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Enfeebling MagicFollow

#1 Apr 14 2010 at 9:25 AM Rating: Good
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Chances are, puppet AI has always worked like this, but I noticed something new last night while killing skelly's in Ule Range. With a wind maneuver up, my puppet was prioritizing Enfeebs over (nukes) and even healing magic. I was using Stormwaker with Damage Guage and Tranq equipped and saw this happen at orange hp and a light maneuver up. Has anyone else seen this? It's a pretty good way to have your SW puppet cast para instead of pulling hate with Thunder3.

I'm thinking this is somewhat like having a water maneuver up on Soulsoother, how it enables -na spells to be cast on party members. It might be one of those little-known secrets that even long-time pup players haven't noticed because they don't put up that maneuver in most situations. Wiki's Soulsoother page lists the -na ability, but there's nothing about Wind and enfeebs on wiki.

I didn't try with any other frames or heads and didn't mess with it too much after I realized those skelly's are war's and not drk's or blm's.
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#2 Apr 14 2010 at 9:49 AM Rating: Decent
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yes this is normal, you can control which enfeebles it does, earth = slow, wind = silence but silence is default enfeeble with any mob with mp, dark is blind etc.
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#3 Apr 14 2010 at 10:31 AM Rating: Good
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Duh, everyone knows that. But it was prioritizing enfeebs over other things, like heals, which I found pretty unusual.
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#4 Apr 14 2010 at 10:49 AM Rating: Default
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It always does. Only way it will do cure over an enfeeble if you have a light up. How long have you been playing pup?

now way back, way way back, you use to not have to put up a light man. up to get it to cast cure at any time, now the only time that it will cast sure without light is when the mob is below a certain percentage in hp, in essence knocking enfeebles out of the priority list. I guess AI says there is no point in casting enfeebles on a mob with low hp.
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#5 Apr 14 2010 at 10:49 AM Rating: Good
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its not that wind makes it prioritize, its the lack of light. with no light maneuvers while the damage gauge is equipped, it will only heal while you are below 50%

having no maneuvers causes it to shuffle through enfeebles, and you use a corresponding maneuver element to tell it which ones to cast first. like if im good on hp and i want blind, i put up dark. so then my automaton casts blind >> bio (sometimes other way around) >> some combination of paralyze slow and silence (unless you have scanner up and the mobs dont cast) and then at the bottom of the list is poison
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#6 Apr 14 2010 at 1:05 PM Rating: Decent
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SelkaSeraph wrote:
Chances are, puppet AI has always worked like this, but I noticed something new last night while killing skelly's in Ule Range. With a wind maneuver up, my puppet was prioritizing Enfeebs over (nukes) and even healing magic. I was using Stormwaker with Damage Guage and Tranq equipped and saw this happen at orange hp and a light maneuver up. Has anyone else seen this? It's a pretty good way to have your SW puppet cast para instead of pulling hate with Thunder3.

I had light up. How long have you been reading the English language?
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#7xbobbobx, Posted: Apr 14 2010 at 1:15 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) well sorry, but it doesnt do that, so either it was lag, or you are wrong. Its either or.
#8 Apr 14 2010 at 1:20 PM Rating: Good
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From reading your post, 3 things immediately pop to mind:

1/ What percentage of the mob's HP was remaining?
2/ What other maneuvers did you have up (Was it just Light and Wind)?
3/ What debuffs were on the enemy already? (Less likely to actually affect the situation, but meh
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I couldn't decide which movie to see last-week, I put up an Ice Maneuver and BOOM, my automaton immediately figured it out for me.
#9 Apr 14 2010 at 3:03 PM Rating: Good
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kairyu wrote:
From reading your post, 3 things immediately pop to mind:

1/ What percentage of the mob's HP was remaining?
2/ What other maneuvers did you have up (Was it just Light and Wind)?
3/ What debuffs were on the enemy already? (Less likely to actually affect the situation, but meh


1 especially. Above 75% mob HP, SW will favor enfeebling magic. Mob hp% is often the culprit when you're trying to figure out why the puppet will do something in one situation with a certain set of manuevers that seems odd compared to the standard.

Under 75%, if you have Ice greater than/equal to other maneuvers, SW nukes. You can use "enfeeble trigger" elements to force enfeebles. If you have a light up with Damage Gauge, and the maneuver/HP trigger conditions are met, it will cure.
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#10 Apr 14 2010 at 3:37 PM Rating: Decent
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1/ Mob was probably 50-70%ish
2/ I think I had wind/light/ice or maybe dark instead of ice
3/ Can't remember for sure. It probably had silence, maybe para. She was casting slow instead of healing me when I expected a heal. Wasn't a critical situation, so no big deal. Just found it interesting.
I know it sounds crazy, so that's why I'm bringing it up. I'm familiar with the usual AI mechanics, but this threw me off.
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#11 Apr 14 2010 at 6:30 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:

I had light up. How long have you been reading the English language?


alright if you wanna be a dick then i'll be a dick. either you didnt have a light up like you thought you did, or you didnt have a damage gauge on. either way, youre mistaken because that will never happen under the situation you explained

so i ask YOU. how long have you had your eyes, your english must not be top notch either

Edited, Apr 14th 2010 8:40pm by AsashinoTsuki
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#12 Apr 14 2010 at 6:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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Fight! fight! fight!
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#13 Apr 14 2010 at 8:11 PM Rating: Decent
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To me it always felt like the order of the maneuvers played a roll, or at least what maneuver is the most recent.

Also, according to FFXIclopedia, an Ice Maneuver prioritizes a Nuke on the SW head, so, effectively, your Ice canceled out the healing effect of the light, and then Ice + Wind prioritized Enfeebling.

That's how I understand it anyway.

Do a test if you'd like. Have something like Light + Wind + Wind and a Cure will "win" (if your HP is the correct % and the mob's HP isn't too low to ignore Maneuvers).

Then do Light + Ice. Puppet should Nuke no matter anyone's HP.

Then do Light + Ice (tells to Nuke) + Wind (tells to Enfeeble). Puppet should Enfeeble no matter HP again, and I THINK that Wind will even make the Puppet Enfeeble below 50% (mob hpp) but above the "nuke threshold".

Those are my thoughts on the matter. Test/refute them if you'd like. My computer hates FFXI right now so I can't... :(
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#14 Apr 14 2010 at 8:26 PM Rating: Good
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Roller wrote:
To me it always felt like the order of the maneuvers played a roll, or at least what maneuver is the most recent.

Also, according to FFXIclopedia, an Ice Maneuver prioritizes a Nuke on the SW head, so, effectively, your Ice canceled out the healing effect of the light, and then Ice + Wind prioritized Enfeebling.

That's how I understand it anyway.

Do a test if you'd like. Have something like Light + Wind + Wind and a Cure will "win" (if your HP is the correct % and the mob's HP isn't too low to ignore Maneuvers).

Then do Light + Ice. Puppet should Nuke no matter anyone's HP.

Then do Light + Ice (tells to Nuke) + Wind (tells to Enfeeble). Puppet should Enfeeble no matter HP again, and I THINK that Wind will even make the Puppet Enfeeble below 50% (mob hpp) but above the "nuke threshold".

Those are my thoughts on the matter. Test/refute them if you'd like. My computer hates FFXI right now so I can't... :(


they absolutely do. dark/dark/ice will give you blind. dark/ice/dark will give you bio2.
#15 Apr 14 2010 at 11:42 PM Rating: Good
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Sorry, Asashino. That was directed at someone else for saying "how long have you been playing pup". Either way, go play with it a bit to see what I'm talking about. Don't knock it till you try it!
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Selka - Bismarck server
#16 Apr 15 2010 at 1:39 AM Rating: Decent
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i remember before i had soulsoother that stormwaker would sometimes fluke up and randomly leave me for dead even though all i had up was a light and would cast an enfeeble. but i was never able to force it to happen even with the exact same situation. it was a really rare fluke for me that costed me xp
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