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The new "Princess job" EpidemicFollow

#1 Aug 03 2010 at 12:06 AM Rating: Excellent
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A couple of nights ago I had been invited to a level 67 party and for about 2 hours or so I held hate between me, an actual, factual emo drk with emo macros included, a sam who I beleive, never actually learned what seigan does and a crazed drg. oh and party build was PLD(me) RDM,DNC,SAM,DRK, and a DRG. now the drama begins when the rdm chooses a bad time to convert then cast Cure 4(He had casted cure 3 on me moments before) and the bird ran over to him and hit him ONE TIME and rushed back to me before I even had time to cast flash again. This rdm lost his mind.
"Wtf Do your god damn job and keep hate you sh*tty pld elf. I cant even cast a cure without tanking the whole fight"
Followed by him checking my gear annnd...
"Wtf why are you in DD gear? your taking way to much damage and now i know why. No wonder you cant keep hate."
I told him that the bird is not hitting me hard enough to warrant turtling up and that I'm keeping hate just fine.
His response...
"Ok fine since your not getting hit hard enough why dont you just heal your damn self?"
After that statement he then refused to heal/refresh/haste/etc me for the next 2 hrs. Even without him healing or refreshing, the dancer switched over to using aspir samba and that kept me with about 50-70% at all times.

The very next day i ran into another rdm in a imp party and the exact same thing happened
1. Timed Convert-> cure 4 badly
2. Imp Ran over an hit him/her ONCE
3. Ran right back to me before i could even hit my flash macro
4. Rdm flipped and bitched

Is this just happening on the fenrir server latley? What do you guys do when you have Princess<job> flip in your party?
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#2 Aug 03 2010 at 12:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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Depends on if I'm party lead or not, but I usually go to tells and say, "Look, you do your job and I'll do mine, ok?" If he then refuses to refresh me, I start looking for another RDM. Not like they're too hard to find. Neither are you, so make sure you ARE doing your job (which you were), and have the satisfaction of knowing that the Princess will always be one.

As far as this being an epidemic? Far from it. Most DRKs I know are trying their hardest to take hate off me at the moment. They succeed,but they forget about Cover, and it all works out in the end.

In all actuality, at this point in the game, I DB a RDM, so I usually just slap myself and get the cycle going. When I'm dealing with a BRD, though, I usually do call them on things if they're being stupid. Since the only two that usually come to my events are awesome, we don't have much issues.
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#3 Aug 03 2010 at 3:57 PM Rating: Good
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was entirely the rdm's fault i wouldn't give it a 2nd thought. He should have converted before he established any hate on the current bird you had just pulled. All the enmity+ gear in the world isnt going to keep him from pulling hate right on pull with a convert~>cure4. Everyone in the party is responsibly for hate control not only the tank. ppl. should be able to feel out their own personal hate boundaries after a round of mobs or so including the dd's. Don't sweat it man, that rdm was an idiot as are the majority ^.~
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#4 Aug 04 2010 at 2:48 PM Rating: Good
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The whole "Princess RDM" thing is about as old as the game itself. That RDM was way out of line for calling you out because he put himself on the hate list before that Convert/Cure IV sequence. If nothing else, he should have run as far out of range as he could and Converted there.
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#5 Aug 04 2010 at 3:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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AriesMCMLXXIII wrote:
The whole "Princess RDM" thing is about as old as the game itself. That RDM was way out of line for calling you out because he put himself on the hate list before that Convert/Cure IV sequence. If nothing else, he should have run as far out of range as he could and Converted there.


Whoa,
Whoa,
Whoa,
Whoa,
Whoa..



Whoa.

That's entirely too smart man. How could the RDM level his evasion skill then?! :| </sarcasm>
PS: This isn't my batman cup.
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#6 Aug 05 2010 at 12:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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RDM's fault for not having stoneskin+phalanx+blink up before he hit convert. That's RDM 101 there. If getting those spells up before converting is not possible due to MP issues, that's when you run 50+ yalms away from the mob before converting (this is exactly what I did during Omega today) so outside the hate-grabbing radius for job abilities as well as AOE radius.

Kick em and find a replacement. RDMs are a dime a dozen, and the good ones never have these issues.
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#7 Aug 05 2010 at 6:06 AM Rating: Good
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As a RDM, seconded(third/fourth, whatever) that they /fail at life. The fact they only got hit once says something about your hate. I tend to Divine Seal >> Convert >> Cure IV, so I get out of range anyway. I also want to know what they were doing standing so close they got hit before you could flash.
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#8 Aug 05 2010 at 7:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
RDM's fault for not having stoneskin+phalanx+blink up before he hit convert. That's RDM 101 there. If getting those spells up before converting is not possible due to MP issues, that's when you run 50+ yalms away from the mob before converting (this is exactly what I did during Omega today) so outside the hate-grabbing radius for job abilities as well as AOE radius.


Usually 20-some yalms will do. From XP'ing BST, it seemed like if you got the mob off of your radar (I know RDM doesn't mob radar, just saying), then I could DS-Cure III myself or whatever without turning the mob, when I could do that with Sneak sometimes if in range.

IMO, it's less of a princess job thing, and more of a player mentality. The same people would likely have gone off if they were on a DD and you weren't keeping hate off of them. If they don't know how the game works, then they'll suck like that no matter the job.
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#9 Aug 05 2010 at 7:54 AM Rating: Decent
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Isiolia wrote:

IMO, it's less of a princess job thing, and more of a player mentality. The same people would likely have gone off if they were on a DD and you weren't keeping hate off of them. If they don't know how the game works, then they'll suck like that no matter the job.


QFT

Idiots will be idiots. No matter the job, race, color or religion.
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#10 Aug 05 2010 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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selond wrote:
the rdm chooses a bad time to convert then cast Cure 4(He had casted cure 3 on me moments before) and the bird ran over to him and hit him ONE TIME and rushed back to me before I even had time to cast flash again. This rdm lost his mind.


Convert - Killing stupid RDMs since level 40. (And yes, I've killed myself with it more then once before learning).

RDM needs to understand hate


selond wrote:
After that statement he then refused to heal/refresh/haste/etc me for the next 2 hrs. Even without him healing or refreshing, the dancer switched over to using aspir samba and that kept me with about 50-70% at all times.


Any why did this last more then 5 min? At that point the party leader tells the RDM to do his job and if not kicks the RDM or you leave. If you chose to stay in a party like that no reason to complain.

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#11 Aug 05 2010 at 9:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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tkinnen wrote:
selond wrote:
the rdm chooses a bad time to convert then cast Cure 4(He had casted cure 3 on me moments before) and the bird ran over to him and hit him ONE TIME and rushed back to me before I even had time to cast flash again. This rdm lost his mind.


Convert - Killing stupid RDMs since level 40. (And yes, I've killed myself with it more then once before learning).

RDM needs to understand hate


You can add BLM and SCH to that list now.
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#12 Aug 05 2010 at 10:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Why in god's name would you ever convert without Stoneskin up?
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#13 Aug 05 2010 at 1:55 PM Rating: Good
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I don't know many Rdm's who convert in middle of fight in an EXP pt. Really not that difficult to vert during the pull or before your on the hate list, especially if you have a dnc in pt who can cover healing for 1 mob.


I honestly can't remember the last time a player died in pt and complained about it.
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#14 Aug 05 2010 at 3:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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Tyleron wrote:
I honestly can't remember the last time a player died in pt and complained about it.


According to the story, the RDM didn't even die. He just got hit once. Which makes his position even more retarded (the RDM, that is).
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#15 Aug 05 2010 at 8:44 PM Rating: Good
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Find a rep and kick them. A few times I've ahd to kick someone who was being a jerk, and it could be the rdm, pld, or brd as easily as a DD. Seriously, having "The Job" does not give someone a pass to be a dick.

Or just say in party chat: This rdm doesn't understand how hate works and I can't tolerate his idiocy, best of luck to you all. Then drop party.

Way I brain it, if I'm paying a fee to play the game, I don't need to feel miserable. But that's just me.
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#16 Aug 06 2010 at 1:20 AM Rating: Good
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Thydonon wrote:
Or just say in party chat: This rdm doesn't understand how hate works and I can't tolerate his idiocy, best of luck to you all. Then drop party.
Replacing the RDM is the way to go, or if you're not leader, try to convince the leader to search for a replacement.

If someone isn't pulling their weight in a party, I have a few steps I usually go to if I'm having an otherwise good day and I'm not in a killing mood:
1) Even if it's not really affecting our kill-speed/survivability, I still hate mooches, so I'd send them a private tell (in my mind to save them the embarrassment of my saying it in Party) asking them if they could do A or B.
2) If that doesn't work, or, even better, they respond rudely, then I bring it to the party's attention. HOPEFULLY, there's a least one other person who isn't retarded and they'll back me up.
3) If all of that even fails to work, then I try to find a replacement for myself and leave.

I figure there's a chance I can keep my party spot and get the mooch kicked out, so I usually go about things in that order. Often, if the rest of the party doesn't really care, and I'm not dying, then I honestly am not going to make a fuss about it, I'll just remember not to invite that person ever again, until I have proof they know what they're doing.
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#17 Aug 06 2010 at 7:10 AM Rating: Good
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Roller wrote:

3) If all of that even fails to work, then I try to find a replacement for myself and leave.


This is the only thing i dont agree. If i find a party unbearable for one reason or another, i will not put someone else in my place.
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#18 Aug 06 2010 at 8:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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TheKhory wrote:
Roller wrote:

3) If all of that even fails to work, then I try to find a replacement for myself and leave.


This is the only thing i dont agree. If i find a party unbearable for one reason or another, i will not put someone else in my place.


When I've done this in the past, I've made it clear why I'm looking for a replacement. Some people want to party regardless of circumstances. Plus, if they know about the RDM'sretard's retardedness, they might be able to get something positive out of it - "Look, I know what you did to the last guy, so if you pull any crap like that, I'm gone, too."

I just think it's good play to let someone know WHY they're repping me. Then, they can take it or leave it at the preference, but if they take it, the party itself doesn't necessarily suffer.
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#19 Aug 08 2010 at 12:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Sorry I have'nt replied been hell week at work lol. Anyway said rdm was the party leaders Boyfriend(to which i figured out after asking the leader to rep his ass) the leader however was a ls mate in my limbo ls and we were doing ok the entire time really. And to be honest i wanted to test my paladin skills a little bit(Having leveled nin to 75 before pld, i've always figured that pld is the easy way of tanking.... which it is) I also explained to him the mechanics of dd tanking after he stopped supporting me so as to keep the party going but I beleive he black listed me so I gave up on him.

Edited, Aug 8th 2010 2:00am by selond
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#20 Aug 08 2010 at 2:34 AM Rating: Decent
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PLD is in far, far, far higher demand at this lvl range than RDM. Tell him to shove it and if he acts up again you'll just bail and they can spend 3 hours looking for another tank while you accept a LFP tell within the next 30 seconds.

BTW this is not a princess job thing. It's just some people being dumb asshats, and that's pretty common on all jobs. "Princess" would mean the RDM refusing to party unless he had a PLD tank, BRD, and COR and if you weren't making 7k/hour he'd fake DC. RDM aren't princesses, there are simply too many of them...heck at 75 I sometimes would see 3-4 RDM lfp.

Edited, Aug 8th 2010 4:38am by Esoa
#21 Aug 14 2010 at 8:02 AM Rating: Good
selond wrote:
A couple of nights ago I had been invited to a level 67 party and for about 2 hours or so I held hate between me, an actual, factual emo drk with emo macros included, a sam who I beleive, never actually learned what seigan does and a crazed drg. oh and party build was PLD(me) RDM,DNC,SAM,DRK, and a DRG. now the drama begins when the rdm chooses a bad time to convert then cast Cure 4(He had casted cure 3 on me moments before) and the bird ran over to him and hit him ONE TIME and rushed back to me before I even had time to cast flash again. This rdm lost his mind.
"Wtf Do your god damn job and keep hate you sh*tty pld elf. I cant even cast a cure without tanking the whole fight"
Followed by him checking my gear annnd...
"Wtf why are you in DD gear? your taking way to much damage and now i know why. No wonder you cant keep hate."
I told him that the bird is not hitting me hard enough to warrant turtling up and that I'm keeping hate just fine.
His response...
"Ok fine since your not getting hit hard enough why dont you just heal your damn self?"
After that statement he then refused to heal/refresh/haste/etc me for the next 2 hrs.Italic Text Even without him healing or refreshing, the dancer switched over to using aspir samba and that kept me with about 50-70% at all times.

The very next day i ran into another rdm in a imp party and the exact same thing happened
1. Timed Convert-> cure 4 badly
2. Imp Ran over an hit him/her ONCE
3. Ran right back to me before i could even hit my flash macro
4. Rdm flipped and bitched

Is this just happening on the fenrir server latley? What do you guys do when you have Princess<job> flip in your party?


The only dumb thing you did was put up with him not doing anything for 2hrs.
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#22 Aug 14 2010 at 5:25 PM Rating: Decent
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To the OP... Why did you defend your actions when you were in the right? You should have told the RDM to shut his stupid hole, and explained to him exactly why he got hit and how stupid he was for doing it, and if he has a problem with it to go find another party that is more tolerant of retardedness. There's no reason to party with idiots. The way it sounds, you could have kicked that RDM and 5-manned it to the same results while looking for a rep.
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#23 Aug 16 2010 at 11:18 AM Rating: Decent
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The reason i stayed in the first party was for a good friend of mine trying to level up. Any other time i would usually just disband as the party pulled and leave(I AM A JACKASS FYI). i get annoyed very quickly when it comes to stupidity.
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#24 Aug 31 2010 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm curious what your guys's take to this situation is and if you think it's possible for you to hold hate against it. I think it it's possible if you flash/voke/attonement at the start of every abyssea fight but with pulls coming every 15-20 seconds i don't think it could happen every pull.

Admittedly I was on my NIN/WAR when this happened. But during a mandy party in abyssea tahrongi a blm in my pty kept insisting on casting burst/freeze2 at the start of every fight for around 1600~1800 damage. After like 30minutes straight of the mob immediately flocking to her and melting her face she opened her mouth in pty chat and said, "too bad we don't have a real tank, maybe i could nuke once without taking hate." I asked her if she thought a pld could keep hate with just voke/flash and she said yea plds in her ls do it all the time. I kind of facepalmed at this point and gave up. It wasn't worth it to get in a catfight with her considering I had spent the last 4 or 5 hours with a brd, whm, and rmd in pty with haste up maybe like 5% of the time and never seeing march. I did get double ballad tho so i got all 30mp back from wally turban whenever i'd gearswap for ws lol...

Anyways TLDR. Can you produce enough threat to hold hate vs an 1600-1800 damage nuke in the opening 10seconds of a fight?
#25 Aug 31 2010 at 1:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, in theory it is possible. When you take the first swing of your weapon agains a mob, you are added to the hate list. Hit sentinel right away for the +100 enmity followed by divine emblem, then hit provoke, flash, vorpal or if you aren't confident with your ws set up atonement. After that, if your additional melee swings isn't keeping hate, you could always use your other JA.

Is this a feasible solution to the nuke happy mage? HELL NO. What the hell are they expecting from you? You could only do this crap once every 5 min without merits. Tell the bitch to either shut up for getting themselves killed or to get that awesome leet PLD friend of theirs to tank.
#26 Aug 31 2010 at 4:36 PM Rating: Good
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Fight after fight, not likely gonna happen. Just flash/voke to control the mob, melee will make quick work of it. Nothing worse for a DD than engage the new mob, and hit WS macro, only to have the mob run to the rdm who casts slow on it, losing TP.

Blm's in Abyssea are mainly there for magic kills. If they are going to start off with ancient magic, they need to do 2 things... 1)sub nin 2)stand next to the mob so it doesn't look like a dunes party and everyone running around.

They don't realize by nuking at the start only slows xp down, since everyone is running after it to kill it now, not to mention the afk'ers who are still just standing in the mobs old location.

In blm's defense, nothing more frustrating than Melee using WS the last 10% when the alliance needs magic kills.

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#27 Sep 01 2010 at 6:30 AM Rating: Good
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I was in an exp party with a guy like that on vultures in Miseraux Coast. He would start every fight with Thunder or Blizzard 4, then run around with the mob chasing him while the melee tried to kill it. I just stood there and did nothing, and after 3 or 4 fights, he finally died. He asked why I didn't heal him, and I told him it was so he'd learn not to do that anymore. Then he started talking about doing a Fragmentation SC so he could magic burst Blizzard on it (Frag is Thunder/Wind). When he continued to insist that he had accomplished that before, I realized he was just a lost cause. Some people just don't accept that anything they do could be wrong.
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#28 Sep 09 2010 at 9:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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To be honest. Paladin has Raise so let the mother@#%^er die. I always let bitching people die. And will continue to do so for every single MMO I play. Trolls die and rage so hard. I live for it.
#29 Sep 13 2010 at 5:17 PM Rating: Decent
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Isiolia wrote:
Usually 20-some yalms will do. From XP'ing BST, it seemed like if you got the mob off of your radar (I know RDM doesn't mob radar, just saying), then I could DS-Cure III myself or whatever without turning the mob, when I could do that with Sneak sometimes if in range.


Hate Range is 30 yalms. The target of whatever ability you use must be outside this range to get no enmity.
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#30 Sep 13 2010 at 11:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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didn't read responses, but here's how you respond to sh*tty players: kick them. anyone who says you're doing it wrong for using DD gear as a high level (even low level) PLD is a sh*tty player. if you're not the leader, announce how sh*tty and unreasonable the person is being, and leave.

why is this behavior acceptable and not being "a princess" yourself? because the game is @#%^ing years and years old, and everyone should know by now that turtle PLDs suck, etc etc. there's still enough people playing and the game is (way, way, way) old enough that there's no reason to tolerate morons.
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