I assume it will get reworked for Cataclysm but I haven't heard anything yet. Anybody else know what they plan to do? Seen it in action on the PTR?
5% extra "spellpower" in Cataclysm would be borderline overpowered for Gnome casters of all classes. I hope they don't make it 5% increase to max mana pool. I'd rather see it brought down to a 2-3% increase in INT, or just left alone, but that seems unlikely.
·Theme
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Expansive Mind
Expansive MindFollow
Went looking and I wasn't able to find much on gnome racial changes beyond Shortblade specialization, so I don't think they've gotten to it yet.
I wouldn't worry too much about it. I've seen something saying +5% to maximum mana pool, which doesn't concern me too much, and I think for balance issues it will most likely end up like that, since the change to spellpower would make this a bit unbalanced.
Sure, we can say it's OP, but look at the racials for the races that are going to be mages in Cataclysm.
Humans get the spirit buff (which will affect hit rating in Cata)
Night elves have a reduced chance to be hit.
Draenei have Heroic Presence.
Worgen get a 1% increase to crit.
Dwarves can remove poison, bleeds and disease from themselves (though they have bigger issues if they're affected by that in PvP)
Orcs have Blood Fury (which is making me consider either rerolling or recustomizing), not to mention extra pet damage.
Trolls have Berserking (This is fun in instances if you're specced Arcane and have Icy Veins; won't work too well in Cata though, since Arcane can't have Icy Veins :( )
Blood Elves get Arcane Torrent (6% of mana recovered, I'm not too worried about that).
Undead have Will of the Forsaken, which has some limited uses in PvE (HoL and UP come to mind)
Goblins have a 1% increase to attack and cast speed, plus their rocket which they can fire every 2 minutes.
Really, this isn't too game breaking, it's just the perks of choosing that race. I'm certain Blizzard will rework Expansive Mind as well as all the other racials to make it a little more balanced, or to give that race some kind of incentive for being a mage. I don't see much use in being a Night Elf, Dwarf, or Undead mage with the current racials, but they most likely will change it on the Gnome.
I'm not too worried about is I'm not competing with Gnomes, and in a PvP environment, mages are easy targets to begin with, and Gnomes...well, who doesn't like killing a Gnome? Even the Alliance took a shot at killing Gnomes (Operation Gnomeregan >_> )
Sure, we can say it's OP, but look at the racials for the races that are going to be mages in Cataclysm.
Humans get the spirit buff (which will affect hit rating in Cata)
Night elves have a reduced chance to be hit.
Draenei have Heroic Presence.
Worgen get a 1% increase to crit.
Dwarves can remove poison, bleeds and disease from themselves (though they have bigger issues if they're affected by that in PvP)
Orcs have Blood Fury (which is making me consider either rerolling or recustomizing), not to mention extra pet damage.
Trolls have Berserking (This is fun in instances if you're specced Arcane and have Icy Veins; won't work too well in Cata though, since Arcane can't have Icy Veins :( )
Blood Elves get Arcane Torrent (6% of mana recovered, I'm not too worried about that).
Undead have Will of the Forsaken, which has some limited uses in PvE (HoL and UP come to mind)
Goblins have a 1% increase to attack and cast speed, plus their rocket which they can fire every 2 minutes.
Really, this isn't too game breaking, it's just the perks of choosing that race. I'm certain Blizzard will rework Expansive Mind as well as all the other racials to make it a little more balanced, or to give that race some kind of incentive for being a mage. I don't see much use in being a Night Elf, Dwarf, or Undead mage with the current racials, but they most likely will change it on the Gnome.
I'm not too worried about is I'm not competing with Gnomes, and in a PvP environment, mages are easy targets to begin with, and Gnomes...well, who doesn't like killing a Gnome? Even the Alliance took a shot at killing Gnomes (Operation Gnomeregan >_> )
"Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent. Personified in this case by an 'orrible c*** : me."
Yeah, I've heard the same about the +5% mana increase. It's now an even worse racial, as it doesn't even give a slight crit boost anymore. Typical, really. Gnomes always get the short end of the stick.
Pun intended?
idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
I have a racist ****.
Steam: TuxedoFish
battle.net: Fishy #1649
GW2: Fishy.4129
I get your argument, Billy, but 5% more sp from int would actually be a ludicrously good buff--I can't imagine it possibly continuing to exist. Because it scales incredibly well with gear. Why? Because it is improving the base power of the spell. 5% more spell power in the coefficient calculation also benefits, after the fact, from crit multipliers and haste.
Look at it this way:
1% haste is one more spell every hundred casts (assuming the same cast time of course, but this is just for argument).
So that's equal to 101 spells.
If you buff your spell power by 5%, and that spell has a .8 sp coefficient, then you are essentially casting each spell as if you are using .84% of your spell power (from the non gnome's point of view). And since the majority of damage from spells comes from spell power, that's a big deal. That 5% extra int is actually acting like we are getting 4 more casts per 100 spells (actually somewhere between 3 and 4 factoring in base damage).
But 80% is actually pretty low for a spell with a cast time. Many of our spells have over 100% of our spell power used. And Arcane Blast multiplies the damage of the spell.
So a 4-5% buff to the base damage of a spell is actually pretty huge. Much better than 1% haste by at least, like, 3% dps. It isn't big enough that a terrible gnome mage will beat out other races. But it's big enough that a skilled player as a Gnome is going to be doing much better than others.
I'd vote that they just reduce it to, like, .5% more intellect. Even that might still be too good though--it depends on if they think 1% haste is borderline OP. And, of course, it depends on how much our spells will scale with SP in Cata. If our main nuke is using 120% of our spell power, than even .5% more is going to be a large dps buff.
Look at Wrath. A Frostwyrm Flask gives 125 sp. This racial is like getting a second flask. (5% of 2500 is 125)
[EDIT]
Wait, I may be confused by what you meant Billy. You said that the Int buff might be unbalanced (which it certainly is). But you also said the mana pool change is how it would likely end up and seem to suggest it would be really powerful? And, with the possible exception of Priests, I doubt the mana buff would be OP at all, which is what is making me confused about what you meant.
So, if this whole post was irrelevant to your point, I apologize.
Edited, Sep 23rd 2010 12:32pm by idiggory
Look at it this way:
1% haste is one more spell every hundred casts (assuming the same cast time of course, but this is just for argument).
So that's equal to 101 spells.
If you buff your spell power by 5%, and that spell has a .8 sp coefficient, then you are essentially casting each spell as if you are using .84% of your spell power (from the non gnome's point of view). And since the majority of damage from spells comes from spell power, that's a big deal. That 5% extra int is actually acting like we are getting 4 more casts per 100 spells (actually somewhere between 3 and 4 factoring in base damage).
But 80% is actually pretty low for a spell with a cast time. Many of our spells have over 100% of our spell power used. And Arcane Blast multiplies the damage of the spell.
So a 4-5% buff to the base damage of a spell is actually pretty huge. Much better than 1% haste by at least, like, 3% dps. It isn't big enough that a terrible gnome mage will beat out other races. But it's big enough that a skilled player as a Gnome is going to be doing much better than others.
I'd vote that they just reduce it to, like, .5% more intellect. Even that might still be too good though--it depends on if they think 1% haste is borderline OP. And, of course, it depends on how much our spells will scale with SP in Cata. If our main nuke is using 120% of our spell power, than even .5% more is going to be a large dps buff.
Look at Wrath. A Frostwyrm Flask gives 125 sp. This racial is like getting a second flask. (5% of 2500 is 125)
[EDIT]
Wait, I may be confused by what you meant Billy. You said that the Int buff might be unbalanced (which it certainly is). But you also said the mana pool change is how it would likely end up and seem to suggest it would be really powerful? And, with the possible exception of Priests, I doubt the mana buff would be OP at all, which is what is making me confused about what you meant.
So, if this whole post was irrelevant to your point, I apologize.
Edited, Sep 23rd 2010 12:32pm by idiggory
IDrownFish wrote:
Anyways, you all are horrible, @#%^ed up people
lolgaxe wrote:
Never underestimate the healing power of a massive dong.
Quote:
Wait, I may be confused by what you meant Billy. You said that the Int buff might be unbalanced (which it certainly is). But you also said the mana pool change is how it would likely end up and seem to suggest it would be really powerful? And, with the possible exception of Priests, I doubt the mana buff would be OP at all, which is what is making me confused about what you meant.
What I'm saying is that for the majority of mage races, while it seems unbalanced (which it will be come Cataclysm), when you look at what the others bring to the table, at least for an individual perspective, it balances out one way or another. That's why I brought up the spirit buff with Humans, since there's an Arcane talent (I believe...) that will apply 100% of your spirit to your hit rating. Not to mention if you're in a group with a Draino, that's just going to be that much less hit that they need to worry about, and they'll be able to focus on other things.
As far as the spellpower is concerned, I'm not sure how they're going to work that in. I doubt they're going to do something like take your current spellpower and apply it straight towards intellect, with the two working together in a nice little synergy (This is for when the game comes out), since that would make the current batch of level 80 mages with any decent (T9[10]) gear insanely strong (as it would for all casters).
I just think that it's basically a non issue so long as you aren't a Dwarf, Night Elf, or Undead come the expansion. Every other race that isn't mentioned or Tauren is going to have some pretty good incentive for playing a mage, if you're going on number crunching.
They still have a lot of time to tweak it, and to be honest, I'd like to see something from Blizzard on the exact way that Intellect is going to affect spell power, not just saying "Oh it will affect it?" How? What's the formula that will be used for this. That would give us, as mages, some very good evidence to point at Gnomes and show that they have a frightening advantage over all other races in that department, and that any mage that wants to focus on being absolute top tier DPS should be no other race EXCEPT a Gnome.
Then there's the PvP side of it, which can be game altering. Instead of teams made up of Rogue, Priest, and Mage, you'll see Rogue, (Gnome) Priest and (Gnome) Mage.
If it's not fixed, then yes, it's going to lead to some major balance issues and give the Alliance a disgusting advantage over the Horde in PvP, at least when it comes to damage from clothies, which are in their very nature glass cannons to begin with.
The numbers I've heard as far as raw stats (Health, Mana) are surreal for level 85s, and that 5% buff will be game breaking.
Chances are though they're going to fix it.
"Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent. Personified in this case by an 'orrible c*** : me."
You know it's BASE mana right?
Quote:
Look at it this way:
1% haste is one more spell every hundred casts (assuming the same cast time of course, but this is just for argument).
So that's equal to 101 spells.
If you buff your spell power by 5%, and that spell has a .8 sp coefficient, then you are essentially casting each spell as if you are using .84% of your spell power (from the non gnome's point of view). And since the majority of damage from spells comes from spell power, that's a big deal. That 5% extra int is actually acting like we are getting 4 more casts per 100 spells (actually somewhere between 3 and 4 factoring in base damage).
But 80% is actually pretty low for a spell with a cast time. Many of our spells have over 100% of our spell power used. And Arcane Blast multiplies the damage of the spell.
1% haste is one more spell every hundred casts (assuming the same cast time of course, but this is just for argument).
So that's equal to 101 spells.
If you buff your spell power by 5%, and that spell has a .8 sp coefficient, then you are essentially casting each spell as if you are using .84% of your spell power (from the non gnome's point of view). And since the majority of damage from spells comes from spell power, that's a big deal. That 5% extra int is actually acting like we are getting 4 more casts per 100 spells (actually somewhere between 3 and 4 factoring in base damage).
But 80% is actually pretty low for a spell with a cast time. Many of our spells have over 100% of our spell power used. And Arcane Blast multiplies the damage of the spell.
Just did some fiddling and increasing SP by 5% at 2640 (hitcapped, 1005 crit rating, with 4set conqueror's bonus and forge ember (I copied someone's armory but I forget who's it was)) increases dps from 8218 to 8494, a difference of 276 or 3.35% on fireball spec. Increasing SP to 4000 and doing it again got an increase of 3.78%.
Quote:
I'd vote that they just reduce it to, like, .5% more intellect. Even that might still be too good though--it depends on if they think 1% haste is borderline OP. And, of course, it depends on how much our spells will scale with SP in Cata. If our main nuke is using 120% of our spell power, than even .5% more is going to be a large dps buff.
So... uh... You realise that 0.5% would increase damage a lot less than 1% crit or haste, right? 1-1.5% would be more like it, depending on how well exactly stuff scales in Cata. I mean, yeah, you want to take into account that it gives you mana too, but that little a boost to your mana pool isn't that big a deal.
Recent Visitors: 406
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (406)
- Forums
- World of Warcraft
- Class Discussion
- Expansive Mind
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC