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In all seriousness, what do I do with Cruor now?Follow

#1 Jan 24 2013 at 2:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Got a lot of free time on my hands for the next 9 months or so and I'm probably going to re-activate for a month out of boredom. I remember seeing something about SE nerfing the items everyone used to exchange Cruor for and NPC. If that's indeed the case then just what are Cruor used for now outside of brewing?
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#2 Jan 24 2013 at 3:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well, can't brew lock anymore either, so you'll need more cruor for brews. It's also still used to buy teleports, voidwatch items, temps etc in abyssea.

In short, it's less useful overall than it used to be, but it's a lot more balanced.
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#3 Jan 24 2013 at 3:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Never brew locked anyway so not a big deal. I just wish I'd gotten rid of all the FC cruor while it would've made me millions lol.
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#4 Jan 24 2013 at 3:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Have you upgraded all your voidwatch atmas? That'll only take 66,385,000 cruor. How much free time have you got?
#5 Jan 24 2013 at 3:15 PM Rating: Good
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DomfranciscoOfIfrit wrote:
Have you upgraded all your voidwatch atmas? That'll only take 66,385,000 cruor. How much free time have you got?


Yeah I burned through over five million just upgrading two of them.

I think that's why, actually, SE didn't really worry to much about the chocobo blinkers until the RMT started doing it.
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#6 Jan 24 2013 at 3:16 PM Rating: Default
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And while you're at it, please let me know what I should do with all my Conquest points/Imperial standing/Allied notes/marbles/Ichor/assault points/fellow points/dominion notes/resistance credits i've accumulated over the years.
#7 Jan 24 2013 at 3:18 PM Rating: Decent
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I've never actually done VW >.> It always seemed like something for people way better geared than I am.
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#8 Jan 24 2013 at 3:34 PM Rating: Decent
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Diamondis wrote:
Never brew locked anyway so not a big deal. I just wish I'd gotten rid of all the FC cruor while it would've made me millions lol.


Yeah, I am sure you're not the only one. I only used that trick when I was a 100K or 200K away from being able to afford an expensive item (especially something not often up on the AH) - but I feel like I got enough benefit out of it, regardless. I also agree with them nerfing it, because it was putting too much new gil into the economy.

Diamondis wrote:
I've never actually done VW >.> It always seemed like something for people way better geared than I am.


Naw, if you do the lower tiers almost anyone can deal with it as long as they know their procs and have the skill to hit them.

And then when you start doing Jueno etc, if you only have so so gear you're fine as a mage. As a blu, you need to have your spells, work with the other blu, set them, and have high enough skill/MACC that you can land the debuff procs - as a BLM you mostly just need to have the spells, as a BRD, it's mostly having high enough skill that your debuffs land and doing appropriate buffs (ideally with an appropriate instrument), as a whm, just don't suck as a whm. As a smn, do the appropriate procs and maybe toss out a heal or two? (not sure about SMN really) Not super hard. If you can manage that, you'd be fine in all city climbs and Jeuno up till at least tier 3. Tier 3 is great because it allows you to farm the bodies, which are all good in their own right, and upgrades to a lot of common gear out there (especially if you aren't doing, say, neo nyzul, which is sounds like you aren't) - you can also get heavy metal plates, which is a nice source of gil for a scrub player, and will allow you to make enough cash to get some decent AH gear.

The main key to success in voidwatch is HIT PROCS. Obviously it's good to have a few heavy DD with good weapons/WS to finish off mobs, but if the group is hitting their procs, even so-so DDs will have the time/space/temp items they need to finish off a mob on the lower tiers. Voidwatch only goes south when people don't work together to hit procs (like for example, I usually have a staff equipped for doing my procs as a blu, so if a staff proc is called, I pop my wing and take a swing at it since I usually have pld subbed, I can try a few WS - I've hit it a few times that way too. If sword is called, I strap on my sword and help out with that too. Ditto with club)

Edited, Jan 24th 2013 1:49pm by Olorinus
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#9 Jan 24 2013 at 3:48 PM Rating: Good
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Anybody can do VW. And if you check your fellow shout group participants, anybody DOES do VW.

I personally dumped most of my cruor into atmacites for VW, and lately I've been brewing Shinryu for things I've neglected in the past. Aside from brews and atmacites, there's no much use for cruor other than keeping a minimum amount around to spend on VW warps and cells.
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#10 Jan 24 2013 at 4:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks for the replies. If AF3+2 and Magian weapons are still considered decent gear then I should be OK for most of my 99 jobs. I think I did start my VW counter way before I left so I should have some stones ready when I go back.
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#11 Jan 24 2013 at 7:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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Diamondis wrote:
AF3+2 and Magian weapons
You show up in that and you're good enough to proc, maybe even do a decent chunk of the damage on the city or low Jeuno tiers.
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#12 Jan 25 2013 at 6:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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#13 Jan 25 2013 at 10:00 AM Rating: Decent
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cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.
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#14 Jan 25 2013 at 10:16 AM Rating: Good
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rdmcandie wrote:
cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.


This is true. It's still possible to sell blinks to a vendor, just not at an ungodly rate of return any more.
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#15 Jan 25 2013 at 11:24 AM Rating: Default
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catwho wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.


This is true. It's still possible to sell blinks to a vendor, just not at an ungodly rate of return any more.


Ya I figured but what the hell, if its just sitting there, may as well put it to some use I guess. to bad instead of punishing the RMT SE always punishes the entire player base.
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#16 Jan 25 2013 at 11:52 AM Rating: Default
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rdmcandie wrote:
catwho wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.


This is true. It's still possible to sell blinks to a vendor, just not at an ungodly rate of return any more.


Ya I figured but what the hell, if its just sitting there, may as well put it to some use I guess. to bad instead of punishing the RMT SE always punishes the entire player base.


Let's be real here...their item description and the NPC you get it from doesn't state:

"You use these for gil."

So while it punishes RMT, it also makes it less lucrative in general because it's being used for something other than it's intended design use. They could have made them R and allowed you only 1 at a time or EX and make them unsellable. That would be punishing the player.


Edited, Jan 25th 2013 9:52am by Theonehio
#17 Jan 25 2013 at 1:01 PM Rating: Default
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Theonehio wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
catwho wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.


This is true. It's still possible to sell blinks to a vendor, just not at an ungodly rate of return any more.


Ya I figured but what the hell, if its just sitting there, may as well put it to some use I guess. to bad instead of punishing the RMT SE always punishes the entire player base.


Let's be real here...their item description and the NPC you get it from doesn't state:

"You use these for gil."

So while it punishes RMT, it also makes it less lucrative in general because it's being used for something other than it's intended design use. They could have made them R and allowed you only 1 at a time or EX and make them unsellable. That would be punishing the player.


Edited, Jan 25th 2013 9:52am by Theonehio


But they didn't do either of these things. They can still be sold which means there was some intent on allowing for a Cruor > Gil transfer. The value was adjusted for one reason only RMT. It was never a great way to make gil. It was a good way to make it, but you could make more Gil in dynamis than you could in Abyssea in less time. But dynamis actually requires one to pay attention and play...unlike an abyssea FC party with a bot WHM made purely to generate isk from leeches, and the cruor.

This adjustment affected the entire player base and not because of abuse, but because of RMT. If players were abusing the tactic and it was unintended, then like old Tav bug, and Dupe bug, players would be banned for not bringing the matter to SE's attention, and continually exploiting it.

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#18 Jan 25 2013 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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It's funny I was in an akvan group last night, and the problem we had was that some fool was parsing it so the DDs were trying to compete and they kept killing it too fast... it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.

Someone needs to remind them that ukkos is not a proc skill. Seriously. I mean once we have capped red, ukkos away, but why the hell do people open with that?
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#19 Jan 25 2013 at 1:46 PM Rating: Decent
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I didn't realise virtual-dick fencing still existed in FFXI, lol. I have a spare tenner tonight... and mysteriously my POL updated itself >.>; may have to jump back in. Thanks again for all the responses. Let's hope I can find an LS on Sylph that will have me!
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#20 Jan 25 2013 at 5:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Theonehio wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
catwho wrote:
rdmcandie wrote:
cant you still turn it into gil from Blinkers? I mean ya its not as sexy as it used to be...but free money is free money. Unless you have VW Atma to level up.


This is true. It's still possible to sell blinks to a vendor, just not at an ungodly rate of return any more.


Ya I figured but what the hell, if its just sitting there, may as well put it to some use I guess. to bad instead of punishing the RMT SE always punishes the entire player base.


Let's be real here...their item description and the NPC you get it from doesn't state:

"You use these for gil."

So while it punishes RMT, it also makes it less lucrative in general because it's being used for something other than it's intended design use. They could have made them R and allowed you only 1 at a time or EX and make them unsellable. That would be punishing the player.


Edited, Jan 25th 2013 9:52am by Theonehio


The problem is that it did do what it was suppose to do till SE decided it was time to nerf it.
#21 Jan 25 2013 at 5:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
It's funny I was in an akvan group last night, and the problem we had was that some fool was parsing it so the DDs were trying to compete and they kept killing it too fast... it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.


Ugh, this. Parsing VW is the height of ridiculousness, and when someone mentions they're doing it the DDs just lose their minds. Similarly, I was on COR in a Hahava group a week or two ago, and obviously we were destroying him - to the point where we had to yell at people to turn around or stop attacking if they weren't working on procs. I had to flat out tell them no Chaos/Fighter's rolls (they got Tactician's/Miser's), because they just couldn't resist spamming stuff like Ukko's/Reso/Shoha...

As for the original question... I got 4 Atmacites up to lv15 and I'm pretty satisfied with them as-is, and not wanting to dump millions more Cruor on a single event that will become outdated over time.

So once you're set with a few good Atmacites, using Cruor for brewing 90 empy NMs is my answer. I don't really care about trying to make sure I get 3+ NM pops (depending on ??? respawn time) per brew, I'm kinda fine doing stuff on my own time with me and a mule, pop both sets on one brew, repeat. So... brewing on THF for TH and estimating ~1.75 items drop per pop (3.5 items per brew), each 85-90 stage would use 21-22 brews = 4.2~4.4mil cruor for a full 75 items to go from 85-90 as a simple me+mule duo.

Yes, I know you can drag a whole group and pop a bunch at a time and kill normally. I'm satisfied working a little bit at a time at something I can easily solo. And fairly regular VW really builds that Cruor balance.

Edited, Jan 25th 2013 6:37pm by Anza
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#22 Jan 25 2013 at 5:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.


Yeah, melees continuously hitting it almost always results in that. If it's ever possible to get them all turned around, it suddenly becomes a lot easier to get those magic procs.
#23 Jan 25 2013 at 5:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Anza wrote:
Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
It's funny I was in an akvan group last night, and the problem we had was that some fool was parsing it so the DDs were trying to compete and they kept killing it too fast... it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.
Ugh, this. Parsing VW is the height of ridiculousness, and when someone mentions they're doing it the DDs just lose their minds.
I see nothing wrong with parsing ANY event (unless you need to read the chatlog). They report more information than simply who put out the most damage and can be incredibly useful tools.
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#24 Jan 25 2013 at 5:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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xypin wrote:
Anza wrote:
Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
It's funny I was in an akvan group last night, and the problem we had was that some fool was parsing it so the DDs were trying to compete and they kept killing it too fast... it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.
Ugh, this. Parsing VW is the height of ridiculousness, and when someone mentions they're doing it the DDs just lose their minds.
I see nothing wrong with parsing ANY event (unless you need to read the chatlog). They report more information than simply who put out the most damage and can be incredibly useful tools.


OK, I agree and I guess I'll back off my comments a bit. Can still be very handy to understand things like accuracy.

But what I was really thinking about was what I normally see in VW, when someone says they're parsing and tells the DDs who "won" the parse. And without fail if people start discussing parses, the DDs tend to go nuts trying to go all out for max damage, procs be damned. THAT is inexcusable and a terrible reason to parse a VW run.
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#26 Jan 25 2013 at 7:44 PM Rating: Good
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Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
It's funny I was in an akvan group last night, and the problem we had was that some fool was parsing it so the DDs were trying to compete and they kept killing it too fast... it didn't help that mr. dickface was constantly using magic shield, making it hard to proc him.

Someone needs to remind them that ukkos is not a proc skill. Seriously. I mean once we have capped red, ukkos away, but why the hell do people open with that?



That's not the parsers problem, though sometimes they can be idiots. DD's sometimes realize there is a difference between the "easy" voidwatch NM's and the Jeuno T5~6 / Morta / Bismark / ProvWatch NMs. T3 and below you need to go slow and hold damage, they simply don't have enough HP to withstand a constant barrage of high powered WS's. On the higher end NMs if your ~not~ going full tilt then there is a good chance of failure, especially on the T6's (T5's can be mean but their not nearly as bad as T6). The DD's your mentioning are forgetting the difference and treating the lower tier NMs the same as the high tier NM's, which is a boneheaded thing to do.

Parsing gives us a ton of info, NM HP, accuracy required and yes you can tell who is essentially leaching a spot. The easiest way to tell isn't the total percentage damage (that number is meaningless) but from the WS average of their more powerful damage WS and the average time between WS's. The average time will tell you if their paying attention or watching TV while occasionally hitting their WS button. You then avoid those individuals when building groups, they not paying enough attention to proc anyway. Parsing requires that the reader actually understand the data being gathered, it's only statistics from the fight not a "I Win The Internetz!!!" meter. As long as most of the DD's are grouped around each other then everything is going fine, it's only when you see two to three people at the top with all the other DD's at 1/2 to 1/3 their damage on "hard" content that people should start getting concerned.
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#27 Jan 25 2013 at 11:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
Well, can't brew lock anymore either, so you'll need more cruor for brews. It's also still used to buy teleports, voidwatch items, temps etc in abyssea.

In short, it's less useful overall than it used to be, but it's a lot more balanced.


Just curious, but did they fix NPC buff/debuff lockouts in general? It's kind of weird to simply fix it just for brewing.
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#28 Jan 26 2013 at 12:40 AM Rating: Good
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Zafire wrote:
Iron Chef Olorinus wrote:
Well, can't brew lock anymore either, so you'll need more cruor for brews. It's also still used to buy teleports, voidwatch items, temps etc in abyssea.

In short, it's less useful overall than it used to be, but it's a lot more balanced.
Just curious, but did they fix NPC buff/debuff lockouts in general? It's kind of weird to simply fix it just for brewing.
I believe it was fixed for all "buffs" and was aimed towards brews and Tabula Rasa.
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#29 Jan 26 2013 at 1:08 AM Rating: Good
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It fixed "stopping time" for all buffs and anything else that was frozen before. For example, checking chests in abyssea with a cor roll on you would freeze the roll whereas now it doesn't. Same goes for auto-refresh from traits or atmas now as well. Before any regen/refresh/regain would freeze, but now will keep building as you check chests or talk to npcs outside abyssea.

A minor downside to this is not being able to talk to npcs to freeze poison, bio, etc while waiting for a friend to get in range to take dots off at low levels. Of course, losing evp isn't an issue until past 30 now, and dying in general isn't an issue like it used to be.
#30 Jan 26 2013 at 2:46 AM Rating: Decent
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I used it to keep myself alive from poison as a low level a lot, back when it did twice your max health. Just click an NPC and go afk or something, hoping a passerby healed you by the time you got back. Was a good time to get stuff done :P

Edited, Jan 26th 2013 3:47am by Zafire
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#31 Jan 26 2013 at 8:16 AM Rating: Good
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As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage. So while it can be used for good, I've only ever seen it used for evil.
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#32 Jan 26 2013 at 8:49 AM Rating: Good
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As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage.


Pretty much this
#33 Jan 26 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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Camiie wrote:
As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage. So while it can be used for good, I've only ever seen it used for evil.


Someone in the party used it on a Bismarck I was leading when I asked if the party should do march march min mad or march march mad mad (this was before dharp was common). It helped us pinpoint that the party was having ACC issues and adjust accordingly.
#34 Jan 26 2013 at 11:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Camiie wrote:
As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage. So while it can be used for good, I've only ever seen it used for evil.
It's almost impossible to give constructive criticism in this game. This is why those that do parse smartly only discuss the results with their linkshell/friends and not random pick up groups.
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#35 Jan 26 2013 at 4:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Fynlar wrote:
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As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage.


Pretty much this


Umm considering you've been in alliance when I've done Morta, and I always parse at least the first two to three fights, you've definitely been in a situation where parsing has been used properly.

That being said, I rarely discuss details inside party chat and prefer to use /tells. Unless someone specifically requests the info be put out there.

Quote:
As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage. So while it can be used for good, I've only ever seen it used for evil.


Maybe you don't do the high end voidwatchs or are in the back line. That "alleged lack of damage" is win or lose. The higher end T6 / Bismark / Morta / Prov NMs all have "f*ck you, you lose" TP moves. The longer they live the lower your chance of winning, especially once buffs start wearing. If it's not dead (or almost) by the time songs and rolls start to go then your damage is going to grind to a halt, and then it'll be spamming stupid damage / status effect moves, fanatics will be down and your procs will grind to a halt unless your incredibly lucky. Over time stupid procs like "PUP JA, BST pet JA, HV Dark Nin" and such will start accumulating along with a horde of BLU and SMN procs. WS procs take forever to do and are generally not worth it unless it's an HV / EV. All these things conspire to make voidwatch a "make it dead now" rush fight.

Now if we're talking about Pil / Akvan / Kaggen spam, or even LL fights, then it's stupid easy.

Edited, Jan 26th 2013 10:22pm by saevellakshmi
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#36 Jan 26 2013 at 4:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Dantedmc wrote:
Camiie wrote:
As far as parsing VW, I've only ever seen it used so some d-bag who never bothers to proc can wag his epeen and berate everyone else for their alleged lack of damage. So while it can be used for good, I've only ever seen it used for evil.


Someone in the party used it on a Bismarck I was leading when I asked if the party should do march march min mad or march march mad mad (this was before dharp was common). It helped us pinpoint that the party was having ACC issues and adjust accordingly.


That's .5% of the time it's used, congrats on finding it. However, the other 99.5% is to stroke e-peens and have pissing contests.
#37 Jan 26 2013 at 6:32 PM Rating: Good
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Umm considering you've been in alliance when I've done Morta, and I always parse at least the first two to three fights, you've definitely been in a situation where parsing has been used properly.

That being said, I rarely discuss details inside party chat and prefer to use /tells. Unless someone specifically requests the info be put out there.


That's probably why I wasn't aware of it Smiley: tongue


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Maybe you don't do the high end voidwatchs or are in the back line. That "alleged lack of damage" is win or lose. The higher end T6 / Bismark / Morta / Prov NMs all have "f*ck you, you lose" TP moves. The longer they live the lower your chance of winning, especially once buffs start wearing. If it's not dead (or almost) by the time songs and rolls start to go then your damage is going to grind to a halt, and then it'll be spamming stupid damage / status effect moves, fanatics will be down and your procs will grind to a halt unless your incredibly lucky. Over time stupid procs like "PUP JA, BST pet JA, HV Dark Nin" and such will start accumulating along with a horde of BLU and SMN procs. WS procs take forever to do and are generally not worth it unless it's an HV / EV. All these things conspire to make voidwatch a "make it dead now" rush fight.

Now if we're talking about Pil / Akvan / Kaggen spam, or even LL fights, then it's stupid easy.


I have seen the most parse epeening at Qilin, and he's kind of a wuss.

Edited, Jan 26th 2013 7:33pm by Fynlar
#38 Jan 27 2013 at 2:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I have seen the most parse epeening at Qilin, and he's kind of a wuss.


Yeah that's just f*ckers stroking their epeen. That or their trying to point out to someone in a not-so-subtle way to stop watching TV.
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lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


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when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the @#%^ out of the way instead...
#39 Jan 27 2013 at 10:49 AM Rating: Default
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Catwho wrote:

I think that's why, actually, SE didn't really worry to much about the chocobo blinkers until the RMT started doing it.


Crap, I knew it was going to happen.. I was trying to get my first relic upgrade..... Now, another way to find money :(... Can't there be a way to determine who's a bot or not? sheesh....
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Almalieque wrote:

I'm biased against statistics
#40 Jan 28 2013 at 2:49 PM Rating: Good
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saevellakshmi wrote:

That's not the parsers problem, though sometimes they can be idiots.


Agreed, I wouldn't care if someone is parsing, that doesn't bother me and I see the use of it. However this was a "so and so won" type of parser... which is not a helpful individual on akvan, since obvs, killing it faster is not what is needed. I got nothing but junk that run, when usually I walk away with a couple plates at the least. Bad luck? Sure, but our lights weren't capping because the DDs were so busy trying to "win" that the rest of us lost.

It's amazing how much crappier akvan groups seem to be getting overall these days. Meanwhile I was in a Kalusutrax group and a group doing that AU path imp, and it went waaaay smoother than some akvan runs I've done lately. Which is hilarious. But I guess the dregs have worked their way up to akvan. One day I'll get the drop. One day.

It sort of sucks being blu/pld at times because really other than hitting your procs there is nothing you can do to stop a run from going sour. Too gimped to be much use.
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