Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

Support JobsFollow

#1 Feb 24 2009 at 1:55 AM Rating: Decent
*
80 posts
Hey all, so I'm having something of a dilemma when it comes to choosing sub jobs for my Dancer in some situations. I took DNC to 75 mostly going /NIN, and occasionally trying out /WAR and /DRG (with the Wyvern's Earring and Targe). I got myself a Joytoy to use on my DNC but unless I'm fighting lower level mobs, I have to switch out Haste for Acc in order to get a good enough hit rate with it, and then I'm sure I'm getting less TP and damage over time than I would if I just dual-wielded daggers, which is what I now do if I'm fighting anything more difficult.

And with that decision - which I do think is normally a good idea - I've lost a lot of my reasoning for /NIN. In situations like merits, I tend to get hate after DE, but of course only for like 2 seconds until someone else WSes, so I feel like I'm getting minimal gain from /NIN and it's enhancing neither my ability to DD or to heal. Corsairs don't sub NIN just for damage mitigation in most party situations since they can get far more benefits from another sub choice, like RNG, so what's our /RNG?

I'm guessing that /SAM would be our greatest TP-generation subjob, though I'm currently leveling my SAM right now so I can't say that I've tested it out myself. I'm now feeling like it would make performing my duties as a DNC easier and allow me to do it better with all that TP, so perhaps it would be a good idea if I were main healing? Though maybe I'd go /NIN main healing still so that way when I do pull hate from the cures, I don't have to heal myself too.

So then what support job would lead to the best performance for a DNC is a DD/support role trying to put out as much damage as possible? It seems to me the candidates would be /WAR or /SAM, but I'm not really sure myself. Berserk + DA vs. Meditate + Store TP + Zanshin (+ Third Eye which can be marginally useful once a minute), seems like /WAR might put forth the greatest damage but /SAM might be more party-friendly. Either way, the both look miles ahead of the ridiculously common /NIN.

So I was just wondering I guess what those of you with more experience have noticed when it comes to sub job selection for Dancer. Sorry I just noticed there's a lot of text above, haha thanks guys.
#2 Feb 24 2009 at 7:21 AM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
**
776 posts
Dual Wield benefits low delay weapons with higher TP gain relative to the delay adjustment. It also allows for more swings in a given amount of time. /NIN will boost both your DoT and your TP Gain. /SAM is better for TP gain, but not by a dominantly large margin. You also lose pretty much any defensive ability, gaining only 30 seconds of coverage for a single hit every 60 seconds. Add to that the fact that /NIN allows for an additional TP-benefitting offhand weapon, and it pretty much becomes one of the only two reasonable subs. If you're going for something else at 75, /SAM is nice, if only because it does a good bit for you at endgame where hitting for 0 or avoiding feeding TP to enemies becomes a priority.

As for /WAR or /DRG, they're not as great as you'd think at 75. /DRG is almost exclusively a WAR sub and /SAM is better. /WAR is for the jobs that can cover themselves defensively already.
____________________________
Character Name: Davrost
Race: Tarutaru
Server: Gilgamesh
Current Job: BLU
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/poster.html?user=391454#FFXI_Characters
Relic: SMN - 6/6, WAR - 6/6, BST - 5/5, BLM - 6/6, PLD: 2/5, MNK - 1/5, THF - 1/5, DNC - 6/6, BLU - 6/6, RDM - 1/5, SCH - 1/5, DRK - 2/5, WHM - 1/5
Notable Crafts: WW: 73.1+2, AL: 60.0, CO: 60.0, LC: 60.0+1, CC: 54.3+1
#3 Feb 24 2009 at 8:44 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
1,245 posts
I don't know about you, but after a DE in a merit party, I'd die if it wasn't for utsusemi.

/Sam is ok, but I just have hard times dumping dual wield for stat bonus weapons and utsusemi.
____________________________
Bsphil wrote:
Rana does his own sh*t. He's edgy and 3-hitty. He'll walk up to merit mobs and go, so what I don't have an attack bonus, I'm @#%^ing rana. I'm a black hole of awesome, absorbing all dimensions of win from all around me. That's right I @#%^ing open darkness for your gekko. Without me you'd be a @#%^ing nobody. You'd be blowing PUPs for party invites. Rana is the alpha and the omega, if by alpha and omega, you mean the first and third hits of rana.
#4 Feb 24 2009 at 10:14 AM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,949 posts
apresmoi wrote:
Though maybe I'd go /NIN main healing still so that way when I do pull hate from the cures, I don't have to heal myself too.

I only seldom pull hate from cures in merit parties as /sam. If you use Divine Waltz during downtime/pulling and Curing Waltz IV as your main cure, you should not have any problem. Curing Waltz IV produces a LOT less enmity than it should.

If you just pulled hate after a cure, got hit and lost agro, wait until the next mob to cure yourself, just to make sure it doesn't come back (it shouldn't, really, if you use Curing Waltz IV and your DD are at least somewhat competent)

Divine Waltz is really great to make mobs angry at you, though. ~660 hp cured for 40 TP is probably our second best hate tool :)
____________________________
FFXIV: Cloe Delisle Scholar, officer of the SWAGGER Free company, Sargatanas server.
#5 Feb 24 2009 at 10:29 AM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,567 posts
Lianda's sig wrote:
Moron on the WoW Forums wrote:

You don't know much about Blizzard, do you? They've been making MMOs for far longer than Square.

Off topic but, doesn't this depend on the definition of "Massive" in MMO? Their previous games have online play which supports up to 8 users, not massive at all, but in technicality, much more than 8 were on a particular server at a time. So if you define it by the amount of people you have an option to play with vs the amount you're limited to play with in a specific instance, then he's right :P

If you define it the other way, then of course he's wrong. Personally, I don't know, but leaning more to the first.

/derail. Sorry, just stuck out at me ><
____________________________
Chatokun 90DRG | 75RDM | 82BRD | 90THF | 90NIN | 75SAM | 90BLU
Valefor Server
Linkshell: Heresy
#6 Feb 24 2009 at 4:32 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,949 posts
Souji wrote:
Personally, I don't know, but leaning more to the first.

Now you're stepping right into my field of expertise, being a game designer and all.

It's widely accepted the term "Massive Multiplayer Online" was coined by Richard Garriott when he created his first MMORPG, Ultima Online. MMO itself refers to a game where hundreds and thousands of players play together in a persistent world. It usually implies the game hosts itself permanently, regardless if there are any players in it.

Online multiplayer games (4, 8, 16, 32 or even 64 player online) have never been considered "Massive Multiplayer Online". Even the service (like battle.net) that links thousands of users together to then determine a host for a multiplayer game has never been considered the same as an MMO.

This is pretty much why Guild Wars, which doesn't host the server during instances (it picks one player to be the host), and only really do for towns, is being debated as an MMO or not. Basically, a town in guild war is little more than a 3D chatroom with your avatar an inventory from the (also free) Battle.Net.

There have been other games than MMORPGs to use the term MMOG (Massively Multiplayer Online Game), like Planetside, but Blizzard has never done any MMOG until World of Warcraft, which came later than FFXI by over 2 years. (May 2002 vs November 2004)
____________________________
FFXIV: Cloe Delisle Scholar, officer of the SWAGGER Free company, Sargatanas server.
#7 Feb 28 2009 at 7:48 PM Rating: Decent
15 posts
/SAM all the way for me. There's nothing better than waiting around for a PT to gather & start... because you can sit and meditate all the way to 300 TP. /NIN might be a better idea if/when you have access to a lot of haste and a joyeuse... but for someone like me whose first 75 job is DNC, and wants to makes sure no one dies, even on account of the first mob, /SAM is the way to go. I find it way more flexible & benefiting than /NIN.
#8 Mar 01 2009 at 7:06 AM Rating: Decent
Avatar
*****
11,534 posts
Taitobi wrote:
/SAM all the way for me. There's nothing better than waiting around for a PT to gather & start... because you can sit and meditate all the way to 300 TP. /NIN might be a better idea if/when you have access to a lot of haste and a joyeuse... but for someone like me whose first 75 job is DNC, and wants to makes sure no one dies, even on account of the first mob, /SAM is the way to go. I find it way more flexible & benefiting than /NIN.


Sorry to break it to you though, but /nin has a lot more importance a lot longer than just when you have access to a joyeuse. Not to mention if you let people die while /nin there's something wrong with you..not the subjob.
#9 Mar 02 2009 at 12:53 PM Rating: Good
**
254 posts
I've mentioned this in other posts also. Saber Dance if you are going to enjoy full use of it. /nin all the way.
____________________________
Your message has met the filter designed to stop ultimately silly messages, hit the back button to edit it and repost.
75DNC Bismarck BattleHoundsII

#10 Mar 02 2009 at 11:43 PM Rating: Default
*
139 posts
Here are some things you may want to consider if you are peticularly fond of your Joyuese. Dancer has D skill in sword naturally, though this can be improved with Suppanomimi, and Sword skill merits. Joyeuse is currently the only multi-hit weapon Dancer has acess too. Joyeuse Dbl.Atk rate does not stack with Saber Dance, Brutal Earring, and Dbl.Atk job trait.

As far as deciding a sub job, I recommend having Ninja, Samurai, Thief, and Warrior at 37. You'll want the luxuray of deciding what roles you can take on depending on where you are going and what you are doing, and getting the most out of your job.



#11 Mar 03 2009 at 5:10 AM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
6,119 posts
FloppyFish wrote:
Joyeuse is currently the only multi-hit weapon Dancer has acess too.

Not quite, DNC can use Terpsichore obviously, it may not be 100% active but it is multihit weapon.
____________________________
This sig better be appropriate...
#12 Mar 03 2009 at 7:13 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
776 posts
FloppyFish wrote:
Joyeuse Dbl.Atk rate does not stack with Saber Dance, Brutal Earring, and Dbl.Atk job trait.


Yes it does. You only get half the increase though. The DA stuff only procs if the Joyeuse's natural trait fails to proc, but it will still increase your DA rate overall.
____________________________
Character Name: Davrost
Race: Tarutaru
Server: Gilgamesh
Current Job: BLU
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/poster.html?user=391454#FFXI_Characters
Relic: SMN - 6/6, WAR - 6/6, BST - 5/5, BLM - 6/6, PLD: 2/5, MNK - 1/5, THF - 1/5, DNC - 6/6, BLU - 6/6, RDM - 1/5, SCH - 1/5, DRK - 2/5, WHM - 1/5
Notable Crafts: WW: 73.1+2, AL: 60.0, CO: 60.0, LC: 60.0+1, CC: 54.3+1
#13 Mar 21 2009 at 10:41 AM Rating: Decent
**
785 posts
/WAR to tank
/NIN to solo
/SAM for everything else

(assuming 60+)
____________________________
Miasto of Bismarck
Black Mage 75 Summoner 75 + misc. mages
Stabbywabby of Garuda
Dancing Galka 75
Jahion of Garuda
Corsair 71
#14 Mar 22 2009 at 12:05 AM Rating: Good
Avatar
*****
11,534 posts
PriestoftheVoid wrote:
/WAR to tank
/NIN to solo
/SAM for everything else

(assuming 60+)


You also forget /NIN for partying/meritting as well, as much as people may want to deny it but /nin just has too many benefits to DNCs in parties.
#15 Mar 22 2009 at 9:43 AM Rating: Default
*
139 posts
I would also add /thf to the list of sub jobs with merit.
For some endgame use where you need to gaurantee stuns/steps landing with SA/TA. Though it is not viable for all endgame mobs with AoE or where you would need /nin or can not melee. Though some people have Dancer as thier only 75 job and can't take anything else. The argument for the mobs you can't melee isn't as strong as it used to be with our merit abilitys reverse flourish effect and No Foot Rise.
You will have enough TP to toss out an emergency cure or keep steps up as the mob is kited past you.

#16 Mar 26 2009 at 5:44 PM Rating: Decent
**
785 posts
Quote:
You also forget /NIN for partying/meritting as well, as much as people may want to deny it but /nin just has too many benefits to DNCs in parties.


Forget? No.
Omit? Yes.

I disagree. =)
____________________________
Miasto of Bismarck
Black Mage 75 Summoner 75 + misc. mages
Stabbywabby of Garuda
Dancing Galka 75
Jahion of Garuda
Corsair 71
#17shinjaku, Posted: Mar 26 2009 at 7:40 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Ditto ^^
#18 Mar 26 2009 at 7:54 PM Rating: Good
****
4,719 posts
Tyrrant wrote:
FloppyFish wrote:
Joyeuse is currently the only multi-hit weapon Dancer has acess too.

Not quite, DNC can use Terpsichore obviously, it may not be 100% active but it is multihit weapon.
You are talking of a weapon that 0.001% of the players will possess, I won't count that.

Edited: 0.1 to 0.001%

Edited, Mar 27th 2009 12:55pm by Jevilwolf
____________________________
Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#19 Mar 27 2009 at 2:52 AM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,252 posts
Quote:
You are talking of a weapon that 0.00000000000000000000000000001% of the players will consider possessing, I won't count that.


Fixed ^^

Kinda makes you wonder why SE created this horrible dagger, then tried to justify that creation by giving us saber dance and no foot rise XD
____________________________
DNC: 90 THF: 90 RNG: Semi retired @90 RDM: Retired@75

lolblog: http://mithrasmemoirs.blogspot.com/
Elemental Magian Dagger Guide
Gearsets/etc
#20 Mar 27 2009 at 9:59 AM Rating: Good
****
4,719 posts
Kalisa wrote:
Quote:
You are talking of a weapon that 0.00000000000000000000000000001% of the players will consider possessing, I won't count that.


Fixed ^^

Kinda makes you wonder why SE created this horrible dagger, then tried to justify that creation by giving us saber dance and no foot rise XD
Thanks. :P It really is a horrible dagger for a lot of real life sacrifices effort to go through to get it.
____________________________
Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#21 Mar 29 2009 at 4:38 PM Rating: Good
Avatar
*****
11,534 posts
PriestoftheVoid wrote:
Quote:
You also forget /NIN for partying/meritting as well, as much as people may want to deny it but /nin just has too many benefits to DNCs in parties.


Forget? No.
Omit? Yes.

I disagree. =)


It's fine if you disagree with /nin being useful at all in partying/meriting, but I guess you're one of the few DNCs that sees no benefits to /nin while just about every other does.

Though in the end, guess I missed the '/nin is no longer useful' train at some point.

Edited, Mar 29th 2009 5:47pm by Theonehio
#22 Mar 29 2009 at 5:55 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
****
9,209 posts
I doubt 'not useful' is an opinion rather than a fact.

If you can make use of /NIN, /NIN is useful. If it's not, then /NIN is not useful.
____________________________
Princess ThePsychoticOne wrote:
int stands for int.

#23 Mar 30 2009 at 6:36 PM Rating: Decent
**
785 posts
Oh sure /nin is useful. Especially for soloing difficult mobs. I just don't see any benefits in exp/merits over /sam or /war.
____________________________
Miasto of Bismarck
Black Mage 75 Summoner 75 + misc. mages
Stabbywabby of Garuda
Dancing Galka 75
Jahion of Garuda
Corsair 71
#24 Mar 30 2009 at 11:16 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
****
9,209 posts
Likewise, I don't see the hype of /WAR or /SAM for merit.

If /NIN helps RDM to be able to cast Dia III for every single mob and not leaving a single second of haste on everyone, I will go /NIN. If the RDM can keep those when I go all out with /WAR, then shall be it. Chance is the latter is more impossible than the 1st.
____________________________
Princess ThePsychoticOne wrote:
int stands for int.

Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 2 All times are in CDT
Anonymous Guests (2)