Forum Settings
       
1 2 3 Next »
Reply To Thread

Mystic Boon and WeaponryFollow

#102 Sep 29 2009 at 6:09 PM Rating: Excellent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Multidude wrote:
Still trying to get the skill unlocked Bsphil. This week as been crazy irl.

I'll have the WS soon enough and I'll get some data on it.
Heh, not like this thread hasn't already gone on for a while anyway. Take your time.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#103 Sep 30 2009 at 7:40 PM Rating: Excellent
**
339 posts
Got Mystic Boon and headed out to fight Inlet Crabs. I used a stack of blinding potions(all that was up) and got as much data as I could before they ran out.

One note about this data is that my melee acc was actually closer to 24% after ~200 swings with blinding potions up fulltime, but since I was short on potions, I started just meleeing without them when they wore and used them right before Mystic Boon to maximize the number of WS I could get with 12 potions.

Data:

Damage Summary 
 
Melee Damage 
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit% 
Rale                  10194   85.06 %    266/608   30.43 %      2/55    33.32     35     42/95   71.37   13.16 % 
 
 
Weaponskill Damage 
Player                 WSkill Dmg   WSkill %  Hit/Miss   WS.Acc %   WS.Low/Hi   WS.Avg 
Rale                         1671    13.94 %      15/4    78.95 %      64/208   111.40 
 - Mystic Boon               1671   100.00 %      15/4    78.95 %      64/208   111.40


WHM/NIN with 256 club skill, -256 Acc from Blinding Potions and no acc in gear except Perdu latent, hit 15/19 Boons for a 78.95% WS hit rate while melee acc was about 30%(in reality closer to 23-24% as stated above).

Confirmed?

p.s. I'll find a way to upload my KParser parse then link to it.

Edit: Eh, columns don't match up. If someone could tell me how to post data from parsers like bsphil does I'll change it.

Edited, Sep 30th 2009 11:41pm by ChronoDragoon

Edited, Oct 1st 2009 5:00pm by ChronoDragoon
____________________________
Rale, Lakshmi, Linkshell: Jhereg, Amaranthine

#104 Oct 01 2009 at 7:21 AM Rating: Good
****
4,203 posts
Use the "Code" button to get a monospace font (each character is equal width so things line up). It still won't work if your text is too wide, though, so try deleting columns that don't pertain to your test such as total damage.

Thanks for providing the data, by the way :) 15/19 is significantly below the accuracy cap, so that's interesting to see. However, it's also drastically higher than your melee accuracy. From this data, it appears it gets a powerful accuracy boost but not automatic cap.

Edited, Oct 1st 2009 8:23am by Pergatory
____________________________
Pergatory (Asura, Kupo LS) WHM99 ~ SMN99 ~ DRK99
"If you want to know me, look inside your heart." -Lao Tzu
#105 Oct 01 2009 at 7:45 AM Rating: Good
***
1,596 posts
I never saw the original testing for the one hit WS testing but did the other WSs that were not MB show 95% acc even with Blinding Pots? If the pot gives -256 acc then a non merited Whm is reduced to a 0Acc rating which is the floor 20% hit rate. Going from a 20% melee hit rate to 78% on the first hit is still a great boost.
____________________________
FFXI: Ragnus Rondain of Phoenix Nin 75,Whm 75,Rng 43 (Retired 5/21/10)
FFXIV: Noemi Rondain of Saronia Arc/Mnr/Pug (On hold until the game stops sucking)
WoW: Ishkabibble of Antonidas Orcish Hunter of 17th level (Kinda active)

Allakhazam's Rating System: Simplified

If you post with the majority opinion: Rate Up
If you post against the majority opinion: Rate Down
If you post against the majority opinion but make a good argument: Slight Rate Down
#106 Oct 01 2009 at 7:54 AM Rating: Decent
Avatar
**
957 posts
Keep in mind that you still get:

1) Dex Accuracy (Dex/2)
2) Level adjustment. You get a 2% hitrate bonus per each level above the enemy. So if you're fighting a level 60 crab while you're 75; you'll have an extra 30% hitrate (Or 60 Accu).

And anyways. Going from 24ish% to 78% is around 54% extra hit rate; about 50% give or take. 50% Hitrate fits in nicely with the "+100 Accuracy" model at the very least.

____________________________
It is better wither to be silent, or to say things of more value than silence. Sooner throw a pearl at hazard than an idle or useless word; and do not say a little in many words, but a great deal in a few.
- Pythagoras
#107 Oct 01 2009 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
ChronoDragoon wrote:
Got Mystic Boon and headed out to fight Inlet Crabs. I used a stack of blinding potions(all that was up) and got as much data as I could before they ran out.

One note about this data is that my melee acc was actually closer to 24% after ~200 swings with blinding potions up fulltime, but since I was short on potions, I started just meleeing without them when they wore and used them right before Mystic Boon to maximize the number of WS I could get with 12 potions.

Data:

Damage Summary 
Player               Total Dmg   Damage %   Melee Dmg   Range Dmg   Abil. Dmg  WSkill Dmg   Spell Dmg  Other Dmg 
Rale                     11985   100.00 %       10194           0           0        1671         120          0 
Total                    11985   100.00 %       10194           0           0        1671         120          0 
 
 
Melee Damage 
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit% 
Rale                  10194   85.06 %    266/608   30.43 %      2/55    33.32     35     42/95   71.37   13.16 % 
 
 
Weaponskill Damage 
Player                 WSkill Dmg   WSkill %  Hit/Miss   WS.Acc %   WS.Low/Hi   WS.Avg 
Rale                         1671    13.94 %      15/4    78.95 %      64/208   111.40 
 - Mystic Boon               1671   100.00 %      15/4    78.95 %      64/208   111.40


WHM/NIN with 256 club skill, -256 Acc from Blinding Potions and no acc in gear except Perdu latent, hit 15/19 Boons for a 78.95% WS hit rate while melee acc was about 30%(in reality closer to 23-24% as stated above).

Confirmed?

p.s. I'll find a way to upload my KParser parse then link to it.

Edit: Eh, columns don't match up. If someone could tell me how to post data from parsers like bsphil does I'll change it.


You use the code tags to remove the automatic space formatting. Interesting find though. With more data to solidify that number, looks like you could help nail down what that accuracy boost is, assuming we ARE positive that a blinding potion gives exactly -256 accuracy. Going with the assumption of 79% hitrate, that's 32 acc short of capped accuracy, which would mean that you gained upwards of accuracy+224 on WS? That doesn't quite make sense though, because your melee hitrate should have been floored at 20% in this case. If you look just at the jump from melee hitrate to WS hitrate it would be (using the 24% hitrate figure) accuracy+110.

I suppose in this case you'd also want to see where your normal TP hitrate is without the blinding potions on those particular mobs. If it's not capped that'd give us a much better idea of where the mob's evasion is, which would show you more specifically what accuracy-256 means overall when stacked on WS, what you should expect for melee hitrate, and if your hitrate isn't floored, what blinding potions really are doing.

I'm a little leery of blinding potions being used because they seem like a bit of an x-factor, but the bonus still looks pretty substantial.




Edited, Oct 1st 2009 12:45pm by bsphil
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#108 Oct 01 2009 at 1:06 PM Rating: Good
**
339 posts
Yeah, I was also wary of the blinding potions, but particularly if there wasn't really an acc boost shown for WS since we wouldn't know if it was because MB doesn't get one or the potions were working like Flash, as you said. To me, the data shows that MB does get a very large acc boost and that blinding potions don't work similar to Puk's flash.

btw I did have a shorter parse before I used the potions with regular hitrate:

Melee Damage 
Player            Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi     
Rale                   1873   80.25 %       63/3   95.45 %      4/51     
 
Weaponskill Damage 
Player                 WSkill Dmg   WSkill %  Hit/Miss   WS.Acc %     
Rale                          365    15.64 %       3/0   100.00 %      
 - Mystic Boon                365   100.00 %       3/0   100.00 %       


I saw that I was getting ~95% and got impatient and started using the potions, lol.

Edited, Oct 1st 2009 5:07pm by ChronoDragoon
____________________________
Rale, Lakshmi, Linkshell: Jhereg, Amaranthine

#109 Oct 01 2009 at 2:52 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
When I talked to Multidude about doing these tests in PMs I actually recommended he fight something close to EM so that he might actually get an uncapped melee hitrate without going to extremes such as taking blinding potions.

By the by, I've yet to see the research that has shown that blinding potions are accuracy-256. It seems to have been randomly added by one guy and further formatted around that since then. In fact, it was added by the same guy who randomly added the "fact" that when you're a higher level than your target, you get an accuracy bonus. I'm not claiming that either of these statements are false, I'm just saying that I don't know where the information came from. As far as I know, the claim is coming from one guy on wiki who decided to add the statement, and its validity rests entirely upon the fact that we're trusting him not to be lying/making assumptions/incorrect in his hypothesis.

Or, if anyone could show me how those conclusions were drawn and the data used to found them, that'd be great.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#110 Oct 03 2009 at 11:19 AM Rating: Good
***
1,596 posts
Flame Ring: Yes or no? I had it laying around from my Nin.

Only other ring options I can do right now are Ruby or Sapphire.
____________________________
FFXI: Ragnus Rondain of Phoenix Nin 75,Whm 75,Rng 43 (Retired 5/21/10)
FFXIV: Noemi Rondain of Saronia Arc/Mnr/Pug (On hold until the game stops sucking)
WoW: Ishkabibble of Antonidas Orcish Hunter of 17th level (Kinda active)

Allakhazam's Rating System: Simplified

If you post with the majority opinion: Rate Up
If you post against the majority opinion: Rate Down
If you post against the majority opinion but make a good argument: Slight Rate Down
#111 Oct 03 2009 at 9:17 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Multidude wrote:
Flame Ring: Yes or no? I had it laying around from my Nin.

Only other ring options I can do right now are Ruby or Sapphire.
No to flame ring, the extra 1 STR is outweighed by the -2 MND. As for ruby v sapphire, I'd have to think on it. Offhand I'd guess Ruby....

EDIT:
base 
80 str 
100 mnd 
 
84 str  
100 mnd 
 
fSTR=6 (assume) 
WSC=((84*.3)+(100*.5)) * .83 
   =((25)   +(50)    ) * .83 
   =75 * .83 
   =62 
 
DMG+ = 68 
 
 
80 str 
104 mnd 
 
fSTR=5 
WSC=((80*.3)+(104*.5)) * .83 
   =((24)   +(52)    ) * .83 
   =75 * .83 
   =63 
 
DMG+ = 68


Looks very close, very slight lead to sapphire that gets exaggerated by rounding in the right scenarios. Ruby ring for attack+2 from STR is liable to balance it out. I'd lean towards Ruby for the attack as well, but really, it's near identical.

Edited, Oct 4th 2009 12:24am by bsphil
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#112 Oct 03 2009 at 9:45 PM Rating: Good
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
Ruby should beat Sapphire about 1/3 of the time, and match otherwise (before attack). However, Aqua should beat Ruby frequently (and by "frequently" I mean "damn near always").

Flame fails hard, though. It's marginally better than a Sun Ring (STR+3 :-D).
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#113 Oct 04 2009 at 6:05 AM Rating: Good
***
1,596 posts
Alright thanks a ton. I got the Flame instead of a Triumph because of Kamu since they were the same price. Guess I'm grabbing a Ruby Ring today.
____________________________
FFXI: Ragnus Rondain of Phoenix Nin 75,Whm 75,Rng 43 (Retired 5/21/10)
FFXIV: Noemi Rondain of Saronia Arc/Mnr/Pug (On hold until the game stops sucking)
WoW: Ishkabibble of Antonidas Orcish Hunter of 17th level (Kinda active)

Allakhazam's Rating System: Simplified

If you post with the majority opinion: Rate Up
If you post against the majority opinion: Rate Down
If you post against the majority opinion but make a good argument: Slight Rate Down
#114 Oct 05 2009 at 2:59 AM Rating: Good
Scholar
***
2,230 posts
After some further testing, here is what i found, again, its not a Huge test number, but its still pretty obvious.

Did 82 Weapon Skills ranging from 100-121 TP, missed 6 times, hit 76 times with True Strike.

Thiw is with only Wearing O hat for Acc, no Additional def or Agi, so just base from a taru whm/sch, however 258 Club skill.

Either way, the WS appeart to have a good Acc rateing overall.
____________________________
Chocobo Status: Retired Green, Black, Red, Yellow

Dmhlucky Tarutaru
Whm/Blm/Rdm/Mnk/Thf/Pld/Blu/Smn/Dnc/Pup/Bst/Drg 99, War 91, Brd/Sch/Sam/Nin/Cor/Drk/Rng/Geo/Run 60

Alch 72+1, Cook 66, CC 61+1, Wood 61, Synergy 56, Bone 54, Leather 51, Gold 49, Smithing 45, Fish 15

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?143946

#115 Oct 06 2009 at 8:52 AM Rating: Decent
***
2,890 posts
Use Aqua on M.Boon because its 5 MND and 2 STR instead of one or the other. This WS is similar to loFB+1 and Death Blossom. STR and MND count for almost exactly the same (depending on dSTR), so choose whichever gives you the most of that particular stat. Being a WHM you should have plentiful access to +MND gear, just don't take -STR.


For that huge a$$ debate about first hit accuracy, I can't believe some of those posters, who I considered very level headed individuals, tried to argue that point. When SE did the 2H buff, they buffed ~ALL~ WS to have a super acc bonus on the first hit. If the WS happens to be a single hit only, then great, else ohh well. It was never automatic capped accuracy, but rather unless your flashed, using a blinding potion, or fighting with a super under leveled weapon, the bonus SHOULD give you capped accuracy fighting anything IT or under. We know its at least +100 if not more, so take that into consideration.
____________________________
RoTZ: Complete DM: O
CoP: Complete AN: O
99 SAM, RDM, BLU, WAR, PLD, DRK

lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


Lucinus wrote:
when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the @#%^ out of the way instead...
#116 Oct 06 2009 at 3:46 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
saevellakshmi wrote:
Use Aqua on M.Boon because its 5 MND and 2 STR instead of one or the other. This WS is similar to loFB+1 and Death Blossom. STR and MND count for almost exactly the same (depending on dSTR), so choose whichever gives you the most of that particular stat. Being a WHM you should have plentiful access to +MND gear, just don't take -STR.


For that huge a$$ debate about first hit accuracy, I can't believe some of those posters, who I considered very level headed individuals, tried to argue that point. When SE did the 2H buff, they buffed ~ALL~ WS to have a super acc bonus on the first hit. If the WS happens to be a single hit only, then great, else ohh well. It was never automatic capped accuracy, but rather unless your flashed, using a blinding potion, or fighting with a super under leveled weapon, the bonus SHOULD give you capped accuracy fighting anything IT or under. We know its at least +100 if not more, so take that into consideration.
If you're seriously worried that acc+100 won't be enough to automatically cap your hitrate for WS, you should consider not meleeing.

Sidenote: ding WHM72.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#117 Oct 10 2009 at 5:25 PM Rating: Decent
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
bsphil wrote:
Sidenote: ding WHM72.
Oh, great, now I have to go get the last three levels on WHM just so you don't beat me to 75.

(Actually, on second thought, screw it. Plenty of other people have beat me to WHM75, it's probably not going anywhere, I'm gonna screw around with other stuff.)
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#118 Oct 10 2009 at 10:02 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Dude I'm WHM74 now, and 12208 to 75.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#119 Oct 13 2009 at 7:12 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Ding WHM75 yay. Had a Werebuster for probably 8 months now.

EDIT: Unlocked Mystic Boon in 90 minutes. :D



Edited, Oct 14th 2009 1:10am by bsphil
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#120 Oct 19 2009 at 10:55 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
****
4,681 posts
I really hope you let the NPC in Whitegate hold on to Werebuster that for you.
____________________________
RNG:75 MNK:75 WHM:75 BRD:75 BST:75 SAM:75 WAR:75 THF:75 BLM:75
DRG:72 SMN:63 DRK:55 NIN:49 PLD:42 RDM:41 DNC:37 SCH:37 BLU:37 COR:20 PUP:22
Woodworking:88 Cooking:60 Alchemy:60 Bone:60 Leather:60 Cloth:60 Smithing:60 Gold:54 Fishing:33
#121 Oct 20 2009 at 4:05 AM Rating: Default
Scholar
***
1,755 posts
saevellakshmi wrote:
For that huge a$$ debate about first hit accuracy, I can't believe some of those posters, who I considered very level headed individuals, tried to argue that point.


I actually never cared less about the results, they were fairly clear from the get go :P

the only accuracy I care about is the mathematical accuracy of proposed models, to me that is important because that's how I roll ;P
and it's nice to see I'm not wrong :P

the neurosis involved in actually arguing over listing possible acc gear in a melee thread is pretty weak to begin with; sure haste will pretty much always be the superior choice in TP gain it's nice to have some filler
____________________________
Dwayna
75WHM 75BLM
94+2 Clothcraft
Lakshmi
1 2 3 Next »
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 21 All times are in CDT
Anonymous Guests (21)