This isn't an endless debate any longer if all the pro-melee agree with Hyrist and his piss poor perception of RDM hybrid dynamics.
What do you want to do, Melee PW? Even that's unrealistic. The only one here who has a piss-poor perception of RDM has been you, and that hasn't changed in years.
You CONSTANTLY flip-flop between opinions on RDM and its melee aspect. At least I can be credited for being consistant.
Take a stance and stick to it before you start critisizing other people's viewpoints. RDM's frontline performance dosen't suck when it's used in the contexts I've described. Essentially anything you can put your dagger-weilders on you can put a RDM on provides the situation doesn't specifcally calls for RDM to be out of Melee Range for some reason.
I do think at times people treat certain NMs with way too much safety involved. (If a DNC can step it, why cant I go in for a Death Blossom?) But that's the way it currently stands, and it's not a huge issue, given how much utility we have elsewise.
Aliekber hit the nail on the head when it came to what my issue with frontline RDM is. VT mobs, cannon fodder, should be fair game. This includes the weaker bits of WoE mobs, as well as Abyssea mobs (We get status boosts to make up for the increasing difficulty of those.)
The "Eternal Debate" should have been over years ago. My current issue with is we now have fallen behind pretty hard in gear support. That problem could be fixed by giving us more spell/ability support (More than Gain STR, I'm counting that already as it's inevitable) or better overall TP gear.
So long as the populace gets accustomed to the idea that "VT is ok." I'm fairly satasfied with our melee set up. If you want to try to push for more go right ahead. I'm still in support of pushing the envelope, but really it's still going to boil down to "Is it ok for people to TP on this?" as a ruling factor. I'm ok with having the same threshold as say a THF or DNC, when it comes to that.
And we don't HAVE to agree, or push people into "Shadow's camp" or "Hyrist's camp" everyone has varying tolerances as far as how far our melee can go, and that's perfectly fine.
To be honest I was tempted not to post in this thread at all because I initially thought it was borderline trolling. We're really not suffering from that much of an idenity crisis as much as an oppertunity to re-craft certain aspects of our job idenity; to obtain more
. I've given my idea for that in the form of Aura spells (working like Avatar's favor.) and I'm pretty much running dry on other ideas besides the bread and butter "Moar damage." methods. We have a HUGE assortment of tools at our disposal, and I don't see the point in snuffing our nose up up at it just because they're not dependant on being in the front lines. I like that level of variability, and we already have mele dependant tools (Enspells, Spikes, Death Blossom.)
There was an idea in which we could use melee to enhance the potency/duration of enfeebles, but Saboteur kinda took that one right out from under us.
So what next? I'm open to the ideas but I'm also not blind to the realities.
So the important questions, Shadow, is:
What role do YOU want RDM to take?
How far do YOU want RDM melee to be effective?
How would YOU impliment the changes to make that feasible?
Right now, I've never been more satasfied with RDM's utility. Do I want more? Yes. But I'm not panicked at what RDM is, and honestly,
I coulden't care less on how certain people view the job from the outside.
Actually, scratch that, I do care enough to be sick of all of this BS surrounding ignorant jackasses that tell people how to play without even a basic understanding of the job they critisize. Most the time how they view mage jobs are often incorrect. (I moved off Midgardsormr with my Fiancee because we hated how her WHM was being discriminated against.)
The players and how they act are probably my biggest problem with FFXI and other MMOs.
So you'll have to pardon me if I'm a bit agressive against the 'appease the other's' approach you're trying to protray. Most the time it will not go appreciated at all, and they don't even understand what RDM is capable of now. (Dosen't help that we're misrepresented by our own brand of morons.)
We can talk about what we can do to further advance it's melee aspect, or how we want to 'further define' the job till the cows come home. But I beleive ignorance is the bigger problem for the majority of this game, on far more than just RDM, when it comes to what classes are capable of, and how to utalize them.
I've spent years with off-the-beaten path job combinations, players, playstyle methods, and it's funny how after all this time I still hear the same old complaints that were disproven years ago.
So I guess the bigger question is, how do we correct
the common misconception of our class? Edited, Sep 15th 2010 7:35pm by Hyrist