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Soulbinding... could be a concern.. especialy for enchantingFollow

#1 Nov 17 2004 at 1:02 PM Rating: Decent
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First off, I think that Soulbinding, should be loosened up a bit.

It causes two things a player CANT do.

One, you can’t help you friends when you get them to join or another stranger on the server for that matter. Just about anything that is halfway decent, is soulbinded, so no one else can wear it.

I remember my early days of playing FFXI, this guy hooked me up with some ‘ok’ leather armor, which for me was ‘awesome’, and he just said, “just be kind to the next guy sometime”. Kind of like ‘pay it forward’, I really liked that.

However I can’t make any decent use of my used gear, unless I trash it (vendor prices are trash).

So then I think, well I can sell it to another player, who is trying to collect old magic items for disenchanting, but I cant send him or give that item to him either.

I think this is way too restrictive.

Anyone else?


#2 Nov 17 2004 at 1:04 PM Rating: Decent
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For the most part I think it's good. Keeps inflation down. The one thing that could be changed would be to make it so you can disenchant from the "won't be traded" window. However, I'm wondering if this would make enchanting too "easy", since it's by design and intent the "harcore" profession.
#3 Nov 17 2004 at 1:13 PM Rating: Good
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It's perfect as is.

Any new players will more then likely be getting the equipment the same way you did, questing/instances/etc.

If you want to "pay it forward", money works.

Besides, there's so many equipment choices, new players should be able to get equipment to fit their paths. It's alot more open that way then FFXI is.
#4 Nov 17 2004 at 1:27 PM Rating: Decent
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You can't hand down items, but unused items are tradable. Also, with required levels in the game, it's kinda hard to pass stuff along anyway to twink your new friend.

I agree on the disenchanting though. You should be able to disenchant through the soulbound slot in the trade window.
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Only the exceptions can be exceptional.
#5 Nov 17 2004 at 2:28 PM Rating: Good
I like the fact that items are bound to users. Sure it takes away some hand me down aspects of the game, but it does prevent twinking.

I like the fact that you have to decide before using an item if you want to keep to sell or use it yourself. And at first that frustrated me...I did not like it at all. But, as I got cool drops I began to like that we have to make that choice. I like having choices in a game where you have to develope a character. It adds an element of realism to the character...rather than the 'save in case you die' way of playing. In this case, you have to choose to use or hand over an item and your decision is final.

Would be nice if there was a way to pay to remove the soul-binding...make it a high price so that casual twinking could not be done, but if you really had the perfect item for a friend or guildie you could pay a price and give it to them.

#6 Nov 17 2004 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
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It also allows for more personal customization of equipment. Hunters of the same level will more then likely have different types of equipment, especially since different quests in different areas yield different reward choices.

Sorry to bring up FFXI again, but in that game, all job classes followed the same equipment paths. Everyone was a carbon copy of the other jobs of the same level and those that had come before.

WoW's system gives us more personal choice and prevents over camping.
#7 Nov 17 2004 at 2:57 PM Rating: Good
Yeah, Warchief, good point. I like WoW because the characters are not all cookie cutter toons. The 'to use or not to use' an item question does help to make your character make choices about what their appearence will be.
#8 Nov 17 2004 at 3:35 PM Rating: Good
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And don't forget the bonuses that leatherworkers can apply to leather armor. That changes when you need to upgrade armor, so again it adds in a whole set of choices to make.
#9 Nov 17 2004 at 3:43 PM Rating: Decent
This is in the game because of all the people who sell equipment on ebay or through other websites for real money. It ruined everquest and from what I hear Lineage 2 and Final Fantasy XI. I actually have found the system to be great. Especially the really nice items which are bind on pickup since people can't sell them the person that will actually use the item gets it.
#10 Nov 17 2004 at 3:46 PM Rating: Good
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DruidOfEq wrote:
Especially the really nice items which are bind on pickup since people can't sell them the person that will actually use the item gets it.



Need before Greed, the way it should always have been.


He who needs it, gets it.
#11 Nov 17 2004 at 5:06 PM Rating: Decent
Soulbind keeps me from having to go to the AH and buy expensive gear that is needed at my level to get groups.

There is a slot to drag items in the trade window for enchanting, no problems there.

Just had my items enchanted the other day in fact.
#12 Nov 17 2004 at 5:08 PM Rating: Good
From what I've seen, the "general" equipment is not bound and is also rather easy to come by. The "good" stuff (green) often binds on use so it's easy to give away if you're not going to use it. As for the rare items, I've yet to see one so I don't have a clue. My point is, you don't have to support your lower level friends be "good" players cause the average gear is very easy to get. If they want nifty rare items you can help them get them, buy them on AH, or the preferred means, get a group together and go have a ball in an instance! The fact that you have to earn the good gear and can't just have it hand-me-downed is really a storng point in this game. You don't have to work to keep yourself in decent gear, you just have to work if you want really nice gear.
#13 Nov 17 2004 at 7:46 PM Rating: Decent
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6,678 posts
Quote:
There is a slot to drag items in the trade window for enchanting, no problems there.

Just had my items enchanted the other day in fact.


But what happens when you want to discard those items, and want to support your local enchanter? You can't disenchant. He can't disenchant your soulbound items. You end up selling them for no effect.
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Only the exceptions can be exceptional.
#14 Nov 18 2004 at 1:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Enchanting would become a lot more of a viable tradeskill at lower levels if you had the ability to disenchant soulbound items through the trade window, but it wouldn't really change the fact that enchanting is a higher level tradeskill. Based on the fact that leveling the actual skill requires disenchanting higher level items, which inherently will have a higher auction house price, it makes it nearly impossible for someone below level 40 to turn this into a money making tradeskill.

I found that around level 40+, you could start easily farming some of the lower level instances. For the horde, that would be Ragefire Chasm, Wailing Caverns and depending on your class, Razorfen Kraul. I personally started this around level 37 on my open beta character and found that it was a bit tough before Ragefire Chasm was introduced a few patches ago, but after that, I found myself storing huge amounts of enchanting components in my bank. If I had put more effort into the tradeskill, I probably could have leveled it quicker, but unfortunately with the economy on the closed beta servers in the turmoil that they were in, people were rarely looking for lower level enchants. Hopefully things will change for retail.
#15 Nov 18 2004 at 3:10 AM Rating: Decent
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2,981 posts
While I haven't played yet, I love the idea of the system. I come from old school PnP D&D where the chances of any two characters being similar were slim to none.

It makes me feel good about my character when I don't see 20 copies with different names wandering around. This just seems like a game that will give me the good old adventure back.
#16 Nov 18 2004 at 4:07 AM Rating: Decent
While I haven't tried enchanting as a trade skill, but I believe the setup blizzard put upon us is great.

For us to not rely on a friend to pity or help us with their better weapons and armors, it allows us to fully experience the game. Although, I would prefer a higher selling price from the vendors and would also agree on trading soulbound items for disenchantment.

Lower stats items will do you fine unless you're striving for the best. And if you are seeking the best, there's no freebie in the world. Find it, slaughter it, quest it, and it's yours. Remember, WOW is a world of survivors.

That's my food for thought. Spare me any negative thoughts thus this is my second post.

Newbie to MMO.
#17 Nov 18 2004 at 5:45 AM Rating: Decent
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174 posts
For the enchanting concerns, Tailoring as a side skill can help a bit. You can make a lot of yellow with Tailoring and you don't need a gathering skill to support it, just the ocaisional leather or gems. Of course, this means burning a lot of income in terms of spending your cloth drops on your craft, but at least you get double use out of them. Also, bags are always in demand, and there will always be new alts and newbies that want them.
#18 Nov 18 2004 at 8:58 AM Rating: Decent
I can see this helping people who sell money on-line. They could monopolies the market easier because of bind on equip items.

They just get a few people camping the monsters that drop it, with enough people and some bots they could gt the monster every time as i have seen in FFXI, and boom they are in total control as they stop other from getting it and people who have upgraded cant sell it there is no other way but to buy it off them anf hence they can charge what ever they like.

there is 3 things i'm not sure on that would combat it:
1. the value of money. like in diablo 2 gold is worthless, it is is similar in WoW and if gold isn't that valuble comparatively there would be no market for gold sellers.
2. the need of good equipment. if the advantage of these items are small most people would just skip them.
3. Blizzards stance on gold sellers. if the constantly seek them out and cancel there accounts there wount be a problem.

#19 Nov 18 2004 at 11:01 AM Rating: Decent
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174 posts
LaChimp, good fear, but unfounded. Most of the "good drops" are bind on pickup from instances. Anything that you can sell is not as good as you could find on your own and never be able to sell. This means that the best equipment on the auction house will never sell for anything near the elite prices you see in other games.

Also, anything sellable of any value in the mid to high game drops in a dungeon instance. This means that there is no exclusive camping of the spawn, as a different party could make a group and go through the same dungeon with noone else in it, their own private instance of the dungeon, and find the same mobs, and I should end this sentence but I'm having fun here, so goodnight!
#20 Nov 18 2004 at 11:08 AM Rating: Good
LeChimp wrote:
I can see this helping people who sell money on-line. They could monopolies the market easier because of bind on equip items.

They just get a few people camping the monsters that drop it, with enough people and some bots they could gt the monster every time as i have seen in FFXI, and boom they are in total control as they stop other from getting it and people who have upgraded cant sell it there is no other way but to buy it off them anf hence they can charge what ever they like.


I do not see how soulbinding makes this any more likely than in other games. That is exactly what happens in other games even if they do not bind the item. So the concern is present in any game where drops can be sold for money, and the drops can be farmed by holding a spawn camp.

Actually, having items bind on loot will minimize this if anything.

#21 Nov 18 2004 at 11:26 AM Rating: Decent
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174 posts
That's just it though, in WoW there are virtually no spawn camps to hold. It all drops inside of instances, and you cannot bar someone else's access to the mob if it is in an instance.
#22 Nov 18 2004 at 11:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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4,574 posts
At first I didn’t like the idea of soul bound items. I like passing out items to low level characters and to my alts. But after playing in the first stress test and open beta I have to say that Blizzard has done a good job of balancing this feature. The items your very first character gets during the first ten levels is junk. I don’t see that as a problem, it’s just a fact. I was amazed when I was level fifteen and found a really nice piece of equipment and then found that its minimum level requirement was something like level six.

What this means is that you can level an alt to about level six or ten and then you can equip him or her with some very decent gear. Heck, even with crappy gear I’m able to solo just fine. With level equivalent standard gear just about every character class can kick butt. And if you happen to loot, or fish up, green items, these can be passed to alts or friends or sold off. Blizzard has managed to allow players to twink their alts and friends while still keeping quests and instanced exciting by offering even better items.

Go Blizzard! *grins*
#23 Nov 18 2004 at 12:07 PM Rating: Good
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Gear isn't as important in this game as it is in others. Sure it's nice to have the uber-weapon, but it's not needed.

This by itself will cut down on the campers because the demand for the equipment just will not be there.

Add to it the fact the good gear comes from instances, which cannot be camped, and you'll have little to no camping in WoW.

Edited, Thu Nov 18 12:11:25 2004 by SeomanP
#24 Nov 18 2004 at 12:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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200 posts
I think what a lot of people have forgotten or that they don't know about WoW is that any specific items aren't only from a certain named spawn like in several other MMOs out on the market right now. If you take a look out on thottbot, you can see that almost ANY green or higher item that is currently in the game can drop from a variety of mobs, the droprate is just very low.

I for one found an epic level sword from a random level 45 mob that I was fighting while running around finishing a quest. I didn't have much use for it with my Rogue (it was a 2h sword) so I threw it up on auction house and it sold later on that day for 80 gold.

Although most items that you will find on boss mobs are BoP (Bind on Pickup) a lot of the other items that you can find in an instance are all going to be BoE, (Bind on Equip) including Rare and Epic level weapons/armor. I can finally rest happy with instances, knowing that I'm not camping a rare spawn along with ten other people just to get an item that I want to further my character. Instead, I can spend some time gaining exp (solo play? how incredible!) and farming for an item that I would like, and will most likely use for up to 10 levels down the road. Take a look at my profile in my signature and look at the levels of the blue items I have and you will see how incredible they can be for the level you get them, and that they are quite viable for 10+ levels into your character.
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