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#1 Jun 25 2013 at 7:58 AM Rating: Decent
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i was wondering after betaing all last weekend... on my pug the abilities read.... (Bootshine Weaponskill Delivers an attack with a potency of 130.) what is this potency calculated off of? STR/DEX/VIT? im trying to figure out how its all done in math so i know what to boost up if anything... any light on this would be very helpful... thanks in advance!
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#2 Jun 25 2013 at 8:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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I think we should just pretend potency = damage. So agi + crit % than str +dmg and vit+ hp. idk if im right but thats how i been going about it.
#3 Jun 25 2013 at 8:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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Mmoderator wrote:
i was wondering after betaing all last weekend... on my pug the abilities read.... (Bootshine Weaponskill Delivers an attack with a potency of 130.) what is this potency calculated off of? STR/DEX/VIT? im trying to figure out how its all done in math so i know what to boost up if anything... any light on this would be very helpful... thanks in advance!


Think of potency as a percentage, so an attack with potency 130 does 130% whatever the damage formula is.

Tradeskills use potency in its abilities as well and it appears to be a percentage there too.
#4 Jun 25 2013 at 11:11 AM Rating: Decent
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hmmm would be nice to know the actual formula for max dmg output... But I understand what you all are saying...
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#5 Jun 25 2013 at 1:42 PM Rating: Good
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Ravashack wrote:
Mmoderator wrote:
i was wondering after betaing all last weekend... on my pug the abilities read.... (Bootshine Weaponskill Delivers an attack with a potency of 130.) what is this potency calculated off of? STR/DEX/VIT? im trying to figure out how its all done in math so i know what to boost up if anything... any light on this would be very helpful... thanks in advance!


Think of potency as a percentage, so an attack with potency 130 does 130% whatever the damage formula is.

Tradeskills use potency in its abilities as well and it appears to be a percentage there too.


That's what I was assuming. 100 potency would be the equivalent of say, your auto attack, so 130 would end up being 30% more damage compared to your AA. However I think I recall AAs doing noticeably less than that, so it could be +100% damage for 100 potency and so on.

Potency values under 100 tend to be quite low, especially for DoTs.. unless the potency is for the total damage inflicted over the duration.

Edited, Jun 25th 2013 3:43pm by DamienSScott
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#6 Jun 25 2013 at 1:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Yeah ive been trying to figure this out also plus with later lvls I noticed that mnk is going to be useing a lot of INT for some reason not sure why yet but I know the af gear has oalot of INT and other things ive been reading on other forums if any one could tell me how INT effects mnk and or pgl id love to find out
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#7 Jun 25 2013 at 4:25 PM Rating: Decent
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hmmm I wasn't aware of the INT on AF gear that is interesting... Wonder what its for maybe secondwind or maybe elemental fists....
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#8 Jun 25 2013 at 4:28 PM Rating: Good
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Fatz23 wrote:
Yeah ive been trying to figure this out also plus with later lvls I noticed that mnk is going to be useing a lot of INT for some reason not sure why yet but I know the af gear has oalot of INT and other things ive been reading on other forums if any one could tell me how INT effects mnk and or pgl id love to find out


Ignore them.

If you're going to look at gear, look at http://xivdb.com because the older sites use the old attribute system (which were overhauled for ARR) are are no longer applicable. INT used to affects all attacks that had an elemental affinity (Red Lotus Blade, for example) so that's the reason why. In the new system that's no longer the case.

Case in point:

Old Temple Circlet:
Level 49
65 Defense
+3 STR
+25 INT
+10 Evasion
Reduces Shoulder Tackle Recast

New Temple Circlet:
Level 49
51 Defense
51 Magical Defense
+9 STR
+9 VIT
+14 Accuracy
+9 Determination

The database doesn't show any of the special modifiers on gear yet (i.e. akin to reduces Shoulder Tackle recast), but the stats are completely overhauled.

Edited, Jun 25th 2013 6:29pm by Viertel
#9 Jun 25 2013 at 5:20 PM Rating: Good
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Attack is a 1:1 ratio with the stat that governs it. For my 50 Archer (http://imgur.com/fGo9d1u.jpg ) you can see that 312 Dex gives my 312 Attack Power.

I believe Potency is a multiplier. 130 would be x1.3. So as others have said 30% bonus to the normal amount.

The interesting thing about the 1:1 ratio is it leaves room for some versatility in the class system. Though, jobs are another story.

All damage and healing pass through the check of Determination. I'd like to see what that means for, say, a lancer who tosses on some mind gear to self cure. It obviously won't be as potent as a conjurer with all their traits and higher-level cures, but it'd be something.

Anyway, I believe that the Potency is a multiplier in play after your Attack Power passes through the Determination check.

I think that Attack Power is your maximum damage potential curve, and determination dictates where you land on that curve. Obviously it'll take quite a bit of testing to figure out, though.

Edited, Jun 25th 2013 7:21pm by Sephrick
#10 Jun 26 2013 at 12:46 AM Rating: Decent
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Awesome thanks I guess xivdb will be my new go to place for game info
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#11 Jun 26 2013 at 3:02 AM Rating: Good
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Fatz23 wrote:
Awesome thanks I guess xivdb will be my new go to place for game info


Until ZAM gets updated, hopefully..

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#12 Jun 26 2013 at 5:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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DamienSScott wrote:
Fatz23 wrote:
Awesome thanks I guess xivdb will be my new go to place for game info


Until ZAM gets updated, hopefully..



We're working on it Smiley: smile
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#13 Jun 26 2013 at 8:13 AM Rating: Good
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Sephrick wrote:
Attack is a 1:1 ratio with the stat that governs it. For my 50 Archer (http://imgur.com/fGo9d1u.jpg ) you can see that 312 Dex gives my 312 Attack Power.

I believe Potency is a multiplier. 130 would be x1.3. So as others have said 30% bonus to the normal amount.

The interesting thing about the 1:1 ratio is it leaves room for some versatility in the class system. Though, jobs are another story.

All damage and healing pass through the check of Determination. I'd like to see what that means for, say, a lancer who tosses on some mind gear to self cure. It obviously won't be as potent as a conjurer with all their traits and higher-level cures, but it'd be something.

Anyway, I believe that the Potency is a multiplier in play after your Attack Power passes through the Determination check.

I think that Attack Power is your maximum damage potential curve, and determination dictates where you land on that curve. Obviously it'll take quite a bit of testing to figure out, though.

Edited, Jun 25th 2013 7:21pm by Sephrick


Fast Blade has a potency bonus of 150. My auto attacks are doing 9, my fast blades are doing 22. That would imply that the potency bonus is additive to auto-attack damage. The implication is that your base damage is 1, fast blade damage is 2.5 (150% increase).

Edit: By extension, by base weapon damage is 9 as well. I have a base strength of 42, and yet my auto-attack damage is still 9. Maybe this weekend I will take off all my gear and see if that affects damage at all, but it looks like STR might only affect attack power which I am guessing works similar to how attack works in XI.

Edited, Jun 26th 2013 9:16am by Meldi
#14 Jun 26 2013 at 8:26 AM Rating: Good
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There was a post on the beta forum that outlined damage calculations. If I can find it, I'll post it later.

I'm assuming that this could change dramatically for phase 4.
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#15 Jun 26 2013 at 10:39 AM Rating: Good
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TurboTom wrote:
There was a post on the beta forum that outlined damage calculations. If I can find it, I'll post it later.

I'm assuming that this could change dramatically for phase 4.


First one: http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/56961-Damage-healing-output-Forumla-s-Thoughts?p=789196&viewfull=1#post789196

Here's one for tanks: http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/60751-Little-Big-Thread-of-Numbers-V2.0-DPS-TANKS-What-damage-do-i-get-for-those-stats?p=817858&viewfull=1#post817858
#16 Jun 26 2013 at 12:31 PM Rating: Good
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Sephrick wrote:
Attack is a 1:1 ratio with the stat that governs it. For my 50 Archer (http://imgur.com/fGo9d1u.jpg ) you can see that 312 Dex gives my 312 Attack Power.


I also noted the following:

Healing Magic Potency=MND
Attack Magic Potency=INT

Moreover, it appears that Accuracy, Critical Hit Rate, Parry, Skill Speed and Spell Speed have the same base, only modified by the gear you equip. However, I have no clue how this base is determined. Any ideas?

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#17 Jun 26 2013 at 12:39 PM Rating: Good
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PavetlXIV wrote:
Sephrick wrote:
Attack is a 1:1 ratio with the stat that governs it. For my 50 Archer (http://imgur.com/fGo9d1u.jpg ) you can see that 312 Dex gives my 312 Attack Power.


I also noted the following:

Healing Magic Potency=MND
Attack Magic Potency=INT

Moreover, it appears that Accuracy, Critical Hit Rate, Parry, Skill Speed and Spell Speed have the same base, only modified by the gear you equip. However, I have no clue how this base is determined. Any ideas?



I was going to mess with it this weekend but my hunch now is those other stats' are a fixed value based on class and level regardless of attributes.

It seems their design philosophy was to stream line and simplify. Doesn't get much more simple than that.



Edited, Jun 26th 2013 2:48pm by Sephrick
#18 Jun 26 2013 at 3:00 PM Rating: Good
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It's determination I want to get my head around. I noticed the straight correlations between the stats, and I find myself rather fond of the simplification. It makes stat crunching easier at least, which will leave less room for arguing when it comes to determining viable ways of playing classes.

From the looks of the depth of abilities available to classes and jobs, there WILL be more than one.
#19 Jun 26 2013 at 4:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Sephrick wrote:
TurboTom wrote:
There was a post on the beta forum that outlined damage calculations. If I can find it, I'll post it later.

I'm assuming that this could change dramatically for phase 4.


First one: http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/56961-Damage-healing-output-Forumla-s-Thoughts?p=789196&viewfull=1#post789196

Here's one for tanks: http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/60751-Little-Big-Thread-of-Numbers-V2.0-DPS-TANKS-What-damage-do-i-get-for-those-stats?p=817858&viewfull=1#post817858


*sigh*

I appreciate people attempting to math out damage formulas (though Yoshida's mentioned it'll change anyway), but I really wish the topic creator knew how to actually write the equation he's attempting to show people.



#20 Jun 26 2013 at 5:03 PM Rating: Decent
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thats the thing... I'm asking what people think the calculation is... because I've tossed several things around in my head and none of it has been anywhere near a constant result... So I'm asking others ideas about DMG calculations cause im lost in thought... Sorry for any missinterpretation...
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#21 Jun 27 2013 at 6:23 AM Rating: Good
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Mmoderator wrote:
thats the thing... I'm asking what people think the calculation is... because I've tossed several things around in my head and none of it has been anywhere near a constant result... So I'm asking others ideas about DMG calculations cause im lost in thought... Sorry for any missinterpretation...


Oh!

That's easy. If you take his very first example on the second link:

Quote:
Attack Potency on Character + Attack Potency of Ability / 100 x Weapon Damage

AP = Attack Potency
POT - Potency Of attack
WDMG = Weapon DMG

WDMG 30, AP 98 POT 100 59.7 dmg


The equation is ( ( AP + PoT ) / 100 ) x WDMG

i.e. ( ( 98 + 100 ) / 100 ) x 30 = 59.4

The rest of the cluster of examples he lists are OK. The first one's are all wrong (off by 0.3); I assume he mentally added the 0.3 from his supposed 1 STR = 0.3 example at the bottom of the first cluster.

Anyway this is more than likely a placeholder calculation (and I even doubt this is correct because it doesn't take defense into account). I'd think they'd be as "complex" as FFXI's calculations except that he mentioned he wanted to make them easier to deal with as 1.0's were so ridiculous they never did manage to fix them.


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