Okay I want to give all games a fair chance so I brought EQ2. Granted I've only played my character to level 6 but that was enought to find some interesting differences between the two.
The one thing I liked better about EQ2 were the character creation and graphics as a whole. They are just nicer overall.
The games are pretty similiar in that both have nice items that bind on pickup, both have quest systems that reward, and both have solo and group mobs.
In WoW I was able to solo pretty much everything outside of instances my level or above. In EQ I already had to group to finish my newbie quest around level 6.
I chose a priest in EQ2 and I hate healing in that game. You have to target the player to heal them. In WoW you can fight and heal at the same time by clicking on heal and then selecting the person you want to heal.
The map interface is pretty similiar with the exception that WoW also has a small map in the upper right hand corner that allows you to see where you group members are and also shows them on the map. The EQ2 map doesn't do this so it's hard to find your group if you get seperated.
Overall I just like WoW better right now. The graphics aren't enough to overcome the minor anoyances so far. I don't think I can play a healer with a system like the one EQ2 uses.
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Oh yeah forgot to mention the "locked" combat system in EQ2. This is just aweful. I can't heal or be healed by someone not in my group. Nor can I do damage to the mob to help the person if they are in trouble unless they "yell" for help.
but the grafics, they totally rock, i mean look at wow the grafics are worst than pong.
all in all the grafics is what makes a game. That brings back the good ol memories of the sega genicis cd system. back they those grafics pwned.
all in all the grafics is what makes a game. That brings back the good ol memories of the sega genicis cd system. back they those grafics pwned.
For me gameplay is the most important thing in a game and those genesis games had that. Super Nintendo had better graphics, but Sega had the better gameplay for sports games.
15 posts
You can't seriouly base a game on graphics, it doesn't work like that. A game doesn't suck just because it's graphics arn't as good as a game that has graphics that most top of the line video cards can run on very high detail. WoW is one of the funnest MMO's I've ever played, but I'm still getting EQ2 because I happen to like the franchise alot. My point is, you can't base a game on graphics
LOL you could not smell the sarcasm in my 1st post!!! hehehehheh
I wasn't sure, but I didn't want to insult you. ;)
Considering who was saying it, I didn't think it was serious. Wasn't exactly dripping of sarcasm though.
There are a lot of aspects of EQ2 you have yet to run into. Try tradeskilling. Try running around in Qeynos or Freeport and picking up meaningful quests and getting between zones to do them. Try comparing the graphics using a machine that only has 512 mb of memory and a regular video card and tell me with a straight face that EQ2's graphics are still better. Tell me that character customization is superior AFTER you get something to cover up your pretty face that nobody looks at anyway since you have to be at point blank to notice the features and most people turn them off for other player's anyway, when that's about the only customization feature EQ has over WoW (and a few other minor cosmetics.)
You forgot to mention that there is a recast timer on heal spells. If you want to cast your wussy heals consecutively to protect your party member, you end up trying to find an alternative spell for the 3 seconds of delay between casts.
There are a lot of aspects of EQ2 you have yet to run into. Try tradeskilling. Try running around in Qeynos or Freeport and picking up meaningful quests and getting between zones to do them. Try comparing the graphics using a machine that only has 512 mb of memory and a regular video card and tell me with a straight face that EQ2's graphics are still better. Tell me that character customization is superior AFTER you get something to cover up your pretty face that nobody looks at anyway since you have to be at point blank to notice the features and most people turn them off for other player's anyway, when that's about the only customization feature EQ has over WoW (and a few other minor cosmetics.)
You forgot to mention that there is a recast timer on heal spells. If you want to cast your wussy heals consecutively to protect your party member, you end up trying to find an alternative spell for the 3 seconds of delay between casts.
Only the exceptions can be exceptional.
Yeah like I said there are many little things about EQ I don't like though the graphics look good on my system. 2ghz athalon XP, 1gig of ram, Radeon 9700 Pro. I don't think that is exactly state of the art, but it's pretty good.
The healing and locked combat is a real turnoff for me. The healing system in EQ2 pretty much means I can't fight as a healer. In WoW I can join the fray and still heal everyone just fine without having to switch between mob and player.
I also really hate that you can't see where you group memebers are on the map.
I have tried the crafting system tutorial to an extent that rewards you with a nice wrist which was the first item that I had to "attune".
To be honest when I played the game for about 4 hours I started to wonder which company had leaked information since both used so many of the same things including the interface that has nearly the same setup.
The healing and locked combat is a real turnoff for me. The healing system in EQ2 pretty much means I can't fight as a healer. In WoW I can join the fray and still heal everyone just fine without having to switch between mob and player.
I also really hate that you can't see where you group memebers are on the map.
I have tried the crafting system tutorial to an extent that rewards you with a nice wrist which was the first item that I had to "attune".
To be honest when I played the game for about 4 hours I started to wonder which company had leaked information since both used so many of the same things including the interface that has nearly the same setup.
I'm not in the beta od WoW (couldn't make into the open beta... sign) but i've been playing EQ2 since its first released so let me say something about the points you complain. ohh before that my mmorpg background is i've only played ffxi before so take that into account.
First I argee gameplay should be more important than the look of the game since that's what we're playing. Also,graphics is highly subjective because everyone has different preference and different games may have different performance on the same machine - like WoW and EQ2, the same machine may be able to run WoW at high details smoothly but can only handle EQ2 at average details. For me, I prefer the more realistic look of EQ2 over the more cartoonish look of WoW; that's just a persoanl preference.
Second, I'm only a lv 12 crusader so I can't say much about the game either but from what I've gone through I quite enjoy the game. I've been doing quest after quest and earn xp and money without noticing it. I didn't earn THAT much but at least it's sufficient for me to pay the rent upkeep and keep my equipment up to date. for grinding, I don't have to grind much because I can earn xp while questing and after i've completed the quest. I heard it's the same in WoW so there's nothing to complain about.
Third, I solo most of the time (reason I quitted ffxi... BINGO because I couldn't solo there) and at least till now I don't see any forced grouping except for the quest in the newbie island, and that quest SOE forces you to group because they want players to be familiar with the party system.
Fourth, I'm a crusader (fighter) so I don't know much about healing/healer and I don't like playing healer anyway so that's not a problem to me (though I've yet to hear any complain about being a healer)
Fifth, the map interface. I also hate not being able to locate group members on the mini map but since I've never got separated with them :P Even if it happens it's pretty easy to meet them using chat. I mean if party members get separated even if you can see them on the mini map you'd still ask "where to meet" first right? so what's the difference there?
Sixth, locked combat. I haven't played any other mmorpg other than eq2 and ffxi so i thought that is a standard? Guess I'm wrong. Well but I think the locked combat is there for a good reason. If I claim a mob and I'm soloing, then I'd pretty much want to handle it on my own. I'd hate to see everyone land a hit on the mob I'm fighting at while they pass by because they think I'm not strong enough for the mob. If I start the fight then I should know what I'm doing, and if I didn't ask for help that means I DON'T NEED IT. I'f i'm foolish enought to start a fight with a mob way tougher than what I can handle and didn't escape or ask for help, well then maybe I should learn a lesson. Also, loced combat eliminates the problem of whether who should get the xp or who should get more xp if someone join the fight midway. For the problem of not being able to heal others while they are fighting, I give the same answer: if they don't ask then don't help.
I haven't tried carfting yet but I'll do soon so really can't comment on this one. For now I'm really happy with this game and that's not only because of the graphics "pwns". graphics does help but mostly the gameplay doesn't bore me like ffxi did. I have friends that get into the WoW beta and they are telling me how fun the game is and ask me to switch. I'd definitely try it out during winter break when all my final exams are over. Until then I'll keep playing EQ2.
First I argee gameplay should be more important than the look of the game since that's what we're playing. Also,graphics is highly subjective because everyone has different preference and different games may have different performance on the same machine - like WoW and EQ2, the same machine may be able to run WoW at high details smoothly but can only handle EQ2 at average details. For me, I prefer the more realistic look of EQ2 over the more cartoonish look of WoW; that's just a persoanl preference.
Second, I'm only a lv 12 crusader so I can't say much about the game either but from what I've gone through I quite enjoy the game. I've been doing quest after quest and earn xp and money without noticing it. I didn't earn THAT much but at least it's sufficient for me to pay the rent upkeep and keep my equipment up to date. for grinding, I don't have to grind much because I can earn xp while questing and after i've completed the quest. I heard it's the same in WoW so there's nothing to complain about.
Third, I solo most of the time (reason I quitted ffxi... BINGO because I couldn't solo there) and at least till now I don't see any forced grouping except for the quest in the newbie island, and that quest SOE forces you to group because they want players to be familiar with the party system.
Fourth, I'm a crusader (fighter) so I don't know much about healing/healer and I don't like playing healer anyway so that's not a problem to me (though I've yet to hear any complain about being a healer)
Fifth, the map interface. I also hate not being able to locate group members on the mini map but since I've never got separated with them :P Even if it happens it's pretty easy to meet them using chat. I mean if party members get separated even if you can see them on the mini map you'd still ask "where to meet" first right? so what's the difference there?
Sixth, locked combat. I haven't played any other mmorpg other than eq2 and ffxi so i thought that is a standard? Guess I'm wrong. Well but I think the locked combat is there for a good reason. If I claim a mob and I'm soloing, then I'd pretty much want to handle it on my own. I'd hate to see everyone land a hit on the mob I'm fighting at while they pass by because they think I'm not strong enough for the mob. If I start the fight then I should know what I'm doing, and if I didn't ask for help that means I DON'T NEED IT. I'f i'm foolish enought to start a fight with a mob way tougher than what I can handle and didn't escape or ask for help, well then maybe I should learn a lesson. Also, loced combat eliminates the problem of whether who should get the xp or who should get more xp if someone join the fight midway. For the problem of not being able to heal others while they are fighting, I give the same answer: if they don't ask then don't help.
I haven't tried carfting yet but I'll do soon so really can't comment on this one. For now I'm really happy with this game and that's not only because of the graphics "pwns". graphics does help but mostly the gameplay doesn't bore me like ffxi did. I have friends that get into the WoW beta and they are telling me how fun the game is and ask me to switch. I'd definitely try it out during winter break when all my final exams are over. Until then I'll keep playing EQ2.
Scholar
37 posts
My background in these types of games primarily revolve around EQ. I've been playing EQ steadily for 3 years. I had 2 characters at level 65 and many others over 50. There are so many problems with end game in EQ plus a plague of many problems with servers, expansions and overall gameplay that I have been looking for a replacement for some time.
I did buy and play City of Heroes (CoH) but it didn't sustain my interest beyond the included first month subscription (made it to level 20 on a toon).
I had the chance to try out both beta: EQ2 and WoW. On both beta version, I brought my characters to the mid-20's so that is the extent of my experience which I'll share.
EQ2: The quality of the graphics is clearly superior at a cost of performance (even with high performance computers). I think I read somewhere that no one could run the game at the extreme resolution setting without slowing the action to a crawl. EQ2 has a very nice tutorial (the boat ride) to ease you into the game. The Island newbie quests are a nice prelude to things to come. At one point you will move to Freeport (if you're evil) or Qeynos (if you're good) and proceed from there. I tried both cities but I am more experienced with Freeport.
The cities are nice. Lots of stuff to do, quests to be assigned and things to discover. You can set up your "home" once arrive and furnish it to your likings (chairs, tables, lamps, etc.). I never could navigate through the cities without the use of the maps but I'm sure I could have gotten used to it eventually.
EQ2 attempted to fix many of the very frustrating things of EQ. Power Leveling is almost impossible because of locked encounters (you can't be healed unless grouped; farming lower level mobs won't yield anything due to level restrictions). Kill stealing (KS'ing) is also eliminated once a mob is engaged (no damage done if it's not your pull).
Even with these enhancements, I still feel that EQ2 is more XP grinding. I was playing EQ2 beta before WoW was available and yet, I knew that EQ2 wasn't going to cut it for me. I didn't want 3 more years of much of the same in a repackaged game. Even though I was playing EQ2, I was still shopping around for other games.
Then came the World of Warcraft Beta (November 9th I signed on). The game has been PURE FUN right from the start. I will miss it for the next couple of days since Beta is closing today and we have to wait for retail on the 23rd.
The environment is so rich with stuff to do and explore. I find the quest system to be awesome with the right balance of hints and reward (in fact, they are reward heavy). Every 2 levels you get new spells or new abilities. I never had the feeling that I was XP grinding. I found it easy and challenging to solo to level 20, all of which through fun quests. I was playing with the Alliance and one day, 3 Hordes members showed up in our territory... that was exciting! We were all rallying to kill the three infidels!
The fighting is really good. It's quick and involved. You have to know your character and learn how the mob will fight. The element of player skill has been incorporated into the fighting. The levelling seems natural and in between levels there is so much fun.
I truly enjoyed the travelling on the backs of griffons. Amazing transition between zones ... it is seemless and very natural. There is never a pause while zones are loading. The quest NPC have great animations, from crying, laughing or whatever and brings it all to life.
Overall, I am excited to have found my game for the next little while. Having played EQ for three years solid, I can say that there is little comparison with WoW even though that is what we are trying to do in this forum.
Since you will be playing a game for some time to come, I would suggest you buy the top 2 games that appeal to you most (you get 1 free month with each) and then go with the one that appeals to you most. My personal choice is very clear!
I did buy and play City of Heroes (CoH) but it didn't sustain my interest beyond the included first month subscription (made it to level 20 on a toon).
I had the chance to try out both beta: EQ2 and WoW. On both beta version, I brought my characters to the mid-20's so that is the extent of my experience which I'll share.
EQ2: The quality of the graphics is clearly superior at a cost of performance (even with high performance computers). I think I read somewhere that no one could run the game at the extreme resolution setting without slowing the action to a crawl. EQ2 has a very nice tutorial (the boat ride) to ease you into the game. The Island newbie quests are a nice prelude to things to come. At one point you will move to Freeport (if you're evil) or Qeynos (if you're good) and proceed from there. I tried both cities but I am more experienced with Freeport.
The cities are nice. Lots of stuff to do, quests to be assigned and things to discover. You can set up your "home" once arrive and furnish it to your likings (chairs, tables, lamps, etc.). I never could navigate through the cities without the use of the maps but I'm sure I could have gotten used to it eventually.
EQ2 attempted to fix many of the very frustrating things of EQ. Power Leveling is almost impossible because of locked encounters (you can't be healed unless grouped; farming lower level mobs won't yield anything due to level restrictions). Kill stealing (KS'ing) is also eliminated once a mob is engaged (no damage done if it's not your pull).
Even with these enhancements, I still feel that EQ2 is more XP grinding. I was playing EQ2 beta before WoW was available and yet, I knew that EQ2 wasn't going to cut it for me. I didn't want 3 more years of much of the same in a repackaged game. Even though I was playing EQ2, I was still shopping around for other games.
Then came the World of Warcraft Beta (November 9th I signed on). The game has been PURE FUN right from the start. I will miss it for the next couple of days since Beta is closing today and we have to wait for retail on the 23rd.
The environment is so rich with stuff to do and explore. I find the quest system to be awesome with the right balance of hints and reward (in fact, they are reward heavy). Every 2 levels you get new spells or new abilities. I never had the feeling that I was XP grinding. I found it easy and challenging to solo to level 20, all of which through fun quests. I was playing with the Alliance and one day, 3 Hordes members showed up in our territory... that was exciting! We were all rallying to kill the three infidels!
The fighting is really good. It's quick and involved. You have to know your character and learn how the mob will fight. The element of player skill has been incorporated into the fighting. The levelling seems natural and in between levels there is so much fun.
I truly enjoyed the travelling on the backs of griffons. Amazing transition between zones ... it is seemless and very natural. There is never a pause while zones are loading. The quest NPC have great animations, from crying, laughing or whatever and brings it all to life.
Overall, I am excited to have found my game for the next little while. Having played EQ for three years solid, I can say that there is little comparison with WoW even though that is what we are trying to do in this forum.
Since you will be playing a game for some time to come, I would suggest you buy the top 2 games that appeal to you most (you get 1 free month with each) and then go with the one that appeals to you most. My personal choice is very clear!
yes I've heard how fun the game is, and I heard you can even get drunk in the game!! now THAT's fun. I really can't say if I'll stay with eq2 or switch to wow until I try out the retail later and I don't think I'll play both at the same time (too expensive and too little time). One question though, how does the class system work? Can I switch it freely like I could in ffxi or is it locked once I declare my class?
You start off with a class, and that is the class you are "locked" into. Same as most other MMORPG's.
However, you will find that after 10th lvl, you can use talents to make your class uniquely your own.
Paladin as an example: Have Holy, Protection, and Retribution.
You can take skills in these three areas to better fill out the character as you would like it to be.
Here is a site that shows the talent trees for all classes: Talent Tree
However, you will find that after 10th lvl, you can use talents to make your class uniquely your own.
Paladin as an example: Have Holy, Protection, and Retribution.
You can take skills in these three areas to better fill out the character as you would like it to be.
Here is a site that shows the talent trees for all classes: Talent Tree
FFXI really does not allow for any greater amount of class switching than any other MMO out there, in fact, it limits you moreso.
Good link! Thanks!
Just my twopence-worth, having participated in both beta tests:
EQII:
I initially enjoyed my time there, lots to do, plenty quests, nice progression rate. Towards the time of retail, having reached the dizzy heights of 18 Brawler/19 Outfitter, I was less sure that it was the game for me.
Being a casual player, I have limited time and don't wish to spend it LFG, which happens more and more as you rise in levels. Solo content was cut back (all dungeon content became group-only), cutting back on my enjoyment of the game. There were also stability problems with the servers, which (judging from my guild board) has carried over on to the Runnyeye server at least after release.
The game was gorgeous, with plenty character customisation and a gritty, real-world feel to it. I had few problems with the graphics, but had them optimised for performance. Still looked very nice though. Also, all the NPCs spoke! And the voice acting was pretty good - only a few howlers I heard (and bugged!). Mainly relating to US actors trying to do Scottish/Welsh pronunciation
Having come from EQI, however, I found it a bit too similar - and the mass of changes just prior to release knocked my confidence a bit as to how the game was going to progress. I planned to wait until March next year and give it a go for the free month that comes with purchase.
WoW
I was then lucky enough to get into the WoW final beta test. At first I thought "I've fallen into an Asterix cartoon!" as the graphics were much more stylized. However, as I continued to play, the graphics seemed to fit more and more - I actually felt like I was in a fantasy world, and the graphics helped that.
The game is just as well paced in the early levels as EQII is - quests abound, the only difference being that the quest-givers are easier to spot. In WoW the have a big orange ! over their heads - in EQII you pretty much had to hail all the NPCs to see which ones had quests to give you. There seems to be a bigger variety in the types of starting area also, with the frozen mountains of the Dwarven starting area contrasting with the open plains of the Tauren. I'm sure EQII will have as much variety as content is added though.
The game is much more accessible as a casual player - most mobs can be soloed, some grouping necessary to complete some quests - but a lot less than EQII.
There is not as much depth to the crafting in WoW, but it is therefore also much easier to get into. Once again, all the NPCs speak to you, with the voice acting on a par with EQII. There are some nice touches - I tried to loot a corpse that showed it had loot on it and had been killed by a group member - A voice then piped up (in best 'Groundskeeper Willie' accent, being a dwarf) "That would be stealing!"
I really wanted to give EQII a try, but found it too much like EQI - grinding exp, spending ages LFG to get a quest completed, or to explore an area. I still think it's a good game, but WoW suits my available playing time so much better, I think that it will be my game of choice this winter.
This is all my subjective opinion, so don't be too harsh! EQII might well be the game for you - it just wasn't the one for me.
EQII:
I initially enjoyed my time there, lots to do, plenty quests, nice progression rate. Towards the time of retail, having reached the dizzy heights of 18 Brawler/19 Outfitter, I was less sure that it was the game for me.
Being a casual player, I have limited time and don't wish to spend it LFG, which happens more and more as you rise in levels. Solo content was cut back (all dungeon content became group-only), cutting back on my enjoyment of the game. There were also stability problems with the servers, which (judging from my guild board) has carried over on to the Runnyeye server at least after release.
The game was gorgeous, with plenty character customisation and a gritty, real-world feel to it. I had few problems with the graphics, but had them optimised for performance. Still looked very nice though. Also, all the NPCs spoke! And the voice acting was pretty good - only a few howlers I heard (and bugged!). Mainly relating to US actors trying to do Scottish/Welsh pronunciation
Having come from EQI, however, I found it a bit too similar - and the mass of changes just prior to release knocked my confidence a bit as to how the game was going to progress. I planned to wait until March next year and give it a go for the free month that comes with purchase.
WoW
I was then lucky enough to get into the WoW final beta test. At first I thought "I've fallen into an Asterix cartoon!" as the graphics were much more stylized. However, as I continued to play, the graphics seemed to fit more and more - I actually felt like I was in a fantasy world, and the graphics helped that.
The game is just as well paced in the early levels as EQII is - quests abound, the only difference being that the quest-givers are easier to spot. In WoW the have a big orange ! over their heads - in EQII you pretty much had to hail all the NPCs to see which ones had quests to give you. There seems to be a bigger variety in the types of starting area also, with the frozen mountains of the Dwarven starting area contrasting with the open plains of the Tauren. I'm sure EQII will have as much variety as content is added though.
The game is much more accessible as a casual player - most mobs can be soloed, some grouping necessary to complete some quests - but a lot less than EQII.
There is not as much depth to the crafting in WoW, but it is therefore also much easier to get into. Once again, all the NPCs speak to you, with the voice acting on a par with EQII. There are some nice touches - I tried to loot a corpse that showed it had loot on it and had been killed by a group member - A voice then piped up (in best 'Groundskeeper Willie' accent, being a dwarf) "That would be stealing!"
I really wanted to give EQII a try, but found it too much like EQI - grinding exp, spending ages LFG to get a quest completed, or to explore an area. I still think it's a good game, but WoW suits my available playing time so much better, I think that it will be my game of choice this winter.
This is all my subjective opinion, so don't be too harsh! EQII might well be the game for you - it just wasn't the one for me.
Scholar
37 posts
4 Year player of EQ1 here.
Level 69 Bard, 66 Cleric and too many alts to mention...
I have played Blizzard's WC1, WC2, WC3 all very lightly but enjoyed them. I played SC fairly heavily with a group of friends at work, but never got into the Battle.net scene.
I have not seen anything of EQ2, and I really am not sure I want to. SoE had plenty of opportunity to fix stuff in EQ1. There were still bugs from 5+ Expansions ago they needed to fix. SoE has proven over and over that they just aren't up to the task of fulfilling their role as heir to the Verant throne.
Verant made EQ1. Not SOE... Do not forget this. Why do I keep hearing about how similar EQ2 is to EQ1? Because they aren't innovaters any more. They have taken several good ideas that appreared in early WoW beta and have implemented them quite well into both EQ1 and EQ2.
Now let me share with you my impressions of WoW...
First off, WOW... Yes it's cartoonish/fantastic... It is a fantasy game.
It keeps to a tradition created in WC's series with the storyline of those past strategy games giving WoW a good foundation.
The first thing I see when I log in is.. I am ready to rumble...
Ready set go...
All classes are capable of soloing and even soloing mobs a tad higher than themselves. Also quests are doable... fun, and not without decent rewards.
I only had limited play time but I leveled a warrior to 10, a priest to 11, and a hunter to 9. I did try out 4 different races, and all of them are pretty fun. The home cities of each race are incredibly detailed, and I have to say the tradeskilling is pretty cool, however the fact that you basically can't do any TS's without collecting stuff first is sorta uncool...
Overall I rate WoW an 8 out of 10, where EQ1 was an 8 or 9 out of 10 when it started but SOE dwindled that down to a 5 out of 10 so far....
Level 69 Bard, 66 Cleric and too many alts to mention...
I have played Blizzard's WC1, WC2, WC3 all very lightly but enjoyed them. I played SC fairly heavily with a group of friends at work, but never got into the Battle.net scene.
I have not seen anything of EQ2, and I really am not sure I want to. SoE had plenty of opportunity to fix stuff in EQ1. There were still bugs from 5+ Expansions ago they needed to fix. SoE has proven over and over that they just aren't up to the task of fulfilling their role as heir to the Verant throne.
Verant made EQ1. Not SOE... Do not forget this. Why do I keep hearing about how similar EQ2 is to EQ1? Because they aren't innovaters any more. They have taken several good ideas that appreared in early WoW beta and have implemented them quite well into both EQ1 and EQ2.
Now let me share with you my impressions of WoW...
First off, WOW... Yes it's cartoonish/fantastic... It is a fantasy game.
It keeps to a tradition created in WC's series with the storyline of those past strategy games giving WoW a good foundation.
The first thing I see when I log in is.. I am ready to rumble...
Ready set go...
All classes are capable of soloing and even soloing mobs a tad higher than themselves. Also quests are doable... fun, and not without decent rewards.
I only had limited play time but I leveled a warrior to 10, a priest to 11, and a hunter to 9. I did try out 4 different races, and all of them are pretty fun. The home cities of each race are incredibly detailed, and I have to say the tradeskilling is pretty cool, however the fact that you basically can't do any TS's without collecting stuff first is sorta uncool...
Overall I rate WoW an 8 out of 10, where EQ1 was an 8 or 9 out of 10 when it started but SOE dwindled that down to a 5 out of 10 so far....
Well i got EQ2 for ***** and giggles. I got to level 17 with a troll want-to-be-ShadowKnight. As far as graphics go, they are good, just good. Ive got a very nice system running, video card being the new X800 and 2 gigs of memory alloted to each of my two processors, and the game is still choppy. Gameplay is good, i found that melee classes are superior to casters as far as the new "all class can solo" thing they tried with EQ2, which failed miserably(sp?) given even an SK cant solo.
All in all, i would say WoW after playing on a friends beta account. Despite the graphics, which for an MMO are pretty good, the game itself is a wreck (EQ2 that is).
Fact: WoW is better.
Edited, Thu Nov 18 21:07:56 2004 by graynomas
All in all, i would say WoW after playing on a friends beta account. Despite the graphics, which for an MMO are pretty good, the game itself is a wreck (EQ2 that is).
Fact: WoW is better.
Edited, Thu Nov 18 21:07:56 2004 by graynomas
49 posts
Eq2 and WoW have different styles of graphics. I don't actually agree that EQ2's are better- they are just a different style. It's like comparing CGI to Cell frame animation. Am I the only one that thinks that one of WoW's biggest strengths is the totally refreshing art? Blizzard has always had really funky creative direction for the warcraft series, and WoW was totally true to that.
I'm not posting it as a WoW fanboy- if you want to criticize the limited character customization, I am right there with you. In many ways it feels like a late nineties featureset coming out on today's technologies- but the graphics being worse than pong? That's crazy talk.
I'm not posting it as a WoW fanboy- if you want to criticize the limited character customization, I am right there with you. In many ways it feels like a late nineties featureset coming out on today's technologies- but the graphics being worse than pong? That's crazy talk.
EQ2 seemed really cool when it was first announced.
Graphics are pretty, when things aren't moving. They must have the same animators they had when they redid the EQ engine. The animations are TERRIBLE!
WoW graphics are great, considering it isn't a level of quality issue, it is a style issue. WoW has a true-to-form style, it is not trying to be realistic. I wouldn't want it that way.
Add in the fact that WoW doesn't feel like a second job and you have a good game.
EQ2 will cater more to power gamers who have 120+ hours a week to kill so they can brag they killed UberDragon_002983 after spending 2000 hours camping keys for their uber guild and countless hours maxing their levels to begin with. That to me isn't fun, it is work... which I guess is ok for those guilds as they probably don't have jobs to begin with ;-) (that was an overgeneralization, don't freak out on me!)
Anyway, each person will find their game. FFXI, EQ2, WoW, and all the rest will have a following, that is the beauty of it. Play what you like and don't worry about the 4000 comparison threads. If nothing else we can all agree that AC was truly a bad game ;-)
Edited, Thu Nov 18 23:14:49 2004 by Quaxotl
Graphics are pretty, when things aren't moving. They must have the same animators they had when they redid the EQ engine. The animations are TERRIBLE!
WoW graphics are great, considering it isn't a level of quality issue, it is a style issue. WoW has a true-to-form style, it is not trying to be realistic. I wouldn't want it that way.
Add in the fact that WoW doesn't feel like a second job and you have a good game.
EQ2 will cater more to power gamers who have 120+ hours a week to kill so they can brag they killed UberDragon_002983 after spending 2000 hours camping keys for their uber guild and countless hours maxing their levels to begin with. That to me isn't fun, it is work... which I guess is ok for those guilds as they probably don't have jobs to begin with ;-) (that was an overgeneralization, don't freak out on me!)
Anyway, each person will find their game. FFXI, EQ2, WoW, and all the rest will have a following, that is the beauty of it. Play what you like and don't worry about the 4000 comparison threads. If nothing else we can all agree that AC was truly a bad game ;-)
Edited, Thu Nov 18 23:14:49 2004 by Quaxotl
I am a diehard MMO gamer. I've played pretty much every major release since Ultima Online and been a termite to content. 65 rog/wiz, 60 war (retired mid-Velious), 60 enc (retired mid Luclin), 62 ranger (retired recently) in EQ, among others. Did PoP with the rogue when it was actually hard (in Elementals in Jan of 2003). Besides EQ, the only games I've really gotten into were Anarchy Online (216 Solitus Keeper after ~3 or so months of playing Dec 03 to Mar 04), Earth and Beyond (150 Progen Warrior and Terran Trader, 127 Terran Enforcer, 119 Jenquai Defender, 103 Progen Sentinel....with 150 being max level when I played), and now WoW. I played some of EQ2 beta and post-release (my niece is my protege and isn't quite as jaded as her aunt so she does play EVERY MMO that comes out) and it seems SoE is up to their old familiar bait n' switch.
I state the above for perspective. The idea of grinding xp is not foreign to me at all. But, some games make the grind transparent and other games make it like a bloodstain on a white evening gown. WoW's grind is completely transparent. EQ1/2, FFXI, Earth and Beyond (post-55), Horizons (combat only), and Anarchy Online (post-100)'s grinds are the aforementioned bloodstains. Honestly, I don't mind the grind (obviously) if there's a point to it. That point has yet to be found in EQ2.
At first, I thought I would hate both EQ2 and WoW since they were touted as being "casual gamer friendly". Generally speaking, the only times I had heard that phrase used was in EQ (as an explanation for the lifting of flag requirements for tier 2 zones and what some refer to as the "dumbing down of EverQuest"). I'm naturally resistant to things like that since I believe time spent doing something should differentiate. Just like hours spent working out makes you more fit than the person who doesn't work out (or doesn't work out as much), so should it be in games where character progression is a large overarching goal. But I've never agreed with EQ's "block time" bias. Basically, the person who plays 5 hrs a day for 5 days a week will usually progress faster than the person who plays 30 hrs a week spread out over 7 days (with the majority of that time being on the weekend).
Something my niece said to me tonight really kinda said it all. After logging off of EQ2, she said "How come every time I log out of this game, I expect to get a paycheck?". Seems SoE still hasn't come off their "MMO as non-paying job" fixation. Also, one thing that factored heavily into my not buying EQ2 is SoE themselves. I think there's an old Bible verse that says something to the effect of "Pride comes before the fall". I think SoE has grown largely complacent and they take their playerbase for granted because EQ has not had a serious competitor since its release. That's about to change (if WoW's open beta signup being flooded is any indication). I think they have no idea what casual gamers (who comprise the lion's share of their subscribers) actually want so instead, they pander and think casual gamer = wants the game made easy when that's not really the case from what I've seen and heard. Look at the aftermath of the GoD debacle. They come out with an expansion that's the very definition of "Monty Haul". So I'd cast my lot with ANY developer before I'd take a chance that SoE has changed.
My opinion is that EQ2 vs WoW will turn out to be as compelling a fight as Tyson-Holyfield II, with SoE pulling a similar dirty trick (following their usual MO, they'll try to steal a popular feature from WoW and implement it into EQ2).
On topic, I think EQ2 will appeal to the so-called "casual-powergamer" (i.e. those folks who usually resided in the 3rd tier of raiding guilds, maybe 1 full expansion behind the top guild). These are folks who generally don't mind the grind but who may be somewhat put off by EQ's time-block requirements but who are still dyed in the wool fans of SoE and EQ. WoW will appeal to everyone else.
I state the above for perspective. The idea of grinding xp is not foreign to me at all. But, some games make the grind transparent and other games make it like a bloodstain on a white evening gown. WoW's grind is completely transparent. EQ1/2, FFXI, Earth and Beyond (post-55), Horizons (combat only), and Anarchy Online (post-100)'s grinds are the aforementioned bloodstains. Honestly, I don't mind the grind (obviously) if there's a point to it. That point has yet to be found in EQ2.
At first, I thought I would hate both EQ2 and WoW since they were touted as being "casual gamer friendly". Generally speaking, the only times I had heard that phrase used was in EQ (as an explanation for the lifting of flag requirements for tier 2 zones and what some refer to as the "dumbing down of EverQuest"). I'm naturally resistant to things like that since I believe time spent doing something should differentiate. Just like hours spent working out makes you more fit than the person who doesn't work out (or doesn't work out as much), so should it be in games where character progression is a large overarching goal. But I've never agreed with EQ's "block time" bias. Basically, the person who plays 5 hrs a day for 5 days a week will usually progress faster than the person who plays 30 hrs a week spread out over 7 days (with the majority of that time being on the weekend).
Something my niece said to me tonight really kinda said it all. After logging off of EQ2, she said "How come every time I log out of this game, I expect to get a paycheck?". Seems SoE still hasn't come off their "MMO as non-paying job" fixation. Also, one thing that factored heavily into my not buying EQ2 is SoE themselves. I think there's an old Bible verse that says something to the effect of "Pride comes before the fall". I think SoE has grown largely complacent and they take their playerbase for granted because EQ has not had a serious competitor since its release. That's about to change (if WoW's open beta signup being flooded is any indication). I think they have no idea what casual gamers (who comprise the lion's share of their subscribers) actually want so instead, they pander and think casual gamer = wants the game made easy when that's not really the case from what I've seen and heard. Look at the aftermath of the GoD debacle. They come out with an expansion that's the very definition of "Monty Haul". So I'd cast my lot with ANY developer before I'd take a chance that SoE has changed.
My opinion is that EQ2 vs WoW will turn out to be as compelling a fight as Tyson-Holyfield II, with SoE pulling a similar dirty trick (following their usual MO, they'll try to steal a popular feature from WoW and implement it into EQ2).
On topic, I think EQ2 will appeal to the so-called "casual-powergamer" (i.e. those folks who usually resided in the 3rd tier of raiding guilds, maybe 1 full expansion behind the top guild). These are folks who generally don't mind the grind but who may be somewhat put off by EQ's time-block requirements but who are still dyed in the wool fans of SoE and EQ. WoW will appeal to everyone else.
EnB... i loved that game... (well, the storyline)... Im sure youre as familiar with the job terminal as I. (150 je, with a plethora of others)
Played ffxi... but couldnt stand waiting 2 hours for a party (even as a whm) when i only had two to start with. I also betad every major mmo besides eq2 (which is why i cant comment on the comparison), and a lot of minor mmos.
Seeing as i have betad many,i can say this with honesty. If beta is any indication, wow is going to be a huge game.
as for the graphics. with my graphics set on the highest settings, its running me at 40 fps. It truelly is artwork how they designed the graphics system in that game. I remember standing in IF and just being amazed at the detail, and the effort put it to everything there. You can almost see the blood and tears of the game designers. There are so many places like that in this game where youll just be at awe at the scenerie. Each zone has a distinct personallity, and you can just feal the mood of it. And dont get me started on the instances.
With that said... graphics arent everything, but the style WoW has just blows off everything ive seen from eq2. (movies and pics...) Seeing as this is the only comparison i can honestly compare... and is EQ2s main advantage from all other posters opinions i have read... i feal im making the right decision.
Edited, Fri Nov 19 08:05:20 2004 by Alekan
Played ffxi... but couldnt stand waiting 2 hours for a party (even as a whm) when i only had two to start with. I also betad every major mmo besides eq2 (which is why i cant comment on the comparison), and a lot of minor mmos.
Seeing as i have betad many,i can say this with honesty. If beta is any indication, wow is going to be a huge game.
as for the graphics. with my graphics set on the highest settings, its running me at 40 fps. It truelly is artwork how they designed the graphics system in that game. I remember standing in IF and just being amazed at the detail, and the effort put it to everything there. You can almost see the blood and tears of the game designers. There are so many places like that in this game where youll just be at awe at the scenerie. Each zone has a distinct personallity, and you can just feal the mood of it. And dont get me started on the instances.
With that said... graphics arent everything, but the style WoW has just blows off everything ive seen from eq2. (movies and pics...) Seeing as this is the only comparison i can honestly compare... and is EQ2s main advantage from all other posters opinions i have read... i feal im making the right decision.
Edited, Fri Nov 19 08:05:20 2004 by Alekan
26 posts
Well, I've noticed some reoccuring theme's in peoples post.
"I've played every major MMORPG" - Not necessarily an untrue statement, but one poster then went on to mention a total of 4 games. Nice try. I've been around the block of MMORPGs, and I'm talking since NWN, Med 3.0, not just these fancy graphical ones. Here's a list of the games I've played...
-Neverwinter Nights(the original, not the new one)
-Medievia 3.0
-Medievia 4.0(Yes, they are different games)
-Ultima Online
-Everquest
-Asheron's Call
-Earth and Beyond Online(beta + retail)
-Star Wars Galaxies
-Anarchy Online
-Asheron's Call 2
-City of Heroes
-Dark Age of Camelot
-Shadowbane
-Guild Wars(beta)
-Everquest 2(beta)
-World of Warcraft(beta)
My Thoughts on WoW vs. EQ2 :
Don't try to say one is better than the other. WoW is built around a PvP(Horde vs. Alliance) theme, while EQ2 is entirely PvE. WoW's(and all of Blizzard for that matter) graphical style is unique, but one cannot argue that the graphics in EQ2 are "better" per sey. EQ2's graphics were built to look more like reality. If you want pretty graphics, go play HL2 or D3. Coming from Mudding, I can tell you first hand GRAPHICS DO NOT MAKE THE GAME. Gameplay is key, and I think both WoW and EQ2 have created exactly what they set out to. Blizzard has created a game that you do not need to invest hours upon hours to enjoy it. They made it so you can play the game without seeing a single person. SOE has created a worth succesor to Everquest. Yes, they may not be made by the same company, but by all standards, Everquest 2 IS Everquest with some new implements as well as some more user friendly traits.
Me? You will see me on the 23rd picking up WoW for one reason and one reason only : PvP. I'm a diehard PvP fan, been so since day 1. Sorry, but nothing compares to PvP i.e in the WoW beta, being a lvl 24 rogue and being able to take out 3 level 26's and grief them til they report you to a GM.
Beware the rogues come retail :)
Edited, Fri Nov 19 08:51:41 2004 by Xarth
"I've played every major MMORPG" - Not necessarily an untrue statement, but one poster then went on to mention a total of 4 games. Nice try. I've been around the block of MMORPGs, and I'm talking since NWN, Med 3.0, not just these fancy graphical ones. Here's a list of the games I've played...
-Neverwinter Nights(the original, not the new one)
-Medievia 3.0
-Medievia 4.0(Yes, they are different games)
-Ultima Online
-Everquest
-Asheron's Call
-Earth and Beyond Online(beta + retail)
-Star Wars Galaxies
-Anarchy Online
-Asheron's Call 2
-City of Heroes
-Dark Age of Camelot
-Shadowbane
-Guild Wars(beta)
-Everquest 2(beta)
-World of Warcraft(beta)
My Thoughts on WoW vs. EQ2 :
Don't try to say one is better than the other. WoW is built around a PvP(Horde vs. Alliance) theme, while EQ2 is entirely PvE. WoW's(and all of Blizzard for that matter) graphical style is unique, but one cannot argue that the graphics in EQ2 are "better" per sey. EQ2's graphics were built to look more like reality. If you want pretty graphics, go play HL2 or D3. Coming from Mudding, I can tell you first hand GRAPHICS DO NOT MAKE THE GAME. Gameplay is key, and I think both WoW and EQ2 have created exactly what they set out to. Blizzard has created a game that you do not need to invest hours upon hours to enjoy it. They made it so you can play the game without seeing a single person. SOE has created a worth succesor to Everquest. Yes, they may not be made by the same company, but by all standards, Everquest 2 IS Everquest with some new implements as well as some more user friendly traits.
Me? You will see me on the 23rd picking up WoW for one reason and one reason only : PvP. I'm a diehard PvP fan, been so since day 1. Sorry, but nothing compares to PvP i.e in the WoW beta, being a lvl 24 rogue and being able to take out 3 level 26's and grief them til they report you to a GM.
Beware the rogues come retail :)
Edited, Fri Nov 19 08:51:41 2004 by Xarth
Hey Xarth, I used to play Med too, about 3 1/2 years ago I think it was..
26 posts
Very fun game :)
Two AV's on 4.0 right now :)
Two AV's on 4.0 right now :)
Ok past xp....
Ledgends of kesmi anyone?
UO....till PVP ruined the game (i hear the revamped it like 4 years ago still won't go back a try thou)
Blah blah I been around....
Point is i played beta of both...
I liked both games. WoW suits me more that eq2. The thing about wow is The colors chosen...at first you might think it was all drawn by the same person but i think they choose colors and kept using only them to give it that feel.
I also love the clicking on human pesant and hearing the same sound byte you heard in Warcraft 2. The comedy of city of heroes was never lost on me...and i like to see it in these games. I actually went into combat in City of heroes to kill some lobies and died cause they had a comedic line i wasn't ready for and just started lauging to much to fight.....
I only reached high teens in beta and really can't wait for retail (I know it's only days but...). One night i got up from my desk to go to bed and said wow that was fun.....and realized i needed to Pre order.....
I do think that if you could take the Tradeskill system out of EQ2 and put it in WoW you would get close to a perfect game but I will still enjoy trade skilling in wow.
EQ2 was a good game...but as alot of folks i got a bad taste in my mouth when they monkeywrenched alot of the game days before release with a patch. I beta tested EQ as well (yes the spell scrolls use to be bed rolls) yea eq has evolved to a game not friendly to Casual players (im a tad over casual but not hard core yet) EQ2 really didn't have casual frienly look to it.
and yes it was kind of strange how the world looked normal after like 4 days of playing ....didn't really look cartoonish.
Ledgends of kesmi anyone?
UO....till PVP ruined the game (i hear the revamped it like 4 years ago still won't go back a try thou)
Blah blah I been around....
Point is i played beta of both...
I liked both games. WoW suits me more that eq2. The thing about wow is The colors chosen...at first you might think it was all drawn by the same person but i think they choose colors and kept using only them to give it that feel.
I also love the clicking on human pesant and hearing the same sound byte you heard in Warcraft 2. The comedy of city of heroes was never lost on me...and i like to see it in these games. I actually went into combat in City of heroes to kill some lobies and died cause they had a comedic line i wasn't ready for and just started lauging to much to fight.....
I only reached high teens in beta and really can't wait for retail (I know it's only days but...). One night i got up from my desk to go to bed and said wow that was fun.....and realized i needed to Pre order.....
I do think that if you could take the Tradeskill system out of EQ2 and put it in WoW you would get close to a perfect game but I will still enjoy trade skilling in wow.
EQ2 was a good game...but as alot of folks i got a bad taste in my mouth when they monkeywrenched alot of the game days before release with a patch. I beta tested EQ as well (yes the spell scrolls use to be bed rolls) yea eq has evolved to a game not friendly to Casual players (im a tad over casual but not hard core yet) EQ2 really didn't have casual frienly look to it.
and yes it was kind of strange how the world looked normal after like 4 days of playing ....didn't really look cartoonish.
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