Sage

1,135 posts

I was looking at 5-hit builds for my Sam and Drk, and now I'm wondering if it's possible on War with a 102 dmg Bonesplitter or 97 dmg Store TP Sumeru?

Annihilator 119! 1st April 2015

Tizona(Blue Mage Mythic) 40/50 Assaults re-clear! And 28k alex to go! Started 24th 2014

Chant du Cygne,Victory Smite,Tachi: Fudo, Blade: Hi, Rudra's Storm, Jishnu's Radiance, Wildfire, Ukko's Fury, Torcleaver

Sage

879 posts

Its not the damage that matter for a X hit build, its the delay.

Our standard ( Perdu voulge, Byakko's, berserker's ) Great Axes have Delay 504.

The bonesplitter has 504 delay - it is exactly as difficult to make a bonespliter 5-hit as it is for our current great axes.

The Stp Sumeru has delay 488 - it is even harder to make a X-hit build than with our standard axes. But it does give some Stp to compensate.

So, short answer: No.

Our standard ( Perdu voulge, Byakko's, berserker's ) Great Axes have Delay 504.

The bonesplitter has 504 delay - it is exactly as difficult to make a bonespliter 5-hit as it is for our current great axes.

The Stp Sumeru has delay 488 - it is even harder to make a X-hit build than with our standard axes. But it does give some Stp to compensate.

So, short answer: No.

TybudX wrote:

The hardest part of this game is finding 5-17 other people who aren't retarded.

Scholar

582 posts

In order to get a 5hit with the STP GA, you need 52 total STP

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

Sage

879 posts

You forgot the fact that the Stp Gaxe has lower delay than 504. So it needs even more Stp.

TybudX wrote:

The hardest part of this game is finding 5-17 other people who aren't retarded.

Scholar

582 posts

Either way, the amount of gear you need to do it, regardless of the axe, seems to be giving up way to much in the way of other stats to be useful.

*Edited, Jul 27th 2010 4:40pm by ShamanTaru *

Scholar

3,816 posts

I think a better question to consider, is what about 6 hits builds with the < 504 delay GA's?

Like... Empyrean GA, and a few of the other new GA's that recently arrived.

Like... Empyrean GA, and a few of the other new GA's that recently arrived.

UNMUTED

Scholar

582 posts

Need 27 STP for 6 hit on 488 delay GA

15 /SAM

5 Rajas

1 Brutal

6 Carbonara / 7 Aurumn body

27/28 And not giving up to much or anything if you eat the carb.

*Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:47am by ShamanTaru *

15 /SAM

5 Rajas

1 Brutal

6 Carbonara / 7 Aurumn body

27/28 And not giving up to much or anything if you eat the carb.

Sage

1,135 posts

Looks like we're stuck on 6-hit builds on Gaxe... Oh well, we kick *** anyway ^^

Annihilator 119! 1st April 2015

Tizona(Blue Mage Mythic) 40/50 Assaults re-clear! And 28k alex to go! Started 24th 2014

Chant du Cygne,Victory Smite,Tachi: Fudo, Blade: Hi, Rudra's Storm, Jishnu's Radiance, Wildfire, Ukko's Fury, Torcleaver

Sage

3,959 posts

Is there anything inherently wrong with a 6-hit that's also fast and furious?

LordFaramir wrote:

ODESNT MATTER CAUSE I HAVE ALCHOLOL IN MY VEINGS BETCH

Sage

1,135 posts

No, but I was looking at options ^^ They should hav gave us better Gaxe magian trials, our weapon barely hit 100 dmg, yet DRK can get up to 105-109 on WS trials easily... I'll be rocking Perdu until Bonesplitter 102 dmg then...

Annihilator 119! 1st April 2015

Tizona(Blue Mage Mythic) 40/50 Assaults re-clear! And 28k alex to go! Started 24th 2014

Chant du Cygne,Victory Smite,Tachi: Fudo, Blade: Hi, Rudra's Storm, Jishnu's Radiance, Wildfire, Ukko's Fury, Torcleaver

Sage

5,745 posts

ShamanTaru wrote:

In order to get a 5hit with the STP GA, you need 52 total STP

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

At that point it might be a "5-hit plus 1/2/3-whiff" build.

FFXI veteran (Lyonheart and Lakiskline of Lakshmi)

1/467 on signed HQ Weskit!!!

Scholar

582 posts

Get the Vermeil Bhuj form Abyssea if you can.. 104 DMG and 8 STR is the best you can get atm I would suspect.

Scholar

1,067 posts

Heavy Darksteel Axe lv59 dmg85 delay529

it would be much easier to try and hit the 5 hit with this axe. however, is it worth using a 85dmg gaxe?

it would be much easier to try and hit the 5 hit with this axe. however, is it worth using a 85dmg gaxe?

Sage

3,959 posts

No, it is not.

LordFaramir wrote:

ODESNT MATTER CAUSE I HAVE ALCHOLOL IN MY VEINGS BETCH

Drunken English Bastard

15,268 posts

Lucinus wrote:

No, it is not.

My Movember page

Solrain wrote:

WARs can use semi-colons however we want. I once killed a guy with a semi-colon.

LordFaramir wrote:

ODESNT MATTER CAUSE I HAVE ALCHOLOL IN MY VEINGS BETCH ;3

Sage

3,959 posts

Nilatai wrote:

Lucinus wrote:

No, it is not.

LordFaramir wrote:

ODESNT MATTER CAUSE I HAVE ALCHOLOL IN MY VEINGS BETCH

894 posts

ShamanTaru wrote:

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

Correct me if i'm wrong, RR/KJ are 3hit WS so you should only need 44STP for a Delay:504 Gaxe, 45STP Assuming one of the hits misses.

Ranger Slugwinder

Leathercraft99

DRG75 | BST75 | RNG75 | THF75 | PUP75 | NIN75/WS | BLM75

{SCH} {Can i have it?}

Sequdaz @Ragnarok

Leathercraft99

DRG75 | BST75 | RNG75 | THF75 | PUP75 | NIN75/WS | BLM75

{SCH} {Can i have it?}

Sequdaz @Ragnarok

Scholar

582 posts

Sequ wrote:

ShamanTaru wrote:

With a normal GA you need 46.

If it is even possible you are going to end up having to use some weird gear, lets see

/SAM : 15

Rajas: 5

Aurumn: 7

Rose: 4

Goading: 5

Brutal: 1

All of the above is still only +37. It is +43 if you are using the STP GA. Still need quite a bit, and starting to really sacrifice stats for STP after the gear I mentioned above. Could add in stuff like Ecphoria(1), White tathlum(2), and the Hoard ring(4). Even with that you need 8 more. Carbonara is 6... so getting close, add in.. a Fourth division mantle and you -technically- have it. However, I can't imagine that giving up that much gear is worth the 5 hit.

Correct me if i'm wrong, RR/KJ are 3hit WS so you should only need 44STP for a Delay:504 Gaxe, 45STP Assuming one of the hits misses.

I don't think this will make-or-break anything.

18 posts

Hello all I am a Bravura user and I have a 5 hit build. Heres what I use:

Samurai Sub STP+15

Hachiryu Hands

Hachiryu Legs {STP+10 for 3 pieces of Hachiryu}

Hachiryu Feet

Aurumn Body STP+7

Rajas Ring STP+5

Rose Strap STP+4

White Tathlum STP+2

Brutal Earring STP+1

Atilla Earring STP+1

Ecphoria Earring STP+1

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Carbonarra(Food) STP+6

All of this together nets +52 STP while allowing for an almost unaltered WS set. Macroing in Hands and Feet for more STR will drop the STP value, yes but if one is using Raging Rush or King's Justice (Raging Rush is my WS of choice ever since Critical Attack Trait lol) you will recieve more than 20% TP return with 2-3 hits as long as the first doesnt miss; Granting you a 5/4-hit.

This Set noticably trades off 10% Haste for 10% WS Frequency. This will drop one's Damage over Time Slightly but for those who are powerful WSer's this combo is quite nice, mobs only have so much HP, and a good WS can usually yank 25% - 75% of a mob's HP depending on what your fighting so having TP at one's finger tips can actually cheat other people out of a parse since they wont be able to get any hits in lol. But these days its all about abyssea anyway idk if I'd wanna try parsing an alliance idk about you guys.

Also, this set is done with really high end s*** but thats the bullet I have to bite for owning a Bravura. If you have a completed Sumaru, you can keep Hachi Legs for a WS piece and keep the Byakko Haidate for an extra 5% Haste, and can sub +1STP from either an Atilla Earring or that Ecphoria Ring for something you like better. A Goading Belt would also work (I'd be using one but I dont have one yet lol) Hachiryu Body would also be lovely but again, Dream on lol.

Hope this info helps some.

*Edited, Sep 3rd 2010 11:08pm by Yandaime *

Samurai Sub STP+15

Hachiryu Hands

Hachiryu Legs {STP+10 for 3 pieces of Hachiryu}

Hachiryu Feet

Aurumn Body STP+7

Rajas Ring STP+5

Rose Strap STP+4

White Tathlum STP+2

Brutal Earring STP+1

Atilla Earring STP+1

Ecphoria Earring STP+1

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Carbonarra(Food) STP+6

All of this together nets +52 STP while allowing for an almost unaltered WS set. Macroing in Hands and Feet for more STR will drop the STP value, yes but if one is using Raging Rush or King's Justice (Raging Rush is my WS of choice ever since Critical Attack Trait lol) you will recieve more than 20% TP return with 2-3 hits as long as the first doesnt miss; Granting you a 5/4-hit.

This Set noticably trades off 10% Haste for 10% WS Frequency. This will drop one's Damage over Time Slightly but for those who are powerful WSer's this combo is quite nice, mobs only have so much HP, and a good WS can usually yank 25% - 75% of a mob's HP depending on what your fighting so having TP at one's finger tips can actually cheat other people out of a parse since they wont be able to get any hits in lol. But these days its all about abyssea anyway idk if I'd wanna try parsing an alliance idk about you guys.

Also, this set is done with really high end s*** but thats the bullet I have to bite for owning a Bravura. If you have a completed Sumaru, you can keep Hachi Legs for a WS piece and keep the Byakko Haidate for an extra 5% Haste, and can sub +1STP from either an Atilla Earring or that Ecphoria Ring for something you like better. A Goading Belt would also work (I'd be using one but I dont have one yet lol) Hachiryu Body would also be lovely but again, Dream on lol.

Hope this info helps some.

Scholar

312 posts

here is my question. at what point does going from 5 hit to 6hit become better than using normal haste+ gear? im having a lot of sam's and war's asking me how to achieve a 5 hit build and i tell them but im not sure if its worth dropping haste gear to do it. at what point does a 5 hit with lots of stp out perform a 6 hit with lots of haste?

99blu 99pup 60sch 99dnc 99nin 99sam

50/50 glavoid shells

50/50 itz scales

6/75 orthrus claws

18 posts

Alot of it depends on the situation. Lets say your out doing a Nyzul Isle run or Limbus/Dynamis. Having TP at your finger tips would be the best thing so you can quickly swat mobs away and move on. But to answer your question:

in my Haste settup, I have 21%(20%) Haste as a 6/5 and in my STP set I have 11%(10%) Haste as a 5/4 so I lose 10% Haste

These will be perfect scenarios where one is never hasted, and one never misses just for an estimation under perfect conditions.

~~There are 3600 seconds in an hour, Bravura's Delay is 488. Every 60 DEL = 1 Second

~~~I will assume an Average strike damage of 200 and again at 275

~~~I will use Metatron Torment as the WS since its probably the most simplistic and almost the same strength as Kings Justice.

~~~Metatron Torment's Mods are [DMG]x2.85 at all TP ranges STR60%. fSTR will be assumed as +80 (+48%) Gorget is in effect

~~~Assumed that Double Attack never procs

Torment will do around 844 Damage when hitting 200

Torment will do around 1160 Damage when hitting 275

21%(20%) Set: DEL = 390 = 6.5 Sec per swing = 553 Swings per hour

This set is a 6/5 so I would get 110 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 110,600 Melee Damage Per Hour and 92,840 WS Damage

~Total of 203,440 Damage per hour when hitting 200~

11%(10%) Set: DEL = 439 = 7.3 Sec per swing = 493 Swings per hour

This set is a 5/4 so I would get 123 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 98,600 Melee Damage Per Hour and 103,812 WS Damage

~Total of 202,412 Damage per Hour when hitting 200~

A 1.51% Difference in the Haste Set's Favor. Not very large given this runs through an hour.

==Now when we run that same "perfect" scenario when hitting 275==

21%(20%) Set: DEL = 390 = 6.5 Sec per swing = 553 Swings per hour

This set is a 6/5 so I would get 110 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 152,075 Melee Damage Per Hour and 127,600 WS Damage

~Total of 279,675 per Hour when hitting 275~

11%(10%) Set: DEL = 439 = 7.3 Sec per swing = 493 Swings per hour

This set is a 5/4 so I would get 123 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 135,575 Melee Damage Per Hour and 142,680 WS Damage

~Total of 278,255 Damage per Hour when hitting 275~

A Difference of 1.51% again.

As it stands, the Damage Outputs of both settups is nearly identical with the Faster set beeing only just barely, like wow thats not even an Inch, more Potent. However, this was done with a WS that is very clean and doesnt jump around. Now if we tried this with Raging Rush (its so awesome after this last update) You will probably see some interesting changes. My RR's currently average 1400 with spikes of 1700-2200 not too rarely. Idk about other WARs. And also considering that the two sets are nearly tied, I would have to say I favor the STP set just because of the situational usefulness of having TP all the time lol. Now if I get a Goading Belt, its over. With that Belt, Ill be able to close the Haste gap and still keep the really high WS Frequency.

**These were simulated tests run in a relatively perfect situation where no one ever misses and no randomness occurs. I prefer doing this rather than parsing cuz again, I dont like randomness lol**

hope this helps

*Edited, Sep 4th 2010 11:31am by Yandaime *

in my Haste settup, I have 21%(20%) Haste as a 6/5 and in my STP set I have 11%(10%) Haste as a 5/4 so I lose 10% Haste

These will be perfect scenarios where one is never hasted, and one never misses just for an estimation under perfect conditions.

~~There are 3600 seconds in an hour, Bravura's Delay is 488. Every 60 DEL = 1 Second

~~~I will assume an Average strike damage of 200 and again at 275

~~~I will use Metatron Torment as the WS since its probably the most simplistic and almost the same strength as Kings Justice.

~~~Metatron Torment's Mods are [DMG]x2.85 at all TP ranges STR60%. fSTR will be assumed as +80 (+48%) Gorget is in effect

~~~Assumed that Double Attack never procs

Torment will do around 844 Damage when hitting 200

Torment will do around 1160 Damage when hitting 275

21%(20%) Set: DEL = 390 = 6.5 Sec per swing = 553 Swings per hour

This set is a 6/5 so I would get 110 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 110,600 Melee Damage Per Hour and 92,840 WS Damage

~Total of 203,440 Damage per hour when hitting 200~

11%(10%) Set: DEL = 439 = 7.3 Sec per swing = 493 Swings per hour

This set is a 5/4 so I would get 123 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 98,600 Melee Damage Per Hour and 103,812 WS Damage

~Total of 202,412 Damage per Hour when hitting 200~

A 1.51% Difference in the Haste Set's Favor. Not very large given this runs through an hour.

==Now when we run that same "perfect" scenario when hitting 275==

21%(20%) Set: DEL = 390 = 6.5 Sec per swing = 553 Swings per hour

This set is a 6/5 so I would get 110 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 152,075 Melee Damage Per Hour and 127,600 WS Damage

~Total of 279,675 per Hour when hitting 275~

11%(10%) Set: DEL = 439 = 7.3 Sec per swing = 493 Swings per hour

This set is a 5/4 so I would get 123 WSs in 1 Hour at most

This will give me 135,575 Melee Damage Per Hour and 142,680 WS Damage

~Total of 278,255 Damage per Hour when hitting 275~

A Difference of 1.51% again.

As it stands, the Damage Outputs of both settups is nearly identical with the Faster set beeing only just barely, like wow thats not even an Inch, more Potent. However, this was done with a WS that is very clean and doesnt jump around. Now if we tried this with Raging Rush (its so awesome after this last update) You will probably see some interesting changes. My RR's currently average 1400 with spikes of 1700-2200 not too rarely. Idk about other WARs. And also considering that the two sets are nearly tied, I would have to say I favor the STP set just because of the situational usefulness of having TP all the time lol. Now if I get a Goading Belt, its over. With that Belt, Ill be able to close the Haste gap and still keep the really high WS Frequency.

**These were simulated tests run in a relatively perfect situation where no one ever misses and no randomness occurs. I prefer doing this rather than parsing cuz again, I dont like randomness lol**

hope this helps

Sage

879 posts

Yandaime wrote:

Hello all I am a Bravura user and I have a 5 hit build. Heres what I use:

Samurai Sub STP+15

Hachiryu Hands

Hachiryu Legs {STP+10 for 3 pieces of Hachiryu}

Hachiryu Feet

Aurumn Body STP+7

Rajas Ring STP+5

Rose Strap STP+4

White Tathlum STP+2

Brutal Earring STP+1

Atilla Earring STP+1

Ecphoria Earring STP+1

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Carbonarra(Food) STP+6

Samurai Sub STP+15

Hachiryu Hands

Hachiryu Legs {STP+10 for 3 pieces of Hachiryu}

Hachiryu Feet

Aurumn Body STP+7

Rajas Ring STP+5

Rose Strap STP+4

White Tathlum STP+2

Brutal Earring STP+1

Atilla Earring STP+1

Ecphoria Earring STP+1

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Carbonarra(Food) STP+6

So... Comparing your set...

Hachy hands - 10 DEX, 5 acc

Hachy feet -

Hachy Legs - 10 STR, 5 atk

Aurum - 8 STR, 8 DEX, 15 atk

Rajas - 5 STR, 5 DEX

Rose Strap

White Tathlum

Brutal

Atilla

Ecphoria - 4 acc

Bravura - 20 acc

Carbonara

Total:

23 STR

23 DEX

20 Atk

25 acc

Against

Dusk Gloves - 3% haste, 5 atk

Aurum Sabatons - 2% Haste, 3 DEX, 5 acc, 5 atk

Byakko's Haidate - 5% Haste, 15 DEX

Haubergeon +1 - 6 STR, 6 DEX, 12 ACC, 12 ATK

Rajas - 5 STR, 5 DEX

Rose Strap

Fire Bomblet - 6 Acc, 6 Atk

Brutal

Merman's - 6 Atk

Ecphoria - 4 Acc

Perdu - 5 Acc, 10 Atk

Total:

10% Haste

11 STR

29 DEX

44 Atk

32 Acc

You are trying to sell that a 5-hit build is better than 10% haste? 10% Haste, extra attack and extra acc? 10% haste and 20 extra acc if you put a bravura on the second set?

Im not sure you understand - 10% haste DOES give you 10% extra WS frequency. Because you gain the needed tp faster.

TybudX wrote:

The hardest part of this game is finding 5-17 other people who aren't retarded.

Scholar

1,054 posts

Quote:

Im not sure you understand - 10% haste DOES give you 10% extra WS frequency. Because you gain the needed tp faster.

Some people put time into getting great gear and some people put time into understanding how it works. A good mix of both works best it would seem.

Quote:

You can't transform numbers into other numbers like that. It'd just go on forever. That's like witchcraft.

There's one guy I know who

Quote:

is a big deal now.

Scholar

2,626 posts

10% haste is ..... Absolutely Massive.

Scholar

312 posts

going from a 6hit to 5hit is a 16.7% increase in ws frequency if my numbers are right. it seems like a good trade off for 16.7% increase compared to 10% haste. but if you start getting high haste: marches, hasso, dnc, haste im thinking that 10% will start to make a big difference. little ffxicalculator math is showing you'd need 14% haste to cap and thats pretty much what you'd be missing by using 5hit. im sure there's a cut off where 5hit>haste and vice versa.

99blu 99pup 60sch 99dnc 99nin 99sam

50/50 glavoid shells

50/50 itz scales

6/75 orthrus claws

Scholar

2,626 posts

Going from 15% haste to 25% haste is a 13.3% increase in DoT & ws frequency

Going from 25% haste to 35% haste is a 15.4% increase in Dot & ws frequency

Going from 30% haste to 40% haste is a 16.7% increase in Dot & ws frequency

So you only need 30% haste (spell & gear?) before that 10% is makin a large impact. Any higher haste then 30% and it starts to get silly the losses your making. Thats just from the haste too, from what Thekhory said, your also losing ~10Acc and ~20Att sacrificing gear which is enough to make 5Hit inferior going from 15% to 25% haste.

Unless you have Mnk or Nin, I'd sell Hachiryu Kote, and I can't realy think of any use for the Sune-Ate bar some tailor specific Eva setup.

Going from 25% haste to 35% haste is a 15.4% increase in Dot & ws frequency

Going from 30% haste to 40% haste is a 16.7% increase in Dot & ws frequency

So you only need 30% haste (spell & gear?) before that 10% is makin a large impact. Any higher haste then 30% and it starts to get silly the losses your making. Thats just from the haste too, from what Thekhory said, your also losing ~10Acc and ~20Att sacrificing gear which is enough to make 5Hit inferior going from 15% to 25% haste.

Unless you have Mnk or Nin, I'd sell Hachiryu Kote, and I can't realy think of any use for the Sune-Ate bar some tailor specific Eva setup.

**B***i*__U__~~S~~
Smileys

**Post**

Anonymous Guests (1)

© 2017 ZAM Network LLC