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Dancer vs. Steely WeaponFollow

#1 Sep 29 2010 at 2:34 AM Rating: Default
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1. Get Jinx Discus from AH(100k on Bahamut)
2. Skill Cap @ 285
3. Eat Rabbit Pie(+100 Ranged Attack)
4. Equip all STR and racc+ gear
5. Clear Aggro
6. Stonekin, Blink(optional)
7. Engage Steely Weapon
8. Curse + Dia 2
9. Box Step to level 5
10. Spam Ranged attack like a motherf*cker
11. ?????
12. Profit!!!
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#2 Sep 29 2010 at 6:29 AM Rating: Good
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Uh, grats?

Clefairy wrote:
6. Stonekin, Blink(optional)
8. Curse + Dia 2


/whm wtf
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#3 Sep 29 2010 at 10:27 AM Rating: Default
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Dia2 is to lower it's Defenses, i combined this with Box Step to get the damage I needed.
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<< Completely merited Full time Dancer, love of adventure, no role I won't play for those who would be her friend. Love to heal, tank, and support.

Cybernetic Pirate Wearwolves vs. Mutant Vampire Ninjas!

http://s8.bite-fight.us/user/bite/93776
#4 Sep 29 2010 at 4:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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Don't you know? DNC/WHM is the new job combo to not heal you.

Need a raise? I'll come Chocobo Jig right over.

><
#5 Sep 29 2010 at 6:45 PM Rating: Decent
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/WHM is actually a fair sub for DNC nowadays in the 80+ level range. Due to the ridiculous amounts of haste that DNC can stack up, having a Haste spell on you suddenly means that much more. It's the sub I end up using most often now whenever I do not need shadows.

But given how Haste doesn't affect ranged attacks, it's not something I'd use in this scenario. I don't know how badly Berserk would get you killed here, but if it doesn't, I'd probably rather be using /WAR for that. It affects ranged attacks too, which is good because I certainly wouldn't want to blow a rabbit pie just to kill this guy.
#6 Sep 30 2010 at 10:00 PM Rating: Decent
fynlar they are just being asses, because Anna here used to rock out whm/thf, thf/whm so its the cool thing to do.

/WHM is a perfectly viable solo sub.

25% self haste + up to 25% in gear (50% total haste all alone)
Reraise
DiaII (11.5% ATK increase) that stacks will box step.
Regen
Stoneskin

I mean seriously is there really a better sub to use solo. I hardly think any thing stacks up to 15% haste and 11.5% ATK boost, that crushes WAR sub, crushes SAM sub, lol@nin.

Also I don't think zerk would giv you a very high RA especially considering you don't have a RA WS. So the point is moot anyway, it will take forever with around 400RATK on a D24 weapon.

24/190*60 = 7.57 (base) D/sec

~2500/7.57 = 330.2 seconds. = 5.5 minutes.

IIRC these guys despawn if not killed quick enough correct. So I doubt it is even possible, (3min IIRC)

Meaning you only have 180s to kill

2500/180 = 13.88 DPS, meaning you need a near capped pdif to kill it in time, and hit for max damage everytime, unfortunately you will miss 95% of the time (capped acc) and therefore must attack as if you were able to do

2500*1.05 = 2625dmg
2625/180 = 14.58
14.58/60*196 = 47.62 D needed per atk

While possible I highly highly doubt its consistency.




Edited, Oct 1st 2010 12:14am by rdmcandie
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#7 Sep 30 2010 at 10:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Wonder Gem rdmcandie wrote:
I mean seriously is there really a better sub to use solo. I hardly think any thing stacks up to 15% haste and 11.5% ATK boost, that crushes WAR sub, crushes SAM sub, lol@nin.
/rdm at lv 96+. You get:

Haste
Dia II
Raise
Stoneskin
Dispel
Ice Spikes
Enspells
Refresh
Convert
Phalanx

RDM gets haste (as well as cure IV) later than WHM, at lv 48 (hence 96+). Though a lot of them can be used right now to toy with. Enspells has its situational use in Fan Dance mode.

Edited, Sep 30th 2010 11:21pm by Jevilwolf
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#8 Oct 01 2010 at 5:13 AM Rating: Decent
good thing its not 96/48 yet then otherwise my original statement would be wrong......
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#9 Oct 01 2010 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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I was hitting it for 90+ per hit, and the Jinx Discus had a delay for less than 200, so a ranged attack was once every two seconds. Also, the discus procs every 3-5 hits or so I knocked off the first 10% quick. Stoneskin + gorget and blink help you absorb the first few hits so you don't worry about healing yourself. If you do I just Waltz(and you can RA while you Waltz, because it's a JA and thus you can so Waltz + Samba + Step + Floursih + Cast a Spell all simultanously, just as you can Trick Attack + Sneak Attack + WS. So you don''t waste attack rounds healing or whatever. On a side note, if you start an attack round with Dual Wield, Double + Triple Attack, or Attacks X times weapons, you can cast during the attack round.

I was just doing this for the challenge. I didn't realize... oh wait I forgot where I was posting; never mind.
____________________________
<< Completely merited Full time Dancer, love of adventure, no role I won't play for those who would be her friend. Love to heal, tank, and support.

Cybernetic Pirate Wearwolves vs. Mutant Vampire Ninjas!

http://s8.bite-fight.us/user/bite/93776
#10 Oct 01 2010 at 8:40 AM Rating: Good
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Wonder Gem rdmcandie wrote:
good thing its not 96/48 yet then otherwise my original statement would be wrong......
I was suggesting for when that moment comes, we know it will. I agreed that /whm is beast right now.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#11 Oct 01 2010 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
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With all due respect what's the big deal with killing a 75 addon NM? Did they add a loot table to it or something or is it just for the fun of beating it?
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#12 Oct 01 2010 at 11:58 AM Rating: Good
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I feel like I'm jumping into a thread that shouldn't exist but what exactly does fan dance have to do with enspell.....

Quote:
Enspells has its situational use in Fan Dance mode.


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#13 Oct 01 2010 at 1:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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As for the comment on not healing, and saying NOTHING about the utility of DNC/WHM, this is from first hand experience with this specific DNC/WHM not healing despite having access to spells, sambas, and waltzes.

Obviously its a fine line between being witty and an ass.

RCD - I'm a little surprised you want to throw one post into the ass-hattery category, but I'm guessing you are much more of an expert on ass-hattery than I, so I'll defer to your judgement on that.

#14 Oct 01 2010 at 2:04 PM Rating: Good
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doctorugh wrote:
I feel like I'm jumping into a thread that shouldn't exist but what exactly does fan dance have to do with enspell.....

Quote:
Enspells has its situational use in Fan Dance mode.


Fan Dance disables the use of Sambas, so that's where enspells come in to being useful unless you have another DNC in the same party to use a samba.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 3:07pm by Jevilwolf
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#15 Oct 01 2010 at 7:10 PM Rating: Good
Clefairy wrote:
I was hitting it for 90+ per hit, and the Jinx Discus had a delay for less than 200, so a ranged attack was once every two seconds. Also, the discus procs every 3-5 hits or so I knocked off the first 10% quick. Stoneskin + gorget and blink help you absorb the first few hits so you don't worry about healing yourself. If you do I just Waltz(and you can RA while you Waltz, because it's a JA and thus you can so Waltz + Samba + Step + Floursih + Cast a Spell all simultanously, just as you can Trick Attack + Sneak Attack + WS. So you don''t waste attack rounds healing or whatever. On a side note, if you start an attack round with Dual Wield, Double + Triple Attack, or Attacks X times weapons, you can cast during the attack round.

I was just doing this for the challenge. I didn't realize... oh wait I forgot where I was posting; never mind.



Ok I gave you the benefit of the doubt, but now Im calling shennanigans. I will say you tried for the challenge but I don't believe you did did it.

First claim

90+DMG

You can only get 90+ DMG on that 24D weapon with a crit at cap pdif. Since ranged weapons attack multiplier caps at 3.0 you can only possibly have a max of 72D without a crit (an average of about 67 when themin i figured in). On a crit you would get 24*3.75 = 90. Even if you factor in capped fSTR value on the weapon (D/9) You only get 2 more base D and thus can only get 78D/97.5crit. In order to see 90+ on every hit you need to be hitting for max pdif value and crit 100% of the time, which is impossible as crit % chance caps @ 20% with feather Step assumed to take it to a cap of 25%.

*Just to clarify I totally forgot about upper fstr which does enable you to get 90DMG on a hit, however this also requires you to be an **** load of STR over the mobs vit, and in most cases is not going to be attained. The min value for this is going to be aprox what I listed so you can ballpark estimates in between.* (however to be fair I also disregarded min pdif function which would drop it even further but I digress)


Second claim

Attack rate, 190 delay is not 2 seconds it is over 3 seconds, haste does not increase the speed your actual time between attacks is 190/60 = 3.16 seconds.

Third claim

Curse application. This helps you one time and one time only it can not be reapplied to take hp away again, once you lose say 10% HP and the effect wears you can not lose 10% more HP. All curse does is lowers your maximum value in the case of this NM you go ~2500*.90 =~2250 HP max
when the effect wears and you do not touch the mob he will be effectively at 2250/2500. Should you apply again the mob losses 250 max HP going to 2250/2250. This is the same effect it has on players. If you do not believe me go check out what happens to you if you do not mute yourself in Qulun Dome or w/e it is under Bedeaux.

Fourth Claim
JA stacking, while you can strng them together, you have a 1-2 secon delay between activation and use of another ability, be it a JA a spellcast, a melee swing. There is nothing special about JA's in this sense. I know well enough I can not string together Step/Waltz/Samba/Spell without some type of pause between each action. However brief it may be. (just because your character is still dancing does not mean you are still performing the ability, it is like casting a spell or taking a melee swing the server registers the effect before your animation comes close to finishing).

Side note

While it appears this way you are not actually casting during the attack round, you are casting during the animation for the attack round, which is completely different.


Just to assume everything falls into place.....

97/190*60 = 30.63

2500*.90 = 2250

2250/30.63 = 73.63*1.05(accadjust)/60 = 1.28 minutes

Well in theory you can do it. In reality the checks in game prevent you from doing this. I imagine it is possible, but not how you have described it.

My issues.....

I doubt DNC is going to be able to cap pDIF on a 75 Mob with a C-ranked weapon (pDIF of 3.0), I doubt DNC will have enough STR to cap fSTR value on a WAR type mob. I doubt most DNC's have dDEX high enough to cap at 20% crit. I doubt most DNC's can obtain one of these, let alone all three required to provide enough damage to the mob.

im just saying, your numbers don't add up with game design.


Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 6:30pm by rdmcandie
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#16 Oct 02 2010 at 6:07 AM Rating: Good
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While I mostly agree with what you are saying, the following is not correct:

Quote:
You can only get 90+ DMG on that 24D weapon with a crit at cap pdif. Since ranged weapons attack multiplier caps at 3.0 you can only possibly have a max of 72D without a crit (an average of about 67 when themin i figured in). On a crit you would get 24*3.75 = 90. Even if you factor in capped fSTR value on the weapon (D/9) You only get 2 more base D and thus can only get 78D/97.


The fSTR cap at weapon rating (D/9) + 8. This would bring it to PDIF x (24+10). So capped hit (w/o crit,randomizer) would be 102.
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#17 Oct 02 2010 at 8:24 AM Rating: Decent
so it is my bad i just got number punchy because I know that every hit was not for 90+
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