as a child, well, that's what a Christian is supposed to have. Matthew 18:3 says that unless we become like children then we can not enter heaven. If that makes me a fool in your mind, then so be it.

Only if you're baptized! If you die before you're baptized, you die with original sin still on your soul. ^^ Fun thought, no?



Actually, no one gets into Heaven right away, according to the Catholics anyway. You go to Purgatory. You have to wait for the second coming of Christ to open the gates to Heaven for you. ^^

And, somewhere in the Bible it doesn't say non-believers go to Hell. All it says, I think, and I don't have quotes to back me up, but I'm relatively certain I'm correct, that if you believe in Jesus as the Saviour, you WILL go to Heaven. But it says nothing about not believing in him meaning you go to Hell.

The way it works, is if you don't believe in Jesus, it then depends entirely on your acts in life and the person you are. Even Atheists, (if there is a Heaven) will go to Heaven if they were good people. Same with Heathens, Pagans, Wiccans, Jewish, Muslims, etc, etc, etc.

(And Jewish and Muslim people believe in the same God (I'm sure we're all aware of that fact), but the former doesn't believe the Son of God has come yet and the latter believes that Jesus was simply a prophet, and not the son of God, and the last prophet was Mohammed. And please, if someone is Jewish or Muslim and I mistated myself, correct me. :)



Why'd you capitalize Satan as Him? :)
And, see my above for why this is false.
Unless you're a believer in Dante's works, and the circles of Hell, of which one is Virtuous Nonbelievers.

And my question is this.. so, the Mafia believe in Jesus. Most of them seem very religious (at least according to TV movies!). So, even though they kill people all the time (breaing a commandment!) they believe in and love Jesus and accept him as a personal saviour, so they go to Heaven?

Meanwhile, a kindly old woman who has done nothing but good deeds all her life, but just so happens to be Hindu rather than Christian.. she goes to Hell simply because she was brought up by her parents to be Hindu and she made the choice of religion in her adult life?

Or what about sometime after Jesus was born and died, some person in a third world country that never heard of Jesus in his entire life dies, he goes to Hell because a missionary never made it that far into the jungle?

Now, this is my opinion, but I think not. I am Christian, and my God doesn't do that.

I am afraid "Karma or something" counts as some sort of supernatural belief, so that doesn't wash.

Most atheists I know just happen to think that humans have rights that should be respected. It's that simple.

Here's the other side of your question: is a religion all that is keeping you from running amok? If it wasn't for your faith in god, you'd be out stealing and lying whenever you could get away with it?

The devil is another fictional character.Translation = 'You see, in my favorite story book, this one fictional character believes that this other fictional character exists.' From a literary standpoint, the stories would not work if the characters didn't believe in each other's existance.
Is anyone else's hypocrite alarm going off?
You're delusional and attempting to project your delusions on others.

I call UBS on your claim that you care about the souls of the athiests on these boards. You may care about winning an argument, thus, scoring one for your team. You may care about recruiting another sucker. But more than that, no, I'm not buying it. Why would I doubt your sincerity? Because "believers" on this board eventually lose their composure and end up gloating "ha ha, when I die I'll go to heaven and you'll be burning in hell."

I, for one, am not angry with the believers. I'm far too indifferent to your nonsensical babbling.

Also, no one judges actions or belief except God. Humans can go by what people say, but we can never say that someone is going to hell or not going to heaven, because we can not fully understand or judge another person. That power is given to God and no one else.

Some people may only have religion to keep them in line, but no more so than other people. Religion usually gives a higher standard of conduct, but that is not certain. No one is perfect. Unfortunately some religions are given a bad name because of a few groups that commit horrible acts in the name of their religion.

Ok, Kiatrix, just about everything you said was Biblically incorrect. So let me break it down for you.

1. "Only if you're baptized! If you die before you're baptized, you die with original sin still on your soul. ^^ Fun thought, no?"

Not Biblical. Check out the most popular verse ever, John 3:16. "Whosoever believes on the Lord Jesus shall be saved". Not baptized ans saved, just saved. Baptism is great, I have been baptized, but it is merely a public gesture of your faith in God.
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2."Actually, no one gets into Heaven right away, according to the Catholics anyway. You go to Purgatory. You have to wait for the second coming of Christ to open the gates to Heaven for you. ^^".

Not Biblical. Show me purgatory in the Bible.
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3."And, somewhere in the Bible it doesn't say non-believers go to Hell. All it says, I think, and I don't have quotes to back me up, but I'm relatively certain I'm correct, that if you believe in Jesus as the Saviour, you WILL go to Heaven. But it says nothing about not believing in him meaning you go to Hell".

Are you kidding me? If believing in Jesus gets you saved, what are you saved from? HELL. "The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life". Clear as day - sin=death(eternal death, not physical death), God=eternal life.
Psalm 9:17
"The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God."
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4."The way it works, is if you don't believe in Jesus, it then depends entirely on your acts in life and the person you are. Even Atheists, (if there is a Heaven) will go to Heaven if they were good people. Same with Heathens, Pagans, Wiccans, Jewish, Muslims, etc, etc, etc.

(And Jewish and Muslim people believe in the same God (I'm sure we're all aware of that fact), but the former doesn't believe the Son of God has come yet and the latter believes that Jesus was simply a prophet, and not the son of God, and the last prophet was Mohammed. And please, if someone is Jewish or Muslim and I mistated myself, correct me. :)"

Again, not Biblical. Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life; NO ONE comes to the Father but through me." Plain and simple, Jesus is the way, and the only way.
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5."And my question is this.. so, the Mafia believe in Jesus. Most of them seem very religious (at least according to TV movies!). So, even though they kill people all the time (breaing a commandment!) they believe in and love Jesus and accept him as a personal saviour, so they go to Heaven? "

Jesus that said that you would know His followers by their fruit, and by their love for each other. I don't think that killing is a fruit of God, or an example of His love. So if they continued doing that stuff, I'd say they probably arent saved. Make sure you know that there is a HUGE difference in believing that Jesus existed and was who He said He was and being religious, and actually following Him, obeying Him, and knowing Him.
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6."Meanwhile, a kindly old woman who has done nothing but good deeds all her life, but just so happens to be Hindu rather than Christian.. she goes to Hell simply because she was brought up by her parents to be Hindu and she made the choice of religion in her adult life?"

Again, Jesus is the only way. She may have been a "good person", but she was good by man's standards, not God's. The Bible says that "our righteousness is as filthy rags". So yes, without Jesus, hell is her destination. Doesn't this you show you A. how important Jesus and what He did is, and B. that we Christians MUST spread the Gospel?
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7."Or what about sometime after Jesus was born and died, some person in a third world country that never heard of Jesus in his entire life dies, he goes to Hell because a missionary never made it that far into the jungle?"

Again, we have to spread the Gospel so that this doesn't happen. That is why we have missionaries. But, to answer your question, the Bible says that "the heavens and earth proclaim his name, and bear witness to His glory". Looking at creation should tell you that there is a God, this couldn't be a coincidence. As far as specifics, I can't speak for God on this. Why don't you ask Him? He always answers me.
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8."Now, this is my opinion, but I think not. I am Christian, and my God doesn't do that."

I truly hope that you really are a Christian. But it sounds like you don't study the Word much. I encourage you to do so, for the Word is God's will, it's how you can get to know Him.

While the Catholic conception of Purgatory isn't Biblical, the Book of Revelation says that the dead will be awakened at the Second Coming, then judged and then brought into Heaven (or cast into Hell). Since the soul is undying, one would assume that post-mortal death and pre-2nd Coming, your soul is in some sort of stasis, be it Purgatory, Sheol or whatever.

Edited, Fri May 14 14:41:06 2004 by Jophiel

Did you every hear of Quantum Philosophy?.. which says that experiments are usally Flawed because of the fact that WE are interfereing with the results with our mere presence?

http://www.fortunecity.com/emachines/e11/86/qphil.html



ANYWAY.. I don't have time..
http://www.who.int/peh-emf/about/WhatisEMF/en/

http://www.ks.uiuc.edu/~ritz/RESEARCH/MS/ms.html

http://www.item-bioenergy.com/rfi/intro.html

http://beatsworking.2itb.com/contact.html
http://www.pracsmart.com/eyes-to-soul6.html

(check out the Pineal Gland also.. which is waht I was thinking of during my post.

http://wwwedu.oulu.fi/homepage/tjarvile/nerve.htm



http://www.nature.com/nsu/021216/021216-4.html

http://www.grantchronicles.com/paralleluniversemk.htm


DAMMIT.. i could find others... but the Firewall is a *****.. and I'm too lazy to **** with it right now..


Look at some of these.. and I expect good arguments later ^^

Edited, Fri May 14 14:57:19 2004 by Kelvyquayo