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#1 Jun 27 2014 at 7:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/topics/detail/e488fcaa436e68de12164d48b7aca681b15fc4b4

Holy crap I can finally break down the primal junk I've been holding onto for some ungodly reason. My inventory rejoices.

Looks like we can only distribute 300 points across 8 crafts. That is 37.5 per craft if we are averaging. Personally, blacksmith, leatherworker, and weaver are going to be high on the list for me. I've got a ton of green and blue junk I need to desynth.

And the rare rewards for desynthing the hm primal wepons are going to be used in the new crafts in 2.3.... My guess is that those are going to be used to craft the glowing versions of the ilvl 90 crafted gear. Interesting.



Edited, Jun 27th 2014 8:39am by Valkayree
#2 Jun 27 2014 at 7:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
And the rare rewards for desynthing the hm primal wepons are going to be used in the new crafts in 2.3.... My guess is that those are going to be used to craft the glowing versions of the ilvl 90 crafted gear. Interesting.


Seems that way. Though that leaves two scenarios (maybe more):

-If you want this new, glowy (and assumedly "better) version of the i90 Saurian, Cashmere, and Wolfram gear, you need to make it allll from scratch with new recipes that use the desynthesis-only materials.

-The original gear is used as a "base", or an ingredient (sort of like how you use some weapons to make higher level weapons, i.e. Book of Electrum turns in to an Embossed Book of Electrum), along with the desynthesis materials.

My hope, of course, is that it's the second option. But I'm just being selfish when I say that since I spent a lot of time and money self-crafting all my gear, and it would suck if I had to go and make all those from scratch, but with a 'special' material.

Edited, Jun 27th 2014 9:47am by Satisiun
#3 Jun 27 2014 at 7:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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Satisiun wrote:

My hope, of course, is that it's the second option. But I'm just being selfish when I say that since I spent a lot of time and money self-crafting all my gear, and it would suck if I had to go and make all those from scratch, but with a 'special' material.
Edited, Jun 27th 2014 9:47am by Satisiun


Especially if it meant that you would lose your melds. Now if it was ilvl 100 glowy gear (similar to the weathered to unweathered transition) I'm more inclined to go with it.

But on the official forums, people are already complaining to devs to have the ability to turn off the glowing effects so FFXIV doesn't look like a pay to win game. I personally think the effects are subtle and well done.
#4 Jun 27 2014 at 8:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.
#5 Jun 27 2014 at 8:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
Especially if it meant that you would lose your melds. Now if it was ilvl 100 glowy gear (similar to the weathered to unweathered transition) I'm more inclined to go with it.

But on the official forums, people are already complaining to devs to have the ability to turn off the glowing effects so FFXIV doesn't look like a pay to win game. I personally think the effects are subtle and well done.


I wouldn't mind a glowy effect toggle, but it's definitely not over the top as you see in other MMOs. And damn, I never even thought about how I'd lose all the accuracy melded to my Heavy Wolfram gear if I did have to use it as a base material. But yeah, if it bumped the iLvl up by 10, then I could roll with that if it means an alternative to weekly Second Turn drops and headaches over splitting where my Soldiery goes. I just want to avoid re-making the armor itself from scratch if possible.

svlyons wrote:
After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.


I mean I guess you could change which desynthesis points you have in each crafting class. I'm actually reminded of back in the day with Ultima Online and their general stats and aptitude system, where you could set some stats to go up, lock them in place, or to go down if others go up so point allocation is moved around. Obviously it's not convenient like leveling everything up at the same time is, but it's an option.

#6 Jun 27 2014 at 8:46 AM Rating: Good
svlyons wrote:
After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.


Self-sufficient crafters don't really make much sense in an MMO. Of course since the game made it possible to be self-sufficient in the short-term the amount of salt caused by this newly introduced limit will be immense. It makes perfect sense though, much more than limiting battle classes.
#7 Jun 27 2014 at 8:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hyanmen wrote:
svlyons wrote:
After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.

Self-sufficient crafters don't really make much sense in an MMO. Of course since the game made it possible to be self-sufficient in the short-term the amount of salt caused by this newly introduced limit will be immense. It makes perfect sense though, much more than limiting battle classes.

And I think it would have been a great idea if they had gone that route from the start with crafting. But instead, you're practically required to level every craft because of the significant advantages of cross class abilities. You don't even have to be someone who wants to be self sufficient. Want to compete with other Weavers? You need to level everything. Want to be the best Armorer you can be? Better level everything.

And now, you have to focus on a limited number of crafting classes, but only for desynthesis? That just seems very strange to me.
#8 Jun 27 2014 at 10:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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svlyons wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
svlyons wrote:
After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.

Self-sufficient crafters don't really make much sense in an MMO. Of course since the game made it possible to be self-sufficient in the short-term the amount of salt caused by this newly introduced limit will be immense. It makes perfect sense though, much more than limiting battle classes.

And I think it would have been a great idea if they had gone that route from the start with crafting. But instead, you're practically required to level every craft because of the significant advantages of cross class abilities. You don't even have to be someone who wants to be self sufficient. Want to compete with other Weavers? You need to level everything. Want to be the best Armorer you can be? Better level everything.

And now, you have to focus on a limited number of crafting classes, but only for desynthesis? That just seems very strange to me.


Well, with the way they ninja nerfed the patrician's gear / dodore doublet in 2.2 and boosted the stats on the craft gear for specific jobs, they are basically trying to force the upper level crafters into a single niche anyway.
#9 Jun 27 2014 at 11:14 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm a little annoyed by this part.

SE wrote:
Classes level 30 or higher will have a skill level of at least one, which counts toward the combined 300 point maximum.

So you don't actually get 300 points because 8 are used up automatically. Why not just make that first point not count towards the total?
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#10 Jun 27 2014 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
svlyons wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
svlyons wrote:
After having made it so that you can level every craft to its maximum, it's strange that they decided to make desynthesis a limited growth opportunity.

Self-sufficient crafters don't really make much sense in an MMO. Of course since the game made it possible to be self-sufficient in the short-term the amount of salt caused by this newly introduced limit will be immense. It makes perfect sense though, much more than limiting battle classes.

And I think it would have been a great idea if they had gone that route from the start with crafting. But instead, you're practically required to level every craft because of the significant advantages of cross class abilities. You don't even have to be someone who wants to be self sufficient. Want to compete with other Weavers? You need to level everything. Want to be the best Armorer you can be? Better level everything.

And now, you have to focus on a limited number of crafting classes, but only for desynthesis? That just seems very strange to me.


Why they didn't do it from the start is the mystery here to be honest. It makes more sense to not force you to level everything if you want to be the best, but obviously they're not going to turn everything upside down overnight; imagine the QQ if they did. It'll be a slow shift, yet an inevitable one.
#11 Jun 27 2014 at 12:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
Well, with the way they ninja nerfed the patrician's gear / dodore doublet in 2.2 and boosted the stats on the craft gear for specific jobs, they are basically trying to force the upper level crafters into a single niche anyway.

Even with the changes from patch 2.2, you can still "max out" all 8 crafts. It just takes a heavier investment than before.
#12 Jun 27 2014 at 1:53 PM Rating: Good
Yeah but the amount of gil required for that is immense. Enough to preclude a lot of even high level crafters from doing it.

In my case I have zero plans to max out more than CUL (consumables market), CRP (materials market), and maybe WVR (durable goods market). The amount of extra gil you can make by having all classes maxxed compared to just focusing on a couple is just a really bad return on investment, as far as I can see.

Edit:

I've also recently started having nightmares. When the next major patch introduces a new ilvl tier of gear, there's going to be new, high level crafted gear added too. That means the stat floors will likely have to go way up again. I don't see how SE could do that without adding a new tier of crafting armor and/or accessories....

Edited, Jun 27th 2014 3:57pm by DarkswordDX
#13 Jun 30 2014 at 1:23 AM Rating: Decent
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The 300 skill cap quickly ruins what could have been a great idea into absolute and utter rubbish. Not so much that you have 300 points to spend, but that the 1 skill you get on any level 30+ crafting class counts towards the 300 cap. So realistically, what could have been a great idea plummets into Two crafts at 100, one craft at 95 and 5 more crafts at 1...

So because they give you one point and count that towards the cap, you can never cap out 3 skills. But let you come so close that it's no longer funny, good going SE. Once again taking what is a good idea in theory and turning it into crap....
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#14 Jun 30 2014 at 6:07 AM Rating: Excellent
Yeah, I think most of us all-50 crafters eventually settled on one or two niche classes where we found the most comfortable profit margins. Realistically, gearing out all the classes AND actually using them all to their fullest extent is unlikely.

I know I'll be putting my points in goldsmithing and leatherwork, with weaver as my 95.
#15 Jun 30 2014 at 9:24 AM Rating: Good
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Catwho wrote:
Yeah, I think most of us all-50 crafters eventually settled on one or two niche classes where we found the most comfortable profit margins. Realistically, gearing out all the classes AND actually using them all to their fullest extent is unlikely.

I know I'll be putting my points in goldsmithing and leatherwork, with weaver as my 95.


This. People may use them all for certain things but let's be real, unless you found a secret most people didn't, most people fall into 1-3 crafts "mastered" with culinarian usually being one of those 3 because it's ALWAYS consistent money. So I don't see anything ruined other than allowing 1 person to flood the market, which isn't a bad thing with that being ruined.

Remember: As much as someone may want to cry foul, Yoshi stated himself he checks what players does and it's VERY obvious he realizes what most people do in terms of crafts. I remember people stating Yoshi would never impose restrictions on us like Tanaka and Matsui and he'll give players absolute freedom to do whatever they want without regards of balance.

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#16 Jun 30 2014 at 1:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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KojiroSoma wrote:
The 300 skill cap quickly ruins what could have been a great idea into absolute and utter rubbish. Not so much that you have 300 points to spend, but that the 1 skill you get on any level 30+ crafting class counts towards the 300 cap. So realistically, what could have been a great idea plummets into Two crafts at 100, one craft at 95 and 5 more crafts at 1...

So because they give you one point and count that towards the cap, you can never cap out 3 skills. But let you come so close that it's no longer funny, good going SE. Once again taking what is a good idea in theory and turning it into crap....

I wouldn't mind this quirk if it was actually viable to level 3 and only 3 crafts to 30+. If you could get away with that, then you could get 3 crafts to 100 in desynthesis. Say you wanted your crafting identity to be an Armorer. That's one level 50 craft right there. Gotta have Byregot's Blessing, so that's a 2nd level 50 craft. After that, how do you choose between Ingenuity II, Careful Synthesis II, Waste Not II, Innovation and Comfort Zone?

On top of that, we're just now finding out about this imposed restriction after players have already leveled 4 to 8 DoH classes to 30+. It's not like there's a way to delevel those classes. Not that any crafter would make that choice if that was an option.

They should raise the total cap to 305. 300 is a nice round number, but 305 makes more sense.
#17 Jun 30 2014 at 2:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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svlyons wrote:
KojiroSoma wrote:
The 300 skill cap quickly ruins what could have been a great idea into absolute and utter rubbish. Not so much that you have 300 points to spend, but that the 1 skill you get on any level 30+ crafting class counts towards the 300 cap. So realistically, what could have been a great idea plummets into Two crafts at 100, one craft at 95 and 5 more crafts at 1...

So because they give you one point and count that towards the cap, you can never cap out 3 skills. But let you come so close that it's no longer funny, good going SE. Once again taking what is a good idea in theory and turning it into crap....

I wouldn't mind this quirk if it was actually viable to level 3 and only 3 crafts to 30+. If you could get away with that, then you could get 3 crafts to 100 in desynthesis. Say you wanted your crafting identity to be an Armorer. That's one level 50 craft right there. Gotta have Byregot's Blessing, so that's a 2nd level 50 craft. After that, how do you choose between Ingenuity II, Careful Synthesis II, Waste Not II, Innovation and Comfort Zone?

On top of that, we're just now finding out about this imposed restriction after players have already leveled 4 to 8 DoH classes to 30+. It's not like there's a way to delevel those classes. Not that any crafter would make that choice if that was an option.

They should raise the total cap to 305. 300 is a nice round number, but 305 makes more sense.


Right now we have no idea how having a 95 versus a 100 has any affect on the process of desynthing, so until we do I think we should maybe hold off on passing judgement. For all we know there's no real difference between being a 90 or a 100 (yet), or if any difference is all that meaningful. It might not matter at all. It's a little early to start complaining IMO.
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