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#27 Sep 14 2011 at 1:13 PM Rating: Good
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Lady Jinte wrote:
dustin, gear =/= career pup. Gear =/= career any job. You can have amazing gear and still no **** all about your job (ie: most members of heavy endgame shells). I've only got +1 head/hands/feet, +2 legs, and no burts/vereth/rev/ken/fire taipan (though that's because I always manage to log on right after firesday ends, or have to log off right before it starts. Always.)/etc. I'd like to see you try and justify that I'm not a career pup just because I don't have OMFGAMAZING gear Smiley: dubious




No your right gear =/= career pup, but as a career pup you should have certain goals for certain gear slots.

EG:
Any pup should want rev fists/verethragna/kenkonken as an ultimate goal (in that order) for a weapon they are using. I have 3-4 other weapons I use depending on what I am up to (refresh one, pet -pdt, +int mab pet ones, etc), but ultimately I want a kenkonken (waiting on toau revamp).

I dont think people should be cookie cutter at all and I dont expect anyone who is newly 90 to be expected to just blamo have all attachments and the best gear, just that for certain slots, there is definitly a best option or in the case of brutal earring an only option. Just like for automaton, there are just certain attachments that are a given if you have them (turbo charger as an example, or the ice setup for blm pet)

To me, career pup is someone who dedicates their time in game to making their pup better (gear, merits, attachments, weapon skills). When I look at a pups gear and see stuff like +1 head and full +2 everything else with an ethereal earing over a brutal earring...I just have to say that to ME it looks like someone who is playing pup but it really isnt their main so they took whatever gear they had and are using it.

When I play dragoon, that is how i would describe it. Exactly as xiozen is geared. I have some +1, some +2 (from when it rotted) and a few pieces of 'o i guess that fits, but im not looking to spend time finding anything better'.

Personally im embarassed when im on dragoon and people see my +3 acc earring lol ;-o
#29 Sep 14 2011 at 2:01 PM Rating: Decent
IMO its cool seeing different takes on a job i love. PUP happens to be the only job of mine to date that i have full +2 for, as such i enjoy reading about how other PUP set up and play the job.

That said

Xiozen your blatant ignoring of a valid question and then throwing around the "we must all be excepting of different playstyles"(paraphrased) card as some kind shield against said ignored question is just maddening. And yes i was following that thread even though i didn't chime in there.

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#30 Sep 14 2011 at 2:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Xiozen wrote:
This post just sounds like someone who is whining...about what? Getting his feelings hurt? Slightly embarrassed? I don't know... but whatever it is get over it... your post started out so well, then just degenerated into something a 13 year old would say... "...see stuff like +1 head and full +2 everything else with an ethereal earring over a brutal earring..." Now your just crying and you know it... You'll be OK ^.^ so cheer the f*** up already. Geesh!



Hm i seem to remember a quote...

what was it...

Xiozen wrote:
Have I touched a nerve?


Thats not crying, but i see i have offended your gear choices, and strangly that doesn't bother me.
#31 Sep 14 2011 at 2:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Xio you must not have gotten the memo.

This is Jinte's forum, and you are working hard to not get the seal of approval. ;)

We are a family here and very welcoming (usually), but when you go tossing out "facts" with no data with an initial attitude. That's when it causes problems.
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#32Xiozen, Posted: Sep 14 2011 at 2:23 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Blatant? means unpleasantly loud and noisy... so I don't believe the word applies... I believe you meant "purposefully". I purposely ignored it... the reason why is because, unlike your statement that it is valid, I do not believe it to be valid. That's why, in my opinion, it doesn't warrant a response. Sorry to disappoint. :'(
#33 Sep 14 2011 at 2:28 PM Rating: Default
Camwin wrote:
Xio you must not have gotten the memo.

This is Jinte's forum, and you are working hard to not get the seal of approval. ;)

We are a family here and very welcoming (usually), but when you go tossing out "facts" with no data with an initial attitude. That's when it causes problems.


Oh please do me the honor and point me in the direction of a post where I was "tossing out 'facts' with no data"... I don't posts on any forum "supposed facts"... I leave that up to "others..." and they know who they are :) They're full of facts about this game.
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#34 Sep 14 2011 at 3:08 PM Rating: Default
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Hmm you might wanna read past the first definition of dictionary.com if you dont know the word.

Blatant also means: completely obvious, conspicuous, or obtrusive especially in a crass or offensive manner

So to blatantly ignore someone is to completely and obviously ignore someones question.

Quote:
I do not believe it to be valid. That's why, in my opinion, it doesn't warrant a response


With that, you are basically saying that, jinte (theytak) asking for all the gear/info on your character to exactly replicate different dps scenarios is in faction an invalid way of proving a point.

You do realize that jinte, kinematics and a slew of people from BG have definitively analyze almost every aspect of the game with a fine tooth mathematical comb, and you cannot disregard the empirical data just because it doesn't make sense to you right? These are formulas based on in game equations, and while not directly given by the developers still hold true.

Its like when a scientist discovers an equation to represent gravity. He didnt create gravity, so that 'smudge factor' is his representation of mathematical proof as far as his data can accurately show.
#35 Sep 14 2011 at 3:12 PM Rating: Default
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Xiozen wrote:

Oh please do me the honor and point me in the direction of a post where I was "tossing out 'facts' with no data"... I don't posts on any forum "supposed facts"... I leave that up to "others..." and they know who they are :) They're full of facts about this game.



Can i just list them?

Animators have a difference on pet behavior (even before you had said animators to make comparison)
Tactical processor has a measurable affect on anything and every pup should use it
sea daughter is better then vv or ss (which you apparently though was in reference to siren shadow)

I can go back and find the links to the posts if you like?
#36Xiozen, Posted: Sep 14 2011 at 3:28 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Yes, please do--because the posts will speak for themselves^^... i never posted anything as a "fact". ^.^
#37 Sep 14 2011 at 3:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Got it.

You admit to being a troll and spreading bad/false information and the reason you refuse to give any evidence/support to any of your claims, is because you know them to already not be true.

You basically just admitted that all 3 of those examples you know to be inaccurate.

As such all future posts from you will be regarded the same. Potential troll looking for troll food.
#38 Sep 14 2011 at 3:54 PM Rating: Good
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Xiozen wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Xiozen wrote:

Oh please do me the honor and point me in the direction of a post where I was "tossing out 'facts' with no data"... I don't posts on any forum "supposed facts"... I leave that up to "others..." and they know who they are :) They're full of facts about this game.



Can i just list them?

Animators have a difference on pet behavior (even before you had said animators to make comparison)
Tactical processor has a measurable affect on anything and every pup should use it
sea daughter is better then vv or ss (which you apparently though was in reference to siren shadow)

I can go back and find the links to the posts if you like?


Yes, please do--because the posts will speak for themselves^^... i never posted anything as a "fact". ^.^



I've also seen things you have posted as "fact". Maybe you should also learn the differences between what facts are, and what opinions are as well.
#39 Sep 14 2011 at 4:12 PM Rating: Decent
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dustinfoley wrote:
Got it.

You admit to being a troll and spreading bad/false information and the reason you refuse to give any evidence/support to any of your claims, is because you know them to already not be true.

You basically just admitted that all 3 of those examples you know to be inaccurate.

As such all future posts from you will be regarded the same. Potential troll looking for troll food.

/highfive!
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#40 Sep 14 2011 at 4:56 PM Rating: Decent
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I guess it goes to show, that even a "good" rated post can be deleted, no matter how true it is, even when a troll can constantly post bad/false info, people can't call them out on it :-(
#41 Sep 14 2011 at 4:57 PM Rating: Excellent
Let's drop the excessive flaming and trolling on here, ok? It's one thing to do it on the official forums, but let's keep it to a minimum here. I don't want it to get to the point of me needing to lock and nuke topics left and right because someone's singled out someone else to flame constantly or someone's decided they're going to be funny and just troll topics like mad cause they can.

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 7:09pm by Vlorsutes
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#42 Sep 14 2011 at 4:58 PM Rating: Decent
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how are any of them off topic, the thread is about people spreading bad/false info on the offical forums and us calling him out on it?

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 6:59pm by dustinfoley
#43 Sep 14 2011 at 5:11 PM Rating: Excellent
I adjusted what I said and did after stepping back and thinking about it, but as much as you guys feel that he's trolling, some of the comments being made in here are pretty much baiting him, so I think both sides should try and straighten up a bit.

I will say this though, Xio, Jinte is someone I would say is easily one of the most knowledgeable and best Puppetmasters I've ever seen, so if he does some tests or makes a statement in regards to what he feels is a proper gear choice for Pup, you'll be hard pressed to find any reason that it's wrong. He might be arrogant at times, but he knows what he's talking about.

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 7:20pm by Vlorsutes
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#44 Sep 14 2011 at 5:19 PM Rating: Excellent
I usually refrain from posting since english is not my first lenguage, and only do so when its kind of relevant, Xiozen, I've read possibly all of the stuff mentioned here, in the official forums and the alla forums, I know this game is all about min/max, and using other stuff than the actual usefull stuff and on top of that posting about it is asking for trouble, on the other hand, you have said some of the most weird things I've heard about pup with a lot of confidence (like the animators affecting performance other than the actual stats on them), if someone like dustin or jinte are arguing with you using hard facts, its kind of sad seeing you "try" to reply.

I guess all am saying is, don't spread stuff if you dont know 100% what you are saying is true (or make it clear that you dont know for sure), or your opinion is quickly and swiftly going to be regarded as crap. hope i dont come off as rude D:, we try to run a tight ship here, you know how everyone (used to?) think pups are not good players well lets just say its in great part from the horrendous gear choices of some.
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#45Xiozen, Posted: Sep 14 2011 at 6:57 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Thanks for your opinion but let's clear a few things up... 1) "posting is asking for trouble" your opinion... maybe trouble for you but last I looked, that's what a forum is for... 2) "said some of the most weird things"... let's be clear on this, it's weird to you... it's not weird to me... just so we're clear on that one :)
#46 Sep 14 2011 at 7:00 PM Rating: Default
Vlorsutes, Lord of Stuff wrote:
I adjusted what I said and did after stepping back and thinking about it, but as much as you guys feel that he's trolling, some of the comments being made in here are pretty much baiting him, so I think both sides should try and straighten up a bit.

I will say this though, Xio, Jinte is someone I would say is easily one of the most knowledgeable and best Puppetmasters I've ever seen, so if he does some tests or makes a statement in regards to what he feels is a proper gear choice for Pup, you'll be hard pressed to find any reason that it's wrong. He might be arrogant at times, but he knows what he's talking about.

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 7:20pm by Vlorsutes


Interesting point you've made.
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#47 Sep 14 2011 at 7:49 PM Rating: Good
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#48 Sep 14 2011 at 8:36 PM Rating: Good
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Xiozen wrote:

Thanks for your opinion but let's clear a few things up...
1) "posting is asking for trouble" your opinion... maybe trouble for you but last I looked, that's what a forum is for...

2) "said some of the most weird things"... let's be clear on this, it's weird to you... it's not weird to me... just so we're clear on that one :)

3) you said "its kind of sad seeing you 'try' to reply'"... last I looked I was replying...soooo not quite sure where you're coming from with this one...

4) you said "don't spread stuff if you don't know 100% what you are saying is true"... again, we're back to semantics... I "spread" what works and continues (to this day) to work for me... whether you believe it or not is your issue, not mine...

5) And you're not coming off as rude--because everyone's entitled to their opinion. :)

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 9:00pm by Xiozen


1) You are correct forums are for discussing min/max. However, saying a known min is really a max, (sea daughter) then offering no proof other then "try it out yourself" is asking for trouble and kayno is correct.

2)Weird: As in Making outrageous claims about animators affects and noticable affects tactical processor, then offering zero shreds of evidence to back up either claim. Weird is also refusing to accept known equations for DD calculations as a fact because of 'assumptions' being made when you yourself base all your 'facts' on observation with no quantifiable proof. Lets be honest, disregarding math as not proof is weird to anyone with a high school education.

3) Obvious trolling? Completely oblivious? Not sure, but you didn't know what blatantly meant....

4) You can use SD all you want. I don't even mind you recommending it as a 'fun toy' or 'something to play around with' or 'a way for VE to stay alive a little longer', but when you say the slow is negligible, or that the tipple attack on Apoc is small...that is when people are going to step in an correct you, because those terms are completely wrong no matter whose 'opinion' it is.


#49 Sep 14 2011 at 9:19 PM Rating: Excellent
dustinfoley wrote:
Xiozen wrote:

Thanks for your opinion but let's clear a few things up...
1) "posting is asking for trouble" your opinion... maybe trouble for you but last I looked, that's what a forum is for...

2) "said some of the most weird things"... let's be clear on this, it's weird to you... it's not weird to me... just so we're clear on that one :)

3) you said "its kind of sad seeing you 'try' to reply'"... last I looked I was replying...soooo not quite sure where you're coming from with this one...

4) you said "don't spread stuff if you don't know 100% what you are saying is true"... again, we're back to semantics... I "spread" what works and continues (to this day) to work for me... whether you believe it or not is your issue, not mine...

5) And you're not coming off as rude--because everyone's entitled to their opinion. :)

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 9:00pm by Xiozen


1) You are correct forums are for discussing min/max. However, saying a known min is really a max, (sea daughter) then offering no proof other then "try it out yourself" is asking for trouble and kayno is correct.

2)Weird: As in Making outrageous claims about animators affects and noticable affects tactical processor, then offering zero shreds of evidence to back up either claim. Weird is also refusing to accept known equations for DD calculations as a fact because of 'assumptions' being made when you yourself base all your 'facts' on observation with no quantifiable proof. Lets be honest, disregarding math as not proof is weird to anyone with a high school education.

3) Obvious trolling? Completely oblivious? Not sure, but you didn't know what blatantly meant....

4) You can use SD all you want. I don't even mind you recommending it as a 'fun toy' or 'something to play around with' or 'a way for VE to stay alive a little longer', but when you say the slow is negligible, or that the tipple attack on Apoc is small...that is when people are going to step in an correct you, because those terms are completely wrong no matter whose 'opinion' it is.




well just wow, xiozen, I appresieate the level of "maturity" you always reply with, most people on your position would have resorted to insults and what not, but something not being weird to you or wrong to you does not by default make it right. facts and numbers win, all. the. time.
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#50 Sep 15 2011 at 11:32 PM Rating: Good
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Xiozen wrote:
Lady Jinte wrote:
You're posting lies and fallacies and claiming them as truths in my home pup forum. Like **** I'm gonna stay quiet about that.


Like a broken record I can say "No I'm not"...then you could say "Yes you are", then I could say "No I'm not"...and on and on and on...

Soooo I'll just end this with: Everyone's entitled to their opinion. /cheers


It's not my opinion. It's empirically proven, mathematically supported fact.

Camwin wrote:
Xio you must not have gotten the memo.

This is Jinte's forum, and you are working hard to not get the seal of approval. ;)

We are a family here and very welcoming (usually), but when you go tossing out "facts" with no data with an initial attitude. That's when it causes problems.


In the 5 years since it was created, Alla's pup forum has never had someone who as much of a blatant troll as you are. We've had various people who were not nice (see: Me), but even those who weren't exactly friendly still managed to be intelligent, and whenever we have disagreements, even when it gets flamey, the end result is civil. You're the oddman out here, Xiozen. In otherwords; kindly gtfo mah pup forum, you're not welcome.

Xiozen wrote:
spiritreaverdiablos the Irrelevant wrote:
IMO its cool seeing different takes on a job i love. PUP happens to be the only job of mine to date that i have full +2 for, as such i enjoy reading about how other PUP set up and play the job.

That said

Xiozen your blatant ignoring of a valid question and then throwing around the "we must all be excepting of different playstyles"(paraphrased) card as some kind shield against said ignored question is just maddening. And yes i was following that thread even though i didn't chime in there.


Blatant? means unpleasantly loud and noisy... so I don't believe the word applies... I believe you meant "purposefully". I purposely ignored it... the reason why is because, unlike your statement that it is valid, I do not believe it to be valid. That's why, in my opinion, it doesn't warrant a response. Sorry to disappoint. :'(

Why doesn't it warrant a response? I asked you for a simple, straight-forward supply of information so that I can accurately calculate your assertion that atma of the sea daughter helps damage, to your rigid requirements. If you don't consider it valid, at least be an adult and justify why, rather than shoving your fingers in your ears and screaming "LALALALALALA, I CAN'T HEAR YOU".

Vlorsutes, Lord of Stuff wrote:
I adjusted what I said and did after stepping back and thinking about it, but as much as you guys feel that he's trolling, some of the comments being made in here are pretty much baiting him, so I think both sides should try and straighten up a bit.

I will say this though, Xio, Jinte is someone I would say is easily one of the most knowledgeable and best Puppetmasters I've ever seen, so if he does some tests or makes a statement in regards to what he feels is a proper gear choice for Pup, you'll be hard pressed to find any reason that it's wrong. He might be arrogant at times, but he knows what he's talking about.

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 7:20pm by Vlorsutes


At times? Be honest vlor, I'm always arrogant, it's part of my charm~

KaynofTitan wrote:
dustinfoley wrote:
Xiozen wrote:

Thanks for your opinion but let's clear a few things up...
1) "posting is asking for trouble" your opinion... maybe trouble for you but last I looked, that's what a forum is for...

2) "said some of the most weird things"... let's be clear on this, it's weird to you... it's not weird to me... just so we're clear on that one :)

3) you said "its kind of sad seeing you 'try' to reply'"... last I looked I was replying...soooo not quite sure where you're coming from with this one...

4) you said "don't spread stuff if you don't know 100% what you are saying is true"... again, we're back to semantics... I "spread" what works and continues (to this day) to work for me... whether you believe it or not is your issue, not mine...

5) And you're not coming off as rude--because everyone's entitled to their opinion. :)

Edited, Sep 14th 2011 9:00pm by Xiozen


1) You are correct forums are for discussing min/max. However, saying a known min is really a max, (sea daughter) then offering no proof other then "try it out yourself" is asking for trouble and kayno is correct.

2)Weird: As in Making outrageous claims about animators affects and noticable affects tactical processor, then offering zero shreds of evidence to back up either claim. Weird is also refusing to accept known equations for DD calculations as a fact because of 'assumptions' being made when you yourself base all your 'facts' on observation with no quantifiable proof. Lets be honest, disregarding math as not proof is weird to anyone with a high school education.

3) Obvious trolling? Completely oblivious? Not sure, but you didn't know what blatantly meant....

4) You can use SD all you want. I don't even mind you recommending it as a 'fun toy' or 'something to play around with' or 'a way for VE to stay alive a little longer', but when you say the slow is negligible, or that the tipple attack on Apoc is small...that is when people are going to step in an correct you, because those terms are completely wrong no matter whose 'opinion' it is.




well just wow, xiozen, I appresieate the level of "maturity" you always reply with, most people on your position would have resorted to insults and what not, but something not being weird to you or wrong to you does not by default make it right. facts and numbers win, all. the. time.


It's not "maturity" it's condescension. All of his posts ooze an aura of "What I say is important, but I don't give a **** what you have to say, because my opinions are always better than anything anyone else has to say." and are followed with some asinine smiley face to try and cover up the fact that he's being a complete ***********
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Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#51 Sep 18 2011 at 7:04 PM Rating: Decent
Wait, have I been replaced? D:
Also I don't read the OF based on what I've heard about the stupidity over there.



Edited, Sep 18th 2011 10:58pm by itege
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