Opinion On: Panda DailiesFollow

Can i just point out, for REAL raiding YOU DO NOT HAVE TO DO DAILIES (Cept the 45 for lesser charms) as i pointed out in my post, Valor Point gear is the SAME ilvl as the FIRST Tier (of 3) or Normal mode Vaults, EVERY Normal Raid after that is higher.

Is it a nice option so you could maybe fill in a spot that that one boss just wont drop yeah, but you can also do LFR to try getting it, its a lower ilvl but you dont need to do dailies. Wanna know a trick? You can only loot a LFR Boss once a week but you can spend tokens no matter what. So lets say you really want the dagger a certain raidboss drops, doesnt drop on normals so you do LFR doesnt drop you finish LFR, you can reque and try the boss again and spend a token for another shot.

Also you can que for LFR with only heroic gear ilvl 460 for MSV, 470 for HoF, and 470 for Terrace(im guessing). So again. If you don't want to do dailies, you don't have to.

The more i think about this topic I'm seeing it for what it is, whiney entitled people wanting free epics. If you don't want to do dailies, don't do dailies, But stop whining about how you cant get gear. If you want gear that bad join a raiding guild learn how to not drool on your keyboard and get shiney purples. Problem solved you get the ilvl489 gear you want, and dont have to do dailies.

As for 'wasting' VP guess what every progressive raider, or even some casuals are ALREADY wasting VP Cause they downed Vaults already and moved on to HoF and guess what? You cant buy ilvl495 VP gear, so if anything the raiders should be ******** not anyone else, because the system is supposed to be there for raider who dont get the drops they want from the current tier as a side thing. Now they cant get a piece because it worse then the current tier, but thats why LFR is in place to offset that.

Also come next tier of raiding no one cares about the old reps (possibly) cause its outclassed and they are going to probably go back to a vendor somewhere to just buy VP gear.

My point being is if you don't want to do dailies then don't do them. But don't ***** if they have an item you want. Go out and raid, it fixes your problem, you can get the items you want.

As for LFR loot, it's there to stop selling of items. I hated LFR for that reason, if it was plate and they could roll on it god forbid if everyone and their mother rolled on it even if it wasnt their spec, or they had a better piece in that slot, then they would sell it to the highest bidder. I was so disgusted by that I just chose not to run LFG back then.

If you really need proof of concept. Dracian, my rogue(linked in previous post) Is nearly exalted with everyone and have a 479 ilvl. Bacon my Warrior alt(Also linked) has is a few ilvls behind 473, and has tillers and Klaxxi revered only cause i ran them for tokens. BTW up until last week I hadn't raided a normal raid (Server time diff caused issues).

My Point being is again, if you don't want to do dailies, don't, but stop complaining you cant get the gear you feel entitled to. Kinda an example is lets say you do a normal raid get stupid lucky and every boss drops an item for you and you win lots etc.Your completely geared from this, by the way you guys speak next week you shouldnt have to waste your time coming to raid, I mean you get nothing out of it. It doesnt work like that, you come and help farm for EVERYONE in the raid, it's wasting your precious time still, which seems to be everyones real problem here.

Sorry for the rant it's just there's so many damn options and still people complain. You have dailies and LFR, or raiding, hell you can also almost Farm and buy a full set of decent epics to feel better about you ilvl epeens. This is an MMO, not a log on 2 hours once a week and get gear handed to you game but a game where you can get gear in MANY ways.

You have to grind rep, just so you can spend VP.

That is a grind double dip IMO.

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/244531-sick-of-blizz-lies-about-hearing-feedback/

The guy makes a very pertinent point about the removal of faction grinds for shoulder & head chants and then putting all VP behind a grind that is greater even than sons of hodir, which is generally recognized as being a major pain in the ***.

Of course 5.1 will invalidate that excuse. 489 becomes 493 then 497. So for certain pieces they will be BiS outside of heroic, which a large portion of the community will not see at current level. Only if it is nerfed after the next tier is released.

I think you're talking about the upgrade system that's coming in 5.1, (Another thing you can spend your VP on, so its not wasted if you dont daily grind), but you forget to take into account that all gear can be upgraded, and by 5.1 Terrace will be out which drops 502 ilvl natively, so after upgrades 489 gear will still be the lowest 497, while HoF will be 503, and terrace will be 509. I might be wrong, maybe I'm having a dumb moment but I still dont understand how Vp gear could ever be BIS after HoF/TES are open.

Also not trying to say you're wrong, but yes BIS natively has the best stat alignment to your class/spec, but with reforging, even most none BIS is a negligible dps loss. For the min/maxers out there that need to have BIS though, nothing stopped em before from grinding for it so they aren't really the people I was addressing in my posts. We all make sacrafices for the gear/items we want, some of us its dealing with stupid people(raiding) some of us its grinding dailies.



Edited, Nov 13th 2012 6:57pm by BeanX

Ok Yeah I can understand what you're saying, but also by that time if your raiding, and your only doing dailies to get 3 tokens once a week (which IHMO) isnt Blizzard, or a raid guild asking too much of their raiders. I showed in one of my last posts you will be revered (Which is all you need to get VP gear, not exalted) with all the factions that have gear.

Head & Shoulder rep were two reps. Hodir was probably the worst, but you could buy relic of ulduar and skip it. I forget if you could buy rep with Aldor & Scryer, but I want to say yes.

This is akin to needing to have rep in order to access hardmodes in TBC. Not a friendly move, though we were used to the grind and we were able to get most of the way through questing & dungeons, unlike Golden Lotus which is soley dailies and is a clear means of gating access to VP.

You could buy Fel Armaments and their Scryer equivalent from the AH too.
Yes something like this for at least one or two of the new factions would have been nice. But in essence I completely agree with BeanX. The current system is not nearly as bad as many people make it out to be. And I did skip the new dailies more often than not. But that was my choice and I don't need to blame Blizzard for that to make me feel better about myself...

Excessive dailies have driven me away from the game TBH. They are too many and take too long (and don't get me started on random drops for quest items). You do them for the rep and for the VPs. I might come back again to the game, but I highly doubt it. MoP had some pretty nice ideas behind it, but for someone like me who can't raid regularily due to time constraints, putting in over an hour a day (at least) to do dailies to be geared up for the random alt raid or pug just isn't an option.

Edited, Nov 14th 2012 5:05am by LGarth

Errm VP gear was originally intended as a consolation prize for those that didnt get gear from raiding or for downing bosses that didnt drop anything for your spec really. That was its original intent.

But the way it is now is like you stated, Its for people that don't raid or can't raid now. Its going to be some of the best gear a non raider can get. The point i was kinda trying to drive home was its an option either raid for your gear OR Grind for your gear. I was trying to point out that if you actively raid then you really aren't forced into doing dailies you can do some for tokens but other then mounts, and a few small side/early upgrades its not something required. But people here were complaining that pretty much they can't have their cake and eat it to, they want 489 but dont want to put the effort in to obtain it. The Gear is gated behind rep as a way of keeping pace with a normal way a raider gears, like i said before, it takes 21000 VP to get every piece of VP gear, or 21 weeks of Valor capping and even doing the bare minimum for tokens a week, you should EASILY have enough rep with the factions to buy every piece you want.

Part of the problem is most people think they are REQUIRED to do every daily every day til exalted, hell even I burned out on week 3 of doing that. But instead of having the self control to say Well Ill work on this one this week that one next week so i can pace myself.

Its like fat people trying to sue McDonalds for their food being good. McBlizzard isnt forcing you to eat, they are giving you the option, it's your own fault for over indulging.

As for tons of ways to gain but no way to spend, There are 3 ways Heroics, LFR, Dailies. Dailies to get VP and rep to spend Vp a means to and end, Heroics give like 80 Vp a day(40 after) So if you ran one heroic a day that's 560 Vp, LFR is 90 for 640 that leaves 360 Vp to get more. Now you could run heroics another 9 times or 72 dailies (over the rest of the week) to get your tokens and rep thats 10 dailies a day one extra on weekends. Which 10 dailies take approx the same time as one heroic.

In the end most people here are concerned about dailies taking to much time to get vp when the time it takes to get VP takes time it self. Hell on Bacon i didn't do any dailies cept cooking and Tillers and was at 2500 VP, so i ran like 4 days of the 8 Klaxxi dailies which took about 10-20 mins each day and hit revered and bought the belt for 1750. now i have like 1k vp and still have the pants to buy for 2250. And since i still want to gear him even as a Non raiding toon i try to get tokens every week to spend in LFR, so I do my Golden lotus dailies, only the first hub, and by the time i buy the pants from klaxxi and be anywhere NEAR close enough VP to buy another piece I'll easily be revered with them doing almost nothing extra.

I will admit I came off very strong, but I was trying to make a point, you dont need to run dailies unless you dont want to Raid, and even if you do the minimum amount of dailies a day to get enough tokens to get a shot at extra loot in LFR/Sha youll get enough rep to buy the VP gear their saying they want.

Lets say theoretically Blizzard took Rep requirements off all VP gear, this is what would happen. Log on tuesday run LFR, then spam heroics until cap, then for the rest of the week people would sit in town and complain their nothing to do, which is something that happened in Cata (Minus rep for Head enchants) and they quickly got bored. This system is to avoid that saying here's something to do and if you do do it it gives you more gear options, so you dont have to spam heroics one day a week and then be bored for the rest of the week.

I did state I feel there should be something for raiders to use VP on (Patch 5.1 nulls this with upgradable gear).

Just wanted to point out, If you do one heroic a day and 8-10 daily quests every day, which no matter which rep you choose Klaxxi, Golden Lotus, or August Celestials + Shado pan (since shadow pan is 5 a day and celestials is 4-5 which =10) It shouldnt take more then 1 hour a day even as a single target low aoe job. Thats about 30 mins for heroic, 30 mins for Dailies, even the most casual of us probably plays an hour a day.

Edit in here as i was thinking while i fished the average raid guild raids 2 nights a week for about 3 hours (so 6 hours of raiding) + 2 hours a week farming mats for flasks, cooking food etc, So about 8 hours a week total to be raid ready and prepared. and it takes about 1 hour a days (give or take) to do a heroic + dailies. So in the end you spend about the same amount of time a week as a raider to get the same (ish) gear as a non-raider.

Edited, Nov 14th 2012 12:30pm by BeanX

That's not Blizzards fault. Seriously.
I skipped the dailies on more days than I did them. I still have some pieces of valor gear. Not as many as I could have, but who cares? And while my progression surely is not that impressive, the overall skill in my raid is a far bigger factor to that than our ilevel.

No dailies? No valor gear for you!

With every week that passes, with every world boss/LFR/normal mode/heroic mode ID, valor gear becomes less important. And these complaints less valid. And they weren't that justified to begin with, imo.

I would like to take a moment to remind people that...

1). Klaxxi has VP Amulets at Honored. The rest of their gear (Belt, Legs) are Revered, which shouldn't take more than a week to attain.
2). You start at Honored with the Klaxxi on the first day you complete Dread Wastes non-daily quests.
3). Klaxxi is not gated behind Golden Lotus; you can easily do em both in a day.
4). Klaxxi also sell 463 weapons (same as Heroic drop/Crafted) at Exalted. Said weapons are ~330 DPS (for a 2-hander) upgrade over the Arena of Annihilation weapon.

Given the above, that's 3 VP pieces you can buy within a week of dinging Level 90. By the end of that week, you're probably pushing towards Honored with Golden Lotus, and IIRC at Honored you start getting more dailies and things to do that increases your rep gain and gives you access to more spawn points of the Guo-Lai Caches (that have rep items in them).

Edit for error fix. Bleh.

Edit 2:

Another interesting fact:

You start at barely Honored (or almost Honored depending on racial/guild perks) with the Shado-pan if you did everything in Kun-Lai Summit, Shado-Pan Monastery (I think those quests give SP rep?) and Townlong Steppes.

So when you get Honored with the Golden Lotus, you're already Honored with the Shado-pan by then if you did your Kun-Lai/Townlong quests.

Edited, Nov 14th 2012 8:51pm by Lyrailis