Forum Settings
       
« Previous 1 2 3
Reply To Thread

New RDM GearFollow

#1 May 09 2011 at 1:30 PM Rating: Good
*
208 posts
Some of the new gear that stood out most:

Oneiros Torque Rare
Neck
Evasion+5 Physical damage taken -2%
Lv88 WAR MNK RDM THF PLD DRK BST BRD SAM NIN DRG BLU COR DNC

Oneiros Cape Rare
Back
DEF:8 Magic Accuracy+5
Enhances "Dragon Killer" effect
Lv88 WHM BLM RDM BRD SMN BLU PUP SCH

Strendu Ring Rare Exclusive
Ring
Magic Accuracy+2
"Magic Atk. Bonus"+4
Lv90 WHM BLM RDM BRD SMN BLU SCH

Oneiros Sash Rare
Waist
DEF:5 HP+20 MP+20
"Magic Atk. Bonus"+4
Lv88 WHM BLM RDM SMN SCH

Demonry Sash Rare
Waist
DEF:6 MND+4 CHR+4 Magic Accuracy+4
Lv88 WHM BLM RDM BRD SMN SCH

Khthonios Mask Rare
Head
DEF:24 Attack+14
"Store TP"+4 Haste+4%
Converts 30 MP to HP
Lv88 WHM BLM RDM BRD SMN SCH

Avesta Bangles Rare Exclusive
Hands
Magic Accuracy+6
Enfeebling magic skill +15
Elemental magic skill +15
Dark magic skill +15
Lv88 MNK WHM BLM RDM THF DRK BRD RNG SMN BLU COR PUP DNC SCH

Melaco Mittens Rare
Hands
DEF:19 MND+3
Physical damage taken -3%
Enhances "Bird Killer" effect
Lv90 WAR MNK RDM THF PLD DRK BST BRD SAM NIN DRG BLU COR DNC

Calmecac Trousers Rare
Legs
DEF:46 Accuracy-8 "Double Attack"+2%
"Triple Attack"+2% Haste+3%
Lv89 WAR MNK RDM THF DRK BST BRD RNG SAM DRG DNC

Tefnut Wand Rare
Club
DMG:42 Delay:216 MND+10
Healing magic skill +5
"Cure" potency +15%
Lv87 WHM BLM RDM SMN SCH

Numen Staff Rare
Staff
DMG:51 Delay:366 MP+45
MP recovered while healing +14
Latent effect: Adds "Refresh" effect
Lv79 WAR MNK WHM BLM RDM BST BRD SMN SCH
#2 May 09 2011 at 3:11 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
Avatar
***
1,649 posts
K1n371x wrote:

Calmecac Trousers Rare
Legs
DEF:46 Accuracy-8 "Double Attack"+2%
"Triple Attack"+2% Haste+3%
Lv89 WAR MNK RDM THF DRK BST BRD RNG SAM DRG DNC

Oh look, DD pants finally!

Numen Staff and Strendu Ring looks interesting. The rest is same-old, same-old though.
____________________________

#3 May 09 2011 at 3:29 PM Rating: Decent
Jack of All Trades
******
29,628 posts
Mostly underwhelming, although I'd have to say what plenty of others are probably thinking in that I definitely have to bag some Avesta Bangles based purely on the name.
#4 May 09 2011 at 4:04 PM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,147 posts
Hyksos Robe
[Body]All Races
DEF:46 INT+12 CHR+12
Enhancing magic skill +10
Elemental magic skill +10
Summoning magic skill +10
Set: Magic Accuracy+5
Lv.90 WHM/BLM/RDM/BRD/SMN/PUP/SCH

Hyksos Robe +1
[Body]All Races
DEF:47 INT+13 CHR+13
Enhancing magic skill +11
Elemental magic skill +11
Summoning magic skill +11
Set: Magic Accuracy+5
Lv.90 WHM/BLM/RDM/BRD/SMN/PUP/SCH

Anhur Robe
[Body]All Races
DEF:48 INT+14 CHR+14
Enhancing magic skill +12
Elemental magic skill +12
Summoning magic skill +12
Enhances "Fast Cast" effect
Sphere: "Magic Atk. Bonus"+5
Set: Magic Accuracy+5
Lv.90 WHM/BLM/RDM/BRD/SMN/PUP/SCH


These caught my eye as upgrades for enhancing magic in the body slot of Glamor Jupon's +3. The last two are also an upgrade over Augur's Jaseran for nuking, with more INT on the latter, but better accuracy overall. I'm gonna assume they're trialed through the VW system in some way.

As for the melee pants, while I wanna say FINALLY with not needing to blow an add-on item, -ACC is not something we need with our lower skill caps and otherwise lesser martial prowess. Probably workable in Abyssea just fine, but if there are things of difficulty elsewhere later, these won't really help our cause. I suppose now I need to weigh redoing ASA pants depending on how hard they are to get, but the Tatsus are also useful for me on SCH, BLM, and SMN.

Edited, May 9th 2011 6:12pm by Seriha
____________________________
Violence good. **** bad. Yay America.
#5 May 09 2011 at 6:11 PM Rating: Good
***
2,890 posts
Accuracy is nothing now, just because of how percentages work. We can easily clear 380 ~ 400 base accuracy without even trying, more if we put effort into it. Once you throw in the 11% from Pizza +1 then that -8 acc isn't gonna be doing much. Still I'm feeling severely underwhelmed, it looks like SE is still having whatever developer spaz contest they've been having for years with out guy putting RDM into the "magic onry" category and the other guy going "well they need this too". Seriously they keep putting BLU / COR / DNC on nice melee pieces but someone keeps thinking "RDM doesn't need any of that".
____________________________
RoTZ: Complete DM: O
CoP: Complete AN: O
99 SAM, RDM, BLU, WAR, PLD, DRK

lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


Lucinus wrote:
when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the **** out of the way instead...
#7 May 09 2011 at 8:59 PM Rating: Default
*
208 posts
I missed a few juicy all jobs items:

Genesis Locket Rare Ex
Neck
"Magic Atk. Bonus"+5 Increases magic critical hit damage
LV 88 All Jobs

Impatiens Rare
Ammo
Spell interruption rate -10% Occ. quickens spellcasting +2%
LV 86 All Jobs

Oneiros Grip Rare Ex
Sub
Adds "Regen" effect Latent effect: Adds "Refresh" effect
LV 88 All Jobs

Roller's Ring Rare
Finger
HP+11 Latent effect: Adds "Refresh" and "Regain" effects
LV 86 All Jobs

Veisa Collar Rare
Neck
Physical damage taken -4%
LV 87 All Jobs

Edited, May 9th 2011 11:10pm by K1n371x
#8 May 10 2011 at 8:04 PM Rating: Good
***
1,624 posts
Don't forget about these gems if you don't have a Badelaire or Almace:

Talekeeper Rare Exclusive
Sword
DMG:55 Delay:224
HP+50 MP+50 STR+10 VIT+10
Resistance against terror
Lv90 WAR RDM PLD BRD DRG COR DNC

and

Sagasinger Rare Exclusive
Sword
DMG:56 Delay:218
HP+75 MP+75 STR+15 VIT+15
Resistance against terror
Additional effect:
Steals enhancement effect
Lv90 WAR RDM PLD BRD DRG COR DNC
____________________________
Deedlitchan-Bismark server
Female Elvaan 90 rdm/(drk, pld, war, blu, dnc)
75 drg/(rdm, blu, war, sam, drk, pld)
90 drk/(sam, blu, rdm, war, dnc)
San d'Oria-Rank 10
#9 May 11 2011 at 9:49 AM Rating: Decent
***
2,890 posts
My only issue with

Quote:
Calmecac Trousers Rare
Legs
DEF:46 Accuracy-8 "Double Attack"+2%
"Triple Attack"+2% Haste+3%
Lv89 WAR MNK RDM THF DRK BST BRD RNG SAM DRG DNC


Is that every THF DRK BRD RNG DRG and most likely DNC will try to lot them, just for ****** Getting melee gear on RDM is rare as is, it sucks when you have to compete with tons of other jobs that have better alternatives but still want to have it.
____________________________
RoTZ: Complete DM: O
CoP: Complete AN: O
99 SAM, RDM, BLU, WAR, PLD, DRK

lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


Lucinus wrote:
when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the **** out of the way instead...
#10 May 11 2011 at 11:17 AM Rating: Default
*
208 posts
saevellakshmi wrote:
My only issue with

Quote:
Calmecac Trousers Rare
Legs
DEF:46 Accuracy-8 "Double Attack"+2%
"Triple Attack"+2% Haste+3%
Lv89 WAR MNK RDM THF DRK BST BRD RNG SAM DRG DNC


Is that every THF DRK BRD RNG DRG and most likely DNC will try to lot them, just for ****** Getting melee gear on RDM is rare as is, it sucks when you have to compete with tons of other jobs that have better alternatives but still want to have it.


Those are AHable, so thats one way we can get them. I'm pretty sure DRK doesnt have a "better" option, not sure about those other jobs, but I'm looking forward to having them for RDM and DRK.

EDIT:
They drop from KCNM50 Dragon Scales in Chamber of Oracles.

Edited, May 11th 2011 1:31pm by K1n371x
#11 May 11 2011 at 12:15 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
saevellakshmi wrote:
Accuracy is nothing now, just because of how percentages work. We can easily clear 380 ~ 400 base accuracy without even trying, more if we put effort into it. Once you throw in the 11% from Pizza +1 then that -8 acc isn't gonna be doing much. Still I'm feeling severely underwhelmed, it looks like SE is still having whatever developer spaz contest they've been having for years with out guy putting RDM into the "magic onry" category and the other guy going "well they need this too". Seriously they keep putting BLU / COR / DNC on nice melee pieces but someone keeps thinking "RDM doesn't need any of that".


I'm just curious, are you suggesting ACC means nothing because of Abyssea atma's? Or just saying ACC has diminished returns and all jobs that have low skill in a weapon can wield it just fine? I'm seriously hoping you're not using Abyssea's uber buffs to argue this point.

As for what RDM needs, it's not more melee gear. You have to look at the game as a whole. Look at the useful mage classes in the game right now. BLM and WHM. The rest are just lost and useless. RDM can't nuke better than a SCH or BLM, can't heal better than a WHM, and our enfeebling skill is useless. As a matter of fact, we've done so many mega-bosses and even outside Abby stuff with no RDM enfeebles without missing a stroke. This is just sad and the answer to making RDM useful again isn't melee gear. Look at how many melee classes we already have, SE isn't going to add us to the ranks of hybrid classes DNC, BLU, PUP, etc just because the RDM forums want to melee.

This isn't about being against those that choose to melee, this is about what RDM needs as a whole. I'm hoping everyone that reads this thread understands this. The useful melee/mage ratio is terribly balanced right now. RDM was the jack of trades and SCH was the jack of all magic trades. This style of plan no longer works well. I'm sure some of you will say "But Shadow, me and my friends low-man this or that". Well guess what, if you could low-man on RDM while meleeing, you could do it on any job now. That's my point here.

For the record, I don't mind RDM meleeing in Abyssea because it doesn't matter. Most people are leeches anyway so I'd rather have a melee RDM than an afk melee. Fair and balanced is the key.

edit: I got rated down for being honest. Oh nooesss.. what will I ever do. C'mon speak up if you you don't agree. Quit being a coward. Grow some balls and say something.

Edited, May 11th 2011 1:45pm by ShadowedgeFFXI

Edited, May 11th 2011 1:46pm by ShadowedgeFFXI
#12 May 11 2011 at 1:01 PM Rating: Decent
***
1,624 posts
Quote:
As for what RDM needs, it's not more melee gear. You have to look at the game as a whole. Look at the useful mage classes in the game right now. BLM and WHM. The rest are just lost and useless. RDM can't nuke better than a SCH or BLM, can't heal better than a WHM, and our enfeebling skill is useless. As a matter of fact, we've done so many mega-bosses and even outside Abby stuff with no RDM enfeebles without missing a stroke. This is just sad and the answer to making RDM useful again isn't melee gear. Look at how many melee classes we already have, SE isn't going to add us to the ranks of hybrid classes DNC, BLU, PUP, etc just because the RDM forums want to melee.


You're not helping any. Then what should they add? More magic gear? More redundancy to a class that no longer has an identity? What really sets us apart from Scholar, who can also cast white and black magic, and gains higher tiers of elemental magic on top of it AND gets status cure spells? Your entire post drags down, yet again, the melee side of the debate but provides no further direction. "Add us to the ranks of hybrid classes DNC, BLU, PUP, etc" What do you mean by this? WE WERE FIRST IN LINE FROM THE VERY BEGINNING! Before even paladin and dark knight, RED MAGE WAS THERE!

Quote:
This isn't about being against those that choose to melee, this is about what RDM needs as a whole.


Yes, yes it is, both ways in this statement. Red Mage does need a bolster to melee capacity to regain its original identity. And don't give me that usual BS about Blue Mage. It's not Red Mage, it wasn't there at the beginning, it wasn't forgotten.
____________________________
Deedlitchan-Bismark server
Female Elvaan 90 rdm/(drk, pld, war, blu, dnc)
75 drg/(rdm, blu, war, sam, drk, pld)
90 drk/(sam, blu, rdm, war, dnc)
San d'Oria-Rank 10
#13 May 11 2011 at 1:35 PM Rating: Default
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
Deedlitchan wrote:


You're not helping any. Then what should they add? More magic gear? More redundancy to a class that no longer has an identity? What really sets us apart from Scholar, who can also cast white and black magic, and gains higher tiers of elemental magic on top of it AND gets status cure spells? Your entire post drags down, yet again, the melee side of the debate but provides no further direction. "Add us to the ranks of hybrid classes DNC, BLU, PUP, etc" What do you mean by this? WE WERE FIRST IN LINE FROM THE VERY BEGINNING! Before even paladin and dark knight, RED MAGE WAS THERE!


So because we were one of the original jobs, in your mind, that means we can never be forced off the line. Well we don't need anymore hybrid jobs, we have enough already. We need backline casters that support the group. Doesn't strike you as odd how few mages people take nowadays? They'll take a WHM and BLM, but the rest are melee.

The course in which RDM should head is the backline casting duties. I'm happy that WHM has healing locked down, but what if SE released some useful enfeebles or other spells that made RDM viable. It would be nice to have a back-up healer too just in case. RDM was always the back-up... tank, healer, nuker etc. It just makes no sense to pursue a melee front when it's already covered in spades by like 15 jobs. Would it not make more sense to be a sensible back line caster? Give us more magical spells that aren't just rehashes of BLM spells now like Tier IV nukes. Addle was a good start, but how about some ancient enfeebles. Give RDM a terror spell that works on Abyssea mega-bosses and other HNM caliber mobs. Or how about a /ja called Rune which absorbs magic with our sword and gives us MP returns. This would work great eating those GA's and other nukes especially if stunning isn't viable. I have ideas how to make us useful again, but I don't think most of you care unless it means you get to auto attack blindly.

Quote:


Yes, yes it is, both ways in this statement. Red Mage does need a bolster to melee capacity to regain its original identity. And don't give me that usual BS about Blue Mage. It's not Red Mage, it wasn't there at the beginning, it wasn't forgotten.


You seem confused here so let me help you. RDM's job has changed and that means it's not the same class it once was. It now needs a niche to fit in, not more "jack of all trades" crap. RDM melee was fine in 2003-2004. BLU replaced RDM as the hybrid melee class. As you know, RDM was stuck as a healer, refresh cycles, and enfeebling duties at the time BLU came out. Now the game has changed to low-man everything and you want SE to improve our meleeing when there are so few mages that can heal/support? How can you possible expect SE to take that seriously? This is NOT a matter if they can or not, this is a question of what sense would it make to do so.
#14 May 11 2011 at 1:43 PM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,147 posts
If you can't bring yourself to contribute ideas to make the hybrid style work, as far as I'm concerned, you're not welcome to the discussion. RDM can be given a unique identity. It doesn't have to be any of my ideas or anyone else's on this board, but it can be done if SE just ***** themselves. In the end, it shouldn't be about "must have" to do, but instead be, "Man, that's really nice to have around."
____________________________
Violence good. **** bad. Yay America.
#15 May 11 2011 at 2:04 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
Seriha wrote:
If you can't bring yourself to contribute ideas to make the hybrid style work, as far as I'm concerned, you're not welcome to the discussion. RDM can be given a unique identity. It doesn't have to be any of my ideas or anyone else's on this board, but it can be done if SE just ***** themselves. In the end, it shouldn't be about "must have" to do, but instead be, "Man, that's really nice to have around."


Have you not seen for yourself how SE low-man NM/HNM's are fought? For the moment, let's address your concept that it would be nice to have some backup. The community doesn't respond to "it would be nice to have" anymore. I think that ended back when we used to main heal bird parties. We could of had 2 healers, but that was overkill in most people's eyes. Why do you think people actual bring BLM/brd if that wasn't the case? They want to do more with less which means "niche" slots are not required. This isn't about what "your friends" do, this is abut what we as a class need to do.

Honestly I don't see a way to make RDM useful again unless they give us over-powered enfeebles like I mentioned. I shouldn't say over-powered as nothing could trump how broken atma make us. I have to ask though why do you want to hybrid knowing full well how mobs are fought now? Like I said, go auto attck in an Abby party, nobody will care. Get it out of your system there. I don't see the point though in having RDM at the front lines for anything else. If you do, we're just going to take damage from AoE or get silenced aura or something. I really don't understand what you expect here.
#16 May 11 2011 at 2:25 PM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,147 posts
You're describing more a fault of the proc system than RDM specifically. Yes, we know people like to skimp on numbers to get their shinies more quickly and GTFO. On the other end, maybe SE could actually reward 18 players in alliance content instead of 1-3. I've always said RDM's problems aren't exactly exclusive to RDM, but with that argument loomed the specter of other jobs being buffed to allow us to move into our own niche. That's happened, but we've stagnated. Calling us the pinnacle enfeebler is pretty much a joke at this point, be it the differences between a WHM's Slow and Para or the vast variety of debuffs BLU gets, often AoE/Conal/Damaging over our few, some locked behind merits.

Edited, May 11th 2011 4:27pm by Seriha
____________________________
Violence good. **** bad. Yay America.
#17 May 11 2011 at 3:02 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
Seriha wrote:
You're describing more a fault of the proc system than RDM specifically. Yes, we know people like to skimp on numbers to get their shinies more quickly and GTFO. On the other end, maybe SE could actually reward 18 players in alliance content instead of 1-3. I've always said RDM's problems aren't exactly exclusive to RDM, but with that argument loomed the specter of other jobs being buffed to allow us to move into our own niche. That's happened, but we've stagnated. Calling us the pinnacle enfeebler is pretty much a joke at this point, be it the differences between a WHM's Slow and Para or the vast variety of debuffs BLU gets, often AoE/Conal/Damaging over our few, some locked behind merits.


I don't think you see the big picture. This isn't about just Abby here. Nyzul is being done with 3. Salvage, Assault etc. All future content is being done with those best jobs because there the game is dying in a matter of speaking. Those alliances you referenced are going the way of a dodo and SE's plan to make FFXI more casual isn't going to help. Shinryu and other Abby mobs isn't the Alpha and the Omega of RDM's fate. The truth is people are using less and less and a n extra healer/hybrid class isn't required anymore. This isn't 2004 anymore. This game isn't about huge alliances and tons of people waiting on the sidelines waiting to be rotated in. It's like you haven't read any of the Dev notes. RDM must fill a low-man role and sadly I think it must be a healer. NA/EU groups aren't going to shout for another mage if WHM and BLM can cover everything. This isn't about procs, this about feeding another mouth. If you take that RDM who offers "support", then you must give him shiny too. The only way this game has ever worked was to have a feasible job that is a workhorse. RDM was the #1 workhorse over the years, but now it's general all purpose tool set is just out-dated.
#19 May 11 2011 at 7:42 PM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,147 posts
That's a rather vague hypothetical. As is, I'd argue a WHM could survive just as well as a RDM (Blink, Stoneskin, Aquaveil, Repose), if not better if you introduce status effects into the equation of survivability (Not to mention Cure V and VI). Martially, Hexa can out-perform CDC in some instances with no elaborate hurdles to jump through and Mystic Boon is basically a Convert-Lite on a 100 TP timer. Any situation you're giving RDMs the okay to swing, a WHM can do just as well, if not better... which is kind of part of the problem in "the big picture" as was put.

Now, I can see the game being more low-man now as intentional. We're still in the leveling transition. Reading up on some of the new Dynamis NMs, though? ****, I'd say some of those are currently balanced toward level 99 players and may very well be level 120+ mobs. I don't expect the stuff of "now" to demand alliances because eventually it will be somewhat antiquated, but to say SE has no intention of encouraging larger group play or more traditional styles of old is folly. Otherwise, they may as well just delete every job aside from WAR, MNK, NIN, WHM, BLM, and THF.
____________________________
Violence good. **** bad. Yay America.
#20 May 11 2011 at 11:37 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
Seriha wrote:
That's a rather vague hypothetical. As is, I'd argue a WHM could survive just as well as a RDM (Blink, Stoneskin, Aquaveil, Repose), if not better if you introduce status effects into the equation of survivability (Not to mention Cure V and VI). Martially, Hexa can out-perform CDC in some instances with no elaborate hurdles to jump through and Mystic Boon is basically a Convert-Lite on a 100 TP timer. Any situation you're giving RDMs the okay to swing, a WHM can do just as well, if not better... which is kind of part of the problem in "the big picture" as was put.

Now, I can see the game being more low-man now as intentional. We're still in the leveling transition. Reading up on some of the new Dynamis NMs, though? sh*t, I'd say some of those are currently balanced toward level 99 players and may very well be level 120+ mobs. I don't expect the stuff of "now" to demand alliances because eventually it will be somewhat antiquated, but to say SE has no intention of encouraging larger group play or more traditional styles of old is folly. Otherwise, they may as well just delete every job aside from WAR, MNK, NIN, WHM, BLM, and THF.


Ok, I'll start with your comment that SE should delete all the other jobs if alliances are a thing of the past. I'll respond to this by saying how can you lump the core jobs of Abyssea(for triggers mostly) and say the other jobs don't have merit? Most of the problems of other DD jobs is the crit advantage(RR atma on single weapons) and the lack of triggers. That isn't going to be problem with most EG content so it's a moot point. As for mages, yes I think both SCH and RDM need Cure V. That will fix(put a bandage) on those 2 jobs for awhile outside Abby. BST is a monster DD job(no pun intended) and if it could do more triggers, it would be a solid Abby job. COR and BRD will become more useful once atmas and brews are taken out of the picture. You should know the rest already.

I just don't understand why you want to hybrid against these uber bosses in Dynamis or any new content. I know you didn't really say that word for word, but you did make this statement. "If you can't bring yourself to contribute ideas to make the hybrid style work, as far as I'm concerned, you're not welcome to the discussion." I think we should stick to hybrid in our Abby parties and low-man if RDM can handle the group. According to most pro-melee RDM's over the years, they never were asking to melee Gods and harder stuff anyway. This includes Starfox's views who seemed popular here. Abby XP parties is what we always asked for, so why must you now ask the unreasonable?

Our real problem as a class is we don't serve much of a purpose during any of the events now. Link control isn't important when you can burn everything down super fast. I'm referencing events like Dynamis prior to the patch. Now because of those NM's and high tier mobs, maybe RDM will find a home again. The problem I see here is that most people myself included are done with Dynamis. I don't really have a answer honestly. I'm open to suggestions at this point. Like I said above, Cure V will only be a bandage to a much greater problem. I supposed SE could swarm us with more Dynamis inspired high tier mobs and make us a link controller again. But that approach would kill off the casual element that SE is aiming for. The old days you needed a monster alliance to take down stuff like Dynamis Lord or AV/PW. SE doesn't seem to want that anymore. As the game gets older, it makes more sense to do stuff with 6 people max. I see fewer and fewer people doing Salvage and Nyzul and those that do are in smaller groups. Those old fashioned alliances would require too many resources and people would get stuck on hated jobs like BRD full-time. Again show me a solution and I'll sign off on it.
#21 May 12 2011 at 3:23 AM Rating: Good
**
654 posts
What's the point of giving Rdm Cure 5? I mean if you are trying to make it into a pseudo Whm why not...just level Whm.

Sure there will be a rather large percentage of white mages, but is that really an issue?

Yes, looking at "the big picture" it would be nice if every job was equally useful and every job received the same amount of invites, but is that what really matters?

What you are ignoring is the people at the individual level. Most people level their favorite job, not because it's the job everyone needs, but to play a certain role.

And while it's debatable exactly what role Rdm plays the people who leveled rdm as their main job did not level it to be a primary healer. That was a role that was forced upon us by SE's terrible foresight with our buffs and the player base.

We have finally shed that role and the people that bandwagoned onto Rdm to heal have all moved to other jobs (like whm) and your suggestion is that Rdm should be the "workhorse" and return to being the Cure + Cycle Bot?

I'm sorry, if you want a primary healer, just invite a whm.

I mean ultimately, you can give Sch and Rdm cure 5, and I'm sure they would get invites and all, but at the end of the day all you have really done is forced the role of primary healer onto those jobs and the roles that those jobs were supposed to be originally and the roles that people leveled those jobs for are no longer viable. Everyone will only invite you for that primary healer role.

You have essentially taken the opportunity for 3 unique jobs and made them into the exact same job more or less.

Now don't get me wrong. I'm not saying Rdm's or Sch's are perfect as they are atm. Far from it, imo, when Blu is the second best healing job in the game, but I believe that instead of just derping the C5 bandage onto Rdm and Sch we should get more unique ways of healing.

That being said, there are really only 2 viable roles that Red Mage can fulfill. Either an enfeebler or a generalist.

Lucky, those roles aren;t exactly exclusive since enfeebling tends to only take a short portion of your time leaving you with plenty of time to be a generalist.

We could really use some work as both enfeeblers and generalists though.

Edited, May 12th 2011 5:27am by SlashAnonymous
#22 May 12 2011 at 5:28 AM Rating: Good
***
2,890 posts
Shadow isn't for RDM melee anything, he's proven that several times over the years.

Shadow you probably didn't notice but ~all~ skills of C or higher got increased by the same amount from 76 to 90. Everyone gained 85 skill points equally, meaning you have the exact same skill difference at 90 that you had at 75. Composure is +15 acc or 16.5 skill worth of acc, that puts RDM at 2.5 acc behind native BLU or 12.5 if you include acc bonus (RDM can get that through /DNC but I'd prefer /NIN). There is virtually no base acc difference between the two, BLU just has access to better melee gear.

My point was that pizza is a set percentage increase, prior to the big 76+ upgrade a RDM could reach 350+ acc with gear but before food. 350 * .11 = +38.5 acc from Pizza +1. Now we add a direct 76.5 increase do that number from the 85 skill we've since received. 426 * .11 = 46.86, or 8.35 free accuracy. Honestly that is at lv 75 equipment, we've since received a few better pieces and there is yet nothing outside Abyssea we can't cap / near cap acc with meat. Inside abyssea accuracy is craptacular unless your target is a THF mob (Tunga as example). I'm eating bison steak on every job now. Prior to abyssea we didn't have issues hitting stuff once we threw in food, the acc argument is a refuge for the ill-informed.
____________________________
RoTZ: Complete DM: O
CoP: Complete AN: O
99 SAM, RDM, BLU, WAR, PLD, DRK

lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


Lucinus wrote:
when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the **** out of the way instead...
#23 May 12 2011 at 5:59 AM Rating: Default
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
SlashAnonymous wrote:
What's the point of giving Rdm Cure 5? I mean if you are trying to make it into a pseudo Whm why not...just level Whm.

Sure there will be a rather large percentage of white mages, but is that really an issue?

Yes, looking at "the big picture" it would be nice if every job was equally useful and every job received the same amount of invites, but is that what really matters?

What you are ignoring is the people at the individual level. Most people level their favorite job, not because it's the job everyone needs, but to play a certain role.

And while it's debatable exactly what role Rdm plays the people who leveled rdm as their main job did not level it to be a primary healer. That was a role that was forced upon us by SE's terrible foresight with our buffs and the player base.

We have finally shed that role and the people that bandwagoned onto Rdm to heal have all moved to other jobs (like whm) and your suggestion is that Rdm should be the "workhorse" and return to being the Cure + Cycle Bot?

I'm sorry, if you want a primary healer, just invite a whm.

I mean ultimately, you can give Sch and Rdm cure 5, and I'm sure they would get invites and all, but at the end of the day all you have really done is forced the role of primary healer onto those jobs and the roles that those jobs were supposed to be originally and the roles that people leveled those jobs for are no longer viable. Everyone will only invite you for that primary healer role.

You have essentially taken the opportunity for 3 unique jobs and made them into the exact same job more or less.

Now don't get me wrong. I'm not saying Rdm's or Sch's are perfect as they are atm. Far from it, imo, when Blu is the second best healing job in the game, but I believe that instead of just derping the C5 bandage onto Rdm and Sch we should get more unique ways of healing.

That being said, there are really only 2 viable roles that Red Mage can fulfill. Either an enfeebler or a generalist.

Lucky, those roles aren;t exactly exclusive since enfeebling tends to only take a short portion of your time leaving you with plenty of time to be a generalist.

We could really use some work as both enfeeblers and generalists though.

Edited, May 12th 2011 5:27am by SlashAnonymous


Are you so dense that you believe only one job out of like 6 mage jobs should be a healer? That's like saying only 1-2 jobs should be a DD class. Cure V should be given to SCH and RDM because they are the best healers behind WHM and which means one cure level, not 2. So Cure V is ok, Cure VI is WHM territory. Again I have to ask how dense you are to think RDM needs cure V to get "invites". This isn't about XP invites. RDM can melee for all I care in invites. The problem with RDM is it's ill-equipped to handle any thing beyond XP mobs. RDM can't cure, nuke, trigger, or anything else useful that other jobs can't do better. I'm not suggesting to make RDM an uber healer, but it does need a niche with CURE V so it can fill a role in the meantime. The generalists role doesn't apply anymore. Sure you can bring it, but all you do is leech by bringing it to an event.

Like this idiot poster above my post, meleeing Tungi is obviously so useful you have to bring it up. Who the **** wants any jobs on that thing unless you're going to kill it post triggers. In the meantime, what do you do? Stand there and pick your ***. This isn't about being against RDM melee, this is about having a purpose that isn't a leech. There is no point to have ANY job on NM's in Abby unless you can zerg kill once you proc triggers. Otherwise, you're either killing too fast or just feeding it extra tp. As the trigger get proced, we need jobs that can actually zerg something down with nice damage, not use pizza as a crutch just to hit the mob and auto attack crappy DoT swords like we have all day to kill it. I said I didn't have a problem with RDM melee in abby XP parties, that should be good enough for you.
#24 May 12 2011 at 10:48 AM Rating: Default
**
863 posts
SlashAnonymous wrote:
What's the point of giving Rdm Cure 5? I mean if you are trying to make it into a pseudo Whm why not...just level Whm.

Sure there will be a rather large percentage of white mages, but is that really an issue?
Edited, May 12th 2011 5:27am by SlashAnonymous


I have to ask, if you think instead of me asking to be able to cure decently I should go level WHM, then why don't you go level BLU or another pure melee instead of asking for RDM to be more melee? Neither of them makes sense, we want different things for RDM, no use telling each other to go level another job just because you don't want the role of this job to go in a certain direction.

I should say that personally I like what RDM has been, I like healing and don't want RDM to go in towards more melee. Like Shadow I think we could do something more, something more fun (I know people don't agree) and also I think more than 1 healing job is needed more than 1 more melee/hybrid or w/e you want to call it.

Edited, May 12th 2011 12:50pm by Belcrono
#25 May 12 2011 at 1:17 PM Rating: Good
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,147 posts
Was under the impression Pizza caps around 40 ACC. Either way, with our best Haste TP set, we're floating around the 400 ACC number outside of Abyssea.

Meanwhile, I'm against homogenizing the mage classes, especially in the direction RDM and SCH are heading. The two should not get Cure V. RDM should get a much, much, more potent Regen that goes off your last damage received while SCH should steer more toward damage mitigation with spells that add more outright -DT% (that could possibly break 50% caps) or even Stoneskin II that they could Accession for 600 "HP" or something. It's curing in a different way, leaving all three distinct and having moments where one may be superior over the other.

As for melee, it needn't be solely about damage, while that'd obviously be the simplest solution to get people to shut up about it. As DNC has proven, melee and (de)buffs needn't be exclusive. I don't think we should be tied into TP use, as that's already a precious resource for us with casting burdens, but if the additional effect of DB didn't suck and other perks that helped the party were to be an option, then outright damage buffs aren't as needed. However, they still need to be worth it to justify arguments against TP feed (or heaven forbid, give us a means to manipulate a mob's TP that isn't cast-only).
____________________________
Violence good. **** bad. Yay America.
#26 May 12 2011 at 5:35 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,775 posts
Seriha wrote:

Meanwhile, I'm against homogenizing the mage classes, especially in the direction RDM and SCH are heading. The two should not get Cure V. RDM should get a much, much, more potent Regen that goes off your last damage received while SCH should steer more toward damage mitigation with spells that add more outright -DT% (that could possibly break 50% caps) or even Stoneskin II that they could Accession for 600 "HP" or something. It's curing in a different way, leaving all three distinct and having moments where one may be superior over the other.

As for melee, it needn't be solely about damage, while that'd obviously be the simplest solution to get people to shut up about it. As DNC has proven, melee and (de)buffs needn't be exclusive. I don't think we should be tied into TP use, as that's already a precious resource for us with casting burdens, but if the additional effect of DB didn't suck and other perks that helped the party were to be an option, then outright damage buffs aren't as needed. However, they still need to be worth it to justify arguments against TP feed (or heaven forbid, give us a means to manipulate a mob's TP that isn't cast-only).


I agree with in regard to not homogenizing the mage classes. Although your ideas for fixing the other jobs isn't going to resonate with the playerbase. First of all, I don't care how potent REGEN you might have, it's never going to replace a Cure V or VI for that matter. This is because when a tank usually takes massive damage, it's not a matter of nickel and diming their health back. You need them out of the red and near full HP asap. Without Cure V minimum, you just can't accomplish this. So again, you're just a back-up to WHM which won't earn you a slot unless your group is taking a gang to overkill. PUP's auto has Cure V, but the poor thing has no brains to use it right. If our PUP's could go see the wizard and get a brain for their Auto, PUP could be a good healer. It doesn't make a lick of sense why RDM shouldn't get Cure V, but we get the tier IV nukes below BLM. I think some of you guys are so concerned that if RDM learns Cure V that will force us into more healing roles so you're not thinking logically here. I have to wonder how logically it makes any sense that any job can sub /WHM and have Cure IV access.

As for melee, we won't ever get more damage. I think my idea of giving RDM Runic would prove more useful. The ability to absorb most magical blasts with our dagger/swords would be a huge bonus for us and a reason to keep our weapons equipped.
« Previous 1 2 3
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 1 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (1)