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shinryu and thf (quick question)Follow

#1 Feb 12 2011 at 10:50 PM Rating: Decent
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just got 200k brew access and wanted to brew a few shinryus, so best way to go about it with gear or atma? not too worry about procing for blue.
#2 Feb 13 2011 at 1:57 AM Rating: Default
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get a bunch of regain atma
/sam if you want, it'll just speed things up but not essential
enter during piercing
get 200+% tp
run in, sekka + two blue dagger ws if you're /sam otherwise you can just get 100% and go
if you get a dagger ws reading, pop brew and cycle dagger ws until you stagger
if you don't get reading, continue to spam dagger ws
if you get a non-dagger ws reading, you can either pop brew or deathwarp
after stagger, spam aeolean edge, be careful not to cure it too much


even WITHOUT mab atma and all that junk you'll be doing about 10k aeolean edge at 100% tp without any buffs

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#3 Feb 13 2011 at 3:39 AM Rating: Decent
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cyrii wrote:
get a bunch of regain atma
Wrong. Get 200-300%TP before entering, then swap atmas to only one regain atma. Use Aeolian Edge damage boosting atmas after that (like Gales). Regain atmas are useless when you've popped the brew, if your first WS doesn't proc discernment he will kill oyu with an aga befor you've regained enough TP to WS again. If he kills you one regain atma is enough to get back enough TP during the 5mins you do nothing weakened (see next point as to why you'd be weakened)

cyrii wrote:
if you get a non-dagger ws reading, you can either pop brew or deathwarp
Wrong.
After not getting proc or getting the wrong proc, just die further than 20" from where it idles, then when it's out of range, reraise and try again. Each time you engage him his blue proc resets. You can get about 3 attempts in the piercing window, warping after one failed attempt is just a waste of 10k cruor. If you pull him with a /ra outside 20" and don't move he wont draw you in and you should be in a good pos to reraise.

Also, I wouldn't waste a brew without blue proc.

Edited, Feb 13th 2011 9:43am by Noodles
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#4 Feb 13 2011 at 10:57 AM Rating: Default
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Noodles wrote:
cyrii wrote:
get a bunch of regain atma
Wrong. Get 200-300%TP before entering, then swap atmas to only one regain atma. Use Aeolian Edge damage boosting atmas after that (like Gales). Regain atmas are useless when you've popped the brew, if your first WS doesn't proc discernment he will kill oyu with an aga befor you've regained enough TP to WS again. If he kills you one regain atma is enough to get back enough TP during the 5mins you do nothing weakened (see next point as to why you'd be weakened)

cyrii wrote:
if you get a non-dagger ws reading, you can either pop brew or deathwarp
Wrong.
After not getting proc or getting the wrong proc, just die further than 20" from where it idles, then when it's out of range, reraise and try again. Each time you engage him his blue proc resets. You can get about 3 attempts in the piercing window, warping after one failed attempt is just a waste of 10k cruor. If you pull him with a /ra outside 20" and don't move he wont draw you in and you should be in a good pos to reraise.

Also, I wouldn't waste a brew without blue proc.

Edited, Feb 13th 2011 9:43am by Noodles


Maybe it's just me, but this reply just seems awfully condescending. You may be right, and he may be wrong, but sheesh.

#5 Feb 13 2011 at 3:20 PM Rating: Default
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Noodles wrote:
cyrii wrote:
get a bunch of regain atma
Wrong. Get 200-300%TP before entering, then swap atmas to only one regain atma. Use Aeolian Edge damage boosting atmas after that (like Gales). Regain atmas are useless when you've popped the brew, if your first WS doesn't proc discernment he will kill oyu with an aga befor you've regained enough TP to WS again. If he kills you one regain atma is enough to get back enough TP during the 5mins you do nothing weakened (see next point as to why you'd be weakened)

cyrii wrote:
if you get a non-dagger ws reading, you can either pop brew or deathwarp
Wrong.
After not getting proc or getting the wrong proc, just die further than 20" from where it idles, then when it's out of range, reraise and try again. Each time you engage him his blue proc resets. You can get about 3 attempts in the piercing window, warping after one failed attempt is just a waste of 10k cruor. If you pull him with a /ra outside 20" and don't move he wont draw you in and you should be in a good pos to reraise.

Also, I wouldn't waste a brew without blue proc.

Edited, Feb 13th 2011 9:43am by Noodles


If you can't survive the time between ws to 100% tp just quit playing thf and try another job.

If you think 10k cruor and a stone is a waste, then you're retarded or you haven't discovered any celerity abyssites, which would make you retarded.

Also, I never said to waste the brew without blue proc, see above comment.
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#6 Feb 14 2011 at 2:37 PM Rating: Good
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I would advise Atma of Gales, and then the most MAB atma you can get your hands on. Remember not to WS when he is casting magic, unless you use physical WS. THF can easily kill Shinryu in 3 Aeolian edges with brew. Good luck!
#7 Feb 16 2011 at 9:11 PM Rating: Decent
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cyrii wrote:
Also, I never said to waste the brew without blue proc, see above comment.

cyrii wrote:
if you get a non-dagger ws reading, you can either pop brew or deathwarp


Also he nukes for 2400ish damage without MDT set. You're solo so wont have shell and most readers here probably wont have good MDT sets (or not yet at least). Personally my MDT set on thief is capped with Shellra, but I do shinryu on rng for wider range of blue procs. Taking melee strikes is not the problem, which is why I stated
Quote:
if your first WS doesn't proc discernment he will kill you with an aga befor you've regained enough TP to WS again
Unless of course you're using HP atmas, but if you're using HP atmas then you're not using regain atmas, and this point was directed solely at the choice of using multiple regain atmas.
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#8 Feb 16 2011 at 9:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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cyrii wrote:
If you think 10k cruor and a stone is a waste, then you're retarded or you haven't discovered any celerity abyssites, which would make you retarded.
And wasting them for no reason is not retarded or something?
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#9 Feb 17 2011 at 2:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Noodles wrote:
Personally my MDT set on thief is capped with Shellra, but I do shinryu on rng for wider range of blue procs.


Hmm. I think I'd take 1/4 blue chance and TH4+ over 1/3 blue chance and TH2. TH makes a big difference.
#10 Feb 18 2011 at 6:19 AM Rating: Decent
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Innuendoze wrote:
Noodles wrote:
Personally my MDT set on thief is capped with Shellra, but I do shinryu on rng for wider range of blue procs.


Hmm. I think I'd take 1/4 blue chance and TH4+ over 1/3 blue chance and TH2. TH makes a big difference.
Blue proc makes more of a difference than two more levels of TH.

Edit: Also it's not 1/3 chance with ranger, it's 2/3s of them (10 out of a possible 15) if you'd risk dagger proc on rng, or 1/2 if you'd only accept arch and marks.

Edited, Feb 18th 2011 12:21pm by Noodles
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#11 Feb 18 2011 at 9:07 AM Rating: Decent
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lucky for me two other people wanted to tag along on all my runs so we went in when its blunt proc with a mnk and whm to tank. Atmas I used are gales/ultimate/apoclyspse since I like the autoraise but can switch it out for any other. Anyways aeolian edge was topping 17k damage and aeolian edge > aeolian edge makes detonation which is a bonus.

got everything to drop except the cloak, body and only saw 1 hat in like 6 runs total even with blue proc on all.
#12 Feb 18 2011 at 10:29 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Blue proc makes more of a difference than two more levels of TH.

Edit: Also it's not 1/3 chance with ranger, it's 2/3s of them (10 out of a possible 15) if you'd risk dagger proc on rng, or 1/2 if you'd only accept arch and marks.


Sure, but you need to go with a good group to keep someone alive long enough to go through the full gambit of 10. Once you have it narrowed down to marks/arch you still have 4 WSes to synch up and make sure people are staying alive.

Sea daughter/VV for TP and apoc in case you need to RR over that time?
#13 Feb 18 2011 at 10:39 AM Rating: Decent
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SKSmokes wrote:
Quote:
Blue proc makes more of a difference than two more levels of TH.

Edit: Also it's not 1/3 chance with ranger, it's 2/3s of them (10 out of a possible 15) if you'd risk dagger proc on rng, or 1/2 if you'd only accept arch and marks.


Sure, but you need to go with a good group to keep someone alive long enough to go through the full gambit of 10.
Abyssite of Discernment.

Either you get the right proc, pop brew, cycle WS and then kill, or you get the wrong proc or no proc, whereupon you die, RR, wait for weakness and try again untill you get the right proc.

Is it really so hard a concept to grasp?

Edit:
Quote:
Sea daughter/VV for TP and apoc in case you need to RR over that time?
No. One regain atma, Apoc if you can't be bothered to use a RR item and then one or two (depending on using apoc or not) Elem+ or MaB+ atmas.
Although to be fair he dies so quick with a few ele WS you could prolly kill him with one regain atma and then a few HP ones to try and let you get a 2nd WS off befor dieing if no discernment proc.

Edited, Feb 18th 2011 4:48pm by Noodles
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#14 Feb 18 2011 at 1:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Let me take another shot at what our miscommunication here might be. You have a timing mechanism for your WSes that never causes them to get lost to Shinryu animation and some way to stay alive for up to 6 or 7 WSes (hit a WS, discernment doesn't proc 1-2 times, then each of the 4 WSes).

Die and reraise is saved for if it's a WS you don't have, right?
#15 Feb 18 2011 at 9:17 PM Rating: Decent
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SKSmokes wrote:
Let me take another shot at what our miscommunication here might be. You have a timing mechanism for your WSes that never causes them to get lost to Shinryu animation and some way to stay alive for up to 6 or 7 WSes (hit a WS, discernment doesn't proc 1-2 times, then each of the 4 WSes).

Die and reraise is saved for if it's a WS you don't have, right?
Quote:
Either you get the right proc, pop brew, cycle WS and then kill,

Wow you are really slow if I have to take the time to spell this out.

1) Find out proc with 1-2 WS using discernment.

2a) If you get Dagger/Polearm or No messsage, die, RR and try again

2b) If you get Arch/Marks message, Pop brew immidiately

3) Under the effects of brew, cycle all your Arch/Marks WS. It will either be Arch OR Marks so you only need to cycle 4 WS.

4) After getting blue trigger, kill with ele WS.

I don't really know how I can simplify this any more. You use one or two WS to get discernment to proc then you pop brew and do the rest of the WS for the weapon discernment says. After getting proc you have to cycle at most 4 WSs. If you can't time 4 WSs between his attacks then you seriously @#%^ing fail.

Edited, Feb 19th 2011 3:20am by Noodles
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#16 Feb 21 2011 at 10:39 AM Rating: Decent
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Yes, that part is simple. I'm not sure why you keep re-explaining it. I wanted to know what you do to time your WSes. I'm asking because I've had to do some of the initial WSes a couple of times to get the proc right.
#17 Feb 21 2011 at 7:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
If you think 10k cruor and a stone is a waste, then you're retarded or you haven't discovered any celerity abyssites, which would make you retarded.


I have 3 celerity abyssites, and 6 sojourn abyssites, guess how many stones I currently have in reserve? 1. To some people losing a stone IS a big deal so maybe you shouldn't be such a ******* *******, you're kinda the one that sounds retarded when you make statements like the one quoted. Being polite costs nothing, being an ******* makes you look like a retarded 13 year old who's ****** off at the world over his microscopic *****.
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#18 Feb 21 2011 at 8:33 PM Rating: Default
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Stop doing it wrong. RL insults are classy though.
#19 Feb 23 2011 at 10:32 AM Rating: Default
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SKSmokes wrote:
Yes, that part is simple. I'm not sure why you keep re-explaining it. I wanted to know what you do to time your WSes. I'm asking because I've had to do some of the initial WSes a couple of times to get the proc right.
It's pretty ******* simple. You gain TP befor you engage, and you WS between attack rounds. (you pull him first with a /ra) he will attack you 3-4 timee then cast an aga. during those 3-4 (rediculously slow) attack rounds, if you can't get a clean WS off, then you don't deserve to have any twilight equipment anyway because you are a ******* failure. Besides, even if you get the timing wrong, the WS does not need to be clean to get a discern proc.

At that point, refer to the "wipe, reraise, pull and try again" part of my last post. If you don't understand the concept by this point in time then you're a ****** who needs to accept some guy who dropped out of university 3 times is more smarter (bad grammar intended) than you.


@ Your last post: In a completely non-condescending tone (Hey, every now and then I do give some sound advice): Just keep trying. You can get 3 attempts per pierce window, and @3 attempts per crimson traveler stone @10k cruor, it's much better value than just going in, brewing, and hoping for dagger.
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#20 Feb 23 2011 at 10:54 AM Rating: Decent
I want to solo this during Blunt as DRG(More chances than Piercing) but I don't have apoc atma, how can I run out of 20' range without getting drawn in? I know some people keep zombying with apoc until they get away but without it, is it possible?
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#21 Feb 23 2011 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I want to solo this during Blunt as DRG(More chances than Piercing) but I don't have apoc atma, how can I run out of 20' range without getting drawn in? I know some people keep zombying with apoc until they get away but without it, is it possible?

One way to do it is to run as far as you can inside draw in range when he's casting a spell. Then when it's just finishing, run the last few yalms, he won't draw in during the spell finishing animation and you have second or two before it registers you're dead. It takes a bit of practice to get the method down.
#22 Feb 24 2011 at 1:39 AM Rating: Decent
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TheHolyDragoonSeraphus wrote:
I want to solo this during Blunt as DRG(More chances than Piercing) but I don't have apoc atma, how can I run out of 20' range without getting drawn in? I know some people keep zombying with apoc until they get away but without it, is it possible?
Bring something to pull him with (/ra) either an aht urgan chakram or a pebble or something. Stand at 21-22"ish away and pull him (/ra's max distance is 25"). Don't move from the spot and let him walk towards you. He wont draw you in.
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