Opinion On: Panda DailiesFollow

@bodh: Um what? I haven't looked into every slot but valor gear = BiS?

Sha/Galleon drop higher level gear for at least some slots. Mogu'shan raid drops same ilevel in normal mode + recipes for 496 gear in normal mode too. HoF and Terrace drop higher ilevel gear in normal mode and only 6 ilevel below in LFR.
How is my statement completely detached from reality? Even if the 489 gear you buy for VP has slightly better stat allocation than the 496 gear that can be acquired via three* other means by now, for whom does that matter? Right, for hardcore progression raiders. The people you yourself said won't be needing it anyway because they have HM gear.
So no, I won't throw that argument out of the window.
Normal raiding Bob (me for instance) doesn't care if the 489 neck piece from Klaxxi has 100 DPS more (theoretically) than the 489 neck piece that just dropped of a boss. I really don't see your concern here.

As far as enrage timers are concerned, sure, every upgrade helps. But you have so much crucial movement in this tier. And so many people ******** that up. I can't speak for other raids but the biggest problem for my guild is not that we hit Enrage at 10% boss health but that people die to stupid sh*t at 90% boss health. And that won't be mitigated by some gear upgrades but only if they and I learn do properly dodge stuff. Mostly three/four of "they". But since I really like them, I gladly put up with some extra wipes on every mechanic.

Maybe this PvE progression route is inferior to last expansions. But I for one prefer it to having to run HC dungeons with PUGs over and over. At least I cannot be wiped by windowlickers when doing my dailies. And it does NOT cost more time to reach the same result.


*
1) world boss drops
2) crafted gear
3) HoF + Terrace raid

Edited, Nov 15th 2012 3:02am by TherealLogros

That comic is very true on a lot of things.

Such a short comic filled with such good ideas.

A "Daily" quest doesn't have to be done "Daily", you know.

Do em 2-3 times a week or something. Heck, I got a blacksmith who I'm doing Klaxxi and Golden Lotus for extra motes and money here-and-there when the mood strikes me and he's more than 50% towards Revered with the Klaxxi. And he finished his Dread Wastes quests, what, 3 weeks ago?

He's pushing 900VP just from doing dailies and I wasn't even counting (after I noticed the neck was only Honored, I was like "well, how many does he have? Oh, 890? He's almost there already!"

Though I might wait and buy the legs instead, not sure what I'll do yet.

ilvl does not always equate BiS.

Look at the trinket off Heroic Algalon, superior to HM ICC trinkets for Paladins. If you look at loot tables w/o heroics in the mix, there will be times when due to stat caps, or secondary stat value having a higher beneficial value that choosing a slightly lower ilvl might provide better results. This has been true for a long, long time (Holy Light Libram and downranking in TBC anyone?) If I had to choose between a 489 with Mastery as a primary stat vs 497 with crit there might be some argument based on gem slot on which way I go. This is even more important with classes that have to hit soft caps or hard caps like +hit %.

As for PvE progression, I think it would be faulty to say in general that it is inferior. Players have JP, 5 mans, Scenarios, pvp & questing to get LFR ready, so there are multiple paths to get raid ready. Once you are raid ready you have LFR, world bosses and heroic 5 mans to keep gearing up. Then the raids themselves which at normal mode aren't as tightly tuned as TBC but probably the best since Ulduar in terms of actual content at normal level. I am really enjoying PvE & content and gearing isn't insane.

My only complaint is that gear that has never had a restriction other than point caps and weekly caps is now behind a very tedious and absolutely mandatory grind that as mentioned is more time consuming than the leveling itself. This effects alts, and the "token" effort /obviouspun to fix it in 5.1 is not really a fix. It can be ignored, but it is hard to because despite claims that a) it only matters for progression and b) it will be outgeared soon enough so quit ******** are both deeply flawed arguments that don't address the poor game design and aren't actually true to begin with.

Also another good read, the wall of text that is quoted from a player in the middle is pretty relevant.

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/244854-how-feedback-works-and-why-it-matters/

The 5.1 adjustment will not fix everyone's complaints, but as someone who has Tillers exalted on an alt, who is 3 days away from getting an alt Revered with the Klaxxi and also someone who almost has Honored with the Golden Lotus, I'm stoked with the idea of getting double rep, as it will be MUCH faster, especially for alts who have never done Dread Wastes before.

Just think about the Klaxxi and Shado-Pan for a second: JUST clearing Dread Wastes gets you a little into Honored with the Klaxxi, right?

That's 3000 + 6000 + a little more rep, we'll say 9,000 rep.

This means that you'll be 9000/12000 towards Revered (You'll get 18k instead of 9k) on an alt that has never done Dread Wastes before. God, that's TWO DAYS away from Revered and being able to buy the VP gear from them after 5.1 Tokens.

You're telling me that two days to get an alt Revered with Klaxxi to buy VP stuff is "too much of a grind" for an alt?

How about the Shado-Pan? Right now, without the dungeon and a few breadcrumb quests, my non-human has roughly 4,000 into Friendly. That's 7,000 Rep gained with them total. After the 5.1 Patch, an alt that has never done anything with the Shado-Pan will be Honored + 3,000 rep before they do a single daily (the two dungeon quests give 500 each, so they'd be Honored + 5,000 towards Revered. That's almost halfway. Without a single daily done). AND, the dailies will give twice as much, too. I'd imagine it'd take less than a week to get an alt from 0 to Revered with the Shado-Pan once you get Golden Lotus to Honored.

Oh, and Golden Lotus?

The first day gets you just shy of Friendly. That's ~2800 Rep. The First Day will now put you at Friendly + 2,000 rep towards Honored in 5.1 for an alt that has never done GL before. Since each day gives ~1100-1200 rep, you're looking at 2-3 days until you reach Honored with Golden Lotus. You could easily start Golden Lotus and then be Honored with them ~3 days later.

Edited, Nov 15th 2012 7:43pm by Lyrailis

I don't know about you, but I found that to get to Level 90, I found it pretty much mandatory to do most of Kun-Lai Summit and Townlong Steppes.

I suppose I could have done more dungeons, but I hate waiting on DPS Queues.

And God Forbid you do a little work with an alt before hauling their butt into Heroics or Raids, eh? Maybe the forced grind will actually cause players to know their class (at least DPS) before they get into a dungeon?

Some of those dailies require at least a little knowledge of boss-like mechanics and actually playing your class.

I think it is a good thing that you need to take your class out and do a bunch of content. Heck, I hadn't touched an Arms Warrior since Wrath. I had NO idea what the heck I was doing when my warrior dinged 90.

A few days and some dailies later, I'm getting the hang of it. If it weren't for me needing to do dailies on her, I'd been that scrub doing less than half of my intended DPS while I fumble with learning the class.

Try walking up to Vicejaw, and ignore his mechanics. Or how about that wolf? Let him jump ontop of you. Or that Wind Elemental. Go ahead and take a wild ride on the tornados. And then there's those days you have to fight the behemoth. Not avoiding his stomps will get you killed even with WoG, as it does at least 60% of your health in damage.

Then lemme know if your WoG heals you through that.

Edited, Nov 15th 2012 9:14pm by Lyrailis

Then you're either in gear so good that you don't NEED those VP pieces, or you're not as bad as you let on to be, OR you weren't "Ignoring" the mechanics.

Good God, letting that wolf jump ontop of you does at least 75% of your health in damage and it takes at least 5 full-powered WoG to recover from that as a Ret. It takes a lot longer for the wolf to jump again than it does for you to get 3HoPo WoG 5 times unless you get lucky with Chain Procs of Divine Purpose.

Vicejaw? You ignored his mechanics? How, exactly, seeing that he's invincible unless you get him to upchuck unless you have someone keeping aggro so you can hit him in the back? And if you're making him upchuck, you're not ignoring his mechanics.

And the Tornadoes? Um, yeah. Staying in one of those kills you in <10 seconds. With or without Divine Purpose-fueled WoGs.

the obvious answer is that I died, got really upset, asked my mom for a hotpocket and then started posting in this thread.

But really, divine shield.

You are way out on a limb here, you've never seen me play ret. I've been known to cast heals on MoBs while playing ret as a "They'll never expect this!" strategy.




(No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!)

Daily quests are a cheap substitute for truly engaging content and activities.

"We can't really think of any kind of decent solo content so we're going to put a TON of monotonous repeatable quests in the game."

And I love their reasoning too "Well, we removed feature X because it was 'unfun' so we're going to add 10 times more of feature Y with the same unfunness but since it's named something else we'll defend it as 'fun'."

They tried that with Scenarios.

A lot of people laughed at them. The "Elite" (or those who claim they are) said that the scenarios were too easy (while forgetting that Scenarios were aimed at casuals) while the casuals said "They're not rewarding enough" while forgetting that Scenarios are something you're supposed to be able to Q up for, get into in less than 5 min since you don't need tank/heals. Apparently they think something so easy should be dropping Heroic-level gear left-and-right.

I will admit, though 1 item every ~5 bags (which will oftentimes be the wrong type of item anyways) is a little low, but yet at the same time, if you get the right scenario (Theramore!) you can get other things. Theramore, for example, is nice for Motes and Cloth if you're a tailor. You just gotta somehow convince people to actually loot the bodies so you can take the extra cloth left behind.

But for most of all, the Scenarios were supposed to be there for FUN, right?

Well, apparently, if it doesn't give you purples, it isn't fun in a lot of peoples' eyes or something. *shrugs* I enjoyed them all the same. Get a few extra valor per day by doing something that only takes 15min and have a chance at maybe getting a 463. Win-win, I think.

Married too eh?