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Crit Hit Rate - JinFollow

#1 May 19 2011 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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I've been surfing the web on crit hit rate. Crit hit rate from atma is speculated to cap at ~50%. Over on BG there is testing that shows dDEX 50 will get you ~25%. Assuming cruor buffs/atma get you at least 50 dDEX thats ~75% crit hit rate inside Abyssea. I couldnt find any testing with dDEX higher than 50, but I am assuming dDEX any higher wont do much if anything. I'm pretty sure I'm way over 50 dDEX in Abyssea, but loleyeballing, it doesnt look like I am much higher than 75%. Can anyone confirm?

That said, I think I have been making a mistake by stacking DEX for Jin in Abyssea. Here is what I'm thinking for a new Jin set:

Crit Hit Rate > Crit Hit Damage > STR > ATK

Does that look right? Has anyone parsed NIN crit hit rate in Abyssea with RR/GH/Apoc/Cruor Buffs?

Edited, May 19th 2011 2:50pm by K1n371x
#2 May 20 2011 at 2:35 AM Rating: Good
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Crit rate:

Crit rate from dDEX caps at 20%.

The now 5% you get from merits put you at 25%

With RR atma (30%) you now have 55% - the DEX from cruor buffs and RR caps dDEX)

With the +2 body (5%), you now have 60% crit rate

With Crit rate from Gnarled Horn atma (30%) you should be sitting on 90% crit rate.

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Crit DMG+: (which now had its cap of 50% removed)

RR atma 30%

Kamome (if you use it) 40%

Iga Erimaki (if you use it) is 2% and the ammo piece is 5% bringing us up to 47% crit dmg

SS atma 30% Crit dmg would knock that up to 77% crit dmg

-------------------------------------------------------

Probably missed something out there, but using RR/GH/SS you get a 90% crit rate with 77% crit dmg.




For Jin, just add in att, STR/DEX if in large amounts, Double attack etc The majority of its dmg will come from the above 3 atma's/cruor buffs




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#3 May 22 2011 at 2:44 AM Rating: Good
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K1n371x wrote:
That said, I think I have been making a mistake by stacking DEX for Jin in Abyssea. Here is what I'm thinking for a new Jin set:


Stacking large amounts of DEX isn't necessarily a bad thing for Jin in or out of Abyssea, but more because of Jin having pretty good STR/DEX WS mods than because of DEX's impact on crits. The extra Acc and crit benefits of DEX sure don't hurt though.

Sandmasterr wrote:
For Jin, just add in att, STR/DEX if in large amounts, Double attack etc The majority of its dmg will come from the above 3 atma's/cruor buffs


I'd have to agree with the above.

For whatever it's worth, I'm far from the most elite NIN (no Iga+2, and it's not my highest priority job) but here's what I'm using for Jin in Abyssea these days:

Weapon: Whatever you use - I personally generally use Kamome/Twilight, working on an evasion Sekka+2 (or pair) for solo but NIN is really my 4th priority job so I'm not going that fast
Ammo: Qirmiz
Head: Anwig Salade (WSAcc+15/STR+4, Acc+10/Atk+5 - yeah I know it's a little overkill on Acc)
Neck: Iga
Ears: Brutal/Hollow
Body: Loki, but lots of solid options here including Iga+1 (I'm 5/10 body seals), Hauby/+1 (still a solid WS piece), and don't sleep on Osode (since the Acc from Hauby isn't as important as it once was, seeing as how it's easily made up with Atma, cruor buffs, and other gear)
Hands: AF+1
Rings: Rajas/Spiral
Back: Atheling
Waist: Warwolf (Sentry would be an alternative if you need the Acc for whatever reason)
Legs: Tumbler Trunks (Byakko's are still great here too, but I don't have em)
Feet: Iga+1

Edited, May 22nd 2011 4:45am by Anza
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#4 May 22 2011 at 6:09 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah what Anza put is a solid WS set. Okote's are fine for hands too if you don't have the AF+1 gloves (not many ppl do limbus any more etc). Use that as a template for making your ws set then change/upgrade pieces as you see fit. I'm sure there was a belt with acc/att+15 DA+2 on? I can't remember the name of it lol but I've just decided I want one!



Talking of limbus, the best 2 pieces were Body and hands, but If I'd happily swap my body and hands now for feet and head. The feet I would love right now and head is just a nice nuke/debuff piece.
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#5 May 22 2011 at 7:25 AM Rating: Decent
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My personal jin set is
Main: Oirandori
Sub: Kamome
Ammo: Qirmiz Tathlum
Head: Varangian Helm
Neck: Iga Erimaki
Lear: Brutal Earring
Rear: Centaurus Earring
Body: Kirin's Osode
Hands: Iga Tekko +1
Lring: Flame Ring
Rring: Spiral Ring
Back: Cavaros Mantle
Waist: Warwolf Belt
Legs: Iga Hakama +2
Feet: Iga Kyahan +2

It's been fairly decent so far, though I'm sure it could use some upgrades, been trying to get haidate to try my luck with synergy, but no luck on drop so far.

Though while we're talking WS, I'm working on my Kannagi, do most people use the same WS setup for :Hi as they do for :Jin?
And on that note, what's better, sub kamome or sub kikoku? (I don't have kikoku obviously, but I do have a lot of relic currency, still debating if I want to do a relic weapon or not)
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#6 May 23 2011 at 5:23 AM Rating: Default
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Sandmasterr wrote:
Useful info...


I've been TPing in Ninja Chainmail, and GH is 20% not 30% so:

30 RR
20 GH
20 dDEX
5 Merits

Puts me right at 75% crit rate inside Abyssea.

New testing since the update over on BG has confirmed that they have raised the Crit Damage cap to 100% and uncapped Crit Hit Rate.

100% Crit Hit Rate Rate can now be obtained by adding Iga Ningi +2 and Atma Of The Dark Depths to the above. A very nice EVA/DD hybrid build.

For Hi NINs this is probably not worth losing Apoc because of the large crit rate bonus that Hi gets, but 100% Crit Rate and consistent damage Jins sounds tempting...

Edited, May 23rd 2011 2:29pm by K1n371x
#7 May 23 2011 at 5:56 AM Rating: Good
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The crit rate has always been uncapped.

My bad on GH being 20% not 30%, but i'm still hitting at 80% crit rate with RR/GH and Iga body+2. No need to add another crit rate + atma ontop of that, really would'nt be worth it.

HI NIN's ws sets also look many times different to Jin ws sets. Tbh, Our crit rate is high enough, no need to raise it any more via atma, Crit DMG+ is the better option. The nice thing is whatever two atma's your using out of GH/SS/Apoc they each bring defensive traits to the table.
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#8 May 23 2011 at 12:23 PM Rating: Default
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IIRC there was no reachable cap on crit hit rate, but crit hit rate from atma capped at 50% didnt it? Thats what lolwiki said...

80% to 100% is a pretty big jump, but I dont think it beats Apoc...

Edited, May 23rd 2011 5:49pm by K1n371x
#9 May 23 2011 at 4:37 PM Rating: Good
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Sandmasterr wrote:
I'm sure there was a belt with acc/att+15 DA+2 on? I can't remember the name of it lol but I've just decided I want one!


Anguinus Belt, from Kulkulkan. Acc/Atk+15 and DA+1, not DA+2, but yeah - great WS piece for multi-hit WS. And especially as we start to get back to some outside Abyssea content like Voidwatch, we may end up needing some Acc that we've been able to ignore for a while while playing in Abyssea and on content from 75cap times...

Sandmasterr wrote:
Talking of limbus, the best 2 pieces were Body and hands, but If I'd happily swap my body and hands now for feet and head. The feet I would love right now and head is just a nice nuke/debuff piece.


I have to say, if you haven't tried solo/lowman Limbus lately, might be worth a try! I duoed SE Apollyon twice in the past week or so for NIN item to +1 my Hatsuburi that I never upgraded, and with my duo pair of me on NIN/DNC and my friend on PUP/DNC with a DD puppet, we destroyed the zone and got a complete win without even coming close on time (20+ minutes to spare). The amount of coins we got made it well worth our time, and it was really fun.

Since NIN in particular still has lots of good +1 pieces (body for DW, head for evasion, hands for WS, feet for extended time on movement speed+), it's something to look into. I almost want to shut up about it to keep it to myself, but I guess I won't be greedy ;)

Edited, May 23rd 2011 6:45pm by Anza
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#10 May 23 2011 at 5:15 PM Rating: Good
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I haven't tried SE Apollyon yet. I've done NE Apollyon as NIN/DNC and it is incredibly easy. I usually take a DD friend of some sort so we can clear the zone. It usually nets around 60 coins (61 on our last run). It's really nice to have a monk with formless strikes or a mage in order to kill the one boss that's physically immune. Only thing to note really.
Easy way to farm friends their Brutal Earrings and other ABC gear =)
#11 May 26 2011 at 3:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Nin + blu works great in limbus as dmg + sleep + stun make most of them really easy, but with good coordination nearly any other setup can do and a 3 men group can beat anything. Get hands, feet and head and you're a happy ninja (and richer expecially after a couple of apollyon runs). Beside getting coins for my loquacious i think i won't stop doing limbus because i simply find it fun and don't forget to slay a couple of yovras on the way if you need gorgets, they're easy to solo as nin now with a nice sublte blow setup :)

Back to the original topic i used this set for Jin:

Head: Aias bonnet
Neck: Breeze gorget
Ear: Brutal/Aesir
Body: Iga ningi +2
Hands: Ninja tekko +1
Rings: Rajas/Spiral
Back: Atheling
Waist: Breeze belt
Legs: Byakko
Feet: Iga kyahan +2

I personally love conserve tp, but Anguinus/Warwolf are also a good choice. Loki can replace ningi +2 but i wouldn't go for it outside abyssea where crit hit rate is still an issue. As stated before farming organs is so easy now that i don't see the point in using erimaki.
I main hand Kannagi (that's why i donì't use Jin so often now) and offhand Kamome most of the time, my ranged of choice is Ungur because i'm lazy and i don't feel like chasing mobs or waisting finishing moves to pull with flourish.

For Hi i changed neck and belt accordingly but i'm still working on a definitive set, probably getting back Seiryu's kote (with an hopefully nice augment) and working on Ambusher's hose. Did anyone try crudelis belt or have some more advice about Hi builds?
#12 May 27 2011 at 2:53 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
As stated before farming organs is so easy now that i don't see the point in using erimaki.
I main hand Kannagi (that's why i donì't use Jin so often now) and offhand Kamome most of the time, my ranged of choice is Ungur because i'm lazy and i don't feel like chasing mobs or waisting finishing moves to pull with flourish.


The difference between Gorget and Erimaki is minimal, but as the Gorget only affects first hit of the ws, and both have 4.0ftp, the gorget only raises Hi/Jin dmg by 2.5%. If a Triple Attack was to go off on either WS, the gorget would only raised DMG by 1.6%, where-as the DMG the Erimaki provides rises.

Outside Abyssea i'll most likely use my breeze gorget, but inside I stick with Erimaki.

EDIT: my bad, Hi's total FTP is 5.0, so best case DMG rise is only 2% more dmg, with is decreasing for every extra hit the WS does.



Edited, May 27th 2011 4:54am by Sandmasterr
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