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The cost of being a pirateFollow

#1 Mar 27 2009 at 7:56 AM Rating: Good
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So guys what is everyone's opinion on the cost of being a corsair. I know when I have ranger as support job I can blow through gil. Do you just eat the cost and accept it. Do you find other people don't truly understand the costs or not care? Or is it just being a whining if you try to rationalize the cost. Based on crafting and purchasing the current cost of a single steel bullet is 200 gil for a total of 220,000 for a 12 pouch of bullets. What is everyone's thoughts?

Edited, Mar 27th 2009 11:56am by Delennshiva
#2 Mar 27 2009 at 8:10 AM Rating: Good
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Delennshiva wrote:
So guys what is everyone's opinion on the cost of being a corsair.

Not so bad at 75.

Delennshiva wrote:
I know when I have ranger as support job I can blow through gil. Do you just eat the cost and accept it.

Gladly COR > ALL

Delennshiva wrote:
Do you find other people don't truly understand the costs or not care? Or is it just being a whining if you try to rationalize the cost.

Actually I think more people understand the cost off the job moreso then they actually understand what our abilites do.

Delennshiva wrote:
Based on crafting and purchasing the current cost of a single steel bullet is 200 gil for a total of 220,000 for a 12 pouch of bullets. What is everyone's thoughts?

It is expensive but what are you gonna do about it? I don't think its so bad since I love this job more then anything =)

~Ath

P.S. why are you taking a survey btw?

Edited, Mar 27th 2009 11:56am by Delennshiva[/quote]
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#3 Mar 27 2009 at 8:29 AM Rating: Good
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If played as COR/RNG, it may be the most expensive job - as iirc, RNG has better ammo that is actually cheaper.

Most people dont understand the cost; fortunately, for endgame events you usually dont shoot as much as you would in a merit party (usually).

For merits, I lvled BRD AND COR, as I quickly found that A) I didnt want to be gimp and I wanted to shoot in a merit party and B) the gil cost for COR is really only worth it for a kickin merit party. So what I do is do merits as BRD unless they have a BRD already, then I go COR ^^
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#4 Mar 27 2009 at 8:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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ManifestOfKujata wrote:
If played as COR/RNG, it may be the most expensive job - as iirc, RNG has better ammo that is actually cheaper.

RNG also goes through ammo a great deal faster than COR.

Pre-75, it's a close comparison, but once you hit 75, RNG's costs easily eclipse COR's. COR really doesn't need to shoot anything at 75 (on stuff that you aren't meleeing, you should probably have a mage SJ), whereas RNG shoots everything.

Edited, Mar 27th 2009 9:51am by redvenomweb
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#5 Mar 27 2009 at 9:02 AM Rating: Decent
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The costs are high, but we live with it due to the love of the job, I make sure to go mining make myself a nice stash of bullets when I start getting low.
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#6 Mar 27 2009 at 11:45 AM Rating: Good
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Not so bad after the initial costs. Those dice are a pain. I usually have to restock several stacks of QD cards every week. Maybe 5k-10k depending on events ive done. I dont go that crazy on cor like I use to. I maybe have to restock pulling/spam ammo every month and WS ammo a bit under 2 months.
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#7 Mar 29 2009 at 5:44 PM Rating: Default
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I'm level 67 atm, and finding myself spending about 200k/level on ammo.. orz.

I don't have a joyeuse yet, but I am freaking thinking long and hard about changing that VERY soon so I don't have to shoot for TP from 70-75.
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#8 Mar 30 2009 at 9:39 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I'm level 67 atm, and finding myself spending about 200k/level on ammo.. orz.


level 70 - level 54 = 16 levels

16 levels * 200k = 3.2 mil

Average price of a Mercurial Kris = 3.4 mil

I highly highly highly recommend people buying a M. kris at 54 or 55. Any party below 60 (barrage level) I use about 1 stack of bullets a party (average of 2 hrs) and 1.5 stacks above 60. When I get my joytoy I can sell the M. kris back for about what I paid for it to recoup all that gil loss.

Assuming I level every other party I spent:

14 levels with iron bullets (thanks to level sync): 14 levels * 2 parties/level * 1.1 stack of bullets/party * 12k/stack of bullets = 370k iron

2 levels with steel bullets: 2 * 2 * 1.5 * 20k = 120k steel

so my total cost for ammo = 490k vs the above poster's 3.2 mil or about 85% less.

I also make my own bullets which cut down on that even more...closer to 300k.

So yes, it is expensive, but there are ways to make it cheaper.

And no, going /WHM is NOT one of those ways.
#9 Mar 30 2009 at 12:23 PM Rating: Good
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BalthezarAsura wrote:
I'm level 67 atm, and finding myself spending about 200k/level on ammo.. orz.


What the **** are you shooting (Steel +2?), and why do your DDs suck so badly that you're going through that much ammo? You shouldn't have to spend THAT much shooting, unless you are the main source of damage for your party and you're non-stop spamming Steel Bullets as fast as possible while the rest of the DDs aren't pulling their weight. On that kind of party, constant COR/RNG shooting is likely to make you the main tank too :P.

You need 27,500 experience points to get from level 66 to 67. Let's say a stack of Steel Bullet pouches is 200k, which looks pretty close to cross-server average on ffxiah. 27,500exp/12 = 2291 exp per bullet pouch if you're using a a 200k stack per level. Are you seriously going through an entire stack of Steel Bullets for every roughly 2k experience points? If that's true, you have much bigger issues with the quality of your parties than you do with the cost of ammo.

Also, many very popular TOAU Level Sync camps aren't even of a level where you can use Steel (66+). Well, you COULD still shoot them if you can equip them with synced down stats, but that would be a really bad idea. So that's quite a bit of ammo savings right there. It's pretty easy to re-cap marksmanship skill if you sync down, just spend some time in Besieged with cheap NQ bullets.

Another recommendation that saved me a little gil in the 60s-70s without a multihit melee weapon - try some pulling. A COR/NIN puller can (and should) still be firing plenty of shots during fights, but leaving early for the next pull and re-applying Utsusemi and rolls during the fight takes up some time so you aren't able to be constantly shooting like you would if you were on COR/RNG as a DD+buffer. I like COR/RNG a lot and it's my preferred way to play COR, but I mixed it up with COR/NIN and pulled a decent amount in 55+ parties as well. I viewed it as both an opportunity to improve my skills as a COR puller as well as a somewhat cheaper couple of hours getting exp.

Also, I really don't think it's "gimp" to use Iron instead of Steel if you're shooting for TP in a regular exp party and you're having a hard time with ammo costs. Completely understandable given the cost and availablity of Steel. Just make sure you're using Steel for WS/QD.

akisushiva wrote:
level 70 - level 54 = 16 levels

16 levels * 200k = 3.2 mil

Average price of a Mercurial Kris = 3.4 mil


Don't forget that you're still shooting your highest quality available bullets more often on WS with a M.Kris. Yes, it isn't as many as you would use shooting for TP, but you will WS a whole lot more so you still have to buy a significant amount of ammo. A real comparison in costs would require you to include the price of a M.Kris PLUS the price of ammo you use for WS from 54-70.

Plus, as discussed above, I think that 200k per level is way too high even in the upper 60s using Steel, much less from level 54-70 where the majority of the time Iron is your best option (54-65).

Though it's certainly true that M.Kris can be re-sold, and that's the big draw. If you have the gil, go for it. If not... I'm not sure it's worth farming the gil to buy and refusing to level without one.

Edited, Mar 30th 2009 4:24pm by Anza
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#10 Mar 30 2009 at 12:52 PM Rating: Good
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I personaly have spent millions on COR but I don't view that as being a lot. The amount of return this job gives me greatly outweighs the cost. I remember When Pirate's Gun was 1.8 Million and now it's settled around 100k. I would have loved to have Access to Steel Bullets on the climb to 75.

All i can say is at 75 the cost of maintaining COR isn't bad at all.

~Ath
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#11 Mar 30 2009 at 1:45 PM Rating: Good
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Anza, I agree 200k/level is an exaggeration.

I have resorted to shooting full time in Mire parties due to amnesia making COR borderline useless so my M.Kris takes a back seat to my fire staff. When shooting full time I use iron with steel macroed in for WS. Even pulling /RNG in these parties I found myself shooting about 3x as many bullets as when I can melee >> WS. So probably a 60% savings over the previous 85% savings based on the above 200k/level estimate.

Looking at about 2 stacks an hour vs. 0.5 stack...so 10k/hr with m. kris and 40k/hr without...about 3 hours/level. So saving 90k/level in the upper 60s, less in the upper 50s and more in the 70s. So 54 to 70, 16 levels using a conservative 80k/level if shooting full time to my 30k/level with kris is approx 1.2 mil vs. 0.5 mil...so saving 700k by using a m kris.

To be honest, I'm not 100% sure what I've spent on bulelts. I had 3 stacks of iron ingots and 1.5 stacks of steel ingots on a mule when I started COR and crafting my own bullets that got me from level 54-69; when I broke down and bought a stack of iron bullet pouches off the AH. Still milking those iron purchased and the steel from the original synth (gogo 3x HQ when I was only 2 levels over the cap O.o)

You're right, I wouldn't stop leveling COR for the m. kris, but it will feel really good when I get that gil back and the Mire parties have really driven home how much I have saved by using the m. kris since 54.
#12 Mar 31 2009 at 8:07 AM Rating: Excellent
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I love pulling, so I usually pulled whenever I could between 50 and 75. Got a few brd's who just didn't want to do it. Np, I loved pulling. It helped cut down on costs for ammo, too. However, those few parties (probably did 69-73 cor/rng the whole time) let me have some fun with shooting crap, and I enjoyed it as a nice break away from pulling a lot. I loved both. I spent about 5 or 600k going from level 63 to 75 on ammo alone, and I don't regret any of it. I'd have paid more.

If I didn't have ammo and didn't have gil, I stopped putting my flag up. Don't let those poor excuses of pie-rats convince you its ok to sub mage and be a brd without march and just pull and sit on the side lines. Shoot to kill in every **** party! Even while pulling, assume you are a DD and are lacking the opportunities the other dd are getting, so you have to squeeze in extra shots every moment possible.


The only thing I regret, playing as cor, gil-wise? 90 **** K for the most useless roll ever: Gallant Roll Dice! There. I said it. D:
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#13 Mar 31 2009 at 2:53 PM Rating: Good
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FenrirXIII wrote:
I love pulling, so I usually pulled whenever I could between 50 and 75. Got a few brd's who just didn't want to do it. Np, I loved pulling. It helped cut down on costs for ammo, too. However, those few parties (probably did 69-73 cor/rng the whole time) let me have some fun with shooting crap, and I enjoyed it as a nice break away from pulling a lot. I loved both. I spent about 5 or 600k going from level 63 to 75 on ammo alone, and I don't regret any of it. I'd have paid more.

If I didn't have ammo and didn't have gil, I stopped putting my flag up. Don't let those poor excuses of pie-rats convince you its ok to sub mage and be a brd without march and just pull and sit on the side lines. Shoot to kill in every @#%^ing party! Even while pulling, assume you are a DD and are lacking the opportunities the other dd are getting, so you have to squeeze in extra shots every moment possible.


The only thing I regret, playing as cor, gil-wise? 90 @#%^ing K for the most useless roll ever: Gallant Roll Dice! There. I said it. D:

I wish some of the dice were more potent as well. Maybe one day they might give them a little tweakage but who knows. Over all I'm incredibly happy with the Balance of COR.

~Ath
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#14 Mar 31 2009 at 3:37 PM Rating: Decent
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FenrirXIII wrote:
I spent about 5 or 600k going from level 63 to 75 on ammo alone, and I don't regret any of it. I'd have paid more.


That sounds much more in line with a realistic cost estimate for a shooting COR who sometimes pulls. And I completely agree, worth every gil.

Quote:
If I didn't have ammo and didn't have gil, I stopped putting my flag up.


Good advice to all.

Quote:
The only thing I regret, playing as cor, gil-wise? 90 @#%^ing K for the most useless roll ever: Gallant Roll Dice! There. I said it. D:


But you know what... you bought it anyway, and I f'ing LOVE that. Thank you for being a real COR! Your COR faith will be rewarded when the Gallant Roll mega-buff update comes. Oh yes.

PS: I used Gallant's the other day on a PLD friend in Besieged, and I felt pretty cool doing it.

PPS: Full disclosure, I purchased my Paladin Die for 60k on the AH. And only 2 have sold in the last 20 months, so I'm still the last one to buy it. LOL.
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#15 Mar 31 2009 at 3:42 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, real CORs get every die, even if it's barely ever used.
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#16 Apr 01 2009 at 5:37 AM Rating: Decent
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I've used Gallant's roll before. On CoP6-4 (the omega fight). We had our PLD supertank the mammets while we picked them off one by one. By the time we got to the last one, it was at 50% health due to reflected damage (and I rolled an 11).

It's not COMPLETELY useless.
#17 Apr 01 2009 at 7:53 AM Rating: Good
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arynel wrote:
I've used Gallant's roll before. On CoP6-4 (the omega fight). We had our PLD supertank the mammets while we picked them off one by one. By the time we got to the last one, it was at 50% health due to reflected damage (and I rolled an 11).

It's not COMPLETELY useless.

Oh that sounds,sound. If I get a chance to do that fight a third time Imma try it =)

~Ath
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#18 Apr 03 2009 at 9:27 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Anza, I agree 200k/level is an exaggeration.


200k/level was not an exaggeration.

- Average 10 bullets per Colibri
- Average 200 exp each kill
- 170 gil per bullet shot (200k/stack of 12 pouches)

That's 1,700 gil per mob down the toilet. Multiply that by ~137 or so colibri you have to kill to go from level 66-67, and you get ~232,900 gil per level.

I was level 67 at the time of that post, and up until that point had been COR/RNG the whole way from 30-67.

I actually just started going COR/NIN to parties and have been meleeing for TP only because I can't afford to shoot that many bullets for exp anymore... I was spending 3-4x as much time making gil just to buy the bullets as I was exp'ing.

Quote:
What the **** are you shooting (Steel +2?), and why do your DDs suck so badly that you're going through that much ammo? You shouldn't have to spend THAT much shooting, unless you are the main source of damage for your party and you're non-stop spamming Steel Bullets as fast as possible while the rest of the DDs aren't pulling their weight. On that kind of party, constant COR/RNG shooting is likely to make you the main tank too :P.


Actually the parties didn't suck, I levelled very quickly... I just don't like to feel like I'm not pulling my weight as far as DD goes.

I probably out-parsed a lot of DD's in those parties, but then again I was spamming Steel Bullets, eating Squid Sushi +1 (and not caring if birds took them away). I'm a DD at heart, and I play the game to have as much fun as possible, and to me that was fun as hell^^

But I can't afford to keep doing that anymore unless I wanna take 2 months to go from 70-75 lol.

I think melee for TP is actually not going to kill me. :P
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#19 Apr 04 2009 at 10:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Hmmm.

Not including Barrage, I fired 2132 shots and 432 WS as COR/RNG from 67-72. That's actual parsed shots, not an average.

200k / stack of 12 steel pouches = 169g / steel bullet
2564 shots fired * 169g per shot = 433,316g
433,316g / 5 levels = 86,663g per level

I think your estimate is quite a bit exaggerated.

Edited, Apr 4th 2009 11:05am by redvenomweb
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#20 Apr 04 2009 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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arynel wrote:
I've used Gallant's roll before. On CoP6-4 (the omega fight). We had our PLD supertank the mammets while we picked them off one by one. By the time we got to the last one, it was at 50% health due to reflected damage (and I rolled an 11).

It's not COMPLETELY useless.


I've always wanted to try this for the supertank strategy for Divine Might, but people were worried that the spike damage would cause the mobs to become claimed and **** up hate. I never got around to testing whether it actually worked that way, but I'm glad to see it doesn't!
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#21 Apr 04 2009 at 10:32 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Hmmm.

Not including Barrage, I fired 2132 shots and 432 WS as COR/RNG from 67-72. That's actual parsed shots, not an average.

200k / stack of 12 steel pouches = 169g / steel bullet
2564 shots fired * 169g per shot = 433,316g
433,316g / 5 levels = 86,663g per level

I think your estimate is quite a bit exaggerated.


Just because you gimped your damage and didn't shoot very often doesn't mean that I'm exagerrating.

In fact I spammed my Ranged Attack macro every fight, and WS'd every mob when it was under 30-40% health.

I had a lot of people I exp'd with tell me I was the best COR they had ever seen. I would get tells from people who I met exp'ing when I wasn't even on COR asking me to change jobs for exp.

Tell me... why is this so hard to believe? If I told you I used a Mercurial Kris instead of shooting for TP, that's somehow believeable... but if I shot Steel Bullets for TP then I must be being dishonest somehow?

I'm sorry but I don't like being called a liar. Just because I can afford to play COR the way I like to doesn't mean I lie.

Now I have already admitted that since turning 67 I have started meleeing for TP because it started to get rediculous spending that much gil on bullets. So I went and spent 500k or so on some good melee gear and /nin to dual-wield Trailer's Kukri's and it's worked out to be about the same amount of gil... but when I'm done I can always sell the gear... bullets are pure waste so meh, no more lol.
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#22 Apr 11 2009 at 10:55 AM Rating: Decent
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BalthezarAsura wrote:
Just because you gimped your damage and didn't shoot very often doesn't mean that I'm exagerrating.

In fact I spammed my Ranged Attack macro every fight, and WS'd every mob when it was under 30-40% health.

I had a lot of people I exp'd with tell me I was the best COR they had ever seen. I would get tells from people who I met exp'ing when I wasn't even on COR asking me to change jobs for exp.

You had random people tell you that you were good? Well then, I take it all back!

I have zero interest in your whimsical claims of how awesome you were. I was also spamming ranged attacks every fight, so if your fights were lasting that much longer than mine, that doesn't really speak to your amazing prowess, now does it.

Quote:
Tell me... why is this so hard to believe?

Because you haven't parsed a **** thing, while I parsed almost every party I had from 15-75?

Quote:
I'm sorry but I don't like being called a liar. Just because I can afford to play COR the way I like to doesn't mean I lie.

I'm not saying that you are lying. "Lying" infers deception.

I'm saying that you don't know WTF you are talking about. There's a difference.

Quote:
Now I have already admitted that since turning 67 I have started meleeing for TP because it started to get rediculous spending that much gil on bullets. So I went and spent 500k or so on some good melee gear and /nin to dual-wield Trailer's Kukri's and it's worked out to be about the same amount of gil... but when I'm done I can always sell the gear... bullets are pure waste so meh, no more lol.

You're calling me a gimp while you're meleeing with dual Trailer's?

Hey, Dr. Thriftspend, I have a suggestion for you: if steel bullets are too rich for your blood, try sticking with iron bullets? It's still better than meleeing with dual Trailer's.

The real irony is that you are complaining about COR costs, and yet one whole level into the phase where COR ammo actually gets expensive, you knuckled under and stopped shooting! Hope you don't break the bank, there.

Edited, Apr 11th 2009 12:05pm by redvenomweb
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#23 Apr 11 2009 at 11:35 AM Rating: Good
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Being a new player, I am actually getting scared of the cost of being a Corsair. I have been playing almost 5 months now, and just leveling Ranger stung a bit. I ended up switching jobs and doing DRG for 54 levels before self reflecting that I really wanted to level Corsair first.

I managed to store up a bit of cash (300k) and am ready to start leveling COR again (currently mid 30s), but I am starting to get the feeling I need to level THF and farm, use DRG to do some Royal Jelly runs, and do some alot of fishing...


Regardless, I may not have a ton of cash, I may be new, but I am going to figure out what I need to do to get COR leveled, and I am going to do my damnedest to be good at it. RNG is suitably leveled to be subbed all the way, NIN is only level 17 and could be leveled.

The way I see it, COR is my job, not RNG. Support is my first and foremost responsibility. I will have every dice, even DRG, PUP, and BST, and I will make sure that I know my support role first and foremost. If I can add some dps to the mix, then I believe I am going above and beyond my role. Sure I could sub WHM, but I want to do DD instead and I will do everything I can to fire as much as I can. To offset costs, I will definitely be all over using Quick Draw as much as possible since Cards are cheaper than Bullets. I will also melee if I need to since Optimum Gun Range is fairly close to melee range anyways.

Im also going to make sure I have my Dedication bonus on every time I level. The faster I get to 75, the less I will spend in ammo over the course of the trip. I will do FoV quests with DNC sub during downtime to get more exp, skill, and farm a little at the same time. There are plenty of ways to offset the sting of bullet costs, and I already have a plan in place on how to avoid them. The thing is I have no delusions about it and am prepared to bite the proverbial (and punlike) bullet for it.

Edited, Apr 11th 2009 1:39pm by Mjrna
#24 Apr 11 2009 at 10:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Call me gimp but I'm just going COR/DNC and not spending a whole lot on ammo. I think I contribute a lot to my PT with support rolls, drain samba, quicksteps, cures, sleeps, dispels, and a little bit of damage. It's fun and very busy and not terribly expensive.
#25 Apr 13 2009 at 10:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Esoa wrote:
Call me gimp but I'm just going COR/DNC and not spending a whole lot on ammo. I think I contribute a lot to my PT with support rolls, drain samba, quicksteps, cures, sleeps, dispels, and a little bit of damage. It's fun and very busy and not terribly expensive.

/DNC was not availible on my climb to 75. I personally went /RNG all the way to 75 with the occasional /NIN. I enjoyed spamming Iron bullets and watching my Marksmanship skill rise^^

If you are going to melee in a PT please don't use lol Racc Daggers. There are plenty of better melee weapons out there other then /RA is your best form of DoT you have.

Now in merits 95% of the time I am /DNC.
  • Spamming Steps
  • Drain Samba II
  • Finishing mobs with WS
  • Curing ZZZ'd members
  • Curing Pecking Flurries

All of that in addition to my COR duties. /DNC can be amazing Sub Smiley: grin

~Ath
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#26 Apr 23 2009 at 10:08 AM Rating: Default
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Well I realize that there are valid reasons to sub jobs other than ranger on Cor and I will relunctantly sub nin for pulling spider pets in a level cap party. However my standard reply for any request to sub a mage job is

"GTFO I am pirate not a fing wet nurse!"
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