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Question about solo gear (mainly evasion)Follow

#1 Oct 11 2009 at 2:12 AM Rating: Good
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Hello. I've been thinking about picking thief back up lately, and I plan to do a lot of soloing and duoing with it. I'm just wondering how important other thfs consider evasion gear, and how much of other stats I should be sacrificing in order to get it. Would it be beneficial to stack as much evasion as I can in every slot, or is that overdoing it?

Also, I'm a bit confused about gear that has "evasion +X" compared to "evasion skill +X." Could anyone tell me what exactly is the difference between evasion and evasion skill?
#2 Oct 11 2009 at 8:08 AM Rating: Good
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What are you planning to solo/duo? XP or high level NMs? And if xp, what level are you?

Edited, Oct 11th 2009 12:08pm by ThiefKiller
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#3 Oct 11 2009 at 10:26 AM Rating: Good
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if you're going to solo/duo stuff like FoV, you really shouldn't need all that much evasion gear. I FoVed my way from 37-75 with pretty much nothing more than dodge earrings and an emp hairpin(which became ohat at 70). THF has the highest evasion skill of any job and in addition you get 4 evasion bonuses by 70. If you're soloing/duoing against EMs and Ts you should be ok without very much in the way of eva gear. you may need more if you get links or set your sights on stronger mobs. Some mobs are more accurate than others as well. Basically, if you're getting hit a lot, add more eva. If you're not, you can replace eva for other beneficial stats. I know it's kinda a vague answer, but it was kinda a vague question. Hard to be speciic if I don't know exactly what you're doing and what yu're fighting.
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#4 Oct 11 2009 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
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http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b330/noodles355/Evasion.png
Set 2 is my standard capped-acc TP set, I'd use this on anything EM or below with signet
Set 10 is my Utsu: Ni set, and I also like to use it on moderately harder things DC-EM without signet bonus.
Set 4 is my full eva/ichi set, I use this on anything T+ generally (aswell as casting ichi). I also sometimes swap to it if an easy mob got lucky and took me to 1 shadow when all timers are down, just incase. Likewise, if :Ni timer is up and I have shadows left, I'll switch to set 10 or 2 untill they go down.

I eventually want Denali legs and hands in set 4.

The earrings are suppa/brutal in 2, and musical/novia in 10 and 4. Res of gear should be obvious.

Hope that helps.

Edited, Oct 11th 2009 6:38pm by Noodles
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#5 Oct 12 2009 at 3:22 AM Rating: Good
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@ 75 i mostly solo as thf/dnc.

i have a haste set up for this, keeping drain samba II up will keep you alive, got an evasion set ready for when i get hit with some nasty tp moves.

also shield and parry skills are higher because of this, but getting those up is soooo hard....
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#6 Oct 12 2009 at 5:56 PM Rating: Decent
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Evasion is to evasion combat skill as Attack is to weapon combat skill.

Evasion is the total evasion that is compared to the mobs accuracy to determine the probability of it hitting you. Evasion is composed of Evasion Skill, plus Agi/2, plus Evasion+ effects from gear, food or job trait bonuses. Not only does thf get the highest skill level (A+ = 276) but they get 4 evasion+ job trait bonuses.

Evasion Skill is there in order to have a "skill up" means of increasing evasion.

Effectively, Evasion +1 would have the same effect as Evasion Skill +1.


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#7 Oct 12 2009 at 10:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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Lokithor, Evasion Skill +1 is ~+.9? Evasion after 200skill.


?=Not sure on that.



Speak with nefarius.lover on ki; he know's the ins and outs of THF EVA setups.
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#8 Oct 13 2009 at 1:14 PM Rating: Good
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SakkaofValefor wrote:
Lokithor, Evasion Skill +1 is ~+.9? Evasion after 200skill.


?=Not sure on that.



Speak with nefarius.lover on ki; he know's the ins and outs of THF EVA setups.


^

When Soloing Higher level NM's for gil/gear drops etc. My evasion set looks like this:

Azoth
Blau (Working on ermine's tail or adder jambiya...still deciding on which I want)
Ungur Boomerang (xbow and Blind bolts for things I can land them on...which is a lot with a decent racc set)
Empress Hairpin
Evasion Torque
Elusive Earring X2 (Soon to get JoL Earring)
Scorpion Harness +1
War Gloves +1/Master Caster's Mitts
Breeze ring x2 (Upgrading to wivre +1's soon)
Boxer's Mantle
Scouter's Rope
Crow Hose (Can't seem to find a damned pair of raven hose on my server ><)
Dance Shoes+1


Its a solid set. I'm happy with the results. Still have a few upgrades to make. But with a good evasion set, soloing high level NM's is a lot of fun.
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#9 Oct 13 2009 at 4:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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ThiefKiller has pretty much the max evasion set possible. I've used a gear set akin to this to solo om'aerns by the JoL pop site (yes, OM Aerns), and that's pretty cool. However one nitpick

Quote:
Empress Hairpin


Honestly the Optical Hat is a better choice than the empress hairpin. The 3 agility isn't going to make a difference with the rest of your gearset (trust me, it's over the top), and additionally the empress hairpin reduces maximum HP by 15 and gives no defense. The optical hat, while also giving no defense gives 10 accuracy and 10 ranged accuracy and does NOT reduce maximum HP. If you're fighting anything where you would NEED this kind of evasion you will benefit from the accuracy without question. Now If you wanted a purely defensive evasion headpiece go with the Wivre Mask or if you can find one, the wivre mask +1 The HQ has 11 evasion which matches the empress by all but 1 agility, does not reduce maximum HP at all, and adds 21 defense, 3 vitality and 3 strength.

But again I reiterate that this is way over the top. You won't find any realistic scenario where more evasion than this is necessary. Remember, evasion caps at 80% and mobs have a 20% accuracy floor. On average one in every five hits made against you WILL land, and the random number generator can and often does throw them together in unpredictable clumps. No amount of added evasion can stop mobs from connecting many times in a short span. I once got hit four times in a row and seven times out of ten by a level 1 bee in gustaburg in my lvl 75 evasion stuff, but I also dodged 25 times in a row on that very same bee. I went afk for an hour and came back later to review the chatlog and that's what I saw.

You would do better to add a Rajas ring in place of a breeze ring at the very least. If nothing else, even in max evasion Rajas >>> breeze ring. The wivre ring +1 has a few HP to go with it so maybe that, but if 18 hp is enough to change a battle it was too close to call anyway so I'd still advocate Rajas >>> evasion ring.

Edited, Oct 13th 2009 6:14pm by Melphina
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#10 Oct 13 2009 at 4:41 PM Rating: Decent
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I have to agree with mel on hairpin and rings. You want to keep some dd gear in during solo so the fight length is kept down too. I do use agl rings during shadow casting tho.

I try to use as little evasion as possible in any solo circumstance (IE none tw-EM, little T-VT, more IT, Lots on IT+/things i might tank/ oh crap moments, and back to none for Sim as he doesnt miss anyway). The shorter the fight, the few times I needed to evade.

On a few NMs, no so much anymore but in the past, I would use a evasion/subtle blow/att setup, use attack food, and let the lower acc rate + subtle blow cut down on TP moves that suck.

These days I rarely bust out my evasion gear on thf. During events that I pull hate on, things die before it matters, and I solo rarely, and if i do its on EM- mobs so no evasion needed. If i go to campaign /nin for some reason I would use it there, but /dnc + mkris is such fast exp there.

I do bring it to events I go /drk. In a pinch, thf/drk can actually generate hate, use 2hr, keep hate, then evasion tank some until whatever happens (you lose, real tank takes over, it dies). In full evasion gear you will be suprised how much some big things will miss you.
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#11 Oct 13 2009 at 8:06 PM Rating: Good
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Mistress Melphina wrote:
ThiefKiller has pretty much the max evasion set possible. I've used a gear set akin to this to solo om'aerns by the JoL pop site (yes, OM Aerns), and that's pretty cool. However one nitpick

Quote:
Empress Hairpin


Honestly the Optical Hat is a better choice than the empress hairpin.


It would seem, but to me it seems mostly irrelevant.

The 10 acc on Ohat...if Im fighting something I really need acc on, I haven't found anything yet where pizza didn't make up the difference. Also being able to abuse 5/5 feint makes it a little less of a big deal to me.

I don't really want to be at capped acc anyway. Most of the big stuff I fight I try to find a balance with TP feeding. Which is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other but it's just the groove I like to sit in I guess.

Racc...in between mob swings if I need to land a bolt I can fire off a bolt in a full racc set and swap back to evasion before the next round with proper timing.

I went with emp pin for my idle evasion set, not only for the 1.5 ish evasion+ potential but have been toying around with maxing agl to see if I could noticably up parry proc, which to my knowledge doesn't count towards the 80% evasion cap (also the reason for breeze rings as opposed to wivres).

I have a 20% haste/evasion set too that I idle in if shadow timers have been up for a while and so on and so on. I probably have like 4-5 different sets depending on what I am soloing/duoing. I probably blink more on solo battles than I do in merit parties lol.

...orrrrr maybe I'm just an evasion ***** lol. But I really like most things in the game not being able to hit me.

Edited, Oct 13th 2009 10:09pm by ThiefKiller
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#12 Oct 14 2009 at 2:13 AM Rating: Good
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I've got,
Ermine's (or DPS weapon)
Adder (or DPS)
Ungur Boomerang (or Xbow)
Optical
Evasion Torque
Elusive/Musical Earring
Novia Earring
Antares Harness
Denali Wristbands
Wivre Ring +1 x2 (or Breeze/Nimble+1, or BQ ring)
Boxer's Mantle
Scouter's Rope
Raven Hose
Dance Shoes+1

I find that my accuracy is too low on very high level stuff. Even when I use squid sushi (gives agi for eva, and also gives ranged acc) it's low. But for serious battles, I usually use Carbonara for HP, which doesn't give acc. Some of these pieces are just collector's items (wivre rings usually), but I think WivreMask+1/Emperor's would be another good collector's piece. I say that because of inventory space issues.

Here's your answer, OP:
[Absolutely get a max evasion set. Get the best possible one you can reasonably afford. Do not use it as your main set (or at least full-time set) for lower and mid-range mobs.

Strategy(1): Melee in your normal DPS set & your full evasion set in a combined way in which you find a balance with your utsusemi timers. That is, you don't want timers to be down and to be taking hits, but you don't want huge timer surpluses from excess evading.
Strategy(2): Use a hybrid set that combines DPS and evasion features. Here's an example set: Denali Bonnet, Evasion Torque, Novia Earring, Suppanomimi, Antares Harness, Denali Wristbands, Rajas Ring, Ulthalam's Ring, Boxer's Mantle, Scouter's Rope, Homam Cosciales, Homam Gambieras. Obviously the optimal DPS:Eva ratio varies depending on mob/situation. Play around and find a set that works for what you usually find yourself doing.]

Strategy (1) and (2) are both fine. On lower level mobs, I find myself going with (2), or the hybrid build. On tougher mobs, I find myself doing something like strategy (1). However, in place of the dps build, I use a hybrid subtle blow one; a mix of subtle blow and evasion, specced for tanking (not to be confused with a hybrid subtle blow build specced for dps'ing). This goes back to what thiefkiller said about minimizing his TP feeding. The concept is the same. Main tank in the subtle blow hybrid, and balance in max evasion when you see wise to keep your timers good. In some cases, however, there are some NM's where full-timing a max evasion build is not a choice, but necessary for survival (at least when you don't have sufficient buffs).

Edited, Oct 14th 2009 8:19am by Shamaya
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#13 Oct 15 2009 at 2:53 PM Rating: Default
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I have soloed alot of NM's like Unger and Chrybdis and others in the 80 range and this set up has done me well. I also have evas capped and maxed merits on it as well I dont get hit often and thank goodness for that being taru I cant afford to get hit 2x. I know I dont have all the best gear but this set works very well for me to evade most attacks, yes the fights are long but I dont die.
I do swap gear for max damage on DE and I usually lose 2-3 shadows in this process but then swap back into evas gear and reapply so I am less likely to get hit. Here is my link to the equips

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?198613

I will add this note if your evas is not capped cap your parry first then cap your evasion, I didnt and am having a rough time capping it.

Evasion is a great tool when Soloing NM's

#14 Oct 15 2009 at 11:01 PM Rating: Good
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Shamaya wrote:
Melee in your normal DPS set & your full evasion set in a combined way in which you find a balance with your utsusemi timers. That is, you don't want timers to be down and to be taking hits, but you don't want huge timer surpluses from excess evading.


I could not possibly agree with this more.

And I have 4-5 different sets with haste acc evasion mixed in for just such occasions. And it changes if you have mage haste support etc, but this advice in particualr is invaluable.

I see a lot of thvs I know full time pure evasion gear for soling everything. I even had one tell me that they didnt care how long it took, just that they survived. But the longer you drag a fight out, the more opportunities you have to die, especially on a harder mob. And if you are trying ot tank, you just cant do it in pure evasion. YOu need that DoT to help you maintain hate.

Its going to be specific to what you are fighting and what support you have but you definately want to maintain that ballance.
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#15 Oct 16 2009 at 12:30 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I have soloed alot of NM's like Unger and Charybdis and others in the 80 range and this set up has done me well.


*pause*

Those are fairly rough NMs to go soloing on thf. Ungur can paralyze/dispel/biteyourfaceoff. Charybdis has attack rounds that vary between 1 and 6, though granted, a full eva set makes most of those miss. Hits are going to land at times. Do you haul around a bunch of hi-pots (and remedies for ungur)?
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#16 Oct 18 2009 at 10:07 AM Rating: Decent
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Wolfhart wrote:
Quote:
I have soloed alot of NM's like Unger and Charybdis and others in the 80 range and this set up has done me well.


*pause*

Those are fairly rough NMs to go soloing on thf. Ungur can paralyze/dispel/biteyourfaceoff. Charybdis has attack rounds that vary between 1 and 6, though granted, a full eva set makes most of those miss. Hits are going to land at times. Do you haul around a bunch of hi-pots (and remedies for ungur)?


These things become a lot easier when you have a high level NPC and a signal+tactics pearl.
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#17 Oct 19 2009 at 1:26 AM Rating: Good
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i did ungur on thf too, it was my first real NM i tanked on thf.
i had a brd helping me (curing, debuffing and mambo stuff) after i noticed that i only needed utsusemi: ni to survive his attacks, i equiped full haste, and even then i had little to no trouble.

but then again, double mambo is very sweet on thf ^^
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