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Osode or AskarFollow

#1 Jun 07 2009 at 8:35 AM Rating: Good
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Ok so im just about done with pld as far as tanking gear goes. In other cases, Im preparing my sam for endgame events now. I finally bought a Hagun and now I was looking at Osode.

So many choices for Body gear now. Im unable to get Usukane body atm, due to its expensive nature lol. Hauby+1 is like 3.2-3.6m on my server. So my next option is a free Askar or 2.2-2.5m Osode. I know the stats on both, but im looking more on reasons to use one over the other.

Anyone got any suggestions?
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#2 Jun 07 2009 at 8:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Option E) None of the above.


Seriously, PLEASE do not TP in Askar. TP in Hauby, and WS in Osode is about the best setup you can get. I know your probably tired of looking at the Hauby model that you and every other SAM has, but it really is that good.
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#3 Jun 07 2009 at 9:22 AM Rating: Good
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               Best Option     Poor Man's Option     do not use 
tp:            Haub+1/Usu*     Haub/Nuevo*           Askar 
WS:            Osode           Hachiman Domaru       Askar 
tanking/solo:  Usukane/Osode*  Askar                 ----- 
 
*situational 


You better have a Haub for PLD, use that for melee/tp while you save up for other stuff.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 1:24pm by shintasama
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#4Deboro, Posted: Jun 07 2009 at 9:43 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Askar is perfectly fine for tp, I keep my 95% Melee Acc on birds, and I keep 20% Haste even breaking into that magical 107 Dex number with gear tweaks.
#5 Jun 07 2009 at 3:14 PM Rating: Good
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Deboro wrote:
Askar is perfectly fine for tp, I keep my 95% Melee Acc on birds, and I keep 20% Haste even breaking into that magical 107 Dex number with gear tweaks.
Deboro uses 20 something less acc than me and is convinced his parsed acc% is higher, the only way this can occur is by him asking BRDs for acc buffs instead of haste, leaving him with much less total haste than a sensible SAM getting double haste songs and wearing Haub for a grand increase of 1.5% acc. I'm still sitting here patiently and waiting for him and Milich to party together so I can laugh at how bad he gets creamed.

Moooooving on.
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#6 Jun 07 2009 at 4:38 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not trying to defend askar (I use Nuevo), I am asking an honest question here. Is it not possible to hit accuracy cap with Askar body and using crab sushi on birds?

Say you had the following TP build:

Tiphia Sting
Walahra Turban
Peacock Charm
Fowling Earring
Brutal Earring
Askar Korazin
Dusk gloves
Ulthalaam's Ring
Rajas Ring
Amemit+1
Swift Belt
Byakko's Haidate
Fuma sune-ate

That gives you a total of +20 DEX, +22 Accuracy. Say you have full great katana merits, so 292 skill = 282 Accuracy. Say you are Elvaan SAM/WAR, which is 65 DEX. So you get a total of 85 DEX which is 63 accuracy + 22 accuracy from gear + 282 accuracy from skill = 367 total accuracy. This, by my math which uses the accuracy formula from wiki, gives you a 79.5% Hit rate on LVL 81 G. Colibris, and a 77% hit rate on LVL 82 G. Colibri. If you eat crab sushi, thats 13% more accuracy, which is a total of accuracy of 414. That is enough to push you to 95% hit rate on both LVL 81 and 82 G. Colibris.

Again, I am not defending or recommending Askar. I am simply asking whether it is possible to hit the accuracy cap on G. Colibri's by using crab sushi and Askar and still maintain 20% haste. Just a hypothetical. Did I make an error in my math or is wiki wrong?
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#7 Jun 07 2009 at 4:47 PM Rating: Good
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but you're using crab sushi instead of miths, so (just like asking the BRD to give you acc songs) you "can" hit the cap, but you're loosing more than you're gaining.
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Winston Churchill wrote:
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#8 Jun 07 2009 at 4:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Makes sense. So you can hit cap, but its still gimp cap. Thanks :)
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#9 Jun 07 2009 at 5:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Don't use GKT on birds.
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#10 Jun 07 2009 at 7:06 PM Rating: Good
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VZX wrote:
Don't use GKT on birds.


This. Polearm always wins. Don't have PA merits? Use crab sushi. You'll still win.

Edit:
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Askar is perfectly fine for tp, I keep my 95% Melee Acc on birds, and I keep 20% Haste even breaking into that magical 107 Dex number with gear tweaks.


Only way you can make a claim like this for 82 birds is if your gear looks like this.

Hagun/Pole/Empty/Black Tathlum
Ace's/Ancient Torque/Bushi/Brutal
Askar/Dusk(+1)/Rajas/Toreador's
Cuchulain's/Swift/Byakko's/Fuma

This build is 405 acc on lv 82 birds(which require 409 to cap) assuming you're Galka/Hume/Taru, less for elvaan and capped for mithra. Acc will also drop an additional 1.5% when swapping from swift to Vbelt

Assuming you're anything except for mithra, you will not cap acc in askar body on birds.

Swapping Dusk for askar or fuma for enkidu? Then you're no longer +3 haste because swapping for haub and to turban and keeping dusk/fuma over enkidu/askar hands will make askar anywhere from +0-2 haste instead of +3

But all that aside, lolgkt on birds. I was just calling BS on your 95% hitrate claim. If you want STP on your body slot, get usukane or gtfo



Edited, Jun 7th 2009 11:26pm by Veggeto
#11 Jun 07 2009 at 9:47 PM Rating: Decent
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I use this:
TP-
input /equip head "Askar Zucchetto";
input /equip l.ring "Rajas Ring";
input /equip l.ear "Fowling Earring";
input /equip neck "Chivalrous Chain";
input /equip body "Haubergeon";
input /equip hands "Dusk Gloves";
input /equip r.ring "Sniper's Ring";
input /equip r.ear "Brutal Earring";
input /equip waist "Swift Belt";
input /equip legs "Byakko's Haidate"
input /equip feet "Usukane Sune-Ate";
input /equip range "Lightning Bow";
input /equip back "Amemet Mantle +1";
input /equip sub "Pole Grip";

WS-
input /equip l.ring "Rajas Ring";
input /equip l.ear "Fowling Earring";
input /equip head "Maat's Cap";
input /equip neck "Snow Gorget";
input /equip body "Kirin's Osode";
input /equip hands "Pallas's Bracelets";
input /equip r.ring "Ruby Ring";
input /equip r.ear "Brutal Earring";
input /equip waist "Warwolf Belt";
input /equip legs "Usukane Hizayoroi";
input /equip feet "Creek M Clomps";
input /equip range "Lightning Bow";
input /equip back "Amemet Mantle +1";

I dont see any askar body there do you?
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#12 Jun 07 2009 at 10:27 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm pretty sure turban beats out askar for TP and that smild+1 beats out am+1 for ws

Edited, Jun 8th 2009 2:28am by Veggeto
#13 Jun 07 2009 at 11:45 PM Rating: Good
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Askar > All for best looking thing you can put on your head. The fact that it has pretty good stats is just a side benefit.
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#14 Jun 08 2009 at 12:35 AM Rating: Good
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Veggeto wrote:
I'm pretty sure turban beats out askar for TP and that smild+1 beats out am+1 for ws

The difference is too little to fuss about which one is the winner.

2008 - the year we talk about how a certain equip win due to something that you can't replicate with the smallest unit in game.
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#15Deboro, Posted: Jun 08 2009 at 12:44 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Wow once again Rated down for having an opinion! Awesome, I cant cap Acc with Askar? do you not know of the mithical Pizza? Also I like how your "Perfect Gear" Setup had wasted spots of Expensive over-used gear, Who would use Ancinet torque over Justice? or Why do Dusk +1 Even matter? ANYWAYS, Haub is not the end all be all of bodies, get over it. And I too am still waiting on mr. Pahn to get a better console / pc to use so we can enjoy some parses, But as you would know if you were reading the thread it has nothing to do with Askar / Hauby. It is a question of /drg vs /war
#16 Jun 08 2009 at 12:53 AM Rating: Good
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Deboro wrote:
Wow once again Rated down for having an opinion! Awesome, I cant cap Acc with Askar? do you not know of the mithical Pizza? Also I like how your "Perfect Gear" Setup had wasted spots of Expensive over-used gear, Who would use Ancinet torque over Justice? or Why do Dusk +1 Even matter? ANYWAYS, Haub is not the end all be all of bodies, get over it. And I too am still waiting on mr. Pahn to get a better console / pc to use so we can enjoy some parses, But as you would know if you were reading the thread it has nothing to do with Askar / Hauby. It is a question of /drg vs /war


better PC, just haven't been playing much. and yeah, /DRG vs /WAR is the point, though at the moment i don't remember who was going to sub which to be honest. i also need to get kparser on this laptop, i hope it works with vista.
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#17 Jun 08 2009 at 3:14 AM Rating: Good
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If you're debating between getting Osode vs other gear, it can be more up in the air, but Osode is the best GK WS piece you can get. If you are a pld first, neuvo isn't really an option.

The difference will end up being 5 str and you prolly won't need the stp from the body with merits or some hachi. Depending on your current gear I might put off the osode for things like brutal, dusk/fuma, pcc, or whatever else you might be lacking. I'm a huge fan of my pcc since I can use it on all my jobs, and looking at your jobs listed you could gain from it to.

There's a lot of other gear that can easily negate the 5 str difference, so get that first. Better to have a pretty solid 6 hit setup with hagun then some mediocre 7 hit with an osode.

tl:dr 10 str > 5 str, but other gear > osode for immediate improvements
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#18 Jun 08 2009 at 4:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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Deboro wrote:
Wow once again Rated down for having an opinion! Awesome, I cant cap Acc with Askar? do you not know of the mithical Pizza? Also I like how your "Perfect Gear" Setup had wasted spots of Expensive over-used gear, Who would use Ancinet torque over Justice? or Why do Dusk +1 Even matter? ANYWAYS, Haub is not the end all be all of bodies, get over it. And I too am still waiting on mr. Pahn to get a better console / pc to use so we can enjoy some parses, But as you would know if you were reading the thread it has nothing to do with Askar / Hauby. It is a question of /drg vs /war


Yes, because we all eat pizza on birds, brilliant!

Who would use Ancient Torque over justice? I would. Ancient torque is 12 acc on a hander. Justice torque is 6 acc 5 str 7 attack provided you have a bushi and capped gkt merits. Sam gets about 70% of total dmg from WS. 6 acc is going to increase ws frequency, which is going to be a better boost in damage than adding to hagun's very crappy DoT.
Think about it, really. 6 acc vs 5 str 7 attack on a job that gets the majority of it's dmg from WS. 5 str 7 attack will increase TP dmg. 6 acc will increase TP dmg AND WS dmg.

Dusk+1 don't matter I used the() to show that it could be either one. Dusk(+1) is dusk or dusk+1 If i meant dusk+1 only, i would have said dusk+1. The point being, using askar body so you could use haste gloves and shoes instead of a piece of hachiman

I never said it was, but it is still better than askar in a lot more situations than askar would be beter than it. If you want stp on the body, get ACP body 10 acc 4 stp or Usu body, and you're going to be better off than askar body.

Edited, Jun 8th 2009 8:05am by Veggeto
#19 Jun 08 2009 at 6:43 AM Rating: Good
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milich wrote:
Deboro wrote:
Wow once again Rated down for having an opinion! Awesome, I cant cap Acc with Askar? do you not know of the mithical Pizza? Also I like how your "Perfect Gear" Setup had wasted spots of Expensive over-used gear, Who would use Ancinet torque over Justice? or Why do Dusk +1 Even matter? ANYWAYS, Haub is not the end all be all of bodies, get over it. And I too am still waiting on mr. Pahn to get a better console / pc to use so we can enjoy some parses, But as you would know if you were reading the thread it has nothing to do with Askar / Hauby. It is a question of /drg vs /war


better PC, just haven't been playing much. and yeah, /DRG vs /WAR is the point, though at the moment i don't remember who was going to sub which to be honest. i also need to get kparser on this laptop, i hope it works with vista.


Milich wrote:
let's have a nyzul mamool party and compare my SAM/DRG to your elite SAM/WAR with askar.
I assumed from the context that your SAM/DRG would be using Haub+1, it's "fairer" if you use the same gear, but I have faith that you're going to cream him so I don't care either way.
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I don't believe in good guys versus bad guys anymore… I only see a plethora of states acting in self interest… with varying ethics and moral standards of course, but self-interest nonetheless
Winston Churchill wrote:
Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things
#20 Jun 08 2009 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
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Deboro wrote:
Wow once again Rated down for having an opinion! Awesome, I cant cap Acc with Askar? do you not know of the mithical Pizza? Also I like how your "Perfect Gear" Setup had wasted spots of Expensive over-used gear, Who would use Ancinet torque over Justice? or Why do Dusk +1 Even matter? ANYWAYS, Haub is not the end all be all of bodies, get over it. And I too am still waiting on mr. Pahn to get a better console / pc to use so we can enjoy some parses, But as you would know if you were reading the thread it has nothing to do with Askar / Hauby. It is a question of /drg vs /war
You use pizza on birds? lol
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#21 Jun 08 2009 at 9:38 AM Rating: Good
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ITT: how to have capped ACC without gimping your damage output to do it.

On a related note, I bet even the backline jobs could reach capped ACC on birds if they used ACC food.
#22 Jun 08 2009 at 9:51 AM Rating: Decent
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VZX wrote:
Don't use GKT on birds.


I'm using my GKT on birds.
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#23 Jun 08 2009 at 11:35 AM Rating: Good
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TrotterOfSylph wrote:
VZX wrote:
Don't use GKT on birds.


I'm using my GKT on birds.

Don't.
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#24Ennoyvl, Posted: Jun 08 2009 at 11:37 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) saevellakshmi
#25 Jun 08 2009 at 11:57 AM Rating: Decent
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Caesura wrote:
ITT: how to have capped ACC without gimping your damage output to do it.

On a related note, I bet even the backline jobs could reach capped ACC on birds if they used ACC food.
We might be able to, but we'd have to gimp our damage output to do it.
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#26 Jun 08 2009 at 12:17 PM Rating: Default
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Ennoyvl wrote:
None of the above?! WTF are you referring to?! Im asking a question about the 3 main gears in the game, and you say none of the above?!

My god!!.. did you even read what I wrote?!! I said nothing about tp gain or specs on gear and how to friggin use it! I was clearly asking which one should I use. I know that I should use Hauby to tp in, its what im using now. I also use my friends Osode in salvage, so i know to macro swap it out when ws'ing. But now that im working on my sam, im putting time into it to want to get an osode, or something good as far as the body piece goes. I am unable to get Usukane atm, so ill settle for the next best thing. What you wrote clearly shows that you didn't even comprehend what I was asking.

I dont mean to be so upset, but **** man, it sucks when asking for help on something opens a f'kn gateway to criticism. Please read correctly before you respond to a post!


After reading your reply, even I have no idea what exactly you are asking. The topic is called "Osode or Askar", it sure sounds like you are picking one over the other. And then you go on about Usukane Body and Haub+1 and so on, as though if all 4 of them are interchangable. I'll just give you an answer to what I think your question is/was. As a sam you have usage for 4 bodies, Osode/Askar/Haub+1/Usukane, where Usukane is an upgrade of both Askar and Haub. If you do not have Usukane Body, you should have Osode/Askar/Haub as each have their uses. Haub+1 for regular monsters and Askar for when you're farming and whatnot since the evasion+ helps and you don't really need the extra acc on lower level monsters. Osode should always be used for WS(unless you're using multi-hit ws) as it gives the most str out of any body that's currently available. The total amount of store tp you have also determines what you should be using. If you have Usu Feet, you should be using haub+1 and haste gloves(if you don't have usu body), if you don't have Usu Feet, then Askar+haste gloves is a viable option. I know people argue about whether askar+haste is better than haub+hachiman kote for those that don't have usu feet, but in my opinion it depends on what you fight and the food that you use. Either way the difference shouldn't be that much for most cases.

Hope this helps, and don't get too upset if it doesn't.
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