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Dancer as a Tank - Amazing ResultsFollow

#27 Feb 21 2008 at 3:30 PM Rating: Default
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no offense, but i'd prefer dnc not to be a tank when it comes to af armor and future weapon design. 1-70ish tanking is a small part of the game, and endgame there are no shortage of tanks that can sub dnc to do what we can better. I have tanked although more in a crisis sense, but the job will just become a paladin mark 2 if tanking becomes its focus, and instead it needs to be developed to thrive in the new world pass midgame exp.
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#28 Feb 23 2008 at 10:39 PM Rating: Decent
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ive been a tank all my ffxi life. lvling dnc to 74 so far has been an awesome experience. as you get closer to 75 it seems more and more like a combination of thf, brd and whm. I can DD and do 500-600 dmg dancing edges with building flourish on IT + mobs, i can main heal, and yes...as erecia says...i can tank. High evasion helps here as well as the evasion bonus. The obvious downfall is our defense. i think its merely 230ish at lvl 74. aka u get raped. For this reason id stick to /nin. if ur truly a main tank with no support animated flourish and divine waltz is more than enough to hold hate. I dont know if its only because i have capped enm...but i see some hate transfer from drain samba cast. I dont, however, see the same from haste samba for some reason. Violent flourish helps if u need to recast ichi (prior to 74 ofcourse) and the stun effect procs WAY more often on vt mobs then IT +. So keep that in mind if a pty asks you to be a true main tank. Worse comes to worse u mess up shadows and start cure bombing yourself....not like its a drain on mp or anything. I think the job is a nice support tank (i had ppl TA me tons while lower lvl exp'n), an ok support job (haste samba mainly), and an ok main heal (recast timers only thing not making this job the best main heal option 1-75 in exp ptys). Its the only job that does well at performing all three functions (brd/whm and cor/rdm cant touch our cure capacity due to their lack of mp).

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#30 Mar 07 2008 at 3:12 AM Rating: Good
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Just wanted to add my testimony to Dancer tanking.

Today I tanked the 40-cap mammet fight for CoP as DNC/WAR. Our group had 3 tanks and 3 mages, one mage to support each tank. We pulled the mammets far afield to avoid aoes and went to town.

By the end of the fight, the Ninja and the Paladin were both deep into the red and had gone through many hi-pots and refresh drinks, while I was cruising along well above 3/4 hps and keeping hate off my blm backup like a champ. :)

Okay, yes I'm bragging.

Still, I was only using average evasion gear, a tavnazian taco, and an icarus wing during the whole thing. It was ridiculously easy. As long as you can build tp faster than they can hurt you, Dancer is incredibly difficult to kill. With provoke + animated flourish, I had some form of spike hate every 15 seconds, plus cure bombing myself--I don't think my mammet ever glanced at the black mage, who was free to nuke pretty hard without having to worry about curing me.

Felt good to know DNC can contribute to CoP ^^

edited because i can't spell

Edited, Mar 7th 2008 3:18am by Vallija

Edited, Mar 7th 2008 3:20am by Vallija
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#31 Mar 23 2008 at 9:22 PM Rating: Good
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I'm sitting in Whitegate right now looking for a party, and somebody is repeatedly shouting the following:

{Party} 47-50 {Meat} {Shield} {Can I have it?} Paladin Ninja or Dancer {Can I have it?}

It looks like some people are starting to think we make an acceptable tank.
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#32 Mar 24 2008 at 7:30 AM Rating: Good
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Success!
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#33 Mar 24 2008 at 9:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Woot, rock on :D
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#34 Mar 25 2008 at 8:37 AM Rating: Good
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I started dnc a few days ago, level 20 now. I want to -TANK-. When dnc first came out I'd invite them as tanks and they'd get ****** off, so I figured I'd find out why. They seem perfect for the job to me... constantly healing yourself gathers so much hate. I haven't gotten to do it yet though, but I hope it works out.
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#35 Mar 25 2008 at 11:28 AM Rating: Decent
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DNC/BLU FTW? Cocoon is just rediculous for def.

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#36 Mar 25 2008 at 12:31 PM Rating: Good
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I haven't seen anything interesting from DNC/BLU. Cocoon only lasts a minute and few of the other spells are worthwhile. Plus you'd have a very shallow MP poor and no real MP gear to boost it that wouldn't hinder your performance as a DNC.

BLU/DNC, on the other hand, is good times.
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#37 Mar 25 2008 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
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I have -enmity merited quite a bit, yet I still could effectivly tank from lvl 15-40+. DNC/NIN wasnt too hard to tank with. When my shadows were down, I'd stun and start casting again. DNC/NIN is just like ninja pre-ni levels. Just get a nice evasion build and those 3 shadows will last for awhile. I see 75DNC/NIN as a great solo job. You have a good evasion skill, evasion bonus JT, high curing capability, ability to stun harmful TP moves or to recast ichi easier, weight in case you need to kite until timers are ready, and probably a bunch of other things I havnt thought about.

Dancer is a great supstitute for tanking from low to mid level ranges.
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#38 Mar 25 2008 at 3:52 PM Rating: Good
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Just wanted to let yall know that I really Like this thread just because it is a true discussion about one aspect of dancer that quickly died out after their lack of tanking and more along the lines of healing came about!
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#39 Mar 31 2008 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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I haven't seen anything interesting from DNC/BLU. Cocoon only lasts a minute and few of the other spells are worthwhile. Plus you'd have a very shallow MP poor and no real MP gear to boost it that wouldn't hinder your performance as a DNC.

BLU/DNC, on the other hand, is good times.


You don't need much MP. The only spell you would be using is Cocoon.

Its 90sec of 50% defense bonus for 10mp lol. One pinapple juice will keep you going for 12 mins without any other refresh. If you can make them, thats like 500gil/hour for a 50% defense boost.

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#40FreeFlier, Posted: Mar 31 2008 at 11:29 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) in all honesty, the 2 probs with dnc tank that i can see is endgame and crappy equipment/crappy pty setup and cooperation.
#41 Mar 31 2008 at 11:36 AM Rating: Good
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FreeFlier wrote:
what happens when a sam, drk, mnk, rng, drg, etc pulls hate unexpectedly, drk is main example from souleater and really horrid def, how can the dnc pull hate back? with a pld u can flash/shield bash then get into position for cover...

You let them get hit and take some damage, then fire off a waltz on them and cure them instead of you. It's relatively low risk since the waltz is an instant job ability, so unless they're blinking like mad you can get it off easily.

I'm not sure if I stressed it very well in the OP, but I essentially never lost hate on DNC tank, and it wasn't from the melees not trying. My life was almost constantly in danger, but losing hate was a complete non-issue.

FreeFlier wrote:
i think dnc can tank within reason but there are better tanks around...

Yeah, that's the thing. There aren't better tanks around. Lots of people have leveled PLD and NIN by now, and WAR's are more cowardly than my DNC when it comes to provoke. This was written to encourage dancers to try to tank in an exp situation where there were no normal tanks to be had.

Dancers tanking in endgame, no, perhaps not, but this was just supposed to be a beginning. I didn't have any fancy setup or really put a whole heck of a lot of thought into how it was going to work. If dancer tanking doesn't go anywhere, well, okay, but I can say I've done it.

Edit: and wtf, cover? Are we playing the game? My entire career leveling paladin I think I had one or two melees that would help me out with cover. It's pretty much a dead job ability in 2008's TP burn parties.

Edited, Mar 31st 2008 3:37pm by Erecia
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#42FreeFlier, Posted: Mar 31 2008 at 11:52 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) do me a favor, get a *** nin/war, pld/nin, or pld/war and plz tell them there is no better tank than a dnc/(ur choice on sub). when they laugh and call u a gaijin (cant remember the actual spelling), maybe u will see a real tank. u will see a huge diff when playing with japanese players...
#43 Mar 31 2008 at 12:00 PM Rating: Good
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Errr... yeah. Thanks for the, um, tips? Please go away now Mr. Ego Paladin. I'm sorry that a job with a silly rose in their hair can sufficiently replace you in an exp party.

PS: it's an unfair generalization perhaps, but all JP parties I've gotten in the past two years or so were still stuck in 2004. I do see a huge difference in partying with JP players; namely, a huge decrease in my overall exp/hour.
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#44FreeFlier, Posted: Mar 31 2008 at 12:21 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) mr ego pld? im not the one saying how perfect dnc is and how they are the best tank in the game. im pointing out flaws in the dnc tank. there are flaws in all tanks, pld main flaw is mp, but if you cant handle the critique tank 2 tank then you have the issues with ego. i have 1 full account with all 75's (save dnc and sch as i retired it b4 WotG came out) i understand tanking in exp, merit, nm, hnm, dynamis ptys. my main char on my new acct has dnc at 29 right now, and i can tell you already that dnc is not the best tank as you claim.
#45 Mar 31 2008 at 12:29 PM Rating: Decent
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OP never said anything about DNC being a perfect tank. And...


Quote:
i have 1 full account with all 75's (save dnc and sch as i retired it b4 WotG came out)


oh wow. You're not even trying here.
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#46 Mar 31 2008 at 12:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Adding in a CoP experience, I tanked Promy-Vazhl as Dnc/nin with another nin/war, We bounced hate between us often and during the boss fight, When the second(or third) would join the brawl, I took control of it while still healing the pt with the blm. Dnc is extremely flexible and capable of doing both (Tanking and healing.) Its just sad that people insist on keeping dncs as support, dnc is getting the same thing rdms got when they were shoved into the backlines to play whm, completely ignoring its other capabilities.
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#47 Apr 01 2008 at 7:50 AM Rating: Default
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More game experience.

Partied with a group of mid-40's last night. Was able to do a decent job as tank until we added a true tank class. Could only generate enough hate to make the mob turn with devine cures after that... and then only for 20 seconds or so. The good news is that the party never chased after the mobs because our back line whm and blms were nuking and curing... the mobs stayed in the sword circle.

There are better tank classes out there, but we'll do as a second choice. Our job is very flexible, that is what's nice about it, but let's face it: a true tank class can do the job better.

If SE wants to give DNC some better weapons, and some better gear they might be able to move DNC from second tier tank to first tier.

Oh, and parties need to agree with DNC on what role they want to play in the party... TP and skill usage is very different using DNC as tank or in a support role.
#48 Apr 03 2008 at 3:20 AM Rating: Decent
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Since 15 I have been main tanking on my DNC, holding hate has never been an issue and my tp gain is fast enough to maintain constant cures and still not blow through my tp. Only time I came close to dying was when I ended up tanking 3 IT mobs(horrible linkage)I popped my 2hr and spammed the **** out of my cures only to die when it wore. we managed to kill all of the mobs but I died in thr process being the hero.

I plan on taking DNC to 75 and I was told that DNC does alot of tanking due to emense hate built by the cures so I look foward to more DNC tankage.
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#49 Apr 03 2008 at 10:20 AM Rating: Good
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I'd like to see your build and get a feel for your party makeups.

If I'm in a party with a PLD and a WHM, there is no need to spam cures just to be a tank...

There have been very few parties that I have been asked to tank, and when asked, its because there are no true tanks to be found. I can do it, but it is very easy to get into deficit TP spending in many cases.

Ultimately a class with voke and good damage can do better with tanking. PLD is the ultimate tank.
#50 May 10 2008 at 11:28 AM Rating: Decent
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Some things I would like to add to this. I have not attempted to tank traditional parties, but duo/trio is perfect...throw a rdm in for Dispel and I'm fine to cure myself and PT members that MAY pull hate. I'm level 50 btw, and I can throw out a CW3 for 350HP... I'm Galka as well, so at level 50 (with squid/sole sushi) I rack in 990ish HP. Now, for 50 TP, which i can generate in no time, i can cure nearly half my HP in one shot...not too much to worry about.

I could see DNC being a tank more often, but your HP might be something to watch. Taru's might want to wear some RSE for added HP.

My biggest problem wiht the job so far...level 49. Deleveled solo... Well, after the experience of using CW3 and only getting CW2 for that little length of time, I can see that level being a nuisance if you know what your getting in 7k exp.

Get yourself a great backline healer that you trust, and does not pull hate, and you can go nonstop on just about anything in your path...just grab a T if you have to, and towards the end, tell others to back out so you can build the TP and finishing moves. Keep track of every ability of your job...their your lifeline when either in party or solo.

Thanks for reading my ramblings about DNC. It's a great job...lets just hope SE doesn't mess it up for those of us who truly love the job.

Theode - Galka Dancer - Ragnarok

Edited, May 10th 2008 3:31pm by JamesLand
#51 May 13 2008 at 10:49 AM Rating: Decent
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I would just like to remind everyone NIN was never intended to be a tank when SE created it. However it is now a staple tank in the game, and my personal favorite job. I do also have PLD leveled, though only 57 right now, so I am not as confident in PLD tanking as I am with NIN tanking.

I am not saying DNC can or can't tank, as I have no experience with tanking as a DNC, justed wanted everyone to remember NIN was created as a DDing debuff job.
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