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Someone help me justify thisFollow

#1 Aug 23 2009 at 3:22 AM Rating: Default
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Fang Earring - +4 Atk -4 Eva 3.5k

Spike Earring -+5 Atk -5 Eva 27k


I cannot justify spending 23.5k more for ONE.. atk... I just can't.

Call me a noob. Whatever. But unless someone can prove to me that 23k for one point of atk is 'worth' it. I'm sticking to fang.
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#2 Aug 23 2009 at 3:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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You can sell it back.

Huzzah!
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#3 Aug 23 2009 at 4:27 AM Rating: Decent
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I personally just used Fang Earrings until an actual "upgrade" became available. I didn't see 1-2 attack being "OMG GIMP". I mean seriously. There are probably better things out there that you can spend that gil on.
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#4 Aug 23 2009 at 10:11 AM Rating: Good
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I guess you don't own any HQ endgame gear. 10mil for +1 INT on BLM? Who would do something like that?
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#5 Aug 23 2009 at 10:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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WordlessThrenody wrote:
Fang Earring - +4 Atk -4 Eva 3.5k

Spike Earring -+5 Atk -5 Eva 27k


I cannot justify spending 23.5k more for ONE.. atk... I just can't.

Call me a noob. Whatever. But unless someone can prove to me that 23k for one point of atk is 'worth' it. I'm sticking to fang.


the hope is that eventually you won't be able to justify saving 25k~ when you could get a mild stat increases. have to turn it around like phoenix wright.

Edited, Aug 23rd 2009 2:28pm by milich
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#6 Aug 24 2009 at 1:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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wait until you get to lvl 63

coral earring 20k
merman earring 400k

Almost all HQ's are gonna be a big price hike for +1 stat.

Sure, you don't need to pay the extra, but if you wanna be the best at your job, your gonna have to upgrade to HQ's at some point
#7 Aug 24 2009 at 4:29 AM Rating: Good
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Don't forget that Merman's offer 1% (per ear) more magic damage reduction that is used by tank in their Magic Defense set.

Edited, Aug 24th 2009 2:30pm by Neraya
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#8 Aug 24 2009 at 5:44 AM Rating: Decent
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HQ prices subsidize the price of NQs.

They cost about 6k per synthesis, and don't always HQ. Most crafters will actually dump the NQs at an NPC b/c they take so long to sell. If a crafter is actually saving and selling the NQs they're having trouble making profits and need to look at other synths.

E.g even if you don't think the spikes are worth whatever they are on your server, enough other people do for the price to be whatever it is (otherwise it will go down). If there aren't enough spike earrings being made to meet demand, the price of spike earrings will go up.
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#9 Aug 24 2009 at 6:19 AM Rating: Good
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Augment that earring, with +1 dex it's better than the spike XD
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#10 Aug 25 2009 at 6:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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is 23.5k really that hard to come by?
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#11 Aug 25 2009 at 6:25 AM Rating: Good
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Thats like people who use Fang Necklace instead of Spike, Like cmon grow a pear and spend a little extra gear to look decent, and have decent gear.
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#12 Aug 25 2009 at 7:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Deboro wrote:
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Cmon, grow a pear


I strongly suggest that if any of you have ANY fruit, be it pear or otherwise, growing between your legs you need to set the controller down and seek immediate medical attention (and possibly an appearance on Letterman).
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#14 Aug 26 2009 at 1:18 PM Rating: Decent
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50k for a completely minor stat increase that you'll be able to sell for 45-55k in a couple weeks when you no longer require the items.
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#15 Aug 26 2009 at 1:32 PM Rating: Good
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The problem is that you are looking at a single piece of gear. I have been playing for years and paid attention to a lot of parties.

Most people have more than one job and a lot of gear can be used on another.

Also, when you add up going with the cheaper piece because HQ is too expensive it adds up a lot. There's head piece, legs, body, hands and so on. In the end, you are not just 1 attack lower than you think. You are lots of attack and acc lower.

To make matters worse, you join an exp party with another 5 people that have the same mentality and you can just see how much less efficient that party is. Everytime you join a party, start checking people's gear and notice how efficient the exp is. You will be surprised.

Just one player that likes to go the cheaper route can cause his exp party to go from good to horrible depending on that person's job.

We can understand going the cheaper route with gear that can only be used on one job and you have many jobs but complaining about something that you could possibly own for years is useless
#16 Aug 26 2009 at 1:47 PM Rating: Good
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Diamond Ring +4 INT 50k
Snow Ring +5 INT 500k

Now justify that. But guess what, good mages do buy snow rings.

So good melees would pay a mere extra 45k for a pair. ****, that's so cheap comparatively.

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 5:48pm by icebabyisme
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#17 Aug 26 2009 at 3:33 PM Rating: Good
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+2 ATT is not gonna make or break your party.

But in reality. You have 2 level 75 jobs, You should be able to make money pretty easily.
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#18 Aug 27 2009 at 11:13 PM Rating: Decent
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Lol, at this stage, thieves like myself pay millions if we can get one extra point of attack -.-
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#19 Aug 29 2009 at 12:24 AM Rating: Default
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Like i said before, most of you are looking at an endgame perspective. Which at endgame, If you're not shelling out a few mil for the smallest increase, you're a complete failure.

I'm talking specifically the level in which these earrings are used. 55-60...

Sure you can sell them back. Sure you can use them on other jobs.

But on my server, and my character, I've never had an easy time making money, even when i spend weeks doing it, I still only make a few hundred K. And that few hundred can be better spent on weapon upgrades, or other pieces that offer me a bit more, be it stat wise or MP(as a mage), So dumping 50k on 2 atk, isn't the easiest thing for me to get away with.

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#20 Aug 29 2009 at 1:00 AM Rating: Good
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the whitebox alone is worth the 24k
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#21 Aug 29 2009 at 5:19 AM Rating: Good
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for something that i wont be using for a long time i would just get the nq, in this example i would just get the fang earrings. Unlike for say a fang vs spike necklace where you will be using it for a very very long time.
#22 Aug 30 2009 at 12:30 PM Rating: Decent
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Whether or not Spike Earring's cost is worth it depends on what your alternatives are. You have to ask yourself certain questions.

What is the rest of your gear like? I'm guessing if you can't afford Spike Earrings, you can't afford a good accuracy set for TP. If your gear doesn't have enough accuracy to hit about 80% sans food/buffs, you are likely better off using Sole Sushi. If you can't afford that, even Crab Sushi will work. You should be worried about Sniper rings, Minuet Earring, and try to party with a BRD! Acc food + minuet/march from BRD is better than attack food + madrigal(s).

You also have to worry about what your other endgame ear options are. Do you have a DM earring? Is it Suppa? What about Apoc Nigh? Did you pick a 'mage' earring from either? Do you have Brutal yet? None of these are even available until 72+, but if you don't have, or don't plan on getting, at least one of either Suppa or Hollow (or for some reason Ethereal), then Spike Earring is a good investment. It's either that or the even more expensive Merman's Earring.

So it really comes down to 2x Spike or Spike/Minuet (if you have a BRD), at least until you can equip (or get) some of the endgame earrings. I haven't leveled in a long time, but I'm pretty sure that those are still your best options. Once you have enough gil saved up you can sell your earrings/rings to buy 2x Snipers, then get by on NQ earrings until you can save up enough gil again. That's assuming your other slots are ok already... if you need a Scorpion Harness, by all means get that first.

And your farming issue. You have RDM and BLM both at 75. If you have access to Sky and ENMs, you shouldn't have any problems making gil. Aside from obvious solo and low-man enterprises, I'd say you are missing out on two very good gil makers - ISNM Shadows of the Mind, and KSNM30 Royale Ramble. I think ISNM is probably one of the easiest ways to make gil in the game right now, as all it takes is meriting/Besieged + some volunteers. Royale Ramble is also good because of the 100% drop of an Orichalcum Ingot (~300k depending on server), and the chance at a couple other 200k+ drops. The fight is a little more difficult, and access to it is more limited, but again, easy money. Hint - farm Beastemen and Kindred seals in one of the starter Promyvion zones. You can double it up with the NPC earring recharge, get Alchemy mats for AH, and even set yourself to merits if you want.

You could also try getting people involved in ANNM fights. The only requirements for trying them are access to the past and Allied notes, so this one is good if you do a lot of Campaign. Some of the fights are more difficult than others, but they each have a variety of rewards. The gil drops can be extremely nice, too... my first one netted our group (6 people) a Star Sapphire from one area and two Khroma Ores from another. We ended up getting 460k each for about an hour and a half of fighting and travel. One guy even got a nice Demon Helm with +macc on it.

Anyways, the point is that there are plenty of ways to make gil that don't involve what people normally think of as farming. You shouldn't be farming for gil, so much as farming for ways to make better gil. Spend two hours killing bees for 10-30k worth of drops, or spend 2 hours getting exp and a chance at several million gil? Where's the fun in fighting bees, anyways?
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#23 Aug 30 2009 at 7:17 PM Rating: Good
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In any event, value, whether we measure it in terms of money or something else, in or out of game, is always relative.
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#24 Aug 30 2009 at 8:54 PM Rating: Decent
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My strong preference is to have good gear which almost always includes HQs for craftable armor.

My main motivation is actually to be as good as I can be - which is why I have a crazy amount of gear swap macros and completely different sets of gear depending on whether I'm in the high or low range for that camp.

I wonder how much difference a couple of spike earrings would make to your total damage. Would there be any 0 dmg hits that would start returning TP? What increase to TADE or SA damage would better gear have?

Ultimately, how much less time would you spend exping up to 75 if you had better gear (there is a LOT of exp after all). Would this saving be more than the time it would take you to farm for better gear? If so, its an easy choice, especially considering you can sell it again afterwards.

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#25 Aug 30 2009 at 10:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Thats like people who use Fang Necklace instead of Spike
Hmm... not really. +1 Attack isn't really doing much, wheras +1 STR and DEX certainly is. I consider Spike Necklace to be the must have equipment on my THF at the moment (Currently Lv. 43) and wouldn't touch Fang Necklace with a 20-ft pole.

Quote:
Like cmon grow a pear
****, grow a whole tree. Sounds like you could use the extra vitamins ;)
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#26 Aug 31 2009 at 4:22 AM Rating: Decent
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Hmm... not really. +1 Attack isn't really doing much, wheras +1 STR and DEX certainly is. I consider Spike Necklace to be the must have equipment on my THF at the moment (Currently Lv. 43) and wouldn't touch Fang Necklace with a 20-ft pole.


What? +1 STR is 0.5 attack, +1 dex is 0.5 acc, and you're saying you'd most definitely be able to notice 0.5 attack and 0.5 acc, but not 1 attack?
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#27 Aug 31 2009 at 5:02 AM Rating: Decent
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I used Fang Necklace for one/several/idk lowbie jobs because there was no Spike Necklace on the AH at the time. I sure as **** was not going to not exp for that day because there was no HQ for sale, nor did I catch any noticeable drop in my Qufim performance. Whatchoo gonna do about it?

Anyway, cost of gear that you're eventually going to sell back anyway doesn't really matter, assuming you can afford it. I tend to take sale rate (that is, how easily could I sell this back on the AH) into account though when I decide whether or not to buy some HQ piece of lowbie gear.
#28 Sep 02 2009 at 8:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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The +1 equipment is worth the price in the long rung. If you consistently upgrade from one level range to the next with all HQ gear, the difference adds up to much more than +1 or +2 to the stat you're focusing on.

If you don't want to spend the money, don't. If someone judges you for it, tell them to take a hike. It's that simple.

There's no point asking for advice on a ZAM board then arguing with the people who are commenting on your thread. If you didn't expect the responses you've gotten here, you're in the wrong place to be asking advice.

Anyway, buy the NQ version and be an average player or buy everything HQ and be the best you can be. There are no two ways about it.

Simple enough?
#29 Sep 02 2009 at 9:34 AM Rating: Default
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The average player would be full-timing Dodge Earrings or something equally meaningless to TP and/or WWS.
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kerberoz wrote:
People don't hate emo kids because they're "misunderstood." People hate emo kids because they're useless.


Realix wrote:
PUP is an average to above average DD... when not in a zerg situation... or on particularly hard targets... and when properly configured... on windsday... with a RDM...
#30 Sep 03 2009 at 7:56 AM Rating: Good
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WordlessThrenody wrote:
Fang Earring - +4 Atk -4 Eva 3.5k

Spike Earring -+5 Atk -5 Eva 27k


I cannot justify spending 23.5k more for ONE.. atk... I just can't.

Call me a noob. Whatever. But unless someone can prove to me that 23k for one point of atk is 'worth' it. I'm sticking to fang.


It's worth it for 2 reasons.

1. It will increase damage. THF is one of those jobs that struggles with low base damage weapons to begin with especially at lower levels. And then has problems overcoming both attack and accuracy deficiencies (We have no native traits that boost either) unless we maximize gear and food. So for us at these levels it is important to squeeze every last bit of damage we can from every piece of gear.


2. Other players' perceptions you are partying with. In many cases this is more relevant to thf leveling than the actual damage increase you will get from the earrings. It has a great impact on whether or not you get repeat invites. It just says "I care about my damage enough to maximize" and many other things about you as a player.

Now a days, things like HQ earrings are kind of the standard. If getting checked and you are sporting all nq gear, it will negatively impact others' perceptions of you, and your ability to DD. Whether or not it makes a significant impact on your actual damage, it will impact your party invites and image as a viable dd.

You might say "I could give two sh*ts what other people think of my gear!!" Yay for you. But you should. THF already has a bit of a lolDD perception. Tarnishing that even further by not spending 25K and sticking with NQ gear could make you a lonely THF.

It has been said a million times but any leveling gear can be resold. So it's an asset not a liability. Think of it like investing in endgame gear for later.

There is really no good reason not to get them.

Edited, Sep 3rd 2009 12:26pm by ThiefKiller
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#31 Sep 03 2009 at 8:21 AM Rating: Decent
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What? +1 STR is 0.5 attack, +1 dex is 0.5 acc, and you're saying you'd most definitely be able to notice 0.5 attack and 0.5 acc, but not 1 attack?
You forget that DEX is also a modifier for Sneak Attack. +1 Attack is not going to put a big dent in your overall attack, but the combination of greater strength and dexterity would. It's 2 stats increased versus one.

Edit: I'm not saying that +1 attack is useless, just pointing out that there's a significant difference in items whose HQ versions increase on more than one statistic.

Edited, Sep 3rd 2009 12:24pm by Crystan
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#32 Sep 03 2009 at 9:12 AM Rating: Decent
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Yeah, that +1 dex to make your 165 damage Sneak Attack 167 is such a huge improvement you'd obviously be able to tell the difference and conclude the damage increase is the dex and not just lucky rolls!

That's using level 20ish numbers. If we go to level 40ish numbers it's still only +2 damage on SA from that +1 dex but you'll be doing something like 250-300 damage baseline. If you can actually see that tiny increase in damage in your normal play you must be a real life Shawn Spencer or Rainman.
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#33 Sep 03 2009 at 9:25 AM Rating: Good
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Sir Crystan wrote:
Quote:
What? +1 STR is 0.5 attack, +1 dex is 0.5 acc, and you're saying you'd most definitely be able to notice 0.5 attack and 0.5 acc, but not 1 attack?


You forget that DEX is also a modifier for Sneak Attack.


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I don't think he forgot.

Edited, Sep 3rd 2009 1:26pm by ThiefKiller
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#34 Sep 04 2009 at 6:26 AM Rating: Default
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SirEaglestrike wrote:
If you can actually see that tiny increase in damage in your normal play you must be a real life Shawn Spencer or Rainman.


Eighth grade math out of your league?
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BG elitists <3 haste.

Allatards/uber casuals hate elitists.

Allatards/uber casuals hate haste, as valuing it would acknowledge that elitists are right


kerberoz wrote:
People don't hate emo kids because they're "misunderstood." People hate emo kids because they're useless.


Realix wrote:
PUP is an average to above average DD... when not in a zerg situation... or on particularly hard targets... and when properly configured... on windsday... with a RDM...
#35 Sep 04 2009 at 7:23 AM Rating: Decent
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TybudX wrote:
SirEaglestrike wrote:
If you can actually see that tiny increase in damage in your normal play you must be a real life Shawn Spencer or Rainman.


Eighth grade math out of your league?


Whatever increase you will get by adding 1 DEX and 1 STR, you would not be able to visually identify in your damage because of the random number generator (unless 8th grade math had a lolffxi random number generator...they didn't at my school).

The variance is too large.

When you start piling on additional dex and str (which you should be), then you will see more pronounced differences.

Edited, Sep 4th 2009 11:30am by ThiefKiller
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#36 Sep 05 2009 at 3:59 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
That's using level 20ish numbers. If we go to level 40ish numbers it's still only +2 damage on SA from that +1 dex but you'll be doing something like 250-300 damage baseline. If you can actually see that tiny increase in damage in your normal play you must be a real life Shawn Spencer or Rainman.
It's still more easily noticed than +1 attack. ;)
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#37 Sep 05 2009 at 4:39 AM Rating: Decent
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No, it's straight up unnoticeable because of the random factor that is in every attack you do.
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#38 Sep 05 2009 at 10:33 AM Rating: Decent
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[insert flaming remark towards someone in this thread here because I'm bored.]

Also, I'm baking a cake right now. Who wants some? It's German chocolate with milk chocolate icing cuz that's all I have.
#39 Sep 08 2009 at 5:58 PM Rating: Decent
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I love nitpicking, and to nitpick--the +1 DEX is only impossible to visually discern when your attack/fSTR are not capped. I can tell you with certainty that if you're farming mobs 30 levels below you you DO see a difference in your SAs. ;)

#40 Sep 08 2009 at 6:22 PM Rating: Default
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You do not when leveling, because even with a crit your pDIF is not capped.
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#41 Sep 09 2009 at 1:02 AM Rating: Decent
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silly argument. who gives a sh*t if you notice the damage increase? it's still guaranteed. also lol @ looking at how much more damage you get instead of % increase (plus pretending that it's not the case that virtually every increase in the game comes in 1%-5% chunklets). a THF using fang necklace instead of spike necklace is a failure (save the "i can't get it crafted or find it on AH", but really, you can get it crafted:P).

re: the earrings, it won't make much difference. still, you should question what you're doing even playing this game if you won't pay 25k~ for a small upgrade. you don't graduate into a fps or action game at 75; this is still dress up and character sculpting.

Edited, Sep 9th 2009 5:03am by milich
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