Quick Mystic Boon and Campaign question.Follow

It can, but it depends on a) if you're using mithkabobs and b) what mob. And personally I stick to /nin for the tp gain and extra safety. Not a big fan of /war, ever, tbh.

Last time I bothered to do campaign on WHM I subbed /DNC for aspir samba.

Yeah, and I don't get what it means, hence the "What"

I refrained from answering your question, since I didn't know if you meant regular mobs, or NMs

Edited, Dec 7th 2009 4:58pm by Kirby

Yeah sorry just the regular ones ><, was studying for spanish and japanese when I posted. I know sublimations helps to stretch the mp pool, wasn't sure how much 'Boon was going to help fill those gaps, thats good news to hear ^^ thank you.

I regularly tank NM mobs as a WHM/SCH on campaign. But to pull this off I usually require meds; mostly the body boost.

Basically, a heavy -PDT and the Body boost allows me to take full advantage of Penury'd Cure V's (Full with Cureskin). Also, Barspells and MDB do short work of the caster types. Add to that Mystic Boon and a pre-stored Sublimation and you will take a while to go down.

Usually what happens is that people start to get confident and attack the NM after I got it pinned for a bit. It'll bounce a bit but it usually turns back at me.
That, or everyone around me dies and I end up holding the mob on my own. I'm not very good at keeping hate when everybody else goes gung ho on them :/

Yep! Boon + /NIN can help a bunch in campaign!

Main tips for WHMs in campaign:

- Use Martial Wand (perdu wand offhand, if you have it)
- Use Wallyturban + Blessed hands/legs/feet (haste+15%) for faster TP
- Use Afflatus Solace (not misery!)
- Put on as much STR & MND as you can for Boon (then switch back to haste)

/NIN does help your damage (can boost your Boon by adding the offhand hit) but the biggest appeal for me is casting longer spells. If you have a mob that you can't slow/para, or he just plain hits fast, you can often put up Utsusemi for just enough time to cast Haste (or whatever "long" spell you're trying to cast).

100 to 150 from Boon is pretty fair, if you keep yourself hasted (and wear the 15% gear above - or more) then that should be enough to sustain you pretty well, especially if you're using Utsusemi: Ni whenever it's available.

You can get much higher returns (several hundred MP!), if you put on lots of STR & MND, Dual Wield, and if you're lucky, maybe even a Double Attack (if you're /WAR or have a Brutal Earring).

... great, now I wanna go do campaign >:[


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edit: sleepy typos, and more purdy colors

Edited, Dec 8th 2009 8:32am by RyaWHM

The main reason I don't like /SCH in campaign, is because of how much (and how quickly!) your HP can fluctuate -- which can make it very hard to use Sublimation effectively (start subli, take 500 damage, subli stops).

Utsu may not directly give you EXP, but it lets you cast spells that might otherwise risk interruption.

Possible alternatives:
- Celerity
- Spell Interruption gear set
- Repose

So yeah, it's not needed, but it also can soak up things like Sweep (2+ shadows, I think) and a buncha awful single-target moves. This might allow you to Hexa more often (less curing, so less booning), which would help balance things out EXP-wise.

In my experience, /SCH won't save you nearly as much MP as it does in regular endgame events*, because you have to choose between Penury (for cures/reraise/etc) and Celerity (to avoid interruption), and because Sublimation isn't as reliable in campaign (as mentioned above).

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*In regular endgame, you can use Sublimation with far lower chance of damage (early subli shutoff), and you can use Penury more freely (far lower chance of spell interruptions overall).
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Still, /SCH isn't bad, and is probably safer than /WAR for the average WHM in campaign.

I'm far more interested in offering my experience with /NIN, than I am arguing that it's better/worse than /SCH. I've had a much better experience with /NIN overall, and I just wanna offer perspective and some of its advantages.

/SCH is fine too, it's just about adapting and using what you have ^^

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But, since the forum is slow/dead (so is the game?), I might as well take a stab at some of these:

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(agree) I agree that you and I don't need it... ;)

(disagree) ...but some WHMs will lack the skill/gear to guarantee landing stuff (even raised to B+ from /SCH), especially since you most likely won't swap staves in. Normal mobs may not be too bad, but NM's are a little different...

Some may have uncapped Divine, which can also cause interruptions when you have multiple mobs on you, and you're trying to Repose one.

Celerity can be very helpful for someone with limited gear, with low skills, in heavy lag, or who is bad/inexperienced/unlucky at timing ^^

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(disagree) I think it's a pretty significant source of MP ... and yes, Body Boost won't always be available :/

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(disagree) The bonus to Enlight is really very minimal, should only be 1 point higher(usually 16 -> 17)

Also, I would strongly recommend using Solace instead, in my eyes the cureskin is worth much more than Enlight's damage.

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(agree) Yay aspir/dispel! Yay agreement! :D

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(irrelevant?) I don't know about others, but personally I don't raise much in campaign ... it doesn't give much exp.

I will raise others when I'm free, or definitely after a battle -- just not very high on my list (campaign is my vacation, I'm here to be slightly selfish for once in my WHM career)

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I don't know what to tell you ... maybe just need more practice on /NIN?

Before Gully/KC, I used Martial/Perdu and routinely capped my exp (you can usually tell by the ratio, or by comparing with others who tagged in around the same time, adjusting slightly by rank). The bottom line though is that you and I don't matter, except to say:

/SCH and /NIN can definitely both max out EXP in campaign, without needing perfect gear ^^

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Well that was fun ... regardless of which sub you choose, try to use variety and optimize the tools available to you. Hopefully our posts above will help /NINs get the best out of /NIN, and /SCHs get the best out of /SCH. :)


*EDIT: I should probably mention, I absolutely LOVE <3 <3 <3 using /SCH for just about every other situation. Lots and lots. I scream and cry and break things when I see /BLM or /SMN when it's not specifically needed (for warp or carby).

I'm very experienced with it, very much a fan of it, a devout /SCH fanatic, love it to pieces.

Just not for campaign. O:)

Edited, Dec 8th 2009 3:45pm by RyaWHM

[Post 700 ding, yay!]



I don't cast with any skill gear at all. 100% potency gear. Campaign mobs and even campaign NM's are no higher than EM at best. You can get away with full MND gear/no staves in campaign against pretty much everything.




It is a significant amount yes. But like I said, it is not required by any means given all the other variables (Mystic Boon, Penury, Aspir).



In my experience: it takes a mob somewhere between 1:30 and 2:20 minutes to deal enough damage to me to warrant a cure (without factoring cureskin). This means I only cure myself every 2 minutes on average.
There is absolutely no reason to keep solace active when you are not using it and could benefit of enlight instead.
In fact, the best application would be to simply Solace -> Cure V -> Misery every time you need a cure; which I do when I'm paying enough attention.

The only time I fulltime Solace is against NM's. Because I constantly cure myself there.





Like I said: I've tried both methods extensively. In a typical session (Let's say a 2.4k Campaign), my /NIN will get 2.4 EXP and like 1.6AN, and my SCH would get 2.4K EXP and 2.4k AN.

And there is a very simple, explainable reason for that: Taking damage improves your EXP/AN.
Bloodtanking mobs (and especially curing yourself after it) gives much, much more AN than evading all the damage.

If I solo the exact same enemy on /SCH compared to as /NIN: the /SCH killed mob will give me more Exp/AN.
They will both do the same damage (The mob's total HP); but the /SCH bloodtanked mob will have taken and cured more damage, giving more EXP/AN.


And for the Raise/Celerity comment, I actually lied: I've used it before. I've used celerity to get a raise off some misshaped player near me while I bloodtank my mob.
Raising doesn't improve my AN much, but it's a nice thing to do that costs me very little. And with what /SCH gives, it goes cost little.



Edited, Dec 8th 2009 5:36pm by Drakonite

I have a feeling that we're arguing two different things, so as much as I wanna say about 15 more things (and responses to specific misconceptions, etc) -- I don't think it would really benefit anyone...

But, I should clarify this at least:
(for those who WANT to do /NIN, not you drakonite, lol)

I don't recommend blink-tanking the normal mobs!
Usually you can blood-tank as you would with any other sub^^

I'm sorry if I made it sound like you want shadows up every second.

I just meant, when it's available, you can use it to block some really deadly stuff (sometimes one-shot NM stuff!) The idea is to use it for big single-targets, or AoE's when you don't have hate (like Sweep from somebody else's mob, etc). There are other uses, but obviously if an NM spams 5 of these, then your timer won't be up -- that's all I meant by "whenever it's available"

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You can also skip Slow* all together, using Utsu to recast Haste uninterrupted. I know it sounds crazy, but I like taking lots of damage fast, dealing lots of damage fast, curing lots of HP fast. Then booning MP, and repeating. All supa-fast!

*You may want it in many situations, but at least using shadows for a couple buffs, makes it optional instead of required. :)

Maybe that's the difference, why my EXP is great on /NIN... I dunno.

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Anyway, I was trying to paint a picture of a WHM with 256 skill or below, and very little MND (because "full potency" gear, MND gear, um, increases accuracy >.>) -- and honestly I haven't tried enfeebling every single mob in campaign with low skill and low MND.

If anyone has personally tested low-skill/low-MND, on all mobs, and had 100% accuracy, every single time ... I would love to hear it.

But I dunno the answer, so it was just a totally crazy what-if! ;)

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Edited, Dec 10th 2009 12:52am by RyaWHM

It's not so much that my healing requirements are so low: it's that they are spaced enough to allow me to abuse Penury; essentially doubling my MP pool.

I really only use Body boost mostly. But it is really not required, specially since there's not always a campaign in windurst. Sometimes I take a Spy's drink to get a mini-hundred fist. I also usually take a Fanatics for "Just in case"; altho I almost always forget to use it and end up wasting it =/

5 minutes per mob if I'm doing nothing but killing it sounds about right. Altho I generally take around 6-9 minutes per mob if I start using Boons; which is more common.

As for damage taken, I do have a lot of -Damage taken gear. 10% from genbu's, 10% from patronus, 5% from jelly, and 5/10 from Cheviot. I could get 3 more from Goliard but I don't like giving up haste.
I also have capped Shield + Merits if that is worth anything <.<

But really, my -PDT and Slow makes most mobs sit in a very nice comfort zone where they are dealing enough damage to get me points; but not enough to endanger me.
Like I said on my first post, I can tank most NM's with this with a good success rate. I've even tanked the SAM Yagudo. He is manageable if you keep barthundra up; else he'll just stunlock you to death :/

Except that pretty much commits you to spamming Cures to be effective, while a -PDT build works even out of mp. It's near as efficient, but not as perfect as -PDT itself. That being said, I <3 me some cureskin.

Idle thread derail, Rya. Is there a scheme to how you colorize your posts?

etf spelling fail

Edited, Dec 15th 2009 6:25pm by kasandaro

I have soloed a normal Campaign Mob as Whm/Sch with only Hexa Strike (don't have Boon unlocked yet)

I typically just cycle between Light and Dark Arts roughly every minute, to cycle Aspir, Drain and Stoneskin (i'll usually get about 150-250 HP on a drain and 30-100 Mp on an Aspir)

My Sublimation is 214 Mp every 5 Mins and 16 seconds (tack on 30 secs for recast) so roughtly every 6 mins.

With Cureskin and Aquaveil i can get Stoneskin back up regularly, and if not, i can flash or repose if needed.

As far as maximizing exp, i was in a campaign last night, it lasted 1 hour exactly,(was looking at the clock when it ended, cause i do silly things likt that) i walked away with 5040 exp. I am on Brass Wings, so thats max you can get for 1 hour. I was not going all out, i was just doing normal Whm duties, Curing the tanks, Dia, Slow, Para on the Mobs, Drain/Aspir when i was down on HP/Mp, Buffing, hasteing, Auspice (since i was not tanking) as well as alternating Holy Bombs (when i had Solice up) Only Died 1 time, took a crapload of damage (which is normal) The mobs also had a Kaiser Behe there XD.

I killed a few mobs, because i just get lucky that way, manage to get the last hit in with normal attacks, that kinda stuff.

Paladin/Dnc and Whm in general, can cap very easily, since we can cure and Enfeeble as well as Holy Bomb and melee.

The point of my whole post is that even without Mystic Boon, a Whm can solo the normal Mobs, Granted it will be a bit harder, but its definatly doable.