Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

Cor MeritsFollow

#1 Apr 16 2011 at 1:10 PM Rating: Good
**
344 posts
Ok, so I looked back through 4 pages of this forum - and nothing, so here I go:

What merits did everyone go for for COR?
Is it kind of "This is the standard" as it is with PUP,
Or is it a little more free reign?

Currently I'm thinking

5/5 QD Recast/acc

then.... no freaking idea for group 2...
____________________________
Ashoka-Phoenix
90 BLU, PUP, DNC, THF, COR & BRD.... yes, I finally finished BRD to 90....

I once ate the soul of a MNK
It tasted like chocolate.
#2 Apr 16 2011 at 2:20 PM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
**
256 posts
AshokaPrime wrote:
Ok, so I looked back through 4 pages of this forum - and nothing, so here I go:

What merits did everyone go for for COR?
Is it kind of "This is the standard" as it is with PUP,
Or is it a little more free reign?

Currently I'm thinking

5/5 QD Recast/acc

then.... no freaking idea for group 2...



Group 2: Snake eye 5/5 is a must, put at least one merit in Loaded deck is a good choice, rest is either fold 4 or fold1+winning streak 3.

I do snake eye 5/5 Loaded deck 1/5 Fold 1/5 and Winning streak 3/5. Have winning streak means my roll stays 1min+ longer, and I can spend less time doing PR, and do more dmg for the pt overall(doing PR and all the double-up+ running around can consume quite a lot of time). Plus with 5 min Snake eye, I land on good number most of the time whenever I need to roll, so multiple fold merit isn't that necessary IMO.

I suppose multiple fold merit is good if you absolutely need to land a good buff, usually defensive buffs like magus/evokers. But that doesn't happen very often. Unless the XI bouns coming this June is truly amazing, and worth spending extra time and sacrifice all the DPS to go for it, I'll just stay Fold 1/5 for now.


For Group 1: QD recast 5/5 is a must have, then rest is either PR recast or QD acc depending on how you play.
#3 Apr 16 2011 at 6:23 PM Rating: Excellent
**
504 posts
I have the same group one. Group two I maxed Snake eye out. I find it useful once per roll cycle to get rid of a bad number. I use it all the time. 1/5 fold because i always double-up a six from a six. 1/5 loaded deck, very useful to have random deal target abilities actually waiting on recast. Then i did 3/5 on winning streak for an extra minute to my buffs. It lets me DD a little more without worrying about buffs getting out of order.
____________________________

?(O.@)/
#4 Apr 16 2011 at 6:31 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
358 posts
Afania wrote:
AshokaPrime wrote:
Ok, so I looked back through 4 pages of this forum - and nothing, so here I go:

What merits did everyone go for for COR?
Is it kind of "This is the standard" as it is with PUP,
Or is it a little more free reign?

Currently I'm thinking

5/5 QD Recast/acc

then.... no freaking idea for group 2...



Group 2: Snake eye 5/5 is a must, put at least one merit in Loaded deck is a good choice, rest is either fold 4 or fold1+winning streak 3.

I do snake eye 5/5 Loaded deck 1/5 Fold 1/5 and Winning streak 3/5. Have winning streak means my roll stays 1min+ longer, and I can spend less time doing PR, and do more dmg for the pt overall(doing PR and all the double-up+ running around can consume quite a lot of time). Plus with 5 min Snake eye, I land on good number most of the time whenever I need to roll, so multiple fold merit isn't that necessary IMO.

I suppose multiple fold merit is good if you absolutely need to land a good buff, usually defensive buffs like magus/evokers. But that doesn't happen very often. Unless the XI bouns coming this June is truly amazing, and worth spending extra time and sacrifice all the DPS to go for it, I'll just stay Fold 1/5 for now.


For Group 1: QD recast 5/5 is a must have, then rest is either PR recast or QD acc depending on how you play.


I have the exact same merits, exacts same mentality...freaky stuff!

Edit Kodos to creapercorsair too.

Edited, Apr 16th 2011 8:33pm by AshMulder

Edited, Apr 16th 2011 8:33pm by AshMulder
____________________________
Drk90
spelunker hat 0/3
#5 Apr 16 2011 at 10:05 PM Rating: Good
**
344 posts
Alright :D
Pretty much the same thing I was thinking, but as I haven't been playing COR as long as I have BLU or PUP, I just wanted to see if I was heading in the right direction :D

Thanks
____________________________
Ashoka-Phoenix
90 BLU, PUP, DNC, THF, COR & BRD.... yes, I finally finished BRD to 90....

I once ate the soul of a MNK
It tasted like chocolate.
#6 Apr 17 2011 at 12:13 AM Rating: Decent
Jack of All Trades
******
29,183 posts
Went 5/5 Snake Eye and Fold.

Random Deal is still lolrandom (besides, in Abyssea, CORs can afford to throw out Wild Cards willy-nilly if they felt like it; Random Deal practically becomes an afterthought), and Phantom Rolls already last so long (compared to a certain other AoE buffing job) that I saw no real need to make them last longer.
#7 Apr 18 2011 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Afania wrote:
Group 2: Snake eye 5/5 is a must, put at least one merit in Loaded deck is a good choice, rest is either fold 4 or fold1+winning streak 3.


Absolutely the standard thinking ^^

I personally used to be 4 Fold, 0 Winning Streak, 1 Loaded Deck for 75COR. I just changed to 1 Fold, 3 Winning Streak, 1 Loaded Deck recently (just put the 3rd Winning Streak merit on last night, in fact).

My biggest reason is that these days I simply never get into the same precise rhythm I once did with 75cap COR activities. Now if I'm in Abyssea it's much more random and I don't have a precise 3-4 roll cycle. I might be a little lazier with timers while just rolling 3 DD rolls, or sticking Chaos + ??? on the DDs and maybe dropping Tactician's or Blitzer's on just myself away from the group. It's just not the same as that feeling I had back in an old style exp/merit party where I could tell just by an internal timer in my brain when to roll that next roll in my cycle exactly when needed.

In dominion ops parties, people are running back and forth so much from the book, or fighting different mobs, so you might miss people more often. Longer buff duration means less chance people are fighting without 2 active rolls because you missed them. For NMs, you might have people running around and not really sticking together (maybe staying back far out of range of AoE until getting TP, then moving in to WS). Nice to do something like stick Tacticians on all the people you can and have an extra 1min active if it's hard to hit them all together the next time.

Quote:
I suppose multiple fold merit is good if you absolutely need to land a good buff, usually defensive buffs like magus/evokers. But that doesn't happen very often. Unless the XI bouns coming this June is truly amazing, and worth spending extra time and sacrifice all the DPS to go for it, I'll just stay Fold 1/5 for now.


On the flip side, if the XI bonus is truly amazing, Winning Streak merits means you get extra time to take advantage of that bonus every time you do hit an XI. I'd rather be able to Fold less, and enjoy the benefits longer when I get an XI.

Besides, Fold is also limited by Phantom Roll timers (and Random Deal). When you Fold, you're spending a lot of time re-rolling and doubling up. If Random Deal is up you can re-roll immediately, but if it's not (or if it resets a different ability) you also have to wait for PR to be ready to use again.

Quote:
For Group 1: QD recast 5/5 is a must have, then rest is either PR recast or QD acc depending on how you play.


Honestly, I'd probably drop 5/5 QD Accuracy (how often do you REALLY have QD accuracy issues?) and pair QD Recast with Random Deal merits if RD merits were better than the lame -40 seconds per merit on a 20min JA. Say, -2min per merit making 5/5 Random Deal a 10min recast.
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#8 Apr 18 2011 at 8:28 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
**
256 posts
Anza wrote:

Honestly, I'd probably drop 5/5 QD Accuracy (how often do you REALLY have QD accuracy issues?) and pair QD Recast with Random Deal merits if RD merits were better than the lame -40 seconds per merit on a 20min JA. Say, -2min per merit making 5/5 Random Deal a 10min recast.



I have the same opinion towards QD Acc merit. Don't know why every NA COR merit QD acc and flame those who doesn't have. I personally don't have QD acc 5/5, and I don't feel my QD acc is lower than my friend with 5/5 either. Although I put the merit in PR recast instead of Random Deal. Being able to get buffs back up sooner when bust/fold/doing roll rotation is just awesome.
#9 Apr 19 2011 at 8:33 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
***
3,917 posts
Quote:
I have the same opinion towards QD Acc merit. Don't know why every NA COR merit QD acc and flame those who doesn't have.


Because capped accuracy is one of the most important aspects to any damage dealing ability. One resist will outdo the advantage a any amount of attack you have.
That being said, since we don't know what our actual QDACC is at any given time, its real hard to know when you are capped and extra QDACC is pointless.
I do notice with my gear setup that I am capped for lower tier NM's around Vanadiel. For higher tier NM's in Abyssea and elsewhere, I do get resists not infrequently. Whether I could overcome that or not is hard to know. It maybe those NM's have a far to high MDB for me to ever overcome and I'm wasting time boosting MACC and MAB.
But I seem to think that QDACC must have some value if SE is stuffing COR gear with MACC stats. SE isn't always rational in their design choices (see Hexagun), but they usually don't remain consistent with these stats if there is no reason for it.
____________________________
Mirabelle
Race: Mithra
Server: Ifrit
75COR/75RDM/75RNG/45THF/37BLM/38WHM/37NIN/37DRK/41BLU/37DNC/37SAM/37WAR/37SCH
#10 Apr 19 2011 at 3:00 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
**
256 posts
Dartagnann wrote:
Quote:
I have the same opinion towards QD Acc merit. Don't know why every NA COR merit QD acc and flame those who doesn't have.


Because capped accuracy is one of the most important aspects to any damage dealing ability. One resist will outdo the advantage a any amount of attack you have.
That being said, since we don't know what our actual QDACC is at any given time, its real hard to know when you are capped and extra QDACC is pointless.
I do notice with my gear setup that I am capped for lower tier NM's around Vanadiel. For higher tier NM's in Abyssea and elsewhere, I do get resists not infrequently. Whether I could overcome that or not is hard to know. It maybe those NM's have a far to high MDB for me to ever overcome and I'm wasting time boosting MACC and MAB.
But I seem to think that QDACC must have some value if SE is stuffing COR gear with MACC stats. SE isn't always rational in their design choices (see Hexagun), but they usually don't remain consistent with these stats if there is no reason for it.


Are there any test result that actually shows the % of resist rate between QD acc 0/5 and QD acc 5/5?

Because right now we're just guessing and not having the exact %.

If the % difference is small, isn't PR recast merit suppose to add more DPS to your total dmg due to lower roll recast time?

I mean back at 75 cap pink bird merit pt, I always do 4 roll rotation, and not having chaos roll on me lose about 300 WS dmg. Having PR recast merit means I can get my chaos roll back on me 10~20 sec faster. If I WS once or twice every 10~20 sec, I kinda lose 300~600 WS dmg everytime I do rolls for other ppl, and 300~600 dmg is much higher than average QD dmg you're losing by getting resist outside of abyssea. And if I hold my TP to wait until chaos roll back up, I lose even more DPS by doing less WS over the long run.

Inside abyssea is the same, the rolls that benefits me are regain/wizards if I'm spamming WF. So even if the mages no longer need evokers, I still have to do other rolls for other DDs. And not having roll that benefits me on myself seems to lose way more DPS than occasional(maybe?) QD resist, which I don't even know the exact %. Of course some ppl may argue "god **** it just don't do chaos/fighters for other DDs they don't need it" But if you have 4 other DDs in your pt, and each got 1% dmg increase from chaos/fighters, will it outperform only 1 person getting DD buffs as well? Either way I just don't believe that QD acc merit 5/5 will give more DPS for entire pt than PR recast merit unless I see the numbers and math.

My light/dark shot rarely got resist as well unless the mob can't be slept, sometimes I don't have time to gear swap when I sleep the mob and light shot still lands in little to no AGI gears. So the whole point of QD acc merit is really just QD dmg against NMs, which has no concrete test result(unless someone already done it) to show how effective it is and how much DPS it gained overall. Not to mention the dmg from QD is really very small % of your overall dmg especially outside of abyssea and NMs outside, and it doesn't seem to be worth going for considering how long recast QD is. It's unlike BLM, magic dmg is main form of dmg a BLM can do, so getting resist as low as possible from merit for them is important. But for COR, unless you're soloing, the main dmg usually came from WS, which is boosted by rolls but not QD acc merit. Isn't QD acc merit worth sacrificing for other stuff that gives more WS dmg instead?

Edited, Apr 19th 2011 5:01pm by Afania

Edited, Apr 19th 2011 5:09pm by Afania
#11 Apr 25 2011 at 12:13 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Dartagnann wrote:
But I seem to think that QDACC must have some value if SE is stuffing COR gear with MACC stats. SE isn't always rational in their design choices (see Hexagun), but they usually don't remain consistent with these stats if there is no reason for it.


Our original AF set is another great example of WTF design choices, with Corsair's Gants (MND+2???)and Culottes (INT+2).

But to your main point - while I agree that it's obvious that there is some value to M.Acc (and AGI) for QD Accuracy, and S-E putting large amounts of it on so much of our gear is certainly a clear statement that they believe it is there with reason, that very act of S-E "stuffing COR gear with MACC" stats is a further reason that QD Acc merits are less valuable now than ever. Schutzen Mittens, Aquiline Belt, Navarch's Bottes +1/+2, Forban Cape, AF+1 hat... these are all nice QD pieces even without the AGI/M.Acc, but they come with large amounts of AGI/M.Acc too.

Since we do now have so many options giving us overkill on AGI/M.Acc, merits become comparatively less valuable (possibly contributing no value at all) than they were back at 75cap with less AGI/M.Acc in the typical COR QD set. It's like someone capped on melee Acc continuing to use Acc gear - it's not helping any more, you're capped.

The reason I still have 5/5 QD Acc is:
1) Just to be sure, for some big bad HNMs or future content.
2) I'm not convinced by the other alternatives.
- Bust duration is a terrible merit. Snake Eye and Fold should take care of your busting issues already.
- Random Deal is a useful JA (Fold, RD, redo Phantom Roll instantly. Or QDx2, RD, QDx2 again.), but the merit is pretty weak at 40sec/merit reduction on a 20min ability. If there was a greater timer reduction per merit (2min per merit sounds about right to me) I might go for it.
- PR recast probably IS the best alternative, but I'm just not convinced I need it. Same as the argument we all had back when Desultor Tassets came out. I dunno though, I'm giving a little thought to doing PR Recast 5/5 instead of QD Acc. Haven't quite convinced myself yet though.

Edited, Apr 25th 2011 2:23pm by Anza
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#12 Apr 25 2011 at 12:30 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
256 posts
Anza wrote:

The reason I still have 5/5 QD Acc is:
1) Just to be sure, for some big bad HNMs or future content.

Edited, Apr 25th 2011 2:23pm by Anza



IF some big bad HNMs in future content requires to use QD as main form of dmg, then maybe I'd do QD acc 5/5.One example is when vision abyssea came out, ppl kill Ovni by a bunch of CORs spamming QD and kiting, I almost wanted to do QD acc 5/5 just for it.

But if not, then it may still not making much difference tbh. QD dmg outside of abyssea is never good enough considering how long the JA recast time is, so I rarely rely on QD dmg anyways(I don't solo)

Edited, Apr 27th 2011 2:05pm by Afania
#13 Aug 03 2011 at 6:00 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
1,054 posts
Thinking of dropping random deal as a merit and moving to 4/5 winning streak. My reasoning is that random seems to only reset phantom roll, which was fine (I used after fold to reroll immediately) until I merited PR recast. And now the new function of XI rolls, you can pretty much hit PR as quickly as you would need to (20s).

Feedback?
Unless I'm messing up the way Loaded Deck is supposed to be used.
____________________________
Quote:
You can't transform numbers into other numbers like that. It'd just go on forever. That's like witchcraft.


There's one guy I know who
Quote:
is a big deal now.
Necro Warning: This post occurred more than thirty days after the prior, and may be a necropost.
#14 Aug 03 2011 at 7:31 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
256 posts
doctorugh wrote:
Thinking of dropping random deal as a merit and moving to 4/5 winning streak. My reasoning is that random seems to only reset phantom roll, which was fine (I used after fold to reroll immediately) until I merited PR recast. And now the new function of XI rolls, you can pretty much hit PR as quickly as you would need to (20s).

Feedback?
Unless I'm messing up the way Loaded Deck is supposed to be used.



I thought Random deal merit is in different group from Winning streak? Or you're talking about Loaded Deck merit?

Random deal still resets something else from what I've seen, I've got it reset QD and meditate before.
#15 Aug 04 2011 at 4:27 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Afania wrote:
Random deal still resets something else from what I've seen, I've got it reset QD and meditate before.


Yep, it certainly resets QD. I have used it very often to get 2 more QD charges - particularly in situations where I need QD to sleep/dispel something. Probably true that RD is going to be used less to reset PR these days with the XI changes though. The common older situation of busting then using Fold/RD to reroll right away just isn't going to come up as much.

And to revisit this whole topic, since the XI changes happened after this discussion began and they really do change things:

For group 1 merits, it's much more viable now to put merits into PR Recast instead of QD Accuracy. Although you're working with a lower PR timer if you have an XI up, 30 seconds still doesn't allow you to instantly re-roll after a bust. But reducing that by 10 more seconds? VERY useful. I've switched my own setup to 5/5 QD Recast and 5/5 PR recast, plus I use PR-5 augmented Desultor Tassets. I LOVE this change, since I can almost always instantly redo a roll after busting with an XI up. I spend more seconds waiting on double-up than I do waiting for PR to be active. It's really nice since you can put any rolls you want on any party members, bust a roll and redo it for people who missed it, etc.

For group 2 merits, Fold has taken a hit at the same time Winning Streak has become more useful. 1 merit into Fold can still be a nice thing to have available, but reducing the recast further doesn't provide as much use as before since when you do have an XI up, a busted roll doesn't hurt anything. On the other hand, Winning Streak is great since you can keep an XI up as your first roll for a longer time, and simply continue to bust your 2nd roll. Also means if there's a much easier chance of getting all your rolls as XI/lucky, and once you have that good roll your party members keep it for longer. It's not that hard now to do something like put two different XI rolls on multiple groups of people.
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#16 Aug 04 2011 at 8:38 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
**
256 posts
Anza wrote:
Afania wrote:
Random deal still resets something else from what I've seen, I've got it reset QD and meditate before.


Yep, it certainly resets QD. I have used it very often to get 2 more QD charges - particularly in situations where I need QD to sleep/dispel something. Probably true that RD is going to be used less to reset PR these days with the XI changes though. The common older situation of busting then using Fold/RD to reroll right away just isn't going to come up as much.

And to revisit this whole topic, since the XI changes happened after this discussion began and they really do change things:

For group 1 merits, it's much more viable now to put merits into PR Recast instead of QD Accuracy. Although you're working with a lower PR timer if you have an XI up, 30 seconds still doesn't allow you to instantly re-roll after a bust. But reducing that by 10 more seconds? VERY useful. I've switched my own setup to 5/5 QD Recast and 5/5 PR recast, plus I use PR-5 augmented Desultor Tassets. I LOVE this change, since I can almost always instantly redo a roll after busting with an XI up. I spend more seconds waiting on double-up than I do waiting for PR to be active. It's really nice since you can put any rolls you want on any party members, bust a roll and redo it for people who missed it, etc.

For group 2 merits, Fold has taken a hit at the same time Winning Streak has become more useful. 1 merit into Fold can still be a nice thing to have available, but reducing the recast further doesn't provide as much use as before since when you do have an XI up, a busted roll doesn't hurt anything. On the other hand, Winning Streak is great since you can keep an XI up as your first roll for a longer time, and simply continue to bust your 2nd roll. Also means if there's a much easier chance of getting all your rolls as XI/lucky, and once you have that good roll your party members keep it for longer. It's not that hard now to do something like put two different XI rolls on multiple groups of people.



QD acc isn't THAT good even at 75 era unless you heavily rely on QD dmg to do stuff(such as solo), otherwise I have no problem landing QD when necessary without putting merit in it even at 75.

I'm never the big fan of Fold 4/5 ever since 75 era too, but that's due to the fact that I mostly use COR in merit pt and want DD buffs stay on myself as long as possible. Fold 4/5 does have it's advantage though, but I'd rather to have DD buff on myself longer ._.

Most of the JP guide I've read years ago also suggested Snake eye 5/5 Fold 1/5 Winning streak 3/5 and loaded deck 1/5, and PR recast over QD acc even at 75(QD recast is a must have though).



Edited, Aug 4th 2011 10:38pm by Afania
#17 Aug 05 2011 at 7:55 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
3,917 posts
Just did a test with a change in Cat 1 merits to 4/5 PR recast and kept 1/5 in QD Acc because I had only ten merits to burn.

Anyways, at that reduction in PR timer, with an XI up I was pretty much able to bust and roll continuously. Remember, that if you are following the strategy outlined by Anza and others, you are going to be moving out of rolling range to bust the unwanted roll off your character. That simple act will chew up the few seconds you need to get back into position and roll again.

So 5/5 PR recast and desultor tassets seem a bit overkill necessity wise. I wonder if we can get away with just 3/5 PR recast and keep a couple merits in QD Acc as a safety net.

I also found that Fold merits become relatively useless once you get that first XI. Of course if you have trouble getting that XI, they are useful right off the bat. But I think I might take 1 of my Fold merits away and add to Winning Streak.

Of course this all makes great sense if I'm just in a role of a buffer in a static positioned party. If we are moving all over the zone, its a bit more complicated. Or even worse zoning frequently. But i don't think that will come up too often.

Now I just need SE to overpower XI's and Lucky numbers and I might get some invites again as COR.
____________________________
Mirabelle
Race: Mithra
Server: Ifrit
75COR/75RDM/75RNG/45THF/37BLM/38WHM/37NIN/37DRK/41BLU/37DNC/37SAM/37WAR/37SCH
#18 Aug 05 2011 at 10:00 AM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Afania wrote:
Most of the JP guide I've read years ago also suggested Snake eye 5/5 Fold 1/5 Winning streak 3/5 and loaded deck 1/5, and PR recast over QD acc even at 75(QD recast is a must have though).


Yep, this is my setup now.

I've always been 5/5 Snake Eye, 1/5 Fold, 1/5 Loaded Deck, 3/5 Winning Streak - was always somewhat debatable before, but that setup has certainly become stronger with these changes. I guess you could debate whether 1/5 Loaded Deck is even that useful, and maybe stick that merit into Winning Streak or Fold as well. I'd rather just keep it.[/quote]

Dartagnann wrote:
So 5/5 PR recast and desultor tassets seem a bit overkill necessity wise. I wonder if we can get away with just 3/5 PR recast and keep a couple merits in QD Acc as a safety net.


I think you're right that it is a arguably a bit overkill once you're already operating on base 30 second recast before merits/gear. If you didn't have the -5 on Desultor, all 10 seconds of 5/5 merits is still pretty handy.

But a couple considerations...

1) Sometimes you don't have an XI up yet, so you don't yet have that short timer. That's a BIG reason to want every second you can get on lower PR recast - so you can get that held XI. You might be just starting to buff, maybe you got killed by AoE, maybe you got dispelled by some move, screwed up a timer or reset a roll leaving yourself without an XI, etc. Maybe you just cycle buffs normally as soon as PR is ready until you can get that needed first XI, in which case every second of recast reduction helps.

2) Sometimes you won't actually need to run away to bust on yourself only. Maybe you're doing a roll on yourself only to begin with, or buffing an idle group waiting for buffs (in which case you may be able to simply bust on everyone and just redo it immediately until you hit XI). In that case, you do get some benefit from the even lower recast.

FWIW, I redid my Desultor Tassets since my old ones were now useless (haste+3%/acc+7). I wanted to make a unique macro piece that wouldn't be replicated, so I chose Repair +10% for my PUP and PR Recast for COR. I know you could still make a very nice QD piece, but there are other good QD options like Denali, Navarch +1/+2, Nimue's Tights, etc. Besides, I think my eventual ideal QD build (with today's gear) would use +2 legs/feet for the set bonus anyway, and stick to Mirke (QD Recast), AF+1 head, and Schutzen Mittens for the other slots.

Edited, Aug 5th 2011 12:04pm by Anza
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#19 Aug 06 2011 at 10:33 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
**
256 posts
Anza wrote:

FWIW, I redid my Desultor Tassets since my old ones were now useless (haste+3%/acc+7). I wanted to make a unique macro piece that wouldn't be replicated, so I chose Repair +10% for my PUP and PR Recast for COR. I know you could still make a very nice QD piece, but there are other good QD options like Denali, Navarch +1/+2, Nimue's Tights, etc. Besides, I think my eventual ideal QD build (with today's gear) would use +2 legs/feet for the set bonus anyway, and stick to Mirke (QD Recast), AF+1 head, and Schutzen Mittens for the other slots.

Edited, Aug 5th 2011 12:04pm by Anza



If you're having more than 90% TP or even 100TP+, then hands+2/feets+2/MAB+4 pants is better than Schutzen Mitten/Feets+2/legs+2, since you don't need that extra TP and can get dmg a bit higher with 4 more MAB.


However you're right that Nimue's Tights also has MAB+4, so putting MAB+4 on Desultor Tassets is really just inventory -1.
#20 Aug 06 2011 at 1:06 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Afania wrote:
If you're having more than 90% TP or even 100TP+, then hands+2/feets+2/MAB+4 pants is better than Schutzen Mitten/Feets+2/legs+2, since you don't need that extra TP and can get dmg a bit higher with 4 more MAB.

However you're right that Nimue's Tights also has MAB+4, so putting MAB+4 on Desultor Tassets is really just inventory -1.


I see the argument for Navarch hands vs. Schutzen, but...

1) I do QD at low TP sometimes - a significant enough amount that a lot of my QDs DO benefit from the extra TP from Schutzen (not to mention the healthy chunk of Store TP from Schutzen/Nav+2 legs). I guess you could make separate "high TP" and "low TP" QD macros with different gear to get ideal results, but that's pretty burdensome.

2) Nav+2 hands do absolutely nothing for QD other than as a piece to get set bonus, but Nav+2 legs are pretty nice for QD with AGI+8 and Store TP+8. Especially considering that I dropped 5 QD Acc merits, I'm kind of OK giving with that trade-off. You do lose some MAB, but gain a lot of Macc/AGI and Store TP/bonus TP from the combination of Schutzen/Nav+2 legs.

I think either choice is reasonable, and you're not going to have a world of difference in either setup. But I'm personally a bit more comfortable with the Navarch legs/feet combo, and keep Schutzen on my hands. In any case, QD recast Mirke, Navarch +2 feet, and AF+1 hat are non-negotiable for me.
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#21 Aug 06 2011 at 3:24 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
256 posts
Anza wrote:
Afania wrote:
If you're having more than 90% TP or even 100TP+, then hands+2/feets+2/MAB+4 pants is better than Schutzen Mitten/Feets+2/legs+2, since you don't need that extra TP and can get dmg a bit higher with 4 more MAB.

However you're right that Nimue's Tights also has MAB+4, so putting MAB+4 on Desultor Tassets is really just inventory -1.


I see the argument for Navarch hands vs. Schutzen, but...

1) I do QD at low TP sometimes - a significant enough amount that a lot of my QDs DO benefit from the extra TP from Schutzen (not to mention the healthy chunk of Store TP from Schutzen/Nav+2 legs). I guess you could make separate "high TP" and "low TP" QD macros with different gear to get ideal results, but that's pretty burdensome.



Oh, what I mean is to have 2 QD sets to begin with, although it can also be pretty annoying to have 2 different sets if you don't use script macros XD, especially when it's not gonna make a very big difference for that much gear swap effort XD.





#22 Aug 07 2011 at 11:02 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
3,917 posts
Quote:
1) Sometimes you don't have an XI up yet, so you don't yet have that short timer. That's a BIG reason to want every second you can get on lower PR recast - so you can get that held XI. You might be just starting to buff, maybe you got killed by AoE, maybe you got dispelled by some move, screwed up a timer or reset a roll leaving yourself without an XI, etc. Maybe you just cycle buffs normally as soon as PR is ready until you can get that needed first XI, in which case every second of recast reduction helps.

2) Sometimes you won't actually need to run away to bust on yourself only. Maybe you're doing a roll on yourself only to begin with, or buffing an idle group waiting for buffs (in which case you may be able to simply bust on everyone and just redo it immediately until you hit XI). In that case, you do get some benefit from the even lower recast.


Even still, without moving, by the time you roll enough to bust, you are pretty much ready to go again. Even without an Xi, the only time I really was sitting on PR recast was when I busted double VI's.

I guess it's nice to always "be prepared" but I could just as easily come up with a rare scenario where a mob was just evasive enough to not be slept by QD without that one merit in it. Or another scenario where you've used your fold and really need it but it's 2:30 away and you don't have that extra merit in it. Sadly compromises must be made in merits and you can't cover every scenario. If I ever finish ASA, I'm going to get pants for a different job than COR. I'm not needing a ton of PR recast at this point with 4/5 merits.
____________________________
Mirabelle
Race: Mithra
Server: Ifrit
75COR/75RDM/75RNG/45THF/37BLM/38WHM/37NIN/37DRK/41BLU/37DNC/37SAM/37WAR/37SCH
#23 Aug 08 2011 at 9:58 AM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
Dartagnann wrote:
Even still, without moving, by the time you roll enough to bust, you are pretty much ready to go again. Even without an Xi, the only time I really was sitting on PR recast was when I busted double VI's.


I still think the biggest benefit is in whittling the PR timer down further while you're still working on that initial XI and don't yet have the 30 second recast reduction that comes with an XI. And that's a scenario that does come up every time I play COR. Plus, that -5 recast on legs is equal to 2.5 merits worth of PR recast, so maybe having the legs provides you a timer you're comfortable enough with that you keep some/all merits in QD Accuracy as opposed to PR recast.

If you have a better use of ASA legs though, perhaps it's worth it. I didn't really have any other augments that impressed me much though, other than Repair+10% as a unique PUP macro piece or possibly Waltz TP cost -5. Out of those three, I went PUP and COR.
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#24 Aug 14 2011 at 9:05 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
3,917 posts
Interestingly I'm a bit concerned about about abandoning my QD Acc merits.

Finally got around to finishing my VNM trials for Armageddon. Did 4 Yacu's, 6 Feuerenkes and 6 Tammuz last night with a group. I noticed that my QD resist rate on these tier II VNM's was a lot higher than I'm used to. I know that even with capped QD acc there is a static resist rate but it was definitely higher than 5%. If at 90 on only modestly difficult NM's I'm seeing higher resists, maybe QD ACC isn't as naturally high as we all seem to think.
____________________________
Mirabelle
Race: Mithra
Server: Ifrit
75COR/75RDM/75RNG/45THF/37BLM/38WHM/37NIN/37DRK/41BLU/37DNC/37SAM/37WAR/37SCH
#25 Aug 14 2011 at 2:39 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
256 posts
Dartagnann wrote:
Interestingly I'm a bit concerned about about abandoning my QD Acc merits.

Finally got around to finishing my VNM trials for Armageddon. Did 4 Yacu's, 6 Feuerenkes and 6 Tammuz last night with a group. I noticed that my QD resist rate on these tier II VNM's was a lot higher than I'm used to. I know that even with capped QD acc there is a static resist rate but it was definitely higher than 5%. If at 90 on only modestly difficult NM's I'm seeing higher resists, maybe QD ACC isn't as naturally high as we all seem to think.



Have you done same NM before you lower your merit? Maybe those NMs just resist magic more?

I think Feuerenkes takes slightly less dmg from QD during certain mode,......but I'm can't remember, haven't done it for ages.

I never notice any significant resist on VWNM, and they're currently highest lv NM in this game. Hardly notice any resist on Abyssea NM either. In fact I feel my WF got resist more sometimes ._., I think I've seen half dmg WF more often than half dmg QD ._.
#26 Aug 15 2011 at 2:37 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
2,869 posts
As I've been playing more COR lately since swapping my 5/5 QD Acc for 5/5 Phantom Roll recast, I can confidently state that I'm very happy with my decision.

If you want to hit an XI for super fast recast and no busts, the biggest issue is getting that FIRST XI while you're still dealing with the full PR timer and you still need to be wary of busting. Well, with 45 sec recast thanks to 5/5 merits and Desultor Tassets, that's a big deal on being able to keep rolling a cycle to hit that initial XI. Once you do hit the XI, it's a luxury that if you're shooting high and you bust, PR will always be ready nearly instantly to simply roll again and aim for a good roll without waiting. And if you end up losing an active XI at some point, you'll need to go back to standard PR timer so the lowered recast is useful again.

As for QD Acc, I will admit to not doing a ton of Voidwatch, but I haven't run into any QD acc issues so far. I just think I was working with a bit of overkill on the M.Acc front, especially with a lot of extra insurance from gear that you'd want to use in any case for QD: Nav+2 boots (10 Macc/13 AGI! That's just insanity), Aquiline Belt, Forban Cape, Nav+2 or Denali legs, Schutzen Mittens, etc.
____________________________
Anza: Titan 2004-2011 / Capuchin: Phoenix 2011-???
#27 Aug 16 2011 at 9:36 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
3,917 posts
Maybe it was just a fluky thing. Was in Aby tonite and only saw one resist from Amuhuluk and Ciren-croin over 6 fights. Of course in Aby I was rocking Ultimate atma so that adds a nice bit of MACC right there.
____________________________
Mirabelle
Race: Mithra
Server: Ifrit
75COR/75RDM/75RNG/45THF/37BLM/38WHM/37NIN/37DRK/41BLU/37DNC/37SAM/37WAR/37SCH
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 18 All times are in CDT
Anonymous Guests (18)