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ME3 Ending PetitionFollow

#1 Mar 14 2012 at 10:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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To start, I haven't played ME 3 and won't be playing ME 3. I tried ME & ME 2 and didn't care for them (yes, I'm a bizarre specimen) so there's no love lost or gained from me on this. I just found it interesting.

So as most of you probably know, there's a bunch of people upset about the ending from ME 3. What do they hate about it? Beats me, I haven't played. Apparently it invalidate your previous hard work and people think it sucks. To that end, a bunch of people are petitioning BioWare to change the ending. Facebook page. I think it's a fool's errand but, hey, if people want to grouse let them grouse.

Perhaps more interesting, someone decided to link a petition to Child's Play, the charitable organization linked to the Humble Bundles. Instead of just ********* you can ***** AND make a donation which I suppose adds a little more weight to your sincerity than just random ******* and moaning. Will it matter? Beats me and I suspect probably not but the worse case scenario is that some people complain and some sick kids benefit. Better than the status quo which just involves complaining.

I posted this separate from the ME3 thread because I didn't want to hijack that but also there's a larger question here of how legitimate it is to expect a developer to change a game after the fact based on people not liking the plot (vs game mechanic/bug fixes). To be clear, everyone has a right to make noise with their noise-holes but should there be any expectation of results?

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 11:48am by Jophiel
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#2 Mar 14 2012 at 10:50 AM Rating: Good
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Square has spent the last decade plus trying to make up for that crap ending of Final Fantasy 7, though they didn't have the benefit of online patching to change it directly I guess. It's an online petition, so that weighs about as much as the paper it's printed on. I think the only real benefit to this is it's link to Child's Play, even if it's only a few extra bucks this year for them.
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#3 Mar 14 2012 at 10:56 AM Rating: Good
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-shrug- People should just make a mental note about what they like and don't like about a company. When making purchases from that company in the future they should keep in mind what that company has done in the past with their games and use it to weigh the pro and cons about a game. But of course that would require more thinking than the average gamer is willing to put into purchasing. Especially when it comes to a popular franchise such as Mass Effect.

The developer won't change the ending like that. I swear people are getting more needy about their wants and this industry grows. I remember back in the day if you had a crappy ending from a game you complained but you didn't expect the developer to create a new ending. Smiley: oyvey

On a side note I think that people were expecting so much from this game that it would have never lived up to what people wanted.
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#4 Mar 14 2012 at 11:01 AM Rating: Good
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A few of the more vocal game critics have been saying that this is emblematic of a growing sense of "gamer entitlement" that's becoming problematic for the industry. I'm inclined to agree with them. They've every right to petition, but I think it makes them seem like petulant brats.

lolgaxe wrote:
Square has spent the last decade plus trying to make up for that crap ending of Final Fantasy 7...


You keep saying that, and I still think you're off your rocker.
#5 Mar 14 2012 at 11:02 AM Rating: Excellent
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Criminy wrote:
I swear people are getting more needy about their wants and this industry grows.

I agree but I'll also note that the cost keeps growing as well. I may feel more bitter about a sucky $60-$80 game than a sucky $30 game.

I know the obvious answer to that is "Don't buy it for $60" but the publishers are relying on that initial rush of first wave players before the game winds up in the Steam/Amazon discount rack. Not to mention console players. So there's some give and take from both sides.
Eske wrote:
They've every right to petition, but I think it makes them seem like petulant brats.

I assume that's partially what the charity petition is supposed to represent. You're not sounding as much like "Gimme free stuff because I deserve free stuff" when you follow up by dropping an average of $25 into the Childs Play kitty.

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 12:03pm by Jophiel
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#6 Mar 14 2012 at 11:19 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:

I agree but I'll also note that the cost keeps growing as well.


Not reallly http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2010/10/an-inconvenient-truth-game-prices-have-come-down-with-time.ars
#7 Mar 14 2012 at 11:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Eske Esquire wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
Square has spent the last decade plus trying to make up for that crap ending of Final Fantasy 7...
You keep saying that, and I still think you're off your rocker.
I'll stop being annoyed at it's ending as soon as someone explains how Red XIII grew a/n uterus using in game evidence.

Edit: A uterus? An uterus? An uterus looks correct, but doesn't sound correct ...

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 1:29pm by lolgaxe
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#8 Mar 14 2012 at 11:41 AM Rating: Good
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It's "a".
#9 Mar 14 2012 at 11:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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KTurner wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
I agree but I'll also note that the cost keeps growing as well.
Not reallly http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2010/10/an-inconvenient-truth-game-prices-have-come-down-with-time.ars

Comparing PC games to Sega Genesis games fails on a couple fronts, the most obvious being the availability of console game rentals. Comparing PC games now to PC games over time would make a lot more sense. Also, what was the price of games five years ago instead of fifteen? The $60 sticker shock didn't happen because everyone's been paying it since 1995.

Edit: Now I'm curious. Trying to access reviews for older games fails to give me their original retail price or else all the site pages are defunct. I have a bunch scanned PDFs from Compute! Gazettes at home but those would mostly be Commodore 64 games.

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 12:59pm by Jophiel
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#10 Mar 14 2012 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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I don't mind the ending, to be honest.
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#11 Mar 14 2012 at 12:05 PM Rating: Decent
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I think comparing PC games to those sega genesis games (only one example, all consoles were the same way) is fine. Especially since those older console games typically were beatable in one sitting.

Look at money spent per hour of gaming rather than cost of the disk/cartridge. The hobby is definitely cheaper than ever.

Regarding the cost jump in PC games, what's most painful about the 60 dollar price is the cost relative to alternative means. I think 60 dollars for Skyrim is straight up ridiculous when I can buy the game a few months later for 33% off.
#12 Mar 14 2012 at 12:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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KTurner wrote:
Look at money spent per hour of gaming rather than cost of the disk/cartridge.

That's just getting into nonsense. Many of the old games were replayable due to their basic nature. Versus plot based games that, once you finish them and see how the story ends, there's not much to go back to. I'm more than willing to compare prices from the same platforms and see how they stock up. Jumping platforms or saying "Oh, but these were better so they're worth more" just dilutes the argument.

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 1:39pm by Jophiel
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#13 Mar 14 2012 at 12:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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Money spent per gaming hour of Mario 3 is probably fractions of a penny/hour for me at this point.
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#14 Mar 14 2012 at 12:51 PM Rating: Good
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I haven't bought ME3 yet, but the whole 'ending' thing didn't bother me until Bioware responded to it. Between the lines, they said that they're listening to the feedback and their DLC will reflect that.

In other words, you have to buy more stuff to get a better ending.
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#15 Mar 14 2012 at 12:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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I probably have literal months of my life tied up in Paradroid which cost me all of $15 in 1988 ($27 in today's dollars).
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#16 Mar 14 2012 at 1:39 PM Rating: Good
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It's an impossible comparison in any case. Productivity tools are massively better now than then, but so are expectations for things like graphics, which are not cheap at all to produce. Honestly, the fact that games still cost roughly the same, considering the quantum leap in objective quality (graphics and other quantifiable content) that they contain, is pretty amazing in itself and mirrors the tech world in general.

More on topic, I don't disagree with the idea of this petition because the general consensus is that the ending feels a lot like "EA forced Bioware to push this out the door unfinished" and that this isn't the intended end to the plot. If this is true, I feel Bioware has an obligation to deliver the intended product. This series, more than almost any other, is wrapped around the idea of your choices having a huge impact in how the story plays out. Removing the player's role in actually deciding how things will end is a huge blow to Bioware's customers.

I found this Forbes article a pretty interesting read, in any case. They take a much different view from most gaming review websites, which seem to just back Bioware.

ETA: Oops, I meant to link this article up above.

Edited, Mar 14th 2012 2:43pm by Majivo
#17 Mar 14 2012 at 2:03 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
I probably have literal months of my life tied up in Paradroid which cost me all of $15 in 1988 ($27 in today's dollars).


Yeah? well you're olde!
#18 Mar 14 2012 at 2:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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Majivo wrote:
It's an impossible comparison in any case. Productivity tools are massively better now than then, but so are expectations for things like graphics, which are not cheap at all to produce.

True enough and I'm hijacking my own thread with something I don't care that much about Smiley: grin

Suffice to say that the perception by consumers is that they are paying more, hence they should receive more. Defending it by pointing to the cost of Golden Axe in 1995 is going to be as effective as people saying "But gas is cheaper than it was in 1979 if you just..." No one gives a ****, they care about what they're paying today.
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#19 Mar 14 2012 at 2:16 PM Rating: Good
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Majivo wrote:
I found this Forbes article a pretty interesting read, in any case. They take a much different view from most gaming review websites, which seem to just back Bioware.

ETA: Oops, I meant to link this article up above.


Those are both pretty good reads, thanks for sharing.
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#20 Mar 14 2012 at 3:29 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Eske wrote:
They've every right to petition, but I think it makes them seem like petulant brats.


I assume that's partially what the charity petition is supposed to represent. You're not sounding as much like "Gimme free stuff because I deserve free stuff" when you follow up by dropping an average of $25 into the Childs Play kitty.


Mmm. Jim Sterling has been suggesting that some folk have been ******** Destructoid out over the charity thing, as well.

Good on the charitable and level-headed folk, obviously. It just seems like there's a lunatic fringe out there that's being very vocal.
#21 Mar 14 2012 at 4:06 PM Rating: Default
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It's quite possible some sort of plot fix will be worked into a DLC, because I can see that as being fairly profitable concept for DLC. Outside of that, no.

I think expectations go hand in hand with what will realistically occur, but for those who might consider it in the context of some sort of deserved end for all they've been through I'd say this: "The very end of the last game game (hopefully) in the Mass Effect series, and you're disappointed? What took you so long?"
#22 Mar 14 2012 at 4:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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Allegory, you're such an anti-Bioware hipster.
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#23 Mar 14 2012 at 5:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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I wonder if it's worse to sound entitled or worse to sound like a colossal ****.
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#24 Mar 14 2012 at 6:46 PM Rating: Decent
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Sir Spoonless wrote:
Allegory, you're such an anti-Bioware hipster.

Being super cool is just a side effect of ineffectual ******** about the stagnation of RPGs.
#25 Mar 14 2012 at 9:11 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:

I wonder if it's worse to sound entitled or worse to sound like a colossal ****.


Meh, it's his schtick.
#26 Mar 14 2012 at 9:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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Never read him so I'll take your word for it. Doesn't look as though I've been missing out by not reading him either.
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