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PS4 version to run locked at 30 FPSFollow

#1 Feb 12 2014 at 6:48 PM Rating: Sub-Default
I was thinking about buying the PS4 version of this game until I read this ridiculous news.

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/119279-FFXIV-Patch-2.1-Press-Interviews-with-Yoshida?p=5981564&viewfull=1#post5981564

... and according to the ZAM interview (other thread) it will drop below 20 FPS during major boss fights.

Does anyone else think these people should just stop attending console ports? I mean, this is getting ridiculous.
#2 Feb 12 2014 at 6:56 PM Rating: Excellent
Check out the ZAM interview with Yoshi-P. He indicates the FPS is capped at 60, with the goal to have FPS never dip below 30.

"The quality and framerate is pretty similar to the PC version."

You can see this part of the interview at the 2:39 mark here: http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=1392199728243771499
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#3 Feb 12 2014 at 7:10 PM Rating: Good
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This contradicts what he said in the ZAM video. He said something along the lines of, it won't be over 60fps but up to 60fps...and as low as -20 in really crazy fights.

Regardless, even at 30fps, the PS4 version will perform better than my current PC, plus I'll get to play in the living room.

I'm picking up a copy for sure.

I don't see a problem with the PS4 especially at this stage in the game's life. However I was kind of puzzled why (other than the money) why SE would release an MMO (and base a lot of design/technical decisions) at the end of a console's life. (PS3)

I have a feeling that this time around SE will be a little more "forceful" in persuading people to switch to either PC or PS4... Although this is more of a hope than something that will actually happen.
#4 Feb 12 2014 at 7:23 PM Rating: Decent
Well, if you take note, that forum thread you posted was dated in December of 2013....

... the video interview posted in ZAM is what... a day or two old?



I'm willing to bet that the video interview is a more accurate representation of what's actually happening.

Screenshot

Screenshot


Edited, Feb 12th 2014 8:27pm by darexius2010
#5REDACTED, Posted: Feb 12 2014 at 8:21 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) You don't need to rate me down because another interview conflicts with ZAM's. All the information I can find about the PS4 version indicates that it will be running at 30 FPS and his answer in ZAM's interview is vague. It definitely doesn't sound like he's saying it will run at 60.
#6 Feb 12 2014 at 8:25 PM Rating: Good
He said it's capped at 60fps, and the target is 60fps, but that at a minimum under extreme conditions it can dip below 30. And again, regardless of whatever other information you have seen, that interview is dated for today, the 12th. It supersedes interviews from November, December, and January, as well as any articles that were written during those times, etc. It's... just logical. It's literally the most up-to-date information.

And don't accuse me of rating you down. For that, you get a rate down. I only rate down when a rate down is merritted.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:26pm by darexius2010
#7 Feb 12 2014 at 8:28 PM Rating: Default
darexius2010 wrote:
He said it's capped at 60fps, and the target is 60fps, but that at a minimum under extreme conditions it can dip below 30. And again, regardless of whatever other information you have seen, that interview is dated for today, the 12th. It supersedes interviews from November, December, and January, as well as any articles that were written during those times, etc. It's... just logical. It's literally the most up-to-date information.

And don't accuse me of rating you down. For that, you get a rate down. I only rate down when a rate down is merritted.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:26pm by darexius2010


In the ZAM interview he says the target is 30+ FPS but FPS will go into the teens at times.

Don't blame me for being skeptical about this team's ability to do console ports. The PS3 version goes below 5 FPS regularly and a lot of game content is literally unbeatable/unplayable on that version due to extreme lag.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:31pm by LucasNox
#8 Feb 12 2014 at 8:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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I swore he said the target cap is 60 fps but they are content with it as long as it doesn't go under 30, and Odin is the only fight where it goes under 30, with it going lower than 20. Seeing as Even people with PCs have that issue, and that fight is the most crowded.

First your title is disingenuous, you re word information for whatever reason. Odin is not a major boss fight by a long shot. Simply saying that makes it look like random boss fights will have low fps when they specifically stated which one will.

"PS4 Locked at 60 fps" More honest title

Odin to be the only fight where fps dips due to the nature of the FATE. There is nothing more ridiculous than a group of people who decide they don't like something. (In this case console ports) So they spread misinformation.

You'd have had better luck claiming ps4 hates women. Smiley: laughSmiley: sly
#9 Feb 12 2014 at 11:17 PM Rating: Good
LucasNox wrote:
darexius2010 wrote:
He said it's capped at 60fps, and the target is 60fps, but that at a minimum under extreme conditions it can dip below 30. And again, regardless of whatever other information you have seen, that interview is dated for today, the 12th. It supersedes interviews from November, December, and January, as well as any articles that were written during those times, etc. It's... just logical. It's literally the most up-to-date information.

And don't accuse me of rating you down. For that, you get a rate down. I only rate down when a rate down is merritted.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:26pm by darexius2010


In the ZAM interview he says the target is 30+ FPS but FPS will go into the teens at times.

Don't blame me for being skeptical about this team's ability to do console ports. The PS3 version goes below 5 FPS regularly and a lot of game content is literally unbeatable/unplayable on that version due to extreme lag.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:31pm by LucasNox


Mmm, no, he said the target is 60FPS, which is where it's capped. The PS3 is limited by it's own hardware -- Let me ask you, would you have rather they not released the PS3 version, something people were literally screaming about during 1.0, just because you, in hind sight, feel like it's a flop of a port? Did you expect it to be PC quality? A next gen title on a previous gen console? Really?

Why do you think they never released it for 1.0? Hmm... I suppose I can't blame you for being skeptical in general, but I can blame you of being skeptical about the team's ability to do console ports... on a console they've been developing games on since the PS3 launched... after you haven't stated an argument based anywhere near fact.

I'm smelling some trolling going on.
#10REDACTED, Posted: Feb 12 2014 at 11:38 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Honestly? Yeah, I would have rather they not released the PS3 version. I understand that it sold a bunch of copies but it's undoubtedly going to hold development back, and longevity is the key to MMORPG success, not initial sales. I think the decision to go through with the PS3 version could end up being a fatal error.
#11 Feb 12 2014 at 11:48 PM Rating: Excellent
I think you're completely wrong.
#12 Feb 13 2014 at 1:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hey guys, I'm the one who filmed this interview. We had the chance to play it for a couple hours prior to our interview session and this question was asked because of the play session. The first thing I noticed was that it was very clearly hitting 60 fps, but not maintaining it when I, say, spin the camera in circles really fast. Even during fights, it would hover somewhere in the 45fps range, but rarely did it ever drop below 30. Since we weren't doing anything other than strolling through towns, checking different mounts, and killing low-level mobs, I figured there had to be situations where the framerate would dip.

That being said, we're playing an early early beta version of the game on what should still be considered new hardware. I'd imagine the game will go through several optimization passes.

Also, in case you were wondering, the VITA feels like it's capped at 30fps even when the console is giving 60.. but no one should be surprised.
#13 Feb 13 2014 at 2:55 AM Rating: Default
That's good to hear that the PS4 version isn't locked at 30 FPS, but I still would have expected a consistent 60 FPS with the PS4 hardware...

Wint wrote:
I think you're completely wrong.


Care to explain how I'm wrong? The PS3 version comes close to crashing in many FATEs and the lag is so bad in certain boss fights that people are complaining that it's just impossible for them (and of course this affects their party members as well) -- and THAT's the content that was in development for a very long time for the PS3. I don't understand how that could possibly not affect the longevity of the game when all new content will need to be 'playable' on the PS3 version.

I can almost guarantee that if they went with PC/PS4, content development would be much quicker.

This was a thread about the PS4 version (and I'm glad that it's not locked at 30 FPS - the BG translator probably messed up about the 30 FPS lock), but since I was asked about the PS3 version, I'll be blunt. It's a horrible port and it should have never been released. Tons of the content on PS3 runs like a slideshow and I don't think it should have been put on the shelves when it's sharing all servers/content release with the PC version. I don't know if you've tried Odin on PS3 but it runs at about 2 FPS (until your PS3 crashes).
#14 Feb 13 2014 at 3:15 AM Rating: Good
LucasNox wrote:
Honestly? Yeah, I would have rather they not released the PS3 version. I understand that it sold a bunch of copies but it's undoubtedly going to hold development back, and longevity is the key to MMORPG success, not initial sales. I think the decision to go through with the PS3 version could end up being a fatal error.

In fact, I'm guessing one of the reasons for the slow content updates is because they just can't get stuff to be playable on the PS3, which can barely keep from crashing in lots of FATEs.


Yes, it sold "a bunch of copies" (nice wording there), and it did result in "a bunch of subscriptions" too, which means the game will be that much more worth investing into "for a bunch of time".

Next, a comparison of a PC only MMO that doesn't suffer from the "slow content update" syndrome would be nice. But we don't do that here, otherwise it would become apparent that ARR is no slower than any other PC only MMO out there and in fact it is one of the best ones.
#15 Feb 13 2014 at 3:25 AM Rating: Default
Hyanmen wrote:
LucasNox wrote:
Honestly? Yeah, I would have rather they not released the PS3 version. I understand that it sold a bunch of copies but it's undoubtedly going to hold development back, and longevity is the key to MMORPG success, not initial sales. I think the decision to go through with the PS3 version could end up being a fatal error.

In fact, I'm guessing one of the reasons for the slow content updates is because they just can't get stuff to be playable on the PS3, which can barely keep from crashing in lots of FATEs.


Yes, it sold "a bunch of copies" (nice wording there), and it did result in "a bunch of subscriptions" too, which means the game will be that much more worth investing into "for a bunch of time".

Next, a comparison of a PC only MMO that doesn't suffer from the "slow content update" syndrome would be nice. But we don't do that here, otherwise it would become apparent that ARR is no slower than any other PC only MMO out there and in fact it is one of the best ones.


I would challenge you to name a semi-popular PC MMORPG which is updating as slowly as ARR.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 4:25am by LucasNox
#16 Feb 13 2014 at 3:26 AM Rating: Good
LucasNox wrote:
Hyanmen wrote:
LucasNox wrote:
Honestly? Yeah, I would have rather they not released the PS3 version. I understand that it sold a bunch of copies but it's undoubtedly going to hold development back, and longevity is the key to MMORPG success, not initial sales. I think the decision to go through with the PS3 version could end up being a fatal error.

In fact, I'm guessing one of the reasons for the slow content updates is because they just can't get stuff to be playable on the PS3, which can barely keep from crashing in lots of FATEs.


Yes, it sold "a bunch of copies" (nice wording there), and it did result in "a bunch of subscriptions" too, which means the game will be that much more worth investing into "for a bunch of time".

Next, a comparison of a PC only MMO that doesn't suffer from the "slow content update" syndrome would be nice. But we don't do that here, otherwise it would become apparent that ARR is no slower than any other PC only MMO out there and in fact it is one of the best ones.


I would challenge you to name a semi-popular PC MMORPG which is updating as slowly as ARR.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 4:25am by LucasNox


If you mean as slowly or slower than ARR, every single one of them.

Well, that was easy.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 12:26pm by Hyanmen
#17 Feb 13 2014 at 3:29 AM Rating: Default
There are actually many MMORPGs which update with some sort of new content every 2 weeks - 1 month to keep their players happy and busy.

... ARR got 1 update in 6 months.

Your post makes me think that you are not really aware of other MMORPGs.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 4:29am by LucasNox
#18 Feb 13 2014 at 3:36 AM Rating: Good
LucasNox wrote:
There are actually many MMORPGs which update with some sort of new content every 2 weeks - 1 month to keep their players happy and busy.

... ARR got 1 update in 6 months.

Your post makes me think that you are not really aware of other MMORPGs.


That is all fine and dandy until we include the one variable that actually matters - the volume of content in said updates.

I really wonder why you chose to leave that one out of the equation... Smiley: rolleyes
#19 Feb 13 2014 at 4:00 AM Rating: Default
Can you really say with a straight face that volume of content offered by 2.1 was worth the wait?

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 5:02am by LucasNox
#20 Feb 13 2014 at 4:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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darexius2010 wrote:
Mmm, no, he said the target is 60FPS, which is where it's capped.

Actually, he said the cap is 60 which is pretty common. The goal was to never drop below 30FPS so you were a little off and it does drop into the teens during Odin. On this account you are incorrect sir darexius2010.

Yoshi@ZAM Interview wrote:
The goal is to not go under um 30 FPS, um... frames per second, but there is a situation in which um, there's a monster called Odin um when it's on the field and you have like, a multitude of characters attacking at the same time with visual effects going on left and right. That scene had caused the frame rate to then go down and it dropped just a little under 20 frames per second...


darexius2010 wrote:
Why do you think they never released it for 1.0?

Because the game sucked to be frank. Why would you produce and distribute a game that 90% of the initial playerbase from PC abandoned and nobody was ready to subscribe to? Think about it. They released an apology for 1.0 about 6 months after launch and vowed to restore the brand with PS3 launch.

darexius2010 wrote:
I suppose I can't blame you for being skeptical in general, but I can blame you of being skeptical about the team's ability to do console ports... on a console they've been developing games on since the PS3 launched... after you haven't stated an argument based anywhere near fact.

They have experience developing for just about every console, but XIV's engine was over-tuned even for PC. XI was ported from PS2 to PC which is the correct way to go about it. It's easy to ride a tricycle after you learn to ride a motorcycle. The other way around? Not so much.


You guys are comparing interviews that are a month apart. SE is working hard to make the PS4 launch successful. It's possible that at the time they believed they would cap FPS at 30 and it's changed. It's also possible that the translator might have gotten a little confused in the recent interview. There was a lot of info and if you listen to it(I did several times because parts of it are hard to understand even translated) you'll hear her um and uh quite a bit. Jury still out...



Edited, Feb 13th 2014 5:32am by FilthMcNasty
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#21 Feb 13 2014 at 4:32 AM Rating: Decent
Quote:
Can you really say with a straight face that volume of content offered by 2.1 was worth the wait?


That's a whole another matter and a subjective one at that. You're no longer even comparing the MMO's (figures)... you just want to drive home your opinion that 2.1 was not "worth the wait".

What's quite funny is that while you emphasize longevity you completely overlook the cumulative volume of content added in favor of update speed as the sole determining factor. One would think that the cumulative amount of content could affect the longevity of an MMO.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 1:34pm by Hyanmen
#22 Feb 13 2014 at 7:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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LucasNox wrote:

In the ZAM interview he says the target is 30+ FPS but FPS will go into the teens at times.

Don't blame me for being skeptical about this team's ability to do console ports. The PS3 version goes below 5 FPS regularly and a lot of game content is literally unbeatable/unplayable on that version due to extreme lag.

Edited, Feb 12th 2014 9:31pm by LucasNox

Really? I play on both the PS3 and the PC. The only time lag is really an issue on the PS3 is during the Titan fights and even then my FPS doesn't suffer, the issue for me is server to client. It is the same on my PC.
#23 Feb 13 2014 at 7:08 AM Rating: Decent
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Edit : double post

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 8:09am by princessary
#24 Feb 13 2014 at 7:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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LucasNox wrote:


I would challenge you to name a semi-popular PC MMORPG which is updating as slowly as ARR.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 4:25am by LucasNox


Really? Updates for WoW were much slower then the ARR updates. WoW was (for the 6 years I played it) about once every 4 to 6 months. ARR, so far has been about every 3 months.

Quote:
There are actually many MMORPGs which update with some sort of new content every 2 weeks - 1 month to keep their players happy and busy.

... ARR got 1 update in 6 months.

Your post makes me think that you are not really aware of other MMORPGs.


Your post makes me think you have no sense of the flow of time. ARR was released at the very end of August on the 27th. Patch 2.1 was released on December 17th. That's around the 3.5 month mark. ARR will have only been out 6 months as of the 27th of this month. Because of your blatant disregard of these facts and others, I must conclude that you sir, are a troll.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 8:32am by princessary
#25 Feb 13 2014 at 7:49 AM Rating: Excellent
Don't forget that 2.1 was delayed because of the massive infrastructure upgrade they had to do. The original plan was a tick/tock release of patches, with one major content patch every 2-4 months and a major bug fix/minor tweak patch every 1 to 2 months. That's pretty standard. Software development takes time. As Fred Brooks famously said, it takes 9 months to make a baby no matter how many women are assigned to the task.

Note that they often do ninja updates to fix minor bugs, as evidenced by the number of times we have to download things out of the blue, but a bug fix is not the same as a content update, so they don't exactly brag about it on the home page.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 8:49am by Catwho
#26 Feb 13 2014 at 11:51 AM Rating: Excellent
@Filth, I concede, you are correct on all accounts related to me. He did say the cap and target was 60 FPS, etc. Good call and I stand corrected. You're also right on the basis of 1.0's PS3 release and what the original engine was built and tuned for. What I am happy to see is the agreement that there's a comparison of data that's several months apart. I rarely see us disagree on anything, and I'm glad to see that trend continue.

LucasNox wrote:
...the BG translator probably messed up about the 30 FPS lock.


Again, you're saying that there was a translation error when back when that interview was done, the most up to date information could very well have been with a 30fps lock. This isn't December anymore. Time has passed and the software is more fully developed. You can't bring up a couple month old interview and call it gospel -- Your argument doesn't track at all in that regard.

That'd be like saying back in 1941 they said the nation would never hit $17 trillion in debt, so therefore what's going on now cannot possibly be true and is just a ruse by the government. Times have changed. We're $17 trillion in debt.

I myself am a PS3 player. I haven't run into content yet that crashes or crawls. At the absolute worst prior to 2.1 I had issues where a mass of onscreen characters wouldn't render right away, and that lasted for a few seconds at most. Now they're prioritized the render pipeline and that's a non issue. I run endgame content all night long on a PS3 when I'm lazy and want to play on the couch instead of on my PC. I experience none of the symptoms you describe.

The 1 week updates you describe in other MMOs are out there, yes -- And they're the sort of small missions that are contextually equivalent to larger dailies that we're running now. New dungeons don't get added every single week in any of the MMOs that I've played, even the SLEW of cracker jack short lifespan games such as Florensia, or any period of time in RF Online. World of Warcraft doesn't release content every single week, or even every two weeks. EVE Online is even slower on the ball than Square has been, and they've improved SUBSTANTIALLY in the last three years. Pantheon is an upcoming MMO, and I doubt they'll release content as quickly as you're stating... In fact, I doubt you yourself can identify an MMO that pulls out new content in the scope of new zones, dungeons, and quest lines in tandem as quickly as you're claiming, with all your vast knowledge of the MMO landscape. In what amounts to essentially a 6 month timespan we're getting two major content patches. I'm curious to see what they'll do with the first expansion. Sadly it seems you're just here to sow dissidence where you've no basis to do so, other than your own amusement, and are confused why it isn't taking.

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 1:01pm by darexius2010

Edited, Feb 13th 2014 1:04pm by darexius2010
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