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why is a bard not pulling wrong?Follow

#27 Dec 31 2009 at 12:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Bard pulling is by far the easiest role in merit parties to boot.


huh.

I don't know about anyone else but when I'm pulling and I hear idle background music instead of battle, I start to panic.

I don't see why ANY brd would not want to pull. You control the pace of the party, the pace of the experience points and it's fun!
When I'm on BRD lfp, or start a merit party, I know I'll be getting good exp. When looking on WAR or RDM, I am not as sure.
#28 Dec 31 2009 at 12:26 PM Rating: Decent
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Most of this has been pointed out, but having multiple 75's, I'll point this out.

From ~20 brd i've been pulling.


Brd can pull and sleep the mob in camp, ready for the party to keep on attacking.

The most efficient use of a DD is if they are constantly attacking, if they have to stop, that's damage that is being wasted and thus EXP lost.

Brds can pull with elegy, on birds this gives you a headstart as they'll wait to take the spell in then mimic it, vs nin mobs (mamools...) we can use virelai (yes charm) which strips all shadows, if they recast, sleep with horde.

Bards have been pulling since before TOAU, it's like saying, what's wrong with a Ninja not willing to tank. It's the way the jobs play with the current game mechanics, like anybody, why get 10k/hr in a party, when with everybody doing their job properly you can get 20k/hr. Less time spent trying to get those merits.

It's all about maximising your job, if a melee has to break off to pull, that costs the pt a DD whilst they pull. I'd be insulted as a healer if you insisted on being a backup healer over pulling in a party which i could quite comfortably cure. I can usually keep buffs up, full haste cycle includig bard, keep debuffs off players, everybody cured to tops without ballad, and that's on whm. Why do i need backup healer for? I didn't sit down for over 30mins one party, with just ballad 2 50% of the time and no ballad 1, I'd make you pick at that point too, heal or pull, i'll do the other.
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#29 Dec 31 2009 at 12:32 PM Rating: Decent
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You know how you will be in a lower level pt and you will sometimes run into that RNG or THF who doesn't pull and you tell your LS all about how this RNG won't even do something that he/she should be doing; then soon after all your LS members lol at said RNG or THF?

Yeah, a brd not pulling is even lulzier than that.
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#30 Dec 31 2009 at 1:09 PM Rating: Good
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I don't see why ANY brd would not want to pull. You control the pace of the party, the pace of the experience points and it's fun!

I don't want to pull in merits >.> that's actually why I stopped going to merit parties as brd. It was fun all the way to ~73 (and I still occasionally use bard in friend's sync parties). But I hate the stress of having to constantly look for new mob every 20-30 seconds while songs are wearing.

As I like to think, I play how I want to play, and you're (you as in any party leader) free not to invite me to your party. ~_^ And if they're that desperate for a pulling bard (the main reason why people give you grief in-game), they're free to level bard themselves.

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I didn't sit down for over 30mins one party, with just ballad 2 50% of the time and no ballad 1, I'd make you pick at that point too, heal or pull, i'll do the other.

I heal, you pull, works for me as long as you keep hastes up. ^_^

Edited, Dec 31st 2009 2:17pm by Sharain
#31 Jan 01 2010 at 8:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Sharain wrote:

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I didn't sit down for over 30mins one party, with just ballad 2 50% of the time and no ballad 1, I'd make you pick at that point too, heal or pull, i'll do the other.

I heal, you pull, works for me as long as you keep hastes up. ^_^



More like I'd jump on bard and give double marches was the thought there :D
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#32 Jan 02 2010 at 7:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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last i checkd the people i party with dont send me money orders to pay for ff11


I don't recall getting any checks from you in the mail either. If a BRD refuses to pull I kick them out and find another. They are not so rare that i can't pick and choose. The reason BRD is asked to pull is because during the time between when you cast your 6 or so songs and when they wear off, what the **** else are you doing? Absolutely nothing at all, and that, my friend is not cool. If you want to leech xp off people, that's fine, but you also have to realize that other people KNOW that you're leeching it, and won't be standing for it. You go right ahead and play the game how you want to play it, but guess what, other people are going to do the same. Sooner or later word will get round that you're the lazy BRD that won't pull and no one is going to invite you anymore, because they are ALSO paying their monthly fees to play as well, and they don't want it wasted by a stuck up prick that's too proud to do his own job. You're basically wasting 5 other people's time and effort and turning a chain 200 pt into a chain 6 pt. Lose the prima donna act and resign yourself to the fact that if you want to merit on BRD in this day and age, you're going to have to either lvl NIN and learn to pull, or come on a different job. You can be stubborn, and sure, there will always be people willing to put up with your BS just to have a BRD, but you'll spend a whole lot more time with your seek flag up when you refuse to pull than you would otherwise. Do you like paying for THAT?

Edit: Spelling

Edited, Jan 2nd 2010 8:41pm by Krissyllyn
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#33 Jan 03 2010 at 10:52 PM Rating: Excellent
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They are not so rare that i can't pick and choose. The reason BRD is asked to pull is because during the time between when you cast your 6 or so songs and when they wear off, what the **** else are you doing? Absolutely nothing at all, and that, my friend is not cool. If you want to leech xp off people, that's fine, but you also have to realize that other people KNOW that you're leeching it, and won't be standing for it.


Heh...Don't read too much into this reply, I definitely support a pulling brd - but...

...yeah I see that happening...half the time the melee afk while exping. I doubt they'd notice or care if BRD stopped pulling and someone else did. Its not uncommon for me to send tells to people telling them to stop watching TV and migrate over to where the rest of the party is. Either that or ask why I haven't seen a WS from them in the past 5 mins - gotta make sure melee have enough ACC you know? /angel

Anyways, it does **** me off when I see people half-assing it. I work my **** off on BRD ...but the moment I ask someone to start playing correctly or insist on EXPing with a static I'm a princess BRD. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

There was no real point in this post. So~~ Everyone else is going to be busy watching TV, so its your job to pull! /sarcasm
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#34 Jan 03 2010 at 11:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Asmoranomar wrote:
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They are not so rare that i can't pick and choose. The reason BRD is asked to pull is because during the time between when you cast your 6 or so songs and when they wear off, what the **** else are you doing? Absolutely nothing at all, and that, my friend is not cool. If you want to leech xp off people, that's fine, but you also have to realize that other people KNOW that you're leeching it, and won't be standing for it.


Heh...Don't read too much into this reply, I definitely support a pulling brd - but...

...yeah I see that happening...half the time the melee afk while exping. I doubt they'd notice or care if BRD stopped pulling and someone else did. Its not uncommon for me to send tells to people telling them to stop watching TV and migrate over to where the rest of the party is. Either that or ask why I haven't seen a WS from them in the past 5 mins - gotta make sure melee have enough ACC you know? /angel

Anyways, it does **** me off when I see people half-assing it. I work my **** off on BRD ...but the moment I ask someone to start playing correctly or insist on EXPing with a static I'm a princess BRD. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

There was no real point in this post. So~~ Everyone else is going to be busy watching TV, so its your job to pull! /sarcasm


obviously telling melees to stop being AFK doesn't make you a "princess BRD" (i still think that concept is made up by people who are butthurt that some BRD said no to their PT request)... though i must admit it's pretty rare for me to see such things in a party. fights aren't really long enough to get away with that... i've seen horrible melees, but they're not usually horrible due to AFK. then again, i kick and remember people who do stuff like that. insofar as i remember anything i guess.
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#35 Jan 04 2010 at 5:47 PM Rating: Decent
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You told them straight up that you're not going to pull...and what they do? Drag you to a camp and then pester you about doing something you ALREADY TOLD THEM you weren't going to do.lol

I'd leave with no guilt.

Besides, they are dummies for wanting a BRD/WHM to pull in a merit party.
It would be a waste of MP for the healer, especially if you're fighting Mamools. You would die if you even tried to keep up with the pulling pace of a BRD/NIN.lol

They knew what they were getting when they invited a BRD/WHM. BRD/WHMs do NOT pull. And if you don't have fun pulling then don't do it.
#36 Jan 04 2010 at 5:52 PM Rating: Decent
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asilica wrote:
You told them straight up that you're not going to pull...and what they do? Drag you to a camp and then pester you about doing something you ALREADY TOLD THEM you weren't going to do.lol

I'd leave with no guilt.

Besides, they are dummies for wanting a BRD/WHM to pull in a merit party.
It would be a waste of MP for the healer, especially if you're fighting Mamools. You would die if you even tried to keep up with the pulling pace of a BRD/NIN.lol

They knew what they were getting when they invited a BRD/WHM. BRD/WHMs do NOT pull. And if you don't have fun pulling then don't do it.


BRDs main role in a merit party is puller, unless there's 2 BRDs. if you don't want to pull, you should be off doing FoV instead of seeking.
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#37 Jan 04 2010 at 6:07 PM Rating: Decent
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BRDs main role in a merit party is puller, unless there's 2 BRDs. if you don't want to pull, you should be off doing FoV instead of seeking.


That is a BRD/NINs role in a merit party - not a BRD/WHM. If you wanted a BRD to pull in your party then you should've asked them to sub ninja. Thats like asking a Samurai to provoke incoming mobs after they told you they are subbing /NIN. Its not gonna happen.
#38 Jan 04 2010 at 6:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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I've pulled as BRD/WHM at MJSP a number of times, just to prove I could. These were chain 100+ parties easily. And I wasn't a burden on our healer, I used DS Cure 3 as needed. Plus, I was still pulling Skoffins.

People who don't know how to pull as BRD/WHM are lousy players. End of story.
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#39 Jan 04 2010 at 6:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Reality-
Most BRD/NINs have never seen chain 200 and can't get a chain 100 without stressing themselves out.

In merit parties, people don't go BRD/WHM to be puller nor is it expected for a BRD/WHM to be puller.

So when you build a merit party, don't invite a BRD/WHM to pull--especially after they told you they aren't going to do it.
#40 Jan 04 2010 at 7:07 PM Rating: Good
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asilica wrote:
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BRDs main role in a merit party is puller, unless there's 2 BRDs. if you don't want to pull, you should be off doing FoV instead of seeking.


That is a BRD/NINs role in a merit party - not a BRD/WHM. If you wanted a BRD to pull in your party then you should've asked them to sub ninja. Thats like asking a Samurai to provoke incoming mobs after they told you they are subbing /NIN. Its not gonna happen.


this is like saying "when you invite a PLD/WHM, don't expect them to provoke! they're obviously meant as backup healers!"

BRD/WHM is only useful in a party as a 2nd BRD, unless the BRD/WHM is competent enough to pull. your argument is absurd; you're criticizing people for not letting BRD/WHMs leech XP by doing a half-assed job. there's no difference between what you're defending and a melee who never WSs because "that's not my playstyle".
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#41 Jan 05 2010 at 12:14 AM Rating: Good
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I've pulled as a BRD/WHM before. It's not pretty, but it's doable. You absolutely have to have on-the-ball melee, though; we had a dedicated WAR/NIN voking my slept birds so they wouldn't eat my face while I tried to get stoneskin or blink back up.
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#42 Jan 05 2010 at 1:22 PM Rating: Decent
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reikazen wrote:
hey bard people whats your thoughts on thfs pulling at 75? just wondering..
Contrary to popular belief, Thf is a DD, and DD pulling = DD not DDing = slower kills as mentioned above.

catwho wrote:
I've pulled as a BRD/WHM before. It's not pretty, but it's doable. You absolutely have to have on-the-ball melee, though; we had a dedicated WAR/NIN voking my slept birds so they wouldn't eat my face while I tried to get stoneskin or blink back up.
With all that effort, it invites the question "why notjust sub nin?".
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#43 Jan 05 2010 at 1:42 PM Rating: Good
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Honestly, pulling as BRD/WHM isn't that hard. It's just different. I have reached 200+ chains as the lone puller at MJSP, and at the Mamool camp above the birdy camps. Admittedly, this was done with LS parties, with DD that knew what they were doing, but even as /whm, I never took that much damage, and when I did, I could heal myself.

However, I generally don't play BRD anymore for merit parties because it drives me bananas trying to pull, buff, and debuff, all while trying my damnedest to not get smeared by a mamool.
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#44 Jan 05 2010 at 5:44 PM Rating: Good
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With all that effort, it invites the question "why notjust sub nin?".


That time, we had JUST come from Zhayolm Remnants in Salvage, and no one wanted to bother going back to town to change. So we were MNK/NIN MNK/NIN WAR/NIN DRK/NIN RDM/WHM BRD/WHM. Not an ideal setup by any means, but we were lazy, and we still broke chain 100 even with our lazy /NIN DDs and /WHM puller.
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#45 Jan 06 2010 at 5:43 PM Rating: Good
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Dear BRDs who want to just buff and not pull,

You're lazy cnuts.


Thank you,

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#46 Jan 08 2010 at 8:21 AM Rating: Good
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cykokakashi wrote:
i just hit 75 brd last month. on brd i sub whm and as such i back up cure pretty effectively as a 75 brd. i also constantly keep songs up and do complex song mixes. i use finale like water w/o having to be told. why is me not pulling on brd an issue. i do all but 1 thing as a brd. last i checkd the people i party with dont send me money orders to pay for ff11. i make it clear i dont pull and people still give me grief over it.



"i also constantly keep songs up and do complex song mixes. "
Okay, BRD juggles a lot of things in merit PT, but they're no DJs.

Nothing wrong with not wanting to pull, just don't expect a warm welcome from a merit party if you choose not to. Contrary to what many people think "Pulling" is not a bard's job, Buffing is, that's what you do for 75 levels. Pulling is a niche that comes in very handy when at merit levels and that is what is expected of you, just like "Healing" is not a SMN's job, but through faulty game design that what is going to be expected of them (and BLMs) in a xp party. If you cannot stand pulling in merit PTs, then just don't join merit PT period, don't join with the intent of not pulling. Just put "Level Sync Only" in your search comment and stick to the 55~70 stretch, you prolly won't break 12k~15k/HR but your not dealing with the mad rush that you would be in Merit PTs, and your still getting very good xp. If you want the +20k/HR xp though, your going to have to suck it up and learn how to pull. My very first time pulling, I pulled have the zone in Mamool, it's something you get use to with practice.



Edited, Jan 8th 2010 9:30am by FluffBunny
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#47 Jan 08 2010 at 10:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Because other pullers aren't going to be able to get to chain 200+, whereas you can with little effort.

Equation for Bard at 75 is: Sing songs + Pull mobs = sh*t-tons of exp

Honestly, if you're not pulling you are a lazy b*stard.

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#48 Jan 08 2010 at 11:53 PM Rating: Good
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FluffBunny wrote:
[quote=cykokakashi]
Contrary to what many people think "Pulling" is not a bard's job, Buffing is, that's what you do for 75 levels. Pulling is a niche that comes in very handy when at merit levels and that is what is expected of you, just like "Healing" is not a SMN's job, but through faulty game design that what is going to be expected of them (and BLMs) in a xp party. If you cannot stand pulling in merit PTs, then just don't join merit PT period, don't join with the intent of not pulling. Just put "Level Sync Only" in your search comment and stick to the 55~70 stretch, you prolly won't break 12k~15k/HR but your not dealing with the mad rush that you would be in Merit PTs, and your still getting very good xp. If you want the +20k/HR xp though, your going to have to suck it up and learn how to pull. My very first time pulling, I pulled have the zone in Mamool, it's something you get use to with practice.



Edited, Jan 8th 2010 9:30am by FluffBunny


I'm sorry but you could not be more wrong about pulling..at least in merits.
The bard's MAIN job is pulling and buffs are secondary. Any competent DD group can keep up the same chains with no buffs at all. It's the pulling and having a fresh mob always available that makes bard so desirable in a merit party. There's no other job that can do that as efficiently as bard.

Edited, Jan 9th 2010 1:02am by luxv
#49 Jan 09 2010 at 3:48 AM Rating: Good
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luxv wrote:
FluffBunny wrote:
[quote=cykokakashi]
Contrary to what many people think "Pulling" is not a bard's job, Buffing is, that's what you do for 75 levels. Pulling is a niche that comes in very handy when at merit levels and that is what is expected of you, just like "Healing" is not a SMN's job, but through faulty game design that what is going to be expected of them (and BLMs) in a xp party. If you cannot stand pulling in merit PTs, then just don't join merit PT period, don't join with the intent of not pulling. Just put "Level Sync Only" in your search comment and stick to the 55~70 stretch, you prolly won't break 12k~15k/HR but your not dealing with the mad rush that you would be in Merit PTs, and your still getting very good xp. If you want the +20k/HR xp though, your going to have to suck it up and learn how to pull. My very first time pulling, I pulled have the zone in Mamool, it's something you get use to with practice.



Edited, Jan 8th 2010 9:30am by FluffBunny


I'm sorry but you could not be more wrong about pulling..at least in merits.
The bard's MAIN job is pulling and buffs are secondary. Any competent DD group can keep up the same chains with no buffs at all. It's the pulling and having a fresh mob always available that makes bard so desirable in a merit party. There's no other job that can do that as efficiently as bard.

Edited, Jan 9th 2010 1:02am by luxv


not only that, but you should be pulling from 55~70 (and way before) too. BRD should already be pulling in the 30s if not right from when they start partying. the nature of what they do (sing and wait) necessitates it. i pulled all the way to 75. if you don't like pulling, astral burn your bard or something. or be a ****** freeloading member of parties that allow you to be.
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#50 Jan 09 2010 at 6:36 AM Rating: Good
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My first pt pulling on brd was at 11 on lizzy's in the good ol' dunes.

More recently though ended up with a brd who wouldnt pull in a manaburn I was in Xarca {s}. So all she did to get exp was double ballad .. go make a cup of tea .. ballad .. read a magazine - you get the picture
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#51 Jan 09 2010 at 2:38 PM Rating: Good
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Bards pull for the same reason whms should use barspells over rdms: Because it's better.

Deal with it.
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