Auspice uses.Follow

General question to the whm community. What uses have you found auspice to be useful for?

I have noticed a difference when using auspice in merits, and have definitely noticed a difference in low man scenarios. My question is for endgame.

Has anyone really noticed a difference when using or having auspice used on them in endgame?

It's pretty awesome in Salvage for Chariots and Gears. It really makes a difference.

Really it depends on how many melee you have whacking the thing, as well as the mob itself. Melee burning Kirin (TP regen+ 12 melees), fuggedaboutit. Low manning some NM with dangerous TP moves, (Joytoy NM) cast away. Salvage bosses, damn straight.

If the enemy/enemies in question do not have auto-regain, I see no reason why it shouldn't be used in almost every battle situation.

It is an AoE spell that costs little more than a single Haste, and has the same duration. And although it may seem rather weak, I find that it drasticly cuts down on the TP moves an enemy is able to ready. The effect is only magnified when used in a party with several melees.

It's true that Auspice isn't some god spell that nulls out all TP gain by the enemy, but the casting time, MP cost, range, and duration are such a drop in the bucket that there really is no reason not to use it. In all likelyhood, the MP spent on the spell will save a great amount more from lowering the enemy's TP attack frequency.

Edit:



As far as I know, Subtle Blows and by extention Auspice, effects the TP given by all attacks, including magic spells.

Edited, Oct 4th 2009 8:23pm by Teiei

As was mentioned, use your discretion. Honestly the effect it has is relatively minute enough (like a COR hitting a 2 on MNK roll) that I think people who claim to visually perceive the benefit it gives are probably imagining it. However in situations where every bit help such as chariots, low-manning things, or anywhere a mob's TP move might mean the difference between success and failure, you should probably throw it out there. In any other situation I find it's not worth the MP or casting time, and even more importantly, not worth the risk of having to run into AOE range for a few seconds.

I abuse Auspice pretty heavily. The effect is small, but WHM has taught me over and over that it doesn't take much in this game to turn the tide of a battle. As little as 1% or 2% difference on a single factor can make or break the fight.

The only scenarios where I won't use it are:
1. When the AOE is too bad to risk it. Salvage bosses are a great example, I won't bother on them, although any lesser chariot I will. HNM like Cerberus are another great example of when it's just too risky.
2. When it just wouldn't matter. Either the mobs die too fast for it to matter, such as Nyzul Isle; or there are simply too many melees beating on it for it to matter, such as a zerg fight or Dynamis/Einherjar where there are a ton of people beating on one mob.

Any situation outside those 2, Auspice is up full-time.

That's a good point too. Supposedly it caps at +50, so a level 75 MNK (moreso a Black Belt, Rajas etc. MNK) will almost certainly be hitting the cap if you have a COR. More reason not to risk it on Chariots.

It does. Many RDM/NINs have noted that it takes more than 10 Bios to give a mob enough TP to use a move (assuming they are playing defensively flawless and not getting hit for damage at all), and this is because of the Subtle Blow trait from their sub.

Chariot's shouldn't AoE you while you cast buffs.
There is a sweetspot where you can cast it outside it's AoE range and still hit the DD's (Inertia And Discharge are centered around the Chariot, not the Targets).

And besides; you can just time your buffs between TP moves. If you're doing things right (Like keeping Auspice/Penance up), you can perfectly do 2 quick buffs between TP Moves. This is a very common practice, even for Melees.

There is no double attack on Auspice, its a Subtle Blow +10% and an Acc Boost after a miss and Enlight Effect with Misery Active.

It was most likely lag if you didn't have brutal on you.

If you're doing that you're already fighting them in easy mode as far as I'm concerned. Why does anyone NEED to know how to do this, particularly when the setup worked just fine in the past?

At the same time, let's not totally discount the MP cost either. It costs 48 MP, which is similar to adding one more person to your Haste cycle. The MP adds up very quickly. Over a 30-minute fight that's 480 MP. Auspice is not cheap; at least, not barspell cheap.


I do concur with this statement, and it's why I think Auspice isn't necessary on fights with particularly nasty AOE. I used to do it anyway, waiting for a gap in the damage so I can run in and cast it before running away again. It's viable, you can do it, even on really nasty stuff like Cerberus if you're smart about it... but it's risky no matter how good you are. A risk that I ultimately decided I wasn't comfortable with. Not because of the risk of being hit by AOE while doing it, but because of the risk of the party needing healing while I'm doing it.

I recall one particular Jailer of Love where I was in the DD party, and just as I had run in and hit the macro to start casting Auspice, a DRK in my party pulled hate and started getting raped. By the time my Auspice animation was done to the point of allowing me to start casting another spell, this person was already at less than 150 HP. I tried to Cure him but never even got the cast started. He died too fast. Even Martyr wouldn't have been fast enough. I then took an AOE to the face from still being in range because I never had time to run back yet. Sometimes it doesn't matter how good you are, if things happen at a bad time then there's nothing you can do. The more proactive spells you have on your plate (Haste, Barspell, Auspice, etc), the less responsive you will be with reactive spells (Cures, -na spells, etc). There is a direct impact on your ability to save lives.


Of course it isn't an extremely effective spell, but it does work. It might not delay his first few weaponskills, but as the battle goes on you will have significantly less weaponskills to deal with if you use this spell frequently. Think of it this way: If everyone has Auspice up, one out of every 10 weaponskills the enemy does will never happen. I'd say that's worth the effort in most cases.

Auspice is easiest to cast when you're fighting chariots already being wailed on with SB and penance.

Auspice is hardest to cast when you're feeding too much tp.

So when the fights are already going smoothly it can make them smoother *when using smart timing* and when you'ld really like to reduce tp attcks you'll prolly die trying.

W00t

Auspice has only a tiny effect (10% TP reduction) which is barely noticed when you have a lot of players wailing on an enemy. For regular fights, Auspice is a waste of MP since the target is down quickly anyway, for tougher NM fights it's only useful if you have an alliance and a WHM in each party is casting it on a zerging team.

Ten percent less TP does not equal ten percent less healing. It basically means for every 100% TP you would normally feed it, the monster is getting 90%. The actual difference between TP moves is a second or two at best. If it was a significantly higher reduction (30% for example) then I would totally agree that Auspice is worth every bit of MP you spend on it in any given situation, but the low bonus as it stands makes it rather unnoticed save for it's additional effect with Afflatus Misery.

Very true, but bear in mind that the spell is self-cast only. This means running into the fire zone. Against imps this can mean getting hit by Amnesia or Silence, and against tougher targets it can mean being devastated by AoE nukes or attacks. That can make it difficult to keep on constantly, and against the targets it's most useful on you might find yourself taking considerable damage if careless.

I mostly cast it for the Enlight effect. If you seriously notice an effect in merit parties, then chances are the monsters are living too long to get decent merits anyway.

Edited, Oct 9th 2009 4:55am by Crystan

I absolutely would not be wasting stratagem charges for that... they all go towards Penury for Cure 5, for me.

Fine, but I'd rather be in and out of AoE range of a nasty chariot with AoE moves fast. I usually have a Balrahn's ring, aristo, brd and rdm, with refresh sanction - as well as having 8/8 MP merits and being hume ;) Oh and if relevant slots are unlocked, 30% cure potency. So with the meds in there, I don't run out of MP that often.

Outside of Salvage, I use Auspice most places and my strategems as I see fit ;)

Or, you can wait until after the boss uses a WS, then run close, auspice, run away?

WHM only, and only while he has Misery up

Someone said they don't bother with it in Salvage.



No monster in salvage, to my knowledge, spams tp moves. You should have enough time to run in, cast, run out before getting hit.

no, it's not needed but those who can't judge distance (due to lack of distance plugin) should know that you can cast spells between TP moves >.>

Their rate of TP move usage says otherwise to me. And I'm not talking just about Salvage bosses, I'm talking about everything in the game that has TP moves.



I never said it wasn't manageable. Their TP moves typically aren't what inflict the most damage, and that's partly why I don't bother with Auspice.



Only LBC

I'd estimate more about 10 times, about half of which were losses due to not getting all 10 of the gears killed and eventually getting owned by Homing Missile bs. But again, I'm not interested in playing Salvage e-peen with you. I've seen Discoid, Brainjack, all that gimmicky stuff, and once you know how to handle each one properly they really aren't all so much different from each other as you are making it sound.



Yeah it is. Auspice works (as much as that's worth) on more things than just Salvage bosses. In just about every case, casting the spell has not reduced the average amount of TP moves a mob has gotten to use in its lifetime, therefore I no longer cast it. If something is easy enough such that I'm bored and looking for something to do, I will cast Auspice and then join in the melee with Misery up. If it's not that easy, my MP is better spent elsewhere.



Actually, MNKs merit that because their other group 2s are sh*t. Mantra's only real purpose is for helping zerg DRKs, and Formless Strikes is generally agreed upon to not be worth more than one point to have it unlocked. Don't act like they're making some sacrifice for something they should have anyway to begin with.

Also, Auspice is not "just" 44/48 MP over the course of a Salvage boss fight, unless your boss fight takes 3 minutes or less. Taking the average duration of my fights into account it would probably take nearly 250-300 MP or so (depending on CMP procs) for me to maintain Auspice throughout, which to me is a significant chunk. All my MP goes toward Cure 5 and -na spam, and I often have had MP trouble later in these fights once the Soul Voice Ballads are gone.

Maybe you can afford such a thing, but in my case, there was no room in my repertoire for Auspice in those fights. Come to think of it, the melees weren't even always in the same party as me, so Auspice wouldn't be hitting them anyway.



Horrid analogy, not even going to dignify this with a further response.



It honestly doesn't matter to me whether or not you can space things out properly so you don't get AoE'd (even though I honestly don't think I could have, because I was still getting AoE'd by some stuff whenever I was not taking care to stand back as far as possible); I still view Auspice generally as a waste of MP and time that's better spent toward Cures, -nas, Haste...

Edited, Nov 12th 2009 9:53am by Fynlar

You know, this "Homing Missile bs" is also easily handled by reducing it's TP spam.



No it is not. You yourself aknowledged you've never tried the Monk/Penury/Auspice setup before.

You're passing your experiences with a very differents scenario as true for all scenarios. This is scientifically wrong. On top of being exprimentally wrong.



Math says hi. Already addressed why this point is wrong before: Auspice will always pay itself against this mobs; always. The same way Slow and Paralyze pay for themsleves.

If you can not understand this basic concept I don't know what to tell you.



This is you going "lalalalalala I can't hear you".

What Auspice brings to the table is extremly close to what Haste brings to the table defensive-wise.

What are the effects of lower recasts on Utsusemi? Taking less damage.
What are the effects of lower Enemy TP gain? Taking less damage.

Is this really such a hard concept to understand? Or do I need to elaborate on why is it a good idea to Paralyze/Slow as well?

Inbefore"Idontusehaste"argument