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Rune Chopper and Balrahn's Ring...Follow

#1 Mar 19 2009 at 11:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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I am thinking of this... It sounds kinda silly, but I want to know if it works out in your head as well as it does in mine.

Currently my gear set I use in Nyzul is:

Perdu/Pole/____/Bombcore
Turban/PCC/Ethereal(fowling)/Brutal
Haub/Dusk/Blood/Rajas
Amemet+1/Swift/Haidate/Dusk

The thing is that I chose Balrahn's from ToAU. I use Ethereal because Acc is not as useful in Nyzul for most targets.

If I got Refresh Sanction and wore Balrahn's ring, I'd have a 2tic refresh plus any damage-mp from ethereal. This would allow me to remove my dusk feet and wear amir for the made up ring stats while capping gear haste.

The main purpose of this is because I tank nyzul and doing things like Chariots make me sad. I'd REALLY love the reduced utsusemi timers. My major concearn is whether or not gaining that extra tic from balrahns plus any damage taken (ethereal) would increase the activation of the chopper above the 50% value or not.

Am I crazy?

Edited, Mar 19th 2009 3:45pm by LordMnementh
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#2 Mar 19 2009 at 11:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sounds and looks pretty solid to me, but who the f*ck am I, I'll leave it to the experts.
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#3 Mar 19 2009 at 11:54 AM Rating: Decent
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There's been a few times I've merited with Rune Chopper and Refresh Sanction (no refresh ring) and I was getting 2 MP a tic. So, you should getting 3 MP a tic with ring. However, keep in mind that the strength of the Sanction effect has to do with the Imperial Defense, or something like that. If you look up the Glory Crown on Wiki, it talks about how all the works.
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#4 Mar 19 2009 at 12:29 PM Rating: Good
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MinscandBoo wrote:
There's been a few times I've merited with Rune Chopper and Refresh Sanction (no refresh ring) and I was getting 2 MP a tic.


I always thought sanction refresh was 1 mp/tick.... Is my Glory Crown actually worth something? Smiley: dubious
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#5 Mar 19 2009 at 12:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
There's been a few times I've merited with Rune Chopper and Refresh Sanction (no refresh ring) and I was getting 2 MP a tic. So, you should getting 3 MP a tic with ring. However, keep in mind that the strength of the Sanction effect has to do with the Imperial Defense, or something like that. If you look up the Glory Crown on Wiki, it talks about how all the works.


Sanction Refresh is always 1MP/tick. Imperial Defense Rating simply affects the range that it will take effect in.

Quote:
The main purpose of this is because I tank nyzul and doing things like Chariots make me sad. I'd REALLY love the reduced utsusemi timers. My major concearn is whether or not gaining that extra tic from balrahns plus any damage taken (ethereal) would increase the activation of the chopper above the 50% value or not.


I think it'd depend in part on how much of a base pool you have to work with, and what sort of time between fights you wind up with.

Obviously without a full 3MP/tick or better, you're going to be losing MP over time when engaged, limiting how long it'd be good for. However, if you've got, say, full MP merits, then that 80MP alone would keep the latent going for approximately the same number of seconds.
If you're recovering 2 out of the 3MP/tick, then it's only draining your base MP (well, once Sanction takes effect) at 1MP/tick, then recovering it at 2MP/tick between mobs.

Still, say, 60MP with 2MP/tick would be 180 seconds of 100% activation before you'd run dry and get the effect 50% of the time, right? Before even taking Ethereal converted MP into account.

You can get Strange Juice at the start for a 5 minute, 2MP/tick Refresh. Maybe from crates too. If you were really concerned, maybe bring some juices to use too.

I think you could make it work pretty well, provided you have some buffer MP and aren't just relying on the MP/tick to fuel it. In that line of thought, arranging gear swaps to not pull out incidental MP pieces (or put other in instead) might be worthwhile. For example, while you may not have them yet, Askar feet have 30MP on them. If you're swapping out Turban for WS, maybe swap those in instead of Hecatomb to maintain that pool.
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#6 Mar 19 2009 at 12:43 PM Rating: Good
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The exp bonus varies from 5-15% based on the state of Besieged. If you get sanction while wearing your crown, you get +1 to the imperial defense bonus (worthless if besieged is already level 8), giving you a very slightly improved exp bonus.
#7 Mar 19 2009 at 2:25 PM Rating: Good
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All I know is with Sanction Refresh, I was only losing 1 MP a tic except when the RDM would refresh me. I thought it was a little odd myself as I always thought Sanction Refresh was 1 MP a tic also, but I figured it had something to do with the Imp. Defense thing or maybe being Captain, I don't know. And to my knowledge, Rune Chopper costs 3 MP a tic when engaged.

Edited, Mar 19th 2009 7:16pm by MinscandBoo
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#8 Mar 19 2009 at 4:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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Toss in an Ares's Cuirass and you could retain a 100% activation rate! I actually have Balrahn's Ring and Cuirass, perhaps worth giving this a try in salvage.
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#9 Mar 19 2009 at 8:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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Isiolia wrote:
For example, while you may not have them yet, Askar feet have 30MP on them. If you're swapping out Turban for WS, maybe swap those in instead of Hecatomb to maintain that pool.


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#10 Mar 20 2009 at 1:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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LordMnementh wrote:

The main purpose of this is because I tank nyzul and doing things like Chariots make me sad. I'd REALLY love the reduced utsusemi timers.
Do you know that spell timers have a haste cap of 50%, if you are getting haste and double march(aka 35% haste), like you should against a chariot, just 15% haste in gear is necessary to reach the cap for utsusemi(this is the trick that paladins, and ninjas alike use to sneak some extra enmity in), therefor I doubt that rune will make any impact in your ability to maintain the shadows up.

LordMnementh wrote:
My major concearn is whether or not gaining that extra tic from balrahns plus any damage taken (ethereal) would increase the activation of the chopper above the 50% value or not.
your activation rate with 2 mp per tic will be 66%, that once you mp reach 0, as the following table shows:

 
tic    mp(before effect)    rune effect    mp(after effect) 
1      2                    no             2 
2      4                    yes            1 
3      3                    yes            0 
4      2                    no             1 
... 


On a second thought about haste, I could work well if you either don't have both marchs or haste(you should but this isn't always the case), justifying the whole idea in your tanking role, since even as awesome as haste is, it doesn't keep up for the huge damage loss(no perdu, -ring slot, etc)

I hope it helps.

Ken.

edit: table positions

Edited, Mar 20th 2009 9:53am by kenage
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#11 Mar 20 2009 at 2:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sanction Refresh has always been 1mp/tic. I use it on dragoon all the time since all I do is solo /mage and it helps a ton.
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#12 Mar 20 2009 at 5:18 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
your activation rate with 2 mp per tic will be 66%, that once you mp reach 0, as the following table shows:


tic mp(before effect) rune effect mp(after effect)
1 2 no 2
2 4 yes 1
3 3 yes 0
4 2 no 1


Rune weapons will take less than their normal MP/tick if that's all you have. That's why 1MP/tick is 50% activation, because you have 0MP, no latent, 1MP, latent, 0MP, no latent, and so on. The MP coming in and the Rune weapon taking it don't exactly sync up, causing you to have 0 MP and no latent every other tick.

Possible the timing with 2MP/tick might let 4 MP build up though, in which case it might actually be active for a couple ticks in a row like you laid out there, I dunno, my main experience with Rune weapons was with the 1h axes on BST.

Quote:
On a second thought about haste, I could work well if you either don't have both marchs or haste(you should but this isn't always the case)


His Nyzul static, as per posts in other threads, does not include a BRD, so no marches.
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#13 Mar 20 2009 at 7:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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kenage wrote:
your activation rate with 2 mp per tic will be 66%, that once you mp reach 0, as the following table shows:


tic mp(before effect) rune effect mp(after effect)
1 2 no 2
2 4 yes 1
3 3 yes 0
4 2 no 1


I think Ken is right, to extrapolate a whole minute: If I started at say, 10 MP...
 
tic    mp(before effect)    rune effect    mp(after effect) 
1      10                   yes            7 
2      9                    yes            6 
3      8                    yes            5 
4      7                    yes            4 
5      6                    yes            3 
6      5                    yes            2 
7      4                    yes            1 
8      3                    yes            0 (next tic, it should see 0) 
9      2                    no             2  
10     4                    yes            1 
11     3                    yes            0 (next tic, it should see 0) 
12     2                    no             2 
13     4                    yes            1 
14     3                    yes            0 (next tic, it should see 0) 
15     2                    no             2 
16     4                    yes            1 
17     3                    yes            0 (next tic, it should see 0) 
18     2                    no             2 
19     4                    yes            1 
20     3                    yes            0 (next tic, it should see 0) 

So... if I started from 10 MP, at 3 seconds per tic, i'd have 48 seconds of activation and 12 seconds of inactivation. 80% on, 20% off. If between battles my MP was allowed to regen to 10, It would start over again. This is just with 1 MP merit though, and I have 3.

Isiolia wrote:

Quote:
On a second thought about haste, I could work well if you either don't have both marchs or haste(you should but this isn't always the case)


His Nyzul static, as per posts in other threads, does not include a BRD, so no marches.


Yeah no brd for me. Currently when we run into boss chariots I just have to pray I don't get aoe -> aoe -> double critical. We just depend on our healing power. I really feel like a mp drain on these things so any help would be kickass.

Thanks for all the responses guys :)

Edited, Mar 20th 2009 11:26am by LordMnementh
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#14 Mar 20 2009 at 12:12 PM Rating: Good
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Sounds and looks pretty solid to me, but who the f*ck am I, I'll leave it to the experts.
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#15 Mar 20 2009 at 12:34 PM Rating: Good
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If you want to reduce timers, you could also just swap in Blitz Ring and Loq Earring for casting, would make for less headaches than dealing with Rune Latent.
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#16 Mar 20 2009 at 12:45 PM Rating: Decent
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From what I've seen/heard, the effect on rune chopper is always active as long as you have some sort of refresh effect, regardless of wether you have MP that tic or not.
#17 Mar 20 2009 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
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From what I've seen/heard, the effect on rune chopper is always active as long as you have some sort of refresh effect, regardless of wether you have MP that tic or not.
Nope, if you have any mp the effect will activate but a constant refrest of less than 3 mp per tick will only keep it up about half the time.
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