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something that was said regarding BiS ingameFollow
I re,ember awhile back asking about BiS here and wad pretty much told that theres no end all be all BiS so theres no definitive thing we can tell you to use, ppls BiS will be different depending on how they wanna build their character. When I said that ingame ppl said "there is definitive BiS as theres no "different builds for different people" because this game lacks that kind of customization" or "here is definitive BiS theres a list of BiS for every job posted on reddit. Now there might e different gear you use for different situations, but BiS is BiS and thats set in stone for each job" Sooo are they correct or are they just following the Elite iS bandwagon?
Basically you need to meet the accuracy cap in Coil. That's really the only hard requirement for gear. Outside of that you can just about forget about accuracy.
So, "BiS" typically refers to a build that meets the accuracy requirement in coil (give or take food), but gives the best stats after that (i.e. highest primary stat and so on and so forth). Typically this difference boils down to secondary stats and not your primary. So basically, if you're the same ilvl as someone else, there's not a whole lot of potential difference between gear sets apart from secondary stats. .
People aren't being elite when they say there's BiS for each class, just ask yourself what the BiS is in fact for. Most of the time people are gauging it against coil.
So, "BiS" typically refers to a build that meets the accuracy requirement in coil (give or take food), but gives the best stats after that (i.e. highest primary stat and so on and so forth). Typically this difference boils down to secondary stats and not your primary. So basically, if you're the same ilvl as someone else, there's not a whole lot of potential difference between gear sets apart from secondary stats. .
People aren't being elite when they say there's BiS for each class, just ask yourself what the BiS is in fact for. Most of the time people are gauging it against coil.
The only customization in XIV comes in the form of the few support abilities you can add from other classes. None of them are anything that would change your playstyle significantly. It's not like other games that have specs, glyphs or runes that completely change the gameplay and give you the freedom to play the class or job how you want to. For that reason, you'll probably always have BiS gear for any standard situation in XIV.
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cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
Good question.
In fact BiS is hard to determine, instead of a BiS set in the stone that will be modified each time a new piece of equipment becomes available, I'd like to use the following priority list to determine which equipment should be used in each slot:
1) First meet your [Accuracy] quota
What a lot of people does not know about accuracy is that given the directional nature of the game combat mechanics, the accuracy required to hit an enemy from the front, from the side and from the back is different. For example in order to hit Twintania in BC Turn 5 you need: 481 from the front, 473~ from the side and 440~ from the back.
Therefore usually tanks require the highest accuracy followed by the melee DPS's and finally the ranged DPS's, it does without saying but healers do not require accuracy for recovering spells.
As far as I understand there is no accuracy requirement for anything outside Bahamut Coil, hence you can have one set for BC and other set for everything else.
2) Tanks, mind your [Defensive Stats]
Every defensive accessory in this game has VIT so there isn't much of a choice there. What you need however is Parry, there isn't much else to consider as far a defensive stats are concerned.
As a Tank you should be concerned only with your Weapon damage above parry, any other offensive stat should come second to your survivability.
3) Finally focus on your [Offensive/Healing stats]
Weapon damage: 49
Main Stat: (STR, DEX, INT, MND): 6
Determination: 2
Critic Damage and Spell/Skill Speed: 1
Note: again this values are approximate but close enough to the real thing to be used for comparisons.
It's also worth mention that while critical chance and spell/skill speed have more or less the same weight the former is a free damage/healing increase, while skill/spell speed increase your resource (MP/TP) consumption which is not really desirable.
[Exceptions]
- Bards and Scholars have mechanics that greatly favor critic chance, hence for them the weight for Critic chance is about 3~ I haven't check this number myself but most people seem to agree on it.
Another thing to mention is that given the weight of each stat it's extremely rare that a lower ilvl piece outperforms a higher ilvl piece given the higher ilvl will have at least 2-3 points difference in the main stat.
I'm sorry the post got a bit long, but I hope it helps.
Ken
In fact BiS is hard to determine, instead of a BiS set in the stone that will be modified each time a new piece of equipment becomes available, I'd like to use the following priority list to determine which equipment should be used in each slot:
1) First meet your [Accuracy] quota
What a lot of people does not know about accuracy is that given the directional nature of the game combat mechanics, the accuracy required to hit an enemy from the front, from the side and from the back is different. For example in order to hit Twintania in BC Turn 5 you need: 481 from the front, 473~ from the side and 440~ from the back.
Therefore usually tanks require the highest accuracy followed by the melee DPS's and finally the ranged DPS's, it does without saying but healers do not require accuracy for recovering spells.
As far as I understand there is no accuracy requirement for anything outside Bahamut Coil, hence you can have one set for BC and other set for everything else.
2) Tanks, mind your [Defensive Stats]
Every defensive accessory in this game has VIT so there isn't much of a choice there. What you need however is Parry, there isn't much else to consider as far a defensive stats are concerned.
As a Tank you should be concerned only with your Weapon damage above parry, any other offensive stat should come second to your survivability.
3) Finally focus on your [Offensive/Healing stats]
Weapon damage: 49
Main Stat: (STR, DEX, INT, MND): 6
Determination: 2
Critic Damage and Spell/Skill Speed: 1
Note: again this values are approximate but close enough to the real thing to be used for comparisons.
It's also worth mention that while critical chance and spell/skill speed have more or less the same weight the former is a free damage/healing increase, while skill/spell speed increase your resource (MP/TP) consumption which is not really desirable.
[Exceptions]
- Bards and Scholars have mechanics that greatly favor critic chance, hence for them the weight for Critic chance is about 3~ I haven't check this number myself but most people seem to agree on it.
Another thing to mention is that given the weight of each stat it's extremely rare that a lower ilvl piece outperforms a higher ilvl piece given the higher ilvl will have at least 2-3 points difference in the main stat.
I'm sorry the post got a bit long, but I hope it helps.
Ken
"Maybe it means: you're the evil man, and I'm the righteous man, and Mr. Nine-millimeter here, he's the shepherd protecting my righteous *** in the Valley of Darkness." - Jules.
FFXIV: Mabel Rand (Gugnir)
FFXI: Kenage, retired.
K&K forever!,
FFXIV: Mabel Rand (Gugnir)
K&K forever!,
I'm going to lay it out for you once again.
As the above mentioned, BiS is usually used in regards to coil content. What is BiS for primals (that have little to no ACC requirement outside of Leviathan Ex), is definitely not BiS for coil because you lose a lot of ACC. At the same time, if you use your coil gear for primals, you are using unnecessary ACC instead of a piece of gear that doesn't have ACC on it.
Now here is where I'll ask you to think: outside of accuracy, which stat is better for certain jobs as a 'secondary'? What are the stat weights? Does 1 crit equal 2 det? You will not know until substantial testing is done, hence why it is mostly speculative.
There is an exception and that is usually BRD: skill speed seems to do little for them so they have a definite best secondary stat which is critical hit.
What is the best secondary stat for BLM? No one knows, though many claim one is better than the other or that they're all equal.
So as a BLM, I want to pick a stat to focus on. For me, it will be critical hit or determination. The highest amount of critical hit and determination I can get on all my gear while still meeting the ACC caps is what would be considered a BiS set. Any gear with spell speed on it would not be considered BiS if there is an equivalent piece of gear with CRIT/DET on it.
Is this clear?
I would also be careful about making assumptions about certain stats for other classes. DET is actually showing favorable returns for SCHs in 2.2 so they may become like BLM in a sense where DET and CRIT are equally weighted. There is also the concept of soft caps and diminishing returns but I'd rather not get into that.
If I were to pick spell speed as my secondary stat for BLM, my BiS list would look completely different than my BiS list for CRIT/DET.
Many jobs are in the same boat.
As the above mentioned, BiS is usually used in regards to coil content. What is BiS for primals (that have little to no ACC requirement outside of Leviathan Ex), is definitely not BiS for coil because you lose a lot of ACC. At the same time, if you use your coil gear for primals, you are using unnecessary ACC instead of a piece of gear that doesn't have ACC on it.
Now here is where I'll ask you to think: outside of accuracy, which stat is better for certain jobs as a 'secondary'? What are the stat weights? Does 1 crit equal 2 det? You will not know until substantial testing is done, hence why it is mostly speculative.
There is an exception and that is usually BRD: skill speed seems to do little for them so they have a definite best secondary stat which is critical hit.
What is the best secondary stat for BLM? No one knows, though many claim one is better than the other or that they're all equal.
So as a BLM, I want to pick a stat to focus on. For me, it will be critical hit or determination. The highest amount of critical hit and determination I can get on all my gear while still meeting the ACC caps is what would be considered a BiS set. Any gear with spell speed on it would not be considered BiS if there is an equivalent piece of gear with CRIT/DET on it.
Is this clear?
I would also be careful about making assumptions about certain stats for other classes. DET is actually showing favorable returns for SCHs in 2.2 so they may become like BLM in a sense where DET and CRIT are equally weighted. There is also the concept of soft caps and diminishing returns but I'd rather not get into that.
If I were to pick spell speed as my secondary stat for BLM, my BiS list would look completely different than my BiS list for CRIT/DET.
Many jobs are in the same boat.
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
I re,ember awhile back asking about BiS here and wad pretty much told that theres no end all be all BiS so theres no definitive thing we can tell you to use, ppls BiS will be different depending on how they wanna build their character. When I said that ingame ppl said "there is definitive BiS as theres no "different builds for different people" because this game lacks that kind of customization" or "here is definitive BiS theres a list of BiS for every job posted on reddit. Now there might e different gear you use for different situations, but BiS is BiS and thats set in stone for each job" Sooo are they correct or are they just following the Elite iS bandwagon?
I see that you have found a group of elitist enablers. Congratulations.
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
I re,ember awhile back asking about BiS here and wad pretty much told that theres no end all be all BiS so theres no definitive thing we can tell you to use, ppls BiS will be different depending on how they wanna build their character. When I said that ingame ppl said "there is definitive BiS as theres no "different builds for different people" because this game lacks that kind of customization" or "here is definitive BiS theres a list of BiS for every job posted on reddit. Now there might e different gear you use for different situations, but BiS is BiS and thats set in stone for each job" Sooo are they correct or are they just following the Elite iS bandwagon?
Find one person you trust. Get their opinion. That way, you don't have to constantly try to get a bunch of forum board posters and in-game contacts to all say the exact same thing to you (cuz that will never happen).
Is that one person someone you know in-game? Stick with what they say. Is that one person someone on these boards? Stick with what they say.
HitomeOfBismarck wrote:
I'm going to lay it out for you once again.
As the above mentioned, BiS is usually used in regards to coil content. What is BiS for primals (that have little to no ACC requirement outside of Leviathan Ex), is definitely not BiS for coil because you lose a lot of ACC. At the same time, if you use your coil gear for primals, you are using unnecessary ACC instead of a piece of gear that doesn't have ACC on it.
Now here is where I'll ask you to think: outside of accuracy, which stat is better for certain jobs as a 'secondary'? What are the stat weights? Does 1 crit equal 2 det? You will not know until substantial testing is done, hence why it is mostly speculative.
There is an exception and that is usually BRD: skill speed seems to do little for them so they have a definite best secondary stat which is critical hit.
What is the best secondary stat for BLM? No one knows, though many claim one is better than the other or that they're all equal.
So as a BLM, I want to pick a stat to focus on. For me, it will be critical hit or determination. The highest amount of critical hit and determination I can get on all my gear while still meeting the ACC caps is what would be considered a BiS set. Any gear with spell speed on it would not be considered BiS if there is an equivalent piece of gear with CRIT/DET on it.
Is this clear?
I would also be careful about making assumptions about certain stats for other classes. DET is actually showing favorable returns for SCHs in 2.2 so they may become like BLM in a sense where DET and CRIT are equally weighted. There is also the concept of soft caps and diminishing returns but I'd rather not get into that.
If I were to pick spell speed as my secondary stat for BLM, my BiS list would look completely different than my BiS list for CRIT/DET.
Many jobs are in the same boat.
As the above mentioned, BiS is usually used in regards to coil content. What is BiS for primals (that have little to no ACC requirement outside of Leviathan Ex), is definitely not BiS for coil because you lose a lot of ACC. At the same time, if you use your coil gear for primals, you are using unnecessary ACC instead of a piece of gear that doesn't have ACC on it.
Now here is where I'll ask you to think: outside of accuracy, which stat is better for certain jobs as a 'secondary'? What are the stat weights? Does 1 crit equal 2 det? You will not know until substantial testing is done, hence why it is mostly speculative.
There is an exception and that is usually BRD: skill speed seems to do little for them so they have a definite best secondary stat which is critical hit.
What is the best secondary stat for BLM? No one knows, though many claim one is better than the other or that they're all equal.
So as a BLM, I want to pick a stat to focus on. For me, it will be critical hit or determination. The highest amount of critical hit and determination I can get on all my gear while still meeting the ACC caps is what would be considered a BiS set. Any gear with spell speed on it would not be considered BiS if there is an equivalent piece of gear with CRIT/DET on it.
Is this clear?
I would also be careful about making assumptions about certain stats for other classes. DET is actually showing favorable returns for SCHs in 2.2 so they may become like BLM in a sense where DET and CRIT are equally weighted. There is also the concept of soft caps and diminishing returns but I'd rather not get into that.
If I were to pick spell speed as my secondary stat for BLM, my BiS list would look completely different than my BiS list for CRIT/DET.
Many jobs are in the same boat.
then heres the award winning question. Lets see you have your BiS build for crit and det (so the highest crit and det you can get) which may sacrifice some accuracy.... probably even so much so that it wont meet the coil acc requirement. wouldnt people get on your case if they saw that?
With the glamour system it's a lot harder to judge someone based on the appearance of gear.
Really all you have to go on is performance.
If someone sees you whiffing in Coil because you didn't have a proper accuracy build and they call you out on it, then yeah, they might suggest you fix the problem before going into Coil again.
Really all you have to go on is performance.
If someone sees you whiffing in Coil because you didn't have a proper accuracy build and they call you out on it, then yeah, they might suggest you fix the problem before going into Coil again.
heh whiff... i hardly ever seen people whiff in this game (unlike a certain other FF mmo where at 50+ if ppl had crappy acc.. everyone could tell without lookin hard lol)
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
heh whiff... i hardly ever seen people whiff in this game (unlike a certain other FF mmo where at 50+ if ppl had crappy acc.. everyone could tell without lookin hard lol)
Go to turn 4 and 5 and you will see it on occasion
DuoMaxwellxx wrote:
heh whiff... i hardly ever seen people whiff in this game (unlike a certain other FF mmo where at 50+ if ppl had crappy acc.. everyone could tell without lookin hard lol)
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