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My Good/Bad take on using the new Vita to control my PS4Follow

#1 May 08 2014 at 9:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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Got a Vita on release day, one of those new fancy ones that come with Borderlands. I have some good and some bad that I wish people would have told me. So now I tell you, so you know.

The good
1. The device itself is excellent. Feels like a cross between a PSP and one of those new fancy tablets. I've been swapping between FFXIV, Borderlands 2, and the Walking Dead (Telltale Games), with relative ease.
2. Battery life on the new version is surprisingly long. I found myself playing for hours and going "I should have had to plug in by now..."
3. When connecting to PS4 drectly (without a router for local play) the range is 20-30 feet approximately. So within range of the PS4, The game runs well, at PS4 speed, some window resizing, but if you can adjust to the smaller scale, it is a literal mini-translation. If you uncheck the box to connect to PS4 directly, the game becomes a bit slower (still much faster than PS3), but you extend the signal length to the capacity of your router's signal so you can pretty much travel all around your house with it.
4. I love being able to mine, craft, check retainers, and garden from my living room. I beat Ifrit HM and Hydra from the Vita on my bard this weekend, so it can be done, but for me at least, it was not easy. I have also tanked the new lost city dungeon and beat garuda HM and T1 recently on bard, so it is possible, just presents some extra challenges.
5. Thank Eorzea for the two little cool joysticks. 2 joysticks = Good. Take notes, Nintendo.

The bad
1. Whoever designed it and tested it must have had the smallest hands on the planet. My poor big hands do not even come close to being comfortable. The device was made for 8-10 year old hands, I'm pretty sure.
2. The rear touch pad is divided into three quadrants, and is used for L2, R2, R3, and L3. Unresponsive pain in the rear. I would rather have a little more bulk to the system than have to deal with those touchscreens. Due to the size of my hands, it is nearly impossible to press them. I wish I had a peripheral like my lifesaving circle pad pro ( http://www.gamestop.com/nintendo-3ds/accessories/3ds-circle-pad-pro-gamestop-exclusive/98636 ) to help me with these touchscreen and gripping problems. Note: I have discovered that swiping the regions of the touchscreen works much better than a press.
3. I can not cycle through my HUD menu on the Vita. On PS3, I could press select. On the PS4 I press down the middle touchpad. On the Vita, it says that my front touchpad/screen will perform the task of the HUD cycling, but the front screen does not click in. Even adjusting in the menu to assign it to a button, it still does not work. So pretty much I have to mouse over on the front touchpad to attempt to target the highly detailed (but very very small) commendation buttons and loot buttons when they pop. Same goes for having to click the mouse in the chat window to talk to anyone. Although when I do get there, it is physically easier to type text on the Vita using the controller than it is to type with a ps3 or ps4 controller, so that is good. This is hands down the most annoying feature for me.
4. The memory cards for the Vita come in 4GB and 8GB varieties. They look like the mini-SD cards. At first I thought, well I'll just go and buy a 32MB generic card for $20 from the camera isle in walmart like I did with the 3DS, but upon inspection, the Vita cards are shaped differently than the generic camera mini SD cards. Once I installed Borderlands II (full version with all add ons btw, that was a cool perk) I didnt have enough space to install Walking Dead, so I was forced to buy a another stinking 8MB Vita memory card for 24 dollars.

Bottom line (and probably due to terrible sales early on) they really need to step up in the controller comfort and memory card universality areas. The range on the local wireless connection left something to be desired, but when connecting through the router all is well. But despite its limitations, the ability to use the device almost as a tablet while being able to play games like borderlands II while controlling my PS4 at the same time makes me happy I made the purchase.

And if you have any solutions or quick fixes to my HUD cycling issue, I am all ears.



Edited, May 8th 2014 10:23am by Valkayree

Edited, May 10th 2014 8:53am by Valkayree
#2 May 08 2014 at 10:15 AM Rating: Decent
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The real question is how does it work remotely.. Over the internet at like someone else's house.. Being on the same network in your house it should be responsive. Like if I wanted to take it too work and use it.. That is what is important.

I was going to pre order one but since we started playing the game way less I have not bought one yet.. Hard to justify buying one just for this game when our game time has dropped so much...
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#3 May 08 2014 at 10:19 AM Rating: Decent
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I've heard reports of people bringing it to work and playing there, succesfully. Though i have no idea what amounts of latency you would endure.

It's kind of pointless for myself. I'm not addicted enough to this game to buy an entire new system for it just so i can play from my bed. If i wanted to do that, i'd just install it on a lower setting on my laptop.
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#4 May 08 2014 at 10:25 AM Rating: Good
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Nashred wrote:
The real question is how does it work remotely.. Over the internet at like someone else's house.. Being on the same network in your house it should be responsive. Like if I wanted to take it too work and use it.. That is what is important.

I was going to pre order one but since we started playing the game way less I have not bought one yet.. Hard to justify buying one just for this game when our game time has dropped so much...


That was the issue, I have a wireless router hardwired to the computer in a middle bedroom. I have the PS4 in a bac bedroom wirelessly connected to the router. The Vita was then connected to the same local wireless connection in the front living room in a setup similar to below:

Vita --------20 feet -------- Wireless Router --------- 20 feet --------- PS4

Keep losing connection, don't know why. Maybe I am treating it as a mobile hotspot, I don't know, I could be. I haven't tried it with a mobile hotspot yet. I heard somewhere that bypassing the wireless router and connecting directly to the PS4 is an option, but I need to work with that some more to see if it is feasable as a solution.
#5 May 08 2014 at 10:25 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
4. This might be my Wireless router (don't think so since no other devices have a problem) but my house is not big. I have a PS4 in the back room and my router is midway between that and my living room. The living room is probably 30-40 feet from the back room. If I got farther than 20 feet away from the PS4, I lost the signal, frequently, and have to reconnect. Sometimes it tells me that the ability of the Vita to connect is not strong enough, or something to that sort. I connect both devices through my wireless router, fyi, I'm not on 3G or a hotspot or anything. No lead walls either. The 360, PS3, PS4, 3DS, and a laptop have all been connected through this device at some point, from longer distances, with no problems. I don't know what is up.


Real quick explanation on this. When using PS4 remote play, the vita does the following
1. Attempt to directly connect to the PS4 via ad-hoc connection (best). Your router is not involved at all with this connection. Don't believe me? Unplug the router and try to connect to the Ps4 locally.
2. If cannot directly connect, try the local network, through your router. (Good). PS4 has to be on the same IP subnet, which is very normal for home networks.
3.try to connect via internet (low). Different IP subnet.

With your scenario, I think you're directly connected to the PS4, and moving further from it, not the router, may be the issue.

Edited, May 8th 2014 6:03pm by mess3
#6 May 08 2014 at 10:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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KojiroSoma wrote:
I've heard reports of people bringing it to work and playing there, succesfully. Though i have no idea what amounts of latency you would endure.

It's kind of pointless for myself. I'm not addicted enough to this game to buy an entire new system for it just so i can play from my bed. If i wanted to do that, i'd just install it on a lower setting on my laptop.


I don't often envy you PC folks, but this is one reason why I would. I'm MMO console exclusive. I stopped playing games on PC when Spore was starting to tank in popularity and the technology was moving faster than my pocketbook could carry.
#7 May 08 2014 at 10:53 AM Rating: Good
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mess3 wrote:
Quote:
4. This might be my Wireless router (don't think so since no other devices have a problem) but my house is not big. I have a PS4 in the back room and my router is midway between that and my living room. The living room is probably 30-40 feet from the back room. If I got farther than 20 feet away from the PS4, I lost the signal, frequently, and have to reconnect. Sometimes it tells me that the ability of the Vita to connect is not strong enough, or something to that sort. I connect both devices through my wireless router, fyi, I'm not on 3G or a hotspot or anything. No lead walls either. The 360, PS3, PS4, 3DS, and a laptop have all been connected through this device at some point, from longer distances, with no problems. I don't know what is up.


Real quick expiation on the. When using PS4 remote play, the vita does the following
1. Attempt to directly connect to the PS4 via ad-hoc connection (best). You router is not involved at all with this connection. Don't believe me? Unplug the router and try to connect to the Ps4 locally.
2. If cannot directly connect, try the local network, through your router. (Good). PS4 has to be on the same IP subnet, which is very normal for home networks.
3.try to connect via internet (low). Different IP subnet.

With your senecio, I think your directly connected to the PS4 and moving further from it, not the router, may be the issue.



That makes a lot of sense, and if that is the case I can confirm the direct PS4 to Vita connection distance is about 30 - 40 feet. I have explored all options for changing the connection setting on the Vita to connect through router, I'll try and look on the PS4 to see if I can change the connection setting from there. In my situation, it would be much better to connect through the router (although I will undoubtedly experience more lag) than be tethered to a 30-40 foot invisible cable that while incredibly stable, is awfully short.
#8 May 08 2014 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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KojiroSoma wrote:
I've heard reports of people bringing it to work and playing there, succesfully. Though i have no idea what amounts of latency you would endure.

It's kind of pointless for myself. I'm not addicted enough to this game to buy an entire new system for it just so i can play from my bed. If i wanted to do that, i'd just install it on a lower setting on my laptop.


I've done this, remote play at work lunch break, and the experience is less than stellar for sure. However, you can craft and gather fine, but I'd log out prepared with mats/at your gathering location.
I will say I got an Atma drop once on remote play at a lunch break. I was all staged in the area I was fate farming, things were a bit too laggy but them fates were like second nature at that point and I could compensate.
#9 May 08 2014 at 1:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
mess3 wrote:
Quote:
4. This might be my Wireless router (don't think so since no other devices have a problem) but my house is not big. I have a PS4 in the back room and my router is midway between that and my living room. The living room is probably 30-40 feet from the back room. If I got farther than 20 feet away from the PS4, I lost the signal, frequently, and have to reconnect. Sometimes it tells me that the ability of the Vita to connect is not strong enough, or something to that sort. I connect both devices through my wireless router, fyi, I'm not on 3G or a hotspot or anything. No lead walls either. The 360, PS3, PS4, 3DS, and a laptop have all been connected through this device at some point, from longer distances, with no problems. I don't know what is up.


Real quick expiation on the. When using PS4 remote play, the vita does the following
1. Attempt to directly connect to the PS4 via ad-hoc connection (best). You router is not involved at all with this connection. Don't believe me? Unplug the router and try to connect to the Ps4 locally.
2. If cannot directly connect, try the local network, through your router. (Good). PS4 has to be on the same IP subnet, which is very normal for home networks.
3.try to connect via internet (low). Different IP subnet.

With your senecio, I think your directly connected to the PS4 and moving further from it, not the router, may be the issue.



That makes a lot of sense, and if that is the case I can confirm the direct PS4 to Vita connection distance is about 30 - 40 feet. I have explored all options for changing the connection setting on the Vita to connect through router, I'll try and look on the PS4 to see if I can change the connection setting from there. In my situation, it would be much better to connect through the router (although I will undoubtedly experience more lag) than be tethered to a 30-40 foot invisible cable that while incredibly stable, is awfully short.


I went home over lunch and accessed the PS4 directly (can't do it while remotely connected). There is a secondary check box in Settings > Remote Play that will select to directly connect to the PS4 (an option when you dont have a router). I had checked this initially and it defaulted to the direct connection. I unchecked this and reconnected via remote play and it is pushing through my router now. I can go all over the house. Good stuff.
#10 May 08 2014 at 1:40 PM Rating: Good
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I wonder what kind of lag using the Vita introduces. I recently took a trip to visit the wife's parents in middle-of-nowhere Florida and brought my laptop along. They don't have internet at all. I only had maybe a bar of 4g coverage out there but decided to tether my phone wirelessly and see how FFXIV played on it. I was able to do my dailies and do a couple treasure maps without a problem. I totally expected a lot of lag but didnt see anything drastic, it was very playable. Maybe remote play requires a lot more bandwidth on top of what the game itself requires? Its just hard to believe its slow like that when someone is in the same house as the PS4 hosting the game.

Maybe we just need a native Vita install of it!
#11 May 08 2014 at 4:11 PM Rating: Decent
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I purposely bought a Vita before the new model came out. The OLED screen on the older model is much nicer than the LCD screen on the new thin model. As to size, I can't even fathom have a thinner version of the Vita, it's already built for tiny little hands, a smaller version would be awful. I had to buy a grip to hold mine to make the thing playable for more than a few minutes. Since I haven't bought a PS4 yet, I can't say how it works as a second screen. I've been playing a handful of Vita games that I've wanted to play for some time, and the little machine pushes out some impressive graphics. I just wish there were more games for it. The ones I have a great, but there aren't many more that I want.
#12 May 08 2014 at 4:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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reptiletim wrote:
I wonder what kind of lag using the Vita introduces. I recently took a trip to visit the wife's parents in middle-of-nowhere Florida and brought my laptop along. They don't have internet at all. I only had maybe a bar of 4g coverage out there but decided to tether my phone wirelessly and see how FFXIV played on it. I was able to do my dailies and do a couple treasure maps without a problem. I totally expected a lot of lag but didnt see anything drastic, it was very playable. Maybe remote play requires a lot more bandwidth on top of what the game itself requires? Its just hard to believe its slow like that when someone is in the same house as the PS4 hosting the game.


The issue with Remote Play is that it streams the post-rendered PS4 display to the Vita rather than just the instructions on what to render because the Vita isn't powerful enough to do the rendering itself (if it were, you wouldn't need the PS4 as a go-between to begin with). So not only are the bandwidth requirements higher because of the streamed content, you have twice the lag because exchanges between the FFXIV servers and the Vita have to take 4 separate trips over the internet instead of the normal 2, i.e.:

Home play
FFXIV -> Internet -> PS4 -> Internet -> FFXIV

vs.

Remote play (over the Internet)
FFXIV -> Internet -> PS4 -> Internet -> Vita -> Internet -> PS4 -> Internet -> FFXIV
#13 May 09 2014 at 12:06 AM Rating: Good
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I was a bit surprised when I saw footage of how it plays, but I figured it would work out being something you could use for simple pleasures like crafting or gathering. Probably not something I'd pick up solely for use with ARR, but my platform of choice is PC so getting the console version would already cover my lazy-boy needs. My guess was that it would be close to PS3 version so it seems I wasn't far off.
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#14 May 09 2014 at 1:38 PM Rating: Excellent
Thanks for the complete review. Very helpful.
#15 May 09 2014 at 4:57 PM Rating: Good
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those rear touch pad buttons suck.. i cant hold my vita in a way that stops me from hitting the touchpad buttons unintentioally
#16 May 10 2014 at 7:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
those rear touch pad buttons suck.. i cant hold my vita in a way that stops me from hitting the touchpad buttons unintentioally


Tell me about it. I am constantly sheathing and unsheathing my weapon and zooming in on things (R3 and L3), looking like an idiot. After borderlands 2, where the rear touchscreen is used for meele, I have found that actually touching the pad is not responsive at all, but if you perform a swipe across the region it seems to work much better.

The hand cramps from the thin version are insane. With that given I'm sure that a few weeks of using it will condition the muscles and it wont be so bad.

With that given, on the vita I have successfully tanked lost city, tanked a brayflox speed run, beat T1, ifrit hm, garuda hm, and hydra on bard. Haven't been brave enough to try titan hm or any of the ex primals on it just yet. I can't imagine that T2 would be so difficult either.

Edited, May 10th 2014 12:00pm by Valkayree
#17 May 10 2014 at 10:01 AM Rating: Good
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I reassign R3 to Target of Target and shut L3 off. This way you can at least touch the bottom of the touchpad with less issues.
Still, don't like it either.
#18 May 10 2014 at 10:59 AM Rating: Good
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mess3 wrote:
I reassign R3 to Target of Target and shut L3 off. This way you can at least touch the bottom of the touchpad with less issues.
Still, don't like it either.


I did that on the Vita, but even though I applied changes it didnt even apply, much less save. It has a "remote play" indicator in the settings menu. I think I may need to set it on the PS4 for it to stick. Even when I switched the "cycle hud" feature to the square button it still didnt work. Odd.
#19 May 10 2014 at 11:08 AM Rating: Good
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Well it's not just me then! Ya, I have to reapply this each time I remote play. Don't matter what I set I the ps4... Bug
#20 May 13 2014 at 9:03 AM Rating: Good
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mess3 wrote:
Well it's not just me then! Ya, I have to reapply this each time I remote play. Don't matter what I set I the ps4... Bug


Its been sticking for me since I applied to the control screen, then reapplied to the main screen. Just apply everywhere you can and it works, I think.
#21 May 14 2014 at 5:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Maybe a dumb question but how do I get out of the main log in screen on the Vita? It usually exit the game on teh PS4, I hit the PS button but when I do it on the Vita I get a Setting type menu and not one to close out the application.

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