My simple question evidently got skipped over. NO biggy. But really, why use a Cobra Unit Knife? Is it for the low delay on off-hand?
I answered it. I said I used CUK in calcs because others suggested it. I wouldn't personally use one. Despite the low delay, it does not have the DPS other low delay weapons other classes use. Perdu Blade for NIN has 10.10. Blau Dolch has 11.12. Sirocco Kukri has 10.4. In contrast, CUK has 8.77 DPS. In my eyes it's another heart snatcher: It has something on it that gives the appearance that it's good, but it's still pretty much **** :P
It is slightly better than HS, in the sense that it causes more tp gain and DNC isn't only focused on damage. However, I'd still go with other daggers.
Now to address the ATK comment... by rdmdontdie
First, you came up to the right number for fSTR, but your calc seems off. Max fSTR for both weapons will be 11, while the fSTR gained is 3. You applied 3, so it's fine.
We no longer know for sure if the pDIF works in the same way as listed on the wiki, but even if it does, some of your calcs seem a bit off. For instance, I'm not sure how you go 1.5 as the max. The max is going to be ~1.0 for dagger and min will be ~.2. We usually just use the cRatio, with the ATK you stated, vs level 82 greater colibri with dia II it would be .839
327*.10= 32, 327-32= 295 Def.
351/295= 1.189 - .35= .839.
298/295= 1.010 - .35= .660
Lets do Bk+1/BK+1 since I think it's smarter. The new Cratio is .873 vs .660. Going to use the gear I had in the mad/march scenario, so delay would be 139(with haste, haste samba, and march, 57% haste). 5.1 tp a hit.
In 1 hour, there will be 1553 rounds, with 3097 landed hits @95% acc and 5% DA.
fSTR is 3, so the average damage over time should be about:
35 * 3097 *.873 = 94,628
For the Joy in that situation, we'll use 47.75% DA to add in the brutal. Delay should be 147. 1469 rounds, 1469 swings at 95% acc and 5% da, so 1464 swings landed with dagger. Damage:
35 * 1464 * .839 = 42,990.
Now the Joy part, you mentioned Closed Position. this is 15 extra acc IF you can keep the monster facing you always. I know that's impossible, unless you get a very cooperative group that all clump up on one side of the enemy. That's also nearly impossible. Especially if other members have similar style merits, like THF and ambush needing to be behind, SAM needing front, etc. Most people circle the enemy. I'll leave it out for now, because if I do include it, then I'd want to leave out mad(which is already helping joy more than dagger).
Joy has 1469 rounds @ 47.75% DA and 83.5% acc(not going to use hollow like you because brutal will be around the same, and help more on WS, plus helps main more). 1811 hits from Joy landed.
38 * 1811 * .660 = 45,419
Total damage for BK+1/Joy = 88,409
This is a difference in melee damage of 7%.
Hmm, what's left is to calculate WS, but I'd need some insight on what kind of WS gear a DNC would use, and their stats at the time. I'll just state what is necessary for BK+1/Joy to catch up: 1200 tp between the two setups mean around 13 ws more for BK+Joy in a perfect world(it's 13 not 12 because the total amount of tp, 16702.5 vs 15485). However, this is nearly impossible since you can't always WS at 100 tp, and with joy you have a high chance of going over 100 due to DA. Worst case would be something similar to having 96.9 or so tp, then procing DA on either offhand only or on all hands, wasting 10.2 to 15.3 tp, and will probably happen often with a 45% DA weapon. See this thread
for an example.
So, while still giving Bk+1/Joy the huge benefit of the doubt, we'll lower it to 11 more WS, probably more likely to 10 WS or less. At 11 WS, you ws average needs to be 747 to catch up, at 10 it needs to be 822. This is also assuming the WS for all the other times you went before the joy pulled ahead, which it will not be. The BK+1/Bk+1 setup will have higher damage WS(due to 10 extra atk) so the gap will be even further.
Final breakdown: BK+1/BK+1 will have 7% increase to your melee side, which, based on your 70/30 breakdown is a 4.9% increase to total DoT. Furthermore, it gives a 4% increase to it's WS side, while BK+1/Joy will produce ~7-7.5% more WS, resulting in a ~3.5% increase from BK+1/Joy in WS damage total. This is all giving Joy favorable conditions. Break those numbers down into the 70/30 split and we get a 1.05% increase to total damage.
The difference between the two is 3.85%
in favor of BK+1/Bk+1 over Bk+1/Joy, even favoring Joy by using acc songs instead of dual haste or atk/haste, and other calc increases favoring joy mentioned above.
The ATK isn't negligible like you stated, nor is joy that big of a winner. Now as you stated, it does net more tp allowing more moves to be done. However, this is only accomplished by crippling the party requiring Madrigal, or by using extremely expensive sushi, and only works on colibri. Granted, having different gear for different camps is to be expected of DDs, my THF and DRG have complete different sets when needing to switch from haste to atk to Acc, and my NIN and THF has other varied sets or simply just slots. I use different food per camp as well.
That said however, Colibri is one of the locations I personally believe madrigal no longer has a place. With cheap sushi being available, any DD class should be able to maintain respectable acc independently, even without a large amount of acc gear. This allows for more powerful songs Minuet and March to be used instead, increasing the overall potential. When I party with people who can't keep up because they need madrigal, I'm upset. I spent the time an effort to increase myself enough to help the party without detriment, and then others who are lazier or refuse to change from a weaker setup that requires it force me to take a song that doesn't help me in the slightest(like on my DRG, before I started haste build).
/rant off. Edited, Jan 29th 2009 4:27pm by Souji