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No Class Adjustments for 2.2Follow

#1 Mar 26 2014 at 7:37 AM Rating: Decent
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So the full patch notes for 2.2 are out, and I didn't see anything about class/job adjustments. Just out of curiosity, I was wondering what everyone else thinks about the current class balance of the game. Are there any changes you'd like to see made to any of the classes/jobs?

Personally, I feel like the game is pretty balanced, but there are a few things I'd like to see tweaked.

White Mage - Currently WHM is the only mage that really has MP issues. So I'd either like to see the MP refresh from Shroud of Saints buffed or the cool-down lowered. It would also be nice to have the enmity reduction and refresh elements of Shroud of Saints split into separate abilities. (Or you could up SCH's MP costs to even things out, but nerfs are no fun)

Dragoon - A reduction in cool-down for Spineshatter Dive. Just because having gap closers available more often is nice. Maybe reduce the timer from 90 seconds to 60 seconds.

Monk - Remove the minimum distance requirement for Shoulder Tackle (making it a viable close range stun), and make Steel Peak a silence instead of a stun (giving Monk an off GCD silence). Remove the silence from Arm of the Destroyer and increase its potency slightly for better AoE damage.

Black Mage - I'd like to see all of the Thunder abilities reworked so that they aren't all the same. Leave Thunder I as it is, a simple DoT. Maybe change Thunder II to be a light AoE (something like Miasma II) so that it's in line with the other tier II spells. Maybe give Thunder III an additional effect when it's used with Thundercloud -- something like strength -5% for 15 seconds for example.
#2 Mar 26 2014 at 7:47 AM Rating: Decent
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Never know what they might have ninja patched
#3 Mar 26 2014 at 8:03 AM Rating: Excellent
I agree, SoS could use a bit of tweaking, but I've found that if I remember to pop it earlier in the battle than I need it, I can sometimes keep my MP under control until the end. It's like Red Mage's refresh was in XI - you pop it every three minutes whether you actually need it right now or not.

I'd like it to be separated from the hate management part of it. After a Medica II is not always the ideal time to pop SoS but sometimes I'll do it just to keep myself from getting smooshed.
#4 Mar 26 2014 at 8:27 AM Rating: Default
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Unbalanced, of course. However, some classes look worse/better than they are because quite frankly there's still Monks who don't use their Stances and BLMs who wouldn't know a rotation if they were on a merry go round.

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#5 Mar 26 2014 at 8:30 AM Rating: Decent
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I can't dig it up quickly but I'm sure I read somewhere that they weren't planning to make class adjustments in 2.3. Anyone else have the source?
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#6 Mar 26 2014 at 9:07 AM Rating: Decent
Theonehio wrote:
Unbalanced, of course. However, some classes look worse/better than they are because quite frankly there's still Monks who don't use their Stances and BLMs who wouldn't know a rotation if they were on a merry go round.


Coming from the EQ clone fellow, I can't stop laughing.
#7 Mar 26 2014 at 10:57 AM Rating: Good
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For black mage - I want flare to have a longer cooldown, and give me back my instant mana from casing Blizzard III out of Astral Fire III. Having to cast thunder II and Scathe to fill the gap until my mana comes back is annoying.

#8 Mar 26 2014 at 12:00 PM Rating: Default
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Hyanmen wrote:
Theonehio wrote:
Unbalanced, of course. However, some classes look worse/better than they are because quite frankly there's still Monks who don't use their Stances and BLMs who wouldn't know a rotation if they were on a merry go round.


Coming from the EQ clone fellow, I can't stop laughing.


Why are you so butthurt? lol Did I insult you to the point you're now stalking me just to be butthurt about something? xD
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#9 Mar 26 2014 at 1:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think the jobs are pretty balanced, none of the content requires any stacking of any jobs to beat it so to me that's pretty balanced.
#10REDACTED, Posted: Mar 26 2014 at 1:32 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Your comments are the best comedy I've heard in years. An endless goldmine. I'm 100% your fan.
#11 Mar 26 2014 at 5:13 PM Rating: Excellent
Something has to have MP issues or Mage's Ballad is not so useful. Right now the two jobs, brd/whm, have a certain synergy.

IMO, the game is balanced quite well.
- Parties prefer the sch/whm combo rather than two of either.
- Drg and mnk get a slight dps edge to make up for having to dodge more often.
- War has a ton of damage and Hp to make up for not having as many damage mitigation tools as pld.
- Pld/war combo is preferred generally speaking.
- Blms get to see high numbers, and ultimately parse on par with bards for single target activities.
- Blm not being able to cast while dodging is a slight disadvantage, but blm remain the top source of burst AoE damage.
- And summoner is a a skill based class that can be very very effective when DoTs are applied correctly, not to mention a huge edge in solo activities, and the only dps job to have access to raise in battle.

Not a single job is being cold-shouldered at endgame. That's my take on it. I'd be surprised if they can maintain that level of balance when the level cap increases.

Edited, Mar 26th 2014 7:14pm by Gnu
#12 Mar 26 2014 at 5:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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My biggest gripe is that ranged DPS have a pretty big advantage in many fights over melee DPS.

2nd gripe would be more/better MP recovery tools for WHM.

Other than that there seem to be very few and far between areas you 'need' one job vs another. Anyone demanding a particular DPS over another is just a 'fraidy cat. :p
#13 Mar 26 2014 at 6:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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As a WHM the only time I have MP issues is when other players are doing something wrong. Frequent SoS use, Cure 1s, Freecure Cure 2s, Divine Sealed Regens & Medicas, whole party Cure 3s, Benediction, Hi-Elixirs... all of these help keep MP reserves at good levels unless things get really ugly. Shouldn't we expect healer MP to run out if party members are taking way too much damage?
#14 Mar 26 2014 at 8:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Gnu wrote:

Not a single job is being cold-shouldered at endgame. That's my take on it. I'd be surprised if they can maintain that level of balance when the level cap increases.
Edited, Mar 26th 2014 7:14pm by Gnu


^ this. I really have not seen any job in EG be avoided due to serious problems. But, time will tell with the level cap.
#15 Mar 26 2014 at 9:05 PM Rating: Decent
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Every end game content, the mob is capable of dropping the tank hp from full to low, and killing the tank next hit. whm only have 1 chance of handling it thru benediction.
Benediction needs to be @ 1min recast, so that whm can handle the WTF moment better, currently sch have 3 lustrate per min, while whm have 1 benediction per 5min, making sch way easier to handle the WTF moment.

on top of that, i think Regen needs to be on non-gcd, there r way too many times, when u cast a Regen on the tank (while high on hp), then suddenly BOOM, mob does an ability, tank hp drops low, there is nothing much u can do, but wait for the Regen gcd (~2sec), then hit yr Cure2 (another 2sec). Worst case app 4sec wait....WTF.
#16 Mar 26 2014 at 11:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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SCH is better than WHM in certain aspects and WHM is better in others. I don't think "SCH has x so WHM should get it too" is a valid argument for buffing WHM. The job will get nice new abilities that will make it more effective and perhaps cover weaknesses when all jobs get new abilities.
#17 Mar 26 2014 at 11:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Agreed. While nothing is ever perfect and there are plenty of things I could nitpick, overall class balance is really good right now.
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#18 Mar 27 2014 at 8:17 AM Rating: Good
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kazame wrote:

Benediction needs to be @ 1min recast, so that whm can handle the WTF moment better, currently sch have 3 lustrate per min, while whm have 1 benediction per 5min, making sch way easier to handle the WTF moment.


But adloquium and succor are incredibly terrible when compared to Cure II and Medica. This is why I favor healing the MT as scholar (especially when it is a warrior since lustrate restores health percentage) but as whm I am better suited to heal the entire party.
#19 Mar 27 2014 at 8:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Valkayree wrote:
kazame wrote:

Benediction needs to be @ 1min recast, so that whm can handle the WTF moment better, currently sch have 3 lustrate per min, while whm have 1 benediction per 5min, making sch way easier to handle the WTF moment.


But adloquium and succor are incredibly terrible when compared to Cure II and Medica. This is why I favor healing the MT as scholar (especially when it is a warrior since lustrate restores health percentage) but as whm I am better suited to heal the entire party.


The main purpose of these are the shield, actually. So while the base recovery is **** compared to actual cure formula, the shield is double of what you heal, hence why SCH's focus on crit rate.
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#20 Mar 27 2014 at 9:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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TauuOfSiren wrote:
SCH is better than WHM in certain aspects and WHM is better in others. I don't think "SCH has x so WHM should get it too" is a valid argument for buffing WHM. The job will get nice new abilities that will make it more effective and perhaps cover weaknesses when all jobs get new abilities.

This is a very important perspective to maintain. For the most part, I have seen very few cases where one job was very specifically being sought out over others. WHM is one of those few cases, but it has been limited mostly to turn 2 for enrage (which may become far less common with 2.2) and Titan EX.

The other case I have seen is BRD being so important for Turn 1 and 2. The nerf to High Voltage will hopefully help with that.
#21 Mar 27 2014 at 7:23 PM Rating: Good
Theonehio wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
kazame wrote:

Benediction needs to be @ 1min recast, so that whm can handle the WTF moment better, currently sch have 3 lustrate per min, while whm have 1 benediction per 5min, making sch way easier to handle the WTF moment.


But adloquium and succor are incredibly terrible when compared to Cure II and Medica. This is why I favor healing the MT as scholar (especially when it is a warrior since lustrate restores health percentage) but as whm I am better suited to heal the entire party.


The main purpose of these are the shield, actually. So while the base recovery is sh*t compared to actual cure formula, the shield is double of what you heal, hence why SCH's focus on crit rate.


Shield is only double the heal when you crit but yes, I'm in agreement that adloquiem is a very nice spell for tank healing. I do think succor needs a slight buff, though. What I'd actually like to see is a sort of aoe lustrate that uses aether flow charges. That way you could keep your low potency aoe with shield and have a heavy aoe heal for burst but have to manage it with your charges.
#22 Mar 28 2014 at 6:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Personally i still feel that Warriors were overly buffed to the point of rediculousness, and either a slight tweak is in order to lower their power a little, or to buff Paladin accordingly.

They used to be two diffirent jobs, but people complained and didnt realize that Warrior needs to be played as a Warrior, not like a Paladin. Same tactics dont apply. Now the only diffirence between them i feel is you can either be a "weaker sword/shield paladin" or a "stronger paladin with a great axe that is called Warrior".

Warriors have all the ability effects that Paladin have, plus all their own on top of that and 25% more HP. If you cant see that that's slightly flawed then there's something seriously wrong with you.
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#23 Mar 28 2014 at 10:01 AM Rating: Good
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Gnu wrote:
Something has to have MP issues or Mage's Ballad is not so useful. Right now the two jobs, brd/whm, have a certain synergy.

IMO, the game is balanced quite well.
- Parties prefer the sch/whm combo rather than two of either.
- Drg and mnk get a slight dps edge to make up for having to dodge more often.
- War has a ton of damage and Hp to make up for not having as many damage mitigation tools as pld.
- Pld/war combo is preferred generally speaking.
- Blms get to see high numbers, and ultimately parse on par with bards for single target activities.
- Blm not being able to cast while dodging is a slight disadvantage, but blm remain the top source of burst AoE damage.
- And summoner is a a skill based class that can be very very effective when DoTs are applied correctly, not to mention a huge edge in solo activities, and the only dps job to have access to raise in battle.

Not a single job is being cold-shouldered at endgame. That's my take on it. I'd be surprised if they can maintain that level of balance when the level cap increases.

Edited, Mar 26th 2014 7:14pm by Gnu



I agree with this 100 percent...
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