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MDT vs MDB vs Resist setsFollow

#1 Oct 19 2010 at 5:08 PM Rating: Good
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Okay, sooo I got PLD to 85, and I figure its about time I get some gear sets for magic.

Now I had this page bookmarked, http://belkinator.livejournal.com/

and it's a good starting point. But before I start collecting more gear...

Can someone explain to me the difference between the three and where they would apply? Magic Damage Taken, Magic Defense Bonus, and a Resist set.

I understand the first two effect how much damage you take, and the resist set gets checked vs the mobs magic accuracy to see if you resist the spell and take partial damage.

So I guess it would be a fire resist set for say Tiamat and Suzaku for example. When your up against something that cast a specific spell like fire spells, a fire resist set would work better than the MDT or MDB?

Then a MDT or MDB would be used forrrrrr? Bahamut or Proto-Ultima?

I would really like to know when I should use which sets ect.

And also that post was made quite a while ago, so if there is some other gear that would be better for those sets I would really appreciate that information also.

Thank you :)
#2 Oct 19 2010 at 8:40 PM Rating: Decent
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SKIP TO BOTTOM FOR THE SHORT ANSWER

Building a resist build would result in the least damage taken because it goes beyond the cap of 50% magic damage taken. It is much easier to get to cap damage taken gear because your inventory will thank you, not to mention not everything uses only one element. Magic damage bonus is what it is, a bonus.

Everyone starts at base x/1, where x is the calculated magic att bonus. Keep in mind this is extremely generalized. Every 1 point of magic def bonus adds .01 to that base of 1. What this means is that the exact value will always be a little less than 1%. If you had +20 mag def bonus, the value is 1/1.2 = .8333, which becomes the multiplier of the damage being taken. +20 mag def bonus only equals a 16.666% less magic damage taken. Keep in mind that this depends on the caster not having their own mag att bonus, making x = 1.

If you take a look at the selection of mag def bonus gear, you'll see that it remains inferior to the magic damage taken gear choices, mainly because the max a PLD could actually add up is about 25, give or take a few points. With shell V on at 1 merit, it only takes +25 magic damage taken to cap. Mag def bonus would require +33 magic def bonus gaer to actually reach that -25% damage point.

Magic damage taken is the better choice for omega/ultima, and stuff that uses different elements.
#3 Oct 20 2010 at 11:48 AM Rating: Good
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Another big thing to remember about resist sets is that they simply increase the chance that you will resist. If you have +130 fire resist, it's still possible to take full damage. Is it likely? No, but there is the chance.

MDT gear always reduces magic damage by close to the listed amount. (The game deals in fractions which are always powers of 2 - look at how haste is calculated for examples). MDB gear, as mentioned, also reduces the damage but at a much smaller ratio.

When I build sets, I typically build with MDT first then fill in MDB on slots that I don't need to cap MDT on. Great spots to cap MDT are rings/earrings, since merman's pack an incredible amount into so little. Iron Ram Gear (the level 68 set) provides a lot of MDB gear for those spots that you aren't getting MDT. You have to play with what you know you'll get, support wise, so it's always worthwhile figuring out how many merits your WHM's have and plan accordingly.

My rule of thumb: MDT, resist gear if specific element, MDB. A lot of people skip the resist sets, as well, typically only keeping Fire sets around for Tiamat. It can get gear intensive to keep a lot of resist gear around.
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#4 Oct 20 2010 at 3:11 PM Rating: Good
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teknos wrote:
Can someone explain to me the difference between the three and where they would apply? Magic Damage Taken, Magic Defense Bonus, and a Resist set.


MDT = A flat % reduction to magic damage taken, Caps at 50%

MDB = Adjust formula on how much damage is taken

Resist = Adds elemental resistance for a single element. The higher the resit the more resists you get and less dammage you take on average.


Quote:
I would really like to know when I should use which sets ect.


Depends on what gear you have and how serious you are.

Me? I cheat since I have Aegis and all my WHMs have merited Shell 5. That caps MDT right there so MDT- Is not needed and I go with MDB for general use.

MDB has no known cap and depend on on sub job and buffs is quite easy to get into the 50+ range which on most mobs is a good as a resist set.

MDT/MDB is best when you don't know what element you will be against, the element changes (for example JoL), or you can not build a sufficient resist set for (for example: Light/Dark aka: Proto-Ultima).

If you know what element you will be getting hit with then with a resist set look at how much resist you have with your setup. For example with BRD and WHM with merited BAR spells and proper gear for Earth and Fire I am at 320+. I actually ran into issues where I don't take enough damage in my resist sets to have HP to cure hold hate with out massive HP- -> HP+ cure cheat macros. If the mob is higher level then you then you need to aim for ~300 resist with buffs. If you don't have 250+ Then you are probably better off with MDT/MDB.

For MDB vs MDT a lot comes down to what you have for support.

If your WHM has full merits on Shellra V (They should) then the Magic Damage reduction is 27.34% to start. Can you get 23% more in gear? If you can then you can put MDB in the reset of the slots.

For MDB you want to aim for something in the 30+ range to start. My base gear is +38 MDB, +4 MD, +4M.Eva and I'm still missing some of the newer pieces that would raise that since NMs are being stingy. The Shamshir +1 sword is a must for this set. About the single best piece you can get.

If the mob does physical attacks also then you want a shield on which means things like the Iron Ram Lance are out and you'd want to keep AF+1 feet over Damage - feet. That tends to push the MDB over the MDT. If you can stand out of Melee range then MDT starts to move up.

Personally I carry a PDT, MDB, DD, and face tank set on me at all times. I keep resist sets on mules for fights that are planned for specific NMs or pop windows. I also keep a breath damage set for random NMs in storage (most is R/E).

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Brytor - Sylph
LS: Legion of Altana
90 PLD, BLM, RDM, WHM, SMN, DRK

#5 Oct 21 2010 at 10:59 AM Rating: Good
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Excellent info tkinnen, well done!

I do have one question, however. When you said this...

tkinnen wrote:
For MDB you want to aim for something in the 30+ range to start. My base gear is +38 MDB, +4 MD, +4M.Eva and I'm still missing some of the newer pieces that would raise that since NMs are being stingy. The Shamshir +1 sword is a must for this set. About the single best piece you can get.


Which Shamshir+1 were you referring to? I mean, the MDB+9 one would fit with that, but there's also the magic attack -15 one, as well as the (lol?) magic evasion one.

Other than that, rate up!
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#6 Oct 21 2010 at 11:33 AM Rating: Good
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axciom wrote:
Which Shamshir+1 were you referring to? I mean, the MDB+9 one would fit with that, but there's also the magic attack -15 one, as well as the (lol?) magic evasion one.


The MDB+9 one.
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Brytor - Sylph
LS: Legion of Altana
90 PLD, BLM, RDM, WHM, SMN, DRK

#7 Oct 25 2010 at 11:23 PM Rating: Decent
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You need MDT-50% (cap) and +19998 MDB to take 0 DMG from a 1k nuke. Can link to you a post of mine (more like a monologue) where I learned how to do the calculations myself. The diminishing returns on MDB are brutal, so make it a proiority to max MDT and/or resist when applicable. Bonus is just icing on the cake, and is calculated *after* MDT redux.
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