Math question, Sirocco KukriFollow

Please forgive me for posting this question as i saw an answer to it in a previous post a long time ago. I had a very hard time finding the answer again so im reposting.

I am under the impression that the amount of hp being healed back to a Puk mob from sirocco kukri is more than made up from the low delay of the dagger. I did isnm on thf and used sirocco, should i have used another dagger? I got a lot of crap for the mob spamming tp moves on us, which i tried to explain had nothing to do with the dagger, and that i would take it off if everyone was gona complain.

In any case, i ended up starting some drama because someone tried to tell me to "stand back and spam bolts, your thf is worthless in here". I got really really mad at that comment. Very angry. I have put a lot of time/merits/gil into thf, and i love the job, i pride myself on playing it to the very best of my abilities. When someone tells me that im worthless in ISNM because im healing the mob, or feeding too much tp, i got pretty pissed. This person was on blm at the time, and then stated "oh i have thf at 75, i hate the job and barely play it". Umm ok, so then your an expert? Grrrrrr sorry for the rant.

Long story short, me and 2 friends did isnm, i went thf cause it was geared, and one friend said he didnt have a lot of time, so i didnt bother changing to mnk. Were on the 4th run, and we wipe. Yes i know, very sad, but i suppose happens. So we get up and start resting and the comments start. My 2 friends start joking about how the sirocco is making the puk go crazy with tp moves. Im sitting here thinking, wth. Then the blm starts in, starts saying how im curing the mob and i made the party wipe from the mob spamming tp moves.

I'd like to point out a few things, 1. nobody had haste, the sam ( my friend) told me afterwards he didnt care about shaddows or anything cause he wasnt hasted. The bard was quick on songs up until the last time we needed it, he lagged out, the baby puks split and the blm's aga missed half of them. So we wipe. Not to mention, after the sam went down, we couldnt pull the puk off the blm cause he's back there dropping blizz IV's like he's got manafont up all day.

Blm says to me "just stand back and spam bolts, we'll kill the puk". "Thf is worthless in here". "I have thf at 75" bla bla bla.

In any case, i really really really want to know, am i wrong about sirocco. I allready know the run was not lost because of a dagger. If im wrong about sirroco, im wrong. The drama i started came on the 6th run when the blm told me to just stand back and spam bolts. So i responded by telling him if he could get on his thf and outparse me in any event, meripo, isnm, w/e, i'd pay him 1m. Same for his blm against mine, and his mnk against mine as well. He directly shut his mouth and offered a weak appology. In any case, i was a drama queen in front of friends, and i hate that i was. But i wont sit there and hear crap from someone who lvl'd the job for lolTH3 and farming, never plays it, quote "hates" the job, but then wants to tell me how to play it. Its ppl like him that give the thf community such a bad rap, and part of the reason ppl think lolthf for events. Anyways, sorry, /rant off, i swear.

So, math on sirocco? ill post my gear/merits if needed.

My rule is just don't use Sirocco vs. puks on Windsdays.

There isn't any math needed to be said on the issue.



Your black mage is an idiot. Most likely HIS thief is sub par thus leading to his ill founded belief. If you EVER do nothing but "spam bolts at a mob" you're a waste of space. Don't ever ever EVER do that in a fight you SHOULD BE MELEEING in (hint, if it's not a god that has wicked tp moves like fafnir or etc, this is the case). Plus TP enters this fight with you. Oftentimes when I'm about to finish one round if I end up with close to 100% or a bit over I'll save it for the next go and open with an SATA Assassin's charged + Hidden weaponskill. As seen below, those are quite nice.



All competent thieves will contribute well in DoT and weaponskill damage, and the hate control aspect really helps in this battle as does the ability to assist with evasion tanking. We do just fine with or without sirocco. The thing about sirocco kukri is that its damage 26 should be hitting the mob for more than it heals, so even if it recovers 12-17 damage on average if you cause 20-25 damage on average you still end up inflicting more damage than you heal. The Boreus Mantle attack that puk uses (the one where it spawns its copy images) is not a tp attack at all, but rather a timed attack. It uses it in 90 second intervals, so once every 90 seconds you'll get copies. The increased tp gain of the blau/sirocco combo is a really strong benefit, and whenever I party with other thieves I don't care if they use sirocco or not. Since I have x's I can use that myself, but I don't ever object to the sirocco.

Long story short, if the paltry amount of HP healed by the sirocco kukri was enough to ruin the fight you were going to lose anyway. Just an FYI, even if you heal 20 hp every swing and have strong haste you'll still heal less than 1000 damage before the battle ends (this is only a 5 minute fight or so, by then you either win or wipe), and this ignores the actual damage the dagger inflicts. You were fine.

Edited, Aug 20th 2009 11:10pm by Melphina

Magnet knife.

Magnet knife gives the THF evasion -10 (if that's what he meant...) and the mob the effect of being Weighed down, not evasion down. Only the Adder Jambiya and +1 give the mob the effect of evasion down (that I know of) and they are FAR FROM 3k in price, lol.

This.

Explains it all.

Thank you everyone, Melphina, i follow a lot of your posts when im looking for something, and they are allways either great math, or very sound advice, so thank you as well. Again i appologize for this long post, in the future, ill just take the dagger off to avoid morons. Thank you guys, makes me feel a lot better. I just get so worked up when ppl insult thf.
I was thinking about our argument, and i remember him saying its only good for TH, i think that was my breaking point, or one of them. Thus all the drama. I kinda went overboard in the arguement, and at one point offered him 1m if he could out dmg my thf vs his. I also offered him 1m to out dmg my blm also vs his. Told him to put his money where his mouth was, and he quickly shut up. Even offering an appology to me, at which point i ignored him, ran out of range of his d2 at the end of the fights and warped myself. I was kinda being a jerk, but whatever. Thank you guys for your advice on SK.

If it makes you feel better, I got called a "light DD" when someone was shouting for Watchful Pixie fights.