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#1 Apr 21 2009 at 6:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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Dear expert CORs.

Please rank the following setups in terms of over all damage over time. For ammo costs, we'll pretend cost is no object. In all examples assume decently equipped "AH" CORs, and a Wal-mart turban for melee, except where specified.

Quote the following and put a "1" beside the best setup, a "2" beside the second best etc.


[ ]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ ]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ ]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ ]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ ]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.



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#2 Apr 21 2009 at 7:14 PM Rating: Good
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Sweet, now I don't have to make a new thread. I was going to ask about what is the best idea for me, from a pure DD/rolling position.

I have a joytoy, ohat/turban, and COR relic body. Otherwise It's all AH gear.
I won't be able to merit sword or marksmanship, because my combat merits are already planned/full for 8 Gsword, 8 h2h, and 4 shield for DRK, MNK, and PLD.

I was just hoping that shooting iron/steel bullets would be atleast equal or more damage over time than meleeing for TP with my joytoy. My ultimate goal would be to eat meat and shoot for TP, and spam detonator since it is not dependant on r.acc. If I melee for TP, I'm assuming I'll need sushi, which just isn't as powerful overall, so I was hoping using meat would balance things out.
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#3Spikido of the Seven Seas, Posted: Apr 21 2009 at 8:56 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) [0.5Smiley: rolleyes ]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
#4 Apr 22 2009 at 12:49 AM Rating: Good
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Excerpt go!

Carrilei wrote:
I do think it's possible for the MK to put out more damage than Joyeuse, but I don't think it means that it's a better weapon. In situations where mobs are dropping at a merit-like pace, MK has the better chance to get off a weaponskill during every fight - however, if you're weaponskilling whenever you have 100 TP with MK, you're going to have substancially more 'empty' damage than with Joy. "Empty" meaning more damage than is needed to kill the mob - it's particularly relevent here with the single-hit Slug Shot and Detonator. It's damage that looks pretty - it'll show up on the screen/parsers, but it's misleading in terms of meaningful performance.


As far as ranged TP, the damage won't eclipse multi-hit melee TP, so is best reserved for dealing physical damage when you don't want to be in melee range. Great for missions (Airship, or this new final ACP fight), certain HNMs like Ixion/Odin, etc. It's really rather incredible how flexible we are in terms of our talents - precious few can sit back and /ra for impactful damage when being in AoE is a death sentence.

Anyway, I guess I'll fill these out :P

[ 3 ]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ 4 ]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ 1 ]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ 2 ]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[ 5 ]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.

Meleeing for TP with single-hit is still acceptable, though.
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#5 Apr 22 2009 at 2:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Those options have "Slug with steel bullets" in the end. Redundant and impolite.

</joke>, in case your sarcasm detector is broken.
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#6 Apr 22 2009 at 5:33 AM Rating: Decent
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[4 ]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[5 ]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[1 ]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2 ]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[3 ]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.

I think meleeing with a strong single hit dagger is reasonable if 1) you obtain haste gear (swift belt, W turban, dusk) and 2) dagger merits. Otherwise it drops from 3 to 4 for me.

Personally before I got Joyeuse I used Jambiya and mixed up shooting and swinging. It was acceptable but Joyeuse is superior in TP gain and rate of WS use.
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#7 Apr 22 2009 at 7:33 AM Rating: Decent
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PriestoftheVoid wrote:
do my bidding!

[1]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[X]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[X]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.

To me /RA can be used anytime great DPS and puts you well out of AoE.

Joy and MK are too close to call.

If you are using a non multi hit weapon to tp, why are you not shooting for TP? Like Alobont said:
"Don't You Dare Cheap Ass!" Iron bullets are a no no.

~Ath
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#8 Apr 22 2009 at 11:11 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
To me /RA can be used anytime great DPS and puts you well out of AoE.
Except for optimum damage, we need to be 5' away don't we? That is pretty much AoE range.
#9 Apr 22 2009 at 11:22 AM Rating: Decent
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Mjrna wrote:
Quote:
To me /RA can be used anytime great DPS and puts you well out of AoE.
Except for optimum damage, we need to be 5' away don't we? That is pretty much AoE range.

Question:
  • Melee and get slammed with AoE
  • /RA at optimum Range and get slammed with AoE
  • /RA out side of AoE

Which would you choose?

~Ath
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#10 Apr 22 2009 at 11:29 AM Rating: Decent
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I hate to answer a question with another question, but if you are out of optimum damage range, why bother using Steel Bullets at all? Wouldn't you want to get the most out of your purchase?
#11 Apr 22 2009 at 11:39 AM Rating: Excellent
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PriestoftheVoid wrote:
Dear expert CORs.

Please rank the following setups in terms of over all damage over time. For ammo costs, we'll pretend cost is no object. In all examples assume decently equipped "AH" CORs, and a Wal-mart turban for melee, except where specified.
^OP

DD contribution is better then doing nothing IMHO. Being able to fire safely from a distance is a great possitive for us COR.

~Ath
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#12 Apr 22 2009 at 11:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Well, my question was actually directed at you Viska ^_^ not the TC.

I would hate to think that I just spent 200k on Steel Bullets only to do Iron Bullet equivalent damage at 24.9' away. And it also was more of a "Why would you..." question instead of "This is why you should..." comment. ^_^
#13 Apr 22 2009 at 11:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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I don't understand. I see no reason not to use every tool at our disposal.

According to Wiki standing out of AoE range you lose a maximum of 15% efficiency. So why would you not contribute to the party in those situations? I know when my DD is effective that is what I do.

~Ath
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#14 Apr 22 2009 at 12:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
[1]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[X]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[X]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.


Couldn't agree much more with this. If cost is no concern, corsairs should bullet spam, IMO, and stick with Steel Bullets.

I wish my pockets were deep enough to play that way.
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#15 Apr 22 2009 at 4:43 PM Rating: Decent
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Dang. That's disappointing.

Honestly, I was hoping Iron Bullet shooting would be #2 as far as raw damage goes. I'm a big fan of the shooting aspect, but Steel is twice as expensive last time I checked. Melee COR just doesn't feel right. I always think lolmeleeCOR, and to think it's better dps than iron shooting TPing is kind of a letdown. =/
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#16 Apr 22 2009 at 9:00 PM Rating: Good
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I recently parsed my COR in a pt where I started /war with joyeuse, meleeing for tp with sole sushi, had Chaos, Fighters (meh I had 2 WARs in the pt and they requested it lol), plus a BRD doing march/madrigal. At some point, when my food got eaten, I switched to shooting for TP with steel bullets, pot-au-feu, everything else the same).

Obviously with the rolls/songs in play, it was set up to be better for meleeing. And the parse showed that much. I was sitting just over 21% meleeing (heh only SLIGHTLY behind an ebody WAR but comfortably behind a WAR without an ebody, strangely enough). Anyway, regardless of that, I slowly began to fall behind in the parse while shooting for TP.

This despite averaging 50+ per melee hit and maybe around 240ish per ranged attack. On paper, if you take the delay and dmg into account, it would appear shooting for TP would win out. It doesn't, or at least didn't in this case.

1) the songs were set up for meleeing. I didn't get prelude and didn't have hunters.

2) what I noticed was I was barely able to get 3 shots off per bird. The gun's delay was killing me. That and other ppl WSing and killing the bird before I could get my shot off.

Not saying this will always be the case. Maybe the other DDs somehow stepped their game up a bit or got some double attack WS or whatever. But TP gain slows up a ton. Ranged dmg beats out melee dmg but it seems like (at least on birds) you can't WS as frequently and at least for me, my WS is a big %age of my dmg.
#17 Apr 23 2009 at 12:25 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
This despite averaging 50+ per melee hit and maybe around 240ish per ranged attack. On paper, if you take the delay and dmg into account, it would appear shooting for TP would win out. It doesn't, or at least didn't in this case.


Im sorry, but writing something like that is like saying my GKT hits for 200dmg per hit, and my Mnk hits for 2 lots of 70 an attack round. My SAM is better than my Mnk.

To make a solid Ranged attack build, you need lots and lots of RATT. You can squeeze ~100 RACC in gear on cor, add that to Marksmanship merits 8/8, you can eat C Subs, and buff your RATT from things like Chaos, Minuets and Berzerk.

In colibiri camp, even shooting 3 times one mob, hopefully the next mob you'l be dropping a kick ass slugger taking 1.5K+ DMG from the colibri.

What would really make shooting a top contender however, IS, if you could somehow squeeze in precisely 20STP into our builds. 20sTP shooting with a coffinmaker, Corsair's gun or Martial gun would give us a 5 hit build.

WS - Shoot 4 times - WS.

The best I can come up with is Rajas + Skadi legs + Attilias earrings? = 13sTP (Rajas + Enkidu legs + Attilias = 11sTP). That would give 18.9 tp / per shot. IF there is a way of hitting 20STP whilst keeping our /rng /war DD Sub jobs, we could pwn using bullets.

The only other option I can think off is:



/SAM would give it. /sam using a Vulcans Staff, would mean Meditate every 3 mins would yield 60TP, 5STR on the Staff + Hasso would equal 5fSTR2. The Cor would have a 5HIT build, only stp needed to wear would be a Rajas Ring OR Skadi legs.

To shoot in merit camps like Colibiri, the right sj, amount of att, and gear is needed, but having a 5HIT Slug shot setup is kinda cool. An additional acc buff would more than likely be needed for this, but for Detonater spammers, /SAM 5HIT shooting for TP could be a good option.
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#18 Apr 23 2009 at 3:15 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:

What would really make shooting a top contender however, IS, if you could somehow squeeze in precisely 20STP into our builds. 20sTP shooting with a coffinmaker, Corsair's gun or Martial gun would give us a 5 hit build.


I love doing this with sam roll lol.
#19 Apr 23 2009 at 5:35 AM Rating: Decent
Admiral Viska wrote:
Like Alobont said:
"Don't You Dare Cheap Ass!" Iron bullets are a no no.

~Ath


Except I'm Spikido <.<!


:p lol
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#20 Apr 23 2009 at 9:08 AM Rating: Decent
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The delay kills you in merits for shooting for TP. No autoattack and the lack of ranged haste also sets shooting behind. I can barely squeeze off two shots when shooting at colibri camp. i found I gained TP much faster, shooting in melee range using a single hit dagger to maximize TP gain. Once I got joytoy, there was no question that I got TP faster just meleeing despite the lower TP/attack from SWD.

Until we get velocity shot, we are going to struggle with shooting for TP compared to meleeing for TP.
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#21 Apr 23 2009 at 10:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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Spikido of the Seven Seas wrote:
Admiral Viska wrote:
Like Alobont said:
"Don't You Dare Cheap Ass!" Iron bullets are a no no.

~Ath


Except I'm Spikido <.<!


:p lol

Sorry onry started using Forums about a month ago >.> I sneak in posts from work. Many Apologies Kind Sir Smiley: bowdown

To the rest: Meripo is only one event of the game and obviously 30 second fights are not in the favor of ranged attacks. Haste setups work exceptionally well there and we tailor everything to fit that need. Remember however most fights in this game are a lot longer then exploding pink birds.

Ath
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#22 Apr 23 2009 at 12:00 PM Rating: Good
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That's basically what I was saying. Shooting exclusively for TP on birds will actually slow you down unless you're in a pt that kills slowly. You wait so long for every shot that your TP gain is much much slower. Can't tell you how many times I had my shot all lined up and someone else would kill the bird before I could get my shot off. So you've already waited say 540 of your 600 delay. The next bird flies in and you've got... another 600 delay!

Haste doesn't apply to ranged attacks and unless you built your mirke to have snapshot, you have no way to reduce that delay. Even though 1 ranged attack KILLS even 2-3 melee attacks, the faster tp gain and ability to slug every 2nd bird instead of every 3rd bird will make joyeuse for TP more effective imo. On a longer fight where you can legitimately get more shots off, i'm sure shooting for TP would be better. Birds do not live long enough (in a good pt) to make it worthwhile. Even the boosted slugs weren't making up for the inability to gain tp as quickly.

#23 Apr 23 2009 at 3:59 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
To the rest: Meripo is only one event of the game and obviously 30 second fights are not in the favor of ranged attacks. Haste setups work exceptionally well there and we tailor everything to fit that need. Remember however most fights in this game are a lot longer then exploding pink birds.


Okay, well, here's the thing. I have a pretty decent (for a level 70 COR) ranged setup, I think. I have no melee setup at all, and no access to any haste gear in the foresable future aside from a walmart turban. But let's pretend I get a SH and other melee stuff from the AH. Assuming only 5% haste gear, is meleeing still better? Is it still better with no multi hit weapon?
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#24 Apr 23 2009 at 4:06 PM Rating: Good
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PriestoftheVoid wrote:
Quote:
To the rest: Meripo is only one event of the game and obviously 30 second fights are not in the favor of ranged attacks. Haste setups work exceptionally well there and we tailor everything to fit that need. Remember however most fights in this game are a lot longer then exploding pink birds.


Okay, well, here's the thing. I have a pretty decent (for a level 70 COR) ranged setup, I think. I have no melee setup at all, and no access to any haste gear in the foresable future aside from a walmart turban. But let's pretend I get a SH and other melee stuff from the AH. Assuming only 5% haste gear, is meleeing still better? Is it still better with no multi hit weapon?

Melee without a multi proc weapon will not outdo /RA. Sorry. My advise to you is to Take a break from leveling and Either Aquire MK or Joyeuse. It is time well spent.

ATH
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#25 Apr 23 2009 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
What Ath said ^^^




And besides... The job is a LOT more fun with a multi-hit weapon Smiley: chug
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#26 Apr 23 2009 at 7:28 PM Rating: Good
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Man, the more I read about COR the more I want to level it before I take PLD to 75. I already have BRD and DNC at 75 and COR would just fill another support role when I really should aim for doing a Tank/DD. Meh!

I have both Sword AND Dagger merits - so unless SE increases the cap (they hinted at this in an interview or "doing something to help these players" rather) I wouldn't be able to do Marksmanship.

Maybe I will level PLD and work on my smithing (Alchemy 100, 60GS) so I can pump out Steel when I finally get around too it.

I could afford an Mkris and already have a Joytoy.. sounds like I'd enjoy blasting stuff a lot.

Yarr, and rate up for all!
#27 Apr 24 2009 at 4:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Hmm, I think I'll stick to shooting for now. 5 levels of shooting is cheaper than a M.Kris, and I don't camp NMs.

Thanks for the help guys!
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#28 Apr 24 2009 at 5:46 PM Rating: Good
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[3]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[4]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[1]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[5]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.

I think w/o a decent multi hit weapon your tp gain would actually be worse than just plain shooting; damage wise prolly not much different than using iron ammo.

For NM or HNM

[1]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[3]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[4]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[5]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.

Some NM you can melee but most have scewered stats that will mostly likely cripple your accuracy and damage with a melee weapon. AoE damage is another factor but not a massive issue since you have to move in for rolls anyway.

And lol at shooting only in melee burn. Sounds like a waste of time burn party.
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#29 Apr 25 2009 at 8:02 AM Rating: Decent
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For merits:


[3]Shooting for TP with Steel Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[10000]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[2]Meleeing for TP with Joyeuse. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[1]Meleeing for TP with M.Kris. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.
[9999]Meleeing for TP with A non-multi hit weapon that has good dps. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.


For much of everything else I do on COR

Elemental staffs + COR gun + Steel + /rdm (or /blm sometimes)
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#30 Apr 25 2009 at 10:12 AM Rating: Good
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Spikido of the Seven Seas wrote:

[ Smiley: madDONT YOU DARE CHEAP ASSSmiley: mad ]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.


I wouldn't be able to afford to play cor if I had to use my steel bullets only. I go through at least 2 stacks of ammo pulling during nyzul.
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#31 Apr 25 2009 at 4:21 PM Rating: Default
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I wouldn't be able to afford to play cor if I had to use my steel bullets only. I go through at least 2 stacks of ammo pulling during nyzul.


Then you have 2 options imo.

1. Change jobs. Its COR, IT ISN'T CHEAP. GET OVER IT OR GO PLAY BRD!

2. Macro in cheap bullets for pulling.
A simple method to not have this take up extra macro room.
1. Goto options and keyboard assingments.
2. turn on the shortcut key for Ranged Attack using any letter you like. I
like ctrl + b.

3. Have your RA macro equip bronze, /RA, then wait a bit, then equip steel.
4. Use that for pulling, and the ctrl+ "key" for normal ranged attacks.
Now you can cheaply pull and not be gimp.

Please do not gimp COR. You can princess COR, but there is no reason to ever be gimp.

I pull with steel.
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#32 Apr 25 2009 at 4:34 PM Rating: Good
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I don't think using non-steel bullets for pulling is gimp. Personally i think if someone was using Iron Bullets to shoot then i'd have no problems with it. It's rarely going to make a difference in most circumstances.
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#33 Apr 25 2009 at 5:06 PM Rating: Decent
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LordTrey wrote:
Quote:

I wouldn't be able to afford to play cor if I had to use my steel bullets only. I go through at least 2 stacks of ammo pulling during nyzul.


Then you have 2 options imo.

1. Change jobs. Its COR, IT ISN'T CHEAP. GET OVER IT OR GO PLAY BRD!

2. Macro in cheap bullets for pulling.
A simple method to not have this take up extra macro room.
1. Goto options and keyboard assingments.
2. turn on the shortcut key for Ranged Attack using any letter you like. I
like ctrl + b.

3. Have your RA macro equip bronze, /RA, then wait a bit, then equip steel.
4. Use that for pulling, and the ctrl+ "key" for normal ranged attacks.
Now you can cheaply pull and not be gimp.

Please do not gimp COR. You can princess COR, but there is no reason to ever be gimp.

I pull with steel.

I don't have a big issue with those who TP with Iron - it's not my piece of pie, but I do think it's a legit way to play. Personally I'd have a difficult time knowing how much better I could be doing TPing with Steel, but still.. The relic DRK in my Salvage shell told me when he plays COR (which is never), that he TPs with Iron -> WS with Steel.. ..My claims of shooting away relic weapons (over a period of year(s)) with Steel TPing aren't far fetched if you play enough. If the price of Steel is hurting relic owners who are never on COR, trust me, it's hurting normal players far, far worse.

That said, don't macro in a sh*t bullet to pull with. If you're TPing with Iron, pull with Iron. If you're TPing with Steel, pull with Steel. No reason to gimp your damage on the pull shot.
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#34 Apr 25 2009 at 7:26 PM Rating: Decent
creapercorsair wrote:
Spikido of the Seven Seas wrote:

[ Smiley: madDONT YOU DARE CHEAP ASSSmiley: mad ]Shooting for TP with Iron Bullets. Slugshot with Steel Bullets.


I wouldn't be able to afford to play cor if I had to use my steel bullets only. I go through at least 2 stacks of ammo pulling during nyzul.


Free Joyeuse
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#35 Apr 27 2009 at 2:07 PM Rating: Good
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Carrilei wrote:
I don't have a big issue with those who TP with Iron - it's not my piece of pie, but I do think it's a legit way to play.


Agreed, I have no issue with TP with Iron. TPing with lv22 Bullets, no way. But Iron is OK with me - Steel is a big step up in cost, and for those who can't synth them yourself or have an on-call synth friend, sometimes the AH doesn't provide much help with Steel. I've seen periods of time where for days there are ZERO stacks/pouches of Steel Bullets on the AH, and when one enterprising crafter tries to put a few up they demand extortionist prices.

That's why I try to keep a bunch of ammo in reserve (I usually own 12-24 stacks of Steel at any given time, and I get nervous when I break into my last stack of 12 pouches), but I understand that sometimes you just want to go out and party and you realize you're low on ammo or funds. Your party is probably more interested in having you come and use Iron than having you pass up the party altogether if your bank account or ammo reserves are suffering at the moment.

I think reasonable rules for ammo choice:

1. For WS (and QD, which doesn't even use the bullet) you need to use Steel if you're 66+. No exceptions.

2. For important events, missions, etc. - use Steel.

3. For pickup exp/merit parties, I've got no problem with TPing with Iron. Certainly Steel is even better, but I wouldn't call it "gimp" to use Iron. Just like I wouldn't call a 66MNK using a Scorpion Harness "gimp" because they aren't using an SH+1. Is the HQ better? Absolutely. Are you an embarassment to your job for using the still solid NQ? No way. Now if the MNK was DDing in AF body (or a 66+ COR was fulltiming regular Bullets), that IS gimp.

4. If you're TPing with a multihit weapon, I see no reason at all to use Iron. Your ammo is presumably all (or at least nearly all) going to WS and your whole strategy is revolving around gaining TP quickly to skew your damage over to WS, so you better be using the good stuff for ammo.


For the switch from Bullets to Iron Bullets, it's even more simple:

1. Are you lv.55+? Use Iron.

2. Only exception that I would excuse is full-time pulling at a fast camp. If all you're doing is pull/Light Shot/buff, Bullet is fine. The small amount of extra damage from one /ra using Iron/Steel isn't going to substantially change the fact that the mobs are dying really fast anyway from your DDs. For the occasional WS and your /RA if you have enough time to fire off an extra shot, macro in the best ammo available.

There are always those uncommon situational uses too. Someone in a skill-up party re-capping Marksmanship after leveling COR in sync parties, for example. I recently went through a couple stacks of normal Bullets breaking weapon latents for myself and a friend (to get Detonator for me, then using Det to help him break Destroyers on MNK). No point in spending extra gil there, and mobs staying alive a little longer can actually be helpful in speeding the process up.
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#36 Apr 28 2009 at 12:18 PM Rating: Good
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358 posts
Didn't want to start a new thread but there is a heated debate on Hexaguns over here. Thought it to be semi-relavant. Carry on.

~Ath
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#37 Apr 28 2009 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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7,899 posts
Owning iron bullets for anything but leaden salute and/or level sync in unacceptable.
#38 Apr 28 2009 at 3:24 PM Rating: Good
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411 posts
If your melee build is really just your RA build with a Walmart hat instead of a pirate hat, then stick to RA. Even with sushi, you're going to need some melee accuracy gear (haste gear is great of course, but not required). The point of Joyeuse or MKris is to build TP quickly, and you're not going to do that by whiffing.

Once you get a melee acc build, I'd start using that for merits, Dynamis, Limbus, Nyzul Isle, etc etc, and work on getting a Joyeuse (it's really a fantastic weapon, you can get the ToD by leaving yourself online overnight and estimating ToD via the Conquest updates, and you can fairly easily trio Charby). As people have mentioned, for shortlived mobs, RA mode has several negatives. No auto-attack means you may be wasting time between shots. Short mob life means you'll only get a few hits in. Also, meleeing with Joyeuse means you can enjoy a number of buffs like Haste/March/Fighter's/Madrigal, which have 0 effect on RA mode. Haste, especially, is what pulls Joyeuse ahead.

And as said above, for tougher fights, stick to RA and/or QD.
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