Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

The Embrava and Perfect Defense AdjustmentsFollow

#1 Oct 23 2012 at 9:20 AM Rating: Excellent
Sage
Avatar
****
5,243 posts
This was posted earlier today over at Japanese side of the Official Forums but over at BG, Slcyer of Fenrir translated it early so here it is:
From: Link.

Quote:


Job Ability Adjustments: Tabula Rasa & Perfect Defense

Hello!

Prior to reducing the recast time of the existing SP abilities and introducing new SP abilities, we believe that we must revise the effects of Tabula Rasa and Perfect Defense. The adjustment is planned to be introduced in this week's test server update, but we want to convey the changes ahead of that so that we can begin gathering your feedback.

Perfect Defense

**Duration: The duration will be reduced from 90 seconds to 30 seconds +1 second for each 20 summoning magic skill. For example, at 600 summoning magic skill, the duration would be 60 seconds (30 + 30 seconds).
**Effect: No change

Tabula Rasa

The effects of the white magic "Embrava" will be adjusted as follows:

**Duration: Reduced from 5 minutes to 90 seconds.
**Haste Effect: Reduced to 15% + 1% for each 20 enhancing skill. Maximum of +25% at 500 enhancing skill.
**Regain Effect: Changed to Refresh effect (the #/tick is the same as before, based on skill).

Since utilizing the above abilities has become mainstream in order to progress through certain battle content, we have planned to lower the difficulty of that content in accordance with this update.

Nyzul Isle

**The required number of astraria to replace with the next higher floor equipment will be reduced from 25 to 5. The number in possession will be divided by 5 and rounded down. The premise that floor 100 will only be reached through a combination of great skill and luck does not change. Since the reliance on the effect of Embrava will be reduced, we will relieve this by reducing the number of required astraria for floors below.

Legion

**Monster HP will be reduced by approximately 10%. All monsters will be included in this change. Since the progress as a whole will be faster but the support effects will be suppressed, we will maintain the 30 minute time limit, or keep it close.

Einherjar

**Odin's HP (Odin's Chamber II) will be reduced by approximately 10~15%. Since the battle with Odin is more than with just the monster itself, Legion is slightly different, so we will reduce Odin's HP by slightly more.

We believe that Embrava and Perfect Defense have been used very significantly in other situations as well, such as with Provenance Watcher and Arch Dynamis Lord, but since these are very short battles, we want to see how the difficulty of these fights changes with the ability adjustments above before we make any adjustments to the fight difficulty.

These adjustments have been made in order to reduce performance of certain abilities that were too strong, with a reliance moreso now than ever on certain jobs and abilities in battle strategies. The purpose of the content adjustment along with these ability adjustments is to allow other strategies to be formed so that these events are not impossible. While reflecting on the adjustments in the test server this week, please recognize that balancing the adjustments will continue, and we would appreciate any comments you may have.



Camate's Official Translation

Camate wrote:


Adjustments to Embrava and Perfect Defense

Greetings everyone!

As was previously mentioned, with the addition of the new special abilities as well as the shortening on the cool down timers for the current special abilities, we are planning to adjust the effects of both Embrava and Perfect Defense. The adjustments will be reflected in this week’s Test Server update, but I’d like to share the information with you beforehand.

Embrava:

Effect duration: Currently 5 minutes → Adjusted to 90 seconds
Haste: Currently 1% increase for every 15 enhancing skill points → Adjusted to 1% increase for every 20 enhancing skill points. Maximum of 25% at 500 skill
Regain Effect: While the value will remain unchanged, the Regain effect will be changed to Refresh.

Perfect Defense:

Effect duration: Currently 90 seconds → Adjusted to 30 seconds. +1 sec for every 20 summoning skill points, maximum of 60 seconds with 600 skill (30 seconds +30 seconds)
Effect: No change


Along with the above adjustments, the content that featured these abilities heavily into their strategies will see adjustments as well.

Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey

We'll be reducing the number of Astrariums necessary to exchange for equipment from 25 to 5.
*As a result of this, the number of Astrariums players have in possession will be reduced by 1/5.

The idea that you'll need some luck on your side to reach level 100 will not change. While we expect that the number of floors reachable and the frequency will decrease due to the adjustments to Embrava, we decided to balance this by reducing the number of Astrariums required for equipment.

Legion

Monster HP will be reduced by around 10%

This will be applied to all monsters, and adjusted so the overall pace will become faster making it possible to defeat close to the same amount of monsters as before within the 30 minutes time limit.

Einherjar

Odin's Chamber II: Odin's HP will be reduced by around 10-15%.

As this is different from Legion and only a single monster battle, we will be adjusting the HP on a slightly larger range.


Besides the above content, Perfect Defense and Embrava are utilized for Arch Dynamis Lord and Provenance Watcher; however, the battle times for these monsters are relatively short, so we would like to monitor the battle situation at their current difficulty.

All of these adjustments will be implemented during the Test Server update this week, but we will continue to look at balance and make adjustments as needed.


http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/28187-Adjustments-to-Embrava-and-Pefect-Defense?p=370978#post370978


Edited, Oct 23rd 2012 11:21am by Szabo

Edited, Oct 23rd 2012 3:25pm by Szabo
#2 Oct 23 2012 at 9:28 AM Rating: Excellent
Needs More Smut
Avatar
*****
19,469 posts
holy crap they gave summoning magic skill a reason to exist

A nerf, but not as bad as it could have been.
____________________________
FFXI: Catwho on Bismarck. Once again a top bard on the server: Dardaubla 90 on 1/6/2014
Thayos wrote:
I can't understand anyone who skips the cutscenes of a Final Fantasy game. That's like going to Texas and not getting barbecue.

FFXIV: Katarh Mest on Lamia - Member of The Swarm and the League of Extraordinary Crafters
#3 Oct 23 2012 at 9:52 AM Rating: Good
**
697 posts
Horrible change for SCH taking them from an essential part of many endgame type bosses/events and throwing them under the bus when compared to other mages. Swapping refresh for regain....really? Too much, too far and too bad for us.

SMN nerf not so bad.

Gimping end game bosses is not the direction we should be taking.



____________________________
Shadechaos of Seraph Bismarck
R.I.P. Cindy 2.26.56 - 4.18.13
~She made a difference~
#4 Oct 23 2012 at 10:01 AM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
10,399 posts
NNI adjustment is pretty huge, IMO, and how the Asteria system should've been to begin with.
#5 Oct 23 2012 at 10:59 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
312 posts
Well schs it was nice being invited, back to uselessness. Huge Nerf to the main reason for sch invitation, and also a nerf to Sch stunning due to the duration decrease and inability to cap magic haste now with just embrava + haste.

Also I love how they use 600 smn skill for their example. I don't know a single smn with 600 skill.

Reducing the monsters hp by 10-15% isn't really going to solve the problem because it is only part of the problem. Another major isssue is these NM spamming insanely damaging moves, thus they need to be killed fast with protection. If the NM wasn't doing 1000+ damage AoEs with tons of debuffs maybe players wouldn't have to rely on PD. If everything wasn't a zerg maybe people wouldn't have become so reliant on embrava.
#6 Oct 23 2012 at 11:05 AM Rating: Good
Guru
Avatar
*****
10,399 posts
While 600 is indeed a dumb number to propose since it's not feasible, it does leave me curious about what's down the pipe for Adoulin. Right now, stuff like Enhancing Magic's potencies cap at 500 skill with the only exception being Enspell's MACC. Can we expect more gear with even higher +skill values? A means to +3 stuff like Emp/Relic? It'd certainly give a carrot to chase, and if done closer to Abyssea-style, would leave a lot of people content. But skills and abilities related to them do need some adjustments if that's the direction SE wants to head.
#7 Oct 23 2012 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
weshouldhavethoughtaboutthisbeforeitbecamemainstream wrote:

These adjustments have been made in order to reduce performance of certain abilities that were too strong, with a reliance moreso now than ever on certain jobs and abilities in battle strategies. The purpose of the content adjustment along with these ability adjustments is to allow other strategies to be formed so that these events are not impossible. While reflecting on the adjustments in the test server this week, please recognize that balancing the adjustments will continue, and we would appreciate any comments you may have.


Maybe you should design multiple strategies that are possible first, then when the ones that are too powerful are the only ones used you can discuss with your customers nerfing the way they use your product, then if the customers agree you could possibly implement it.

This is different from designing a product where only one or two possible uses exist, obliterating those uses, then saying it was because there was lots of other uses.

____________________________
Carbuncle


#8 Oct 23 2012 at 11:23 AM Rating: Excellent
**
479 posts
Seriha wrote:
NNI adjustment is pretty huge, IMO, and how the Asteria system should've been to begin with.


Except that it will probably be harder to reach floor 80 w/o Embrava than it was to reach floor 100 with it. And you need to do it 5 times now. Without more adjustments to NNI, floor 100 is pretty much unobtainable.

And SCH is done for most end game events now. This is exactly why I wanted the job to be useful for something other than Embrava because the nerf was inevitable. It might still get invites to NNI and stun duty at other events but that's about it.

SE should increase the duration. 90 seconds is just ridiculous. And with Regain being removed for Refresh (which is useless), it would be great if they finally got around to fixing Aldoquium.
____________________________
Sasaraixx
Tarutaru!
Gilgamesh
BLM 99/SMN 99/RDM 99/SCH 99/WHM 99/BLU 99/DNC 99/NIN 49/WAR 49/THF 46/BRD 41/COR 40/RNG 38/DRK 37/
#9 Oct 23 2012 at 11:35 AM Rating: Excellent
Guru
Avatar
*****
10,399 posts
Eh, while random is random and can bone you at its whim, I'm inclined to believe that people were too quick to fall back to Embrava and write it off as the only way. 100 may very much be rarer and impossible to get now, but even with sh*tty luck, not having to traverse 20 floors in 3-7 random jumps does leave more time to focus on 80 if your group isn't top-tier. Not every floor is a Kill All, after all.

And if it does turn out that nobody hits 100 post-patch, maybe SE will actually insert time extensions related to NM kills or some other interactable, which also should've been there from the start. But I'd also be just as happy with future gear added to the game being better and people never having to set foot in NNI again.
#10 Oct 23 2012 at 11:35 AM Rating: Default
Scholar
****
4,172 posts
Maybe people can finally participate if they dont have a SMN or SCH now. Good times await.
____________________________
[XI] Surivere of Valefor
[XIV] Sir Surian Bedivere of Behemoth
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/2401553/
#11 Oct 23 2012 at 1:47 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
****
9,033 posts
Eh, I think they will need to do more than that for NNI.
____________________________
lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.

clicky
#12 Oct 23 2012 at 1:53 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
KojiroSoma wrote:
Maybe people can finally participate if they dont have a SMN or SCH now. Good times await.


Darn, there goes my SCH burning of NNI. Now I'll have to bring 4 DD's in addition to 2 SCH.Smiley: rolleyes
____________________________
Carbuncle


#13 Oct 23 2012 at 2:28 PM Rating: Excellent
Jack of All Trades
******
28,996 posts
Welp, Embrava's pointless now; you might as well just bring a BRD to HQ Nyzul now if you feel like you need a support class. Why they saw it fit to neuter both the duration AND remove the regain, I have no idea.

PD will still be just as relied on as ever, just that the SMNs will need to have summoning skilled now for the duration to not be trash, basically bringing it in line with the rest of their buff BPs. Depending on the event you might need two SMNs in situations where you otherwise would have only needed one. Other than that, nothing's gonna change in that regard.

Edited, Oct 23rd 2012 4:32pm by Fynlar
#14 Oct 23 2012 at 6:17 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
****
6,222 posts
Seriha wrote:
Eh, while random is random and can bone you at its whim, I'm inclined to believe that people were too quick to fall back to Embrava and write it off as the only way. 100 may very much be rarer and impossible to get now, but even with sh*tty luck, not having to traverse 20 floors in 3-7 random jumps does leave more time to focus on 80 if your group isn't top-tier. Not every floor is a Kill All, after all.

Except you can still overshoot floor 80, which was the major stopping-block (or lack of one, actually) in hitting floor 100 for the longest time.
____________________________
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Airships on fire off the shoulder of Bahamut. I watched Scapula Beams glitter in the dark near the Three Mage Gate...

Nilatai wrote:
Vlorsutes wrote:
There's always...not trolling him?

You're new here, aren't you?
#15 Oct 23 2012 at 7:17 PM Rating: Excellent
***
3,772 posts
Quote:

Except you can still overshoot floor 80, which was the major stopping-block (or lack of one, actually) in hitting floor 100 for the longest time.


That's why you use the stopper feature to prevent your group from going higher than floor 80. Sure your run will end after the floor 80 boss, but with the embrava nerf you won't be making it to floor 100 anyway.

Edited, Oct 23rd 2012 9:18pm by Melphina
____________________________
[ffxisig]56619[/ffxisig]

There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.
#16 Oct 24 2012 at 4:04 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
***
1,633 posts
These 2 abilities were completely and utterly stupid, nerfing these and a few others things are needed if they are serious about carrying on with this game, surprised it took them as long as it did to take action on these (considered they nerfed Widfire and Ukon last year). Perfect defence was one of the worst things they ever added to the game, I know why they added it (AV) but it ended up being the answer to everything.

They better fix the stupid content that was made with these abilities being part of the game with it though.

This shows they plan to actually try to fix the game and make it work as it used to again. Problem of course though is if the players having had all these things (100%dmg mitigation with multiple smns, huge dmg increases with SCH and gil fountains) are now ready to have a real MMO again, where most people are poor most of the time and most players aren't good enough to clear endgame content. The last "ok, fu** this" straw for me was a nerf (Widlfire nerf), same could happen here for a lot of other players.
#17 Oct 24 2012 at 5:01 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
Avatar
****
6,222 posts
Melphina wrote:
Quote:
Except you can still overshoot floor 80, which was the major stopping-block (or lack of one, actually) in hitting floor 100 for the longest time.


That's why you use the stopper feature to prevent your group from going higher than floor 80. Sure your run will end after the floor 80 boss, but with the embrava nerf you won't be making it to floor 100 anyway.

Probably true that you'd drop the stopper to 80 with a now 'normal' run, but consider a floor 100 win would be equivalent to ten floor 80 wins (then again, it was equivalent to 50 before so...)

I just forgot the details that you could set it to a target is all.

Edited, Oct 24th 2012 4:02am by Raelix
____________________________
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Airships on fire off the shoulder of Bahamut. I watched Scapula Beams glitter in the dark near the Three Mage Gate...

Nilatai wrote:
Vlorsutes wrote:
There's always...not trolling him?

You're new here, aren't you?
#18 Oct 24 2012 at 6:46 AM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
Runespider wrote:
These 2 abilities were completely and utterly stupid, nerfing these and a few others things are needed if they are serious about carrying on with this game, surprised it took them as long as it did to take action on these (considered they nerfed Widfire and Ukon last year). Perfect defence was one of the worst things they ever added to the game, I know why they added it (AV) but it ended up being the answer to everything.

They better fix the stupid content that was made with these abilities being part of the game with it though.

This shows they plan to actually try to fix the game and make it work as it used to again. Problem of course though is if the players having had all these things (100%dmg mitigation with multiple smns, huge dmg increases with SCH and gil fountains) are now ready to have a real MMO again, where most people are poor most of the time and most players aren't good enough to clear endgame content. The last "ok, fu** this" straw for me was a nerf (Widlfire nerf), same could happen here for a lot of other players.


The way the game has always worked is that players find an optimal solution to the problem and the sheeple copy them. Penta Spam > MNK burns > Mana & Arrow Burns > TP Burns > Throw more BLMs at it > etc. This imaginary field full of butterflies when you used to walk uphill in the snow 20 miles to get to your exp party never existed.

The only thing nerfs show is that the developer did not properly think about their content before implementing it.

The only thing nerfs accomplish is that they have a high chance of pissing off your loyal customers, thus driving away profits, thus possibly killing (not reviving) the game. I know I'm much more likely to tell potential subscribers that are my friends that this game is now headed the wrong direction rather than the right one.



Edited, Oct 24th 2012 8:49am by TheBarrister
____________________________
Carbuncle


#19 Oct 24 2012 at 7:51 AM Rating: Default
***
2,227 posts
When I see people complain about PD and Emb, I'm reminded of the useless mouth breathers on the news complaining about gay marriage. That the presence of one play style destroys all others. If you don't like playing that way, then don't, but don't complain to mom and dad.
____________________________
[ffxisig]188740[/ffxisig]
Busa's Cloth Guide 1-100
Zaredx wrote:
Gjallihorn + Carnwenhan = Green Ranger's Flute! DRAGONZORD!
#20 Oct 24 2012 at 9:06 AM Rating: Good
Avatar
***
2,644 posts
You can't hit 600 summoning magic skill right now. In fact not even close. I wonder if they are considering another level cap raise for Adoulin...
#21 Oct 24 2012 at 9:26 AM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
7,426 posts
TheBarrister wrote:
Runespider wrote:
These 2 abilities were completely and utterly stupid, nerfing these and a few others things are needed if they are serious about carrying on with this game, surprised it took them as long as it did to take action on these (considered they nerfed Widfire and Ukon last year). Perfect defence was one of the worst things they ever added to the game, I know why they added it (AV) but it ended up being the answer to everything.

They better fix the stupid content that was made with these abilities being part of the game with it though.

This shows they plan to actually try to fix the game and make it work as it used to again. Problem of course though is if the players having had all these things (100%dmg mitigation with multiple smns, huge dmg increases with SCH and gil fountains) are now ready to have a real MMO again, where most people are poor most of the time and most players aren't good enough to clear endgame content. The last "ok, fu** this" straw for me was a nerf (Widlfire nerf), same could happen here for a lot of other players.


The way the game has always worked is that players find an optimal solution to the problem and the sheeple copy them. Penta Spam > MNK burns > Mana & Arrow Burns > TP Burns > Throw more BLMs at it > etc. This imaginary field full of butterflies when you used to walk uphill in the snow 20 miles to get to your exp party never existed.

The only thing nerfs show is that the developer did not properly think about their content before implementing it.

The only thing nerfs accomplish is that they have a high chance of pissing off your loyal customers, thus driving away profits, thus possibly killing (not reviving) the game. I know I'm much more likely to tell potential subscribers that are my friends that this game is now headed the wrong direction rather than the right one.



Edited, Oct 24th 2012 8:49am by TheBarrister


They have always nerfed things that they deem too good. In this case they have done so again. This reminds me of the Bloodweapon nerf that all but destroyed Kclub DRK zergs. Whether the nerf was good or bad remains to be seen. However it now requires the community to develop a new tactic.


Edited, Oct 24th 2012 11:27am by rdmcandie
____________________________
HEY GOOGLE. @#%^ OFF YOU. @#%^ YOUR BULLsh*t SEARCH ENGINE IN ITS @#%^ING sh*tTY BINARY ASS. ALL DAY LONG.

#22 Oct 24 2012 at 10:18 AM Rating: Excellent
**
697 posts
TheBarrister wrote:
This imaginary field full of butterflies when you used to walk uphill in the snow 20 miles to get to your exp party never existed.
[/i]


Obviously you never xp'd at the upper Demon camp in Ul[tab] Range. It was FORTY miles uphill in the snow.
____________________________
Shadechaos of Seraph Bismarck
R.I.P. Cindy 2.26.56 - 4.18.13
~She made a difference~
#23 Oct 24 2012 at 11:07 AM Rating: Excellent
eldelphia wrote:
You can't hit 600 summoning magic skill right now. In fact not even close. I wonder if they are considering another level cap raise for Adoulin...


I think it's probably just to give an example of how it will scale really. Right now I can hit about 521 with gear, merits, and capped skill, and that's excluding only a handful of gear pieces in total. I'm missing 3 from a Summoning Earring (which will probably shoot up in price soon), 2 from a perfectly augmented Aptus Earring, 2 from Ngen Seraweels from the Paramount Botulus in Legion, and 5 from a Kirin's Pole with the max Summoning Magic skill on it (with Byakko's Scraps).
____________________________
Lady Jinte wrote:

Vlorsutes' Negotiation Skill rises 0.2 points
Vlorsutes' Observant Parent Skill rises 0.3 points
Vlorsutes' Argument Diffusing Skill rises 0.1 points


My thoughts and reviews on all sorts of sci-fi stuff...and things.
#24 Oct 24 2012 at 11:41 AM Rating: Excellent
Anterograde Amnesia
ZAM Administrator
Avatar
*****
12,361 posts
Professor Shock Vlorsutes wrote:
eldelphia wrote:
You can't hit 600 summoning magic skill right now. In fact not even close. I wonder if they are considering another level cap raise for Adoulin...


I think it's probably just to give an example of how it will scale really. Right now I can hit about 521 with gear, merits, and capped skill, and that's excluding only a handful of gear pieces in total. I'm missing 3 from a Summoning Earring (which will probably shoot up in price soon), 2 from a perfectly augmented Aptus Earring, 2 from Ngen Seraweels from the Paramount Botulus in Legion, and 5 from a Kirin's Pole with the max Summoning Magic skill on it (with Byakko's Scraps).


Sometimes your posts scare the crap out of me.
____________________________
"Choosy MMO's choose Wint." - Louiscool
The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince the world he didn't exist.
Keyser Soze - Ultros
Guide to Setting Up Mumble on a Raspberry Pi
#25 Oct 24 2012 at 12:31 PM Rating: Good
Sage
Avatar
****
5,243 posts
Camate wrote:

Hello!

As this topic has generated quite a large amount of feedback already, we will be doing our best to collect it all and deliver it to the development team.

I would like to, however, follow-up on a couple of things.

First, there is a question about the cap on summoning skill being 600 being a mistake; however, this is the correct number. While it might not be currently possible to reach this number, the development team set the cap to 600, so consider that there may be room to increase this in the future.

Next, keep in mind that these adjustments to Perfect Defense and Embrava were made with the idea that all special abilities’ cool down timers will be shortened. With that said, during this week’s Test Server update we are also planning on making adjustments so that the cool down timer on current and new special abilities will be halved. (We are also planning to make it possible to cut this time even further via equipment and merit points.)

We understand that these adjustments will change the usage of these abilities and may cause inconvenience to some, and we apologize for this. We would like to proceed with these adjustments carefully, so we will be looking closely at the feedback we receive. Also, we realize that there are a good amount of people who oppose these changes, but we would appreciate it if you could post specific feedback about what would be the preferred method for going about these changes.


http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/28187-Adjustments-to-Embrava-and-Perfect-Defense?p=371824#post371824

Edited, Oct 24th 2012 5:54pm by Szabo
#26 Oct 24 2012 at 12:55 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
RaiseIII wrote:
TheBarrister wrote:
This imaginary field full of butterflies when you used to walk uphill in the snow 20 miles to get to your exp party never existed.
[/i]


Obviously you never xp'd at the upper Demon camp in Ul[tab] Range. It was FORTY miles uphill in the snow.


I certainly did. That was part of how I got my Thief to 75 because I wasn't invited to Arrow and Mana burns. However, I had no delusions that it was a great thing and that it was full of butterflies. It was crap.
____________________________
Carbuncle


#27 Oct 24 2012 at 1:04 PM Rating: Default
**
639 posts
TheBarrister wrote:
RaiseIII wrote:
TheBarrister wrote:
This imaginary field full of butterflies when you used to walk uphill in the snow 20 miles to get to your exp party never existed.
[/i]


Obviously you never xp'd at the upper Demon camp in Ul[tab] Range. It was FORTY miles uphill in the snow.


I certainly did. That was part of how I got my Thief to 75 because I wasn't invited to Arrow and Mana burns. However, I had no delusions that it was a great thing and that it was full of butterflies. It was crap.


That was a fun camp, assuming you made it to camp alive.
#28 Oct 24 2012 at 1:22 PM Rating: Good
Sage
**
742 posts
Something has to give, getting to floor 100 in NNI will be even remotely possible. They're going with Astrariums...not gonna cut it guys.

Does not bode well for mine and all of my friends' waning interest in this game...
____________________________
90PLD/90WAR/90THF/90BLM/90BLU/90BST/90MNK/90WHM
#29 Oct 24 2012 at 2:59 PM Rating: Excellent
Wint wrote:
Professor Shock Vlorsutes wrote:
eldelphia wrote:
You can't hit 600 summoning magic skill right now. In fact not even close. I wonder if they are considering another level cap raise for Adoulin...


I think it's probably just to give an example of how it will scale really. Right now I can hit about 521 with gear, merits, and capped skill, and that's excluding only a handful of gear pieces in total. I'm missing 3 from a Summoning Earring (which will probably shoot up in price soon), 2 from a perfectly augmented Aptus Earring, 2 from Ngen Seraweels from the Paramount Botulus in Legion, and 5 from a Kirin's Pole with the max Summoning Magic skill on it (with Byakko's Scraps).


Sometimes your posts scare the crap out of me.


How? >_>
____________________________
Lady Jinte wrote:

Vlorsutes' Negotiation Skill rises 0.2 points
Vlorsutes' Observant Parent Skill rises 0.3 points
Vlorsutes' Argument Diffusing Skill rises 0.1 points


My thoughts and reviews on all sorts of sci-fi stuff...and things.
#30 Oct 24 2012 at 4:31 PM Rating: Excellent
Jack of All Trades
******
28,996 posts
Quote:
You can't hit 600 summoning magic skill right now. In fact not even close. I wonder if they are considering another level cap raise for Adoulin...


I'm sure they're not. It's a lot like how they said after nerfing Yuly's and Falcorr's TH that they would be able to increase their TH back up by equipping "Pet: Treasure Hunter+" stuff. What people got from that was that they would be introducing pet TH gear, but they were merely using that as an example and never actually had any plans to introduce such gear (which is a move that got them into quite some hot water on their forums)
#31 Oct 24 2012 at 5:16 PM Rating: Excellent
***
2,886 posts
NNI got nerfed pretty hard but it's not as bad as people making it out to be. Instead of 2xSCH your now bringing BRD + SCH. The SCH will perp Haste on everyone along with AoE Regen V while the BRD needs to alternate NT double March's with regular double march's. The BRD will be staying at the pole while the SCH runs around curing people. You'll still have stupid high haste in either case. It's harder but not impossible, definitely a better use of time to farm floor 80 x5 for most groups. NNI has too many "screw you" rolls of the dice as is, so setting the bar lower may be a better long term goal.

Edited, Oct 24th 2012 11:16pm by saevellakshmi
____________________________
RoTZ: Complete DM: O
CoP: Complete AN: O
99 SAM, RDM, BLU, WAR, PLD, DRK

lolgaxe wrote:
Nothing in this game is impossible if you set yourself to the task of actually doing it. Even dumb people can only hold you back for so long.


Lucinus wrote:
when you're hefting something that deadly, you don't miss - mobs get the @#%^ out of the way instead...
#32 Oct 25 2012 at 3:09 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
3,764 posts
Runespider wrote:
These 2 abilities were completely and utterly stupid, nerfing these and a few others things are needed if they are serious about carrying on with this game, surprised it took them as long as it did to take action on these (considered they nerfed Widfire and Ukon last year). Perfect defence was one of the worst things they ever added to the game, I know why they added it (AV) but it ended up being the answer to everything.

They better fix the stupid content that was made with these abilities being part of the game with it though.

This shows they plan to actually try to fix the game and make it work as it used to again. Problem of course though is if the players having had all these things (100%dmg mitigation with multiple smns, huge dmg increases with SCH and gil fountains) are now ready to have a real MMO again, where most people are poor most of the time and most players aren't good enough to clear endgame content. The last "ok, fu** this" straw for me was a nerf (Widlfire nerf), same could happen here for a lot of other players.


When did they nerf wildfire? It was uko's fury and victory smite that they reduced the critical hit rate on, not wildfire from what I remember.
____________________________
Quote:
Maybe if we wait long enough, he'll tell us about how he walked barefoot uphill through snow both ways in Uleregand and defeated the evil Snoll Tzar with nothing but a stack of pebbles. Men were men back then. Mithra were men, too, but they don't talk about that.

Mellowy is awesome, now.
Quote:
I'm sorry. My hoovercraft is full of Summoners. As soon as I claim a thread, they just flood out and cover the whole place. Slippery suckers, those Summoners.
#33 Oct 25 2012 at 7:55 AM Rating: Good
***
3,772 posts
Quote:
Something has to give, getting to floor 100 in NNI will be even remotely possible. They're going with Astrariums...not gonna cut it guys.

Does not bode well for mine and all of my friends' waning interest in this game...


Am I the only one looking forward to the NINI changes? I never bothered with NINI at all until now because I don't have two sch and four elite DD ready to bust their way up to floor 100 with me, nor do any of my friends or I use any of the popular third party hacks that make 100 easier. You act like even WITH all these things floor 100 wins are guaranteed, but they're not. Win ratios may be higher than 20%, but they're not 100% by any means. Call me whatever derogatory name you wish, but I actually LIKE the concept of doing runs and saving progress toward gear. In abyssea you can farm a few seals or +2 items and know your time wasn't wasted. Five gold astarium is a similar feat. It'll take longer than seals or +2, but the gear is friggin awesome, and you'll be getting some +3 gear directly as well which is still pretty sweet and most are great temporary substitutes for the 100 piece in the meantime. I know floor 80 won't be 100% either under the new system, but it'll be more realistic for most people than floor 100 ever was.

Now what S-E needs to do is listen to players and lower mobs offensive stats to a level where they're managable. Quoting Saevellakshmi from the other thread,

Quote:

While I agree with your sentiment, currently no other strategy is viable then killing sh!t as fast as possible while making yourself immune to it's abilities. When the boss monster is equipped with a JP button that instantly kills anyone around it who isn't sporting an Aegis or Ochain with a maxed PDT/MDT set, then the only way to win is to circumvent the damage system (PD / Fanatics).
.
Reducing their HP by 10~15% won't change anything about the fight. It's the offensive power of everything that needs to be lowered.
.
Our HP didn't go up by much, neither did our defensive abilities (outside of PD). NM's on the other hand have had their offensive abilities more then doubled (tripled if you take into account the level differences). It's become a situation where you simply can't survive without beating the system itself.


This is the problem, not the way players have dealt with it. I agree It sucks that embrava took such a huge hit. I never like to see people get the nerf bat, but embrava was totally busted and you know it. Akinori has stated that he plans to rework events where embrava and PD were core strategies and change not only the JA's, but the events as well. If reducing embrava and PD to more reasonable levels means that Legion becomes impossible (which it just may) he will have to fix that blasted mass player one shotting crap. That would be beneficial for everyone, and if S-E actually learns something in the process and remembers not to go over the top in future end game NM stats rather than create even more Legion like offense the game will be a much better place. As Akinori said when he spoke about players utilizing embrava and PD as their sole strategy, "it should never have to come to that in the first place". And it shouldn't. If they fix the mob's offensive power alongside the proposed embrava/PD I think a lot more people will be happy with the game than pissed off.

TLDR version: I like the NINI changes, and I'm also fine with the embrava/PD tweaks so long as they actually fix the unwinnable events as well. If S-E lowers the bar for gear progression to a realistic level players will have more stuff as a whole and be overall happier. I'm looking forward to seeing what he changes next to coincide with the nerfs.

Edited, Oct 25th 2012 9:57am by Melphina
____________________________
[ffxisig]56619[/ffxisig]

There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.
#34 Oct 25 2012 at 8:20 AM Rating: Good
Sage
**
742 posts
Melphina wrote:
Quote:
Something has to give, getting to floor 100 in NNI will be even remotely possible. They're going with Astrariums...not gonna cut it guys.

Does not bode well for mine and all of my friends' waning interest in this game...


Am I the only one looking forward to the NINI changes? I never bothered with NINI at all until now because I don't have two sch and four elite DD ready to bust their way up to floor 100 with me, nor do any of my friends or I use any of the popular third party hacks that make 100 easier. You act like even WITH all these things floor 100 wins are guaranteed, but they're not. Win ratios may be higher than 20%, but they're not 100% by any means. Call me whatever derogatory name you wish, but I actually LIKE the concept of doing runs and saving progress toward gear. In abyssea you can farm a few seals or +2 items and know your time wasn't wasted. Five gold astarium is a similar feat. It'll take longer than seals or +2, but the gear is friggin awesome, and you'll be getting some +3 gear directly as well which is still pretty sweet and most are great temporary substitutes for the 100 piece in the meantime. I know floor 80 won't be 100% either under the new system, but it'll be more realistic for most people than floor 100 ever was.


Perhaps I misspoke a bit. Maybe? I agree, 100% was never guaranteed due to the RNG having so very many opportunities to screw you over in your climb. I also loved the original Nyzul Isle, and never like dthe idea of a 1-100 climb.

With these changes, even with the same setup you mentioned I honestly think it's going to be tougher to hit floor 80 than it was before to hit floor 100, under the current conditions the event has. Then you have to do it 4 more times, provided you actually take down the boss in time. Which was kind of my point.
____________________________
90PLD/90WAR/90THF/90BLM/90BLU/90BST/90MNK/90WHM
#35 Oct 25 2012 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
Under the new system, if you are 100% successful, you will get one piece of gear every 5 days. I think most of the current groups that have been winning will be able to do this, but every now and then (let's say 10% of the time for sake of example) you'll get extremely unlucky, and this is for the most elite groups (4 excellent DD, Brd, Sch). So you're getting 2 pieces of gear every 12 days.

Now let's talk about what this means for the masses of people that haven't really gotten up to the elite level, in terms of group formation or even gear (e.g., not 4 = Rag DRK + Ukon WAR). I assume a generous estimate of 50% win rate for 80 floor. Your gear progression becomes 1 piece of gear every 10 days. So after 150 consecutive days of NNI, you can expect to be done. This is of course after an initial honeymoon period where you learn to interact with your group, let's call that 20 days.

This isn't too bad but it's quite a bit different than completing the content 30 days because you're able to get 3-5 pieces per week.
____________________________
Carbuncle


#36 Oct 25 2012 at 11:42 AM Rating: Good
Guru
Avatar
*****
10,399 posts
Well, that assumes the not-leet group would've even been able to 100 with consistency once they got over their honeymoon. Way I look at it, people should be capping at 80 if they're not confident. If you a hit point where you're hitting 80 a large majority of the time (80%+) with anywhere from 8-15 minutes to spare, you could try shooting for 100 and see what happens. It might not be the most eloquent example of "choose your difficulty" game play out there, but choosing either is by no means permanent. You learn, smart +3 choices may improve you, and you move on.

Though, among other suggestions for NNI tweaks, I would like to see a means for prior gear to upgrade. So, if you do get a +3, through some trial you can eventually get the HQ. I'd rather avoid including Alexandrite in this process, but I'm also feeling it should be a bit more involved than Kill X trials, but also not at like 1500 HMP or even 75 turn-ins for Emp weapons.
#37 Oct 26 2012 at 1:51 PM Rating: Good
Sage
Avatar
****
5,243 posts
Camate wrote:

Greetings everyone.

I have some feedback from the development team to share in regards to all the response we have been receiving about the adjustments to Perfect Defense and Embrava.

Adjustments to Perfect Defense and Embrava

At the current time, we would like to proceed with the changes as stated.

The main idea behind the adjustments and the plan is as Producer Akihiko Matsui has mentioned:
Akhiko Matsui wrote:

For both existing content and content to come in the future, I believe that conditions where special monsters are created for the sole purpose of counteracting Perfect Defense and Embrava is not desirable at all. The main idea behind the adjustments to Perfect Defense and Embrava is to correct the situation so it will not come to this.

As a result we would like to make it so summoner and scholar can widen their range of play and usefulness via other elements. We understand that these adjustments might be somewhat of an inconvenience, but we appreciate your understanding.


In other words, currently we have been giving consideration towards Perfect Defense and Embrava when making adjustments to content and monster strength. Likewise we have had to scale back new equipment stats and abilities for other jobs for the same reason.

In the event that we were to continue at this pace, content and monsters would be created where the effects of Perfect Defense and Embrava would be ineffective, so in order to redraw the standard values for content and equipment we will be making these adjustments.

We apologize for how late these adjustments are being made.

Nyzul Isle Uncharted Area Survey Adjustments

The reduction in the amount of Astrarium needed is a boon for reaching each of the main floors, but in addition to this we will be making the below adjustments in order to increase the chances of reaching these floors.
*These adjustments have yet to be implemented on the Test Server


Increase the cap value for warping to ??? floor

When randomly warping, the highest value will be increase from 9 to 11, and the average amount of floors that need to be clear in order to reach floor 100 will be reduced.

Adjustments to lamp response speed

In order to prevent any impediments to the time attack element, we will be reducing the wait time.

- After “same time” lamps have been operated, the wait time until they can be checked again will be reduced from 30 seconds to 15 seconds.
- The time until “order” lamps judge the correct answer will be reduced from 12 seconds to 7 seconds.

Astraria adjustments
Currently, the below changes have been made on the Test Server:

 
Astraria in Possession  Astraria in Possession 
Before Implementation  After Implementation

 
0~4	→	0 
5~9	→	1 
10~14	→	2 
15~19	→	3 
20~24	→	4 
25	→	5



We will next be changing it to the below:

 
Astraria in Possession  Astraria in Possession 
Before Implementation  After Implementation

 
0      →	0 
1~6	→	1 
7~12	→	2 
13~18	→	3 
19~24	→	4 
25	→	5


Changes to jobs that can equip Powder Boots

As an experiment, we will be making this item equippable by all jobs.
*This adjustment is not reflected in today’s Test Server update.

Legion and Einherjar adjustments

With the adjustments to Embrava and the scaling back of its boons to offensive capabilities, it will take longer to defeat enemies. In regards to Perfect Defense, with the effect duration reduction, it's important to defeat enemies quickly.

We are closing the gap of the increased time variation by reducing an enemy's HP.

We know that there are a variety of reasons as to why enemies need to be defeated in a shorter amount of time, and it varies by monster and content, and we believe it's very important to look into all of these individually.

While there were many comments touching on this, we would like to keep this separate from the feedback regarding Perfect Defense and Embrava. (Please know we are not ignoring your suggestions, we just need to look into them one by one based on

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/28187-Adjustments-to-Embrava-and-Perfect-Defense?p=372952#post372952

Edited, Oct 26th 2012 4:18pm by Szabo
#38 Oct 26 2012 at 2:17 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,248 posts
Quote:
Increase the cap value for warping to ??? floor

When randomly warping, the highest value will be increase from 9 to 11, and the average amount of floors that need to be clear in order to reach floor 100 will be reduced.

Adjustments to lamp response speed

In order to prevent any impediments to the time attack element, we will be reducing the wait time.

- After “same time” lamps have been operated, the wait time until they can be checked again will be reduced from 30 seconds to 15 seconds.
- The time until “order” lamps judge the correct answer will be reduced from 12 seconds to 7 seconds.


This at least looks promising for the NNI compensation. I was just about to start seeing if I could merc some gear. I am hoping I will still be able to do that after the update.
#39 Oct 26 2012 at 6:44 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
****
9,033 posts
It seems like they are considering the implications of weakening these two abilities, and frankly, I am happy to see them talk about reducing recast times on abilities overall. It might make for some slightly twichy-er gameplay. I'd like them to add macro-able gear sets directly into the game so that macros could be less hellish. It wouldn't allow for botting/scripting in terms of actions to allow us to make an alias for a gear set and refer that in /equip calls.
____________________________
lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.

clicky
#40 Oct 26 2012 at 9:20 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
7,426 posts
Nice gotta get me some powder boots.
____________________________
HEY GOOGLE. @#%^ OFF YOU. @#%^ YOUR BULLsh*t SEARCH ENGINE IN ITS @#%^ING sh*tTY BINARY ASS. ALL DAY LONG.

#41 Oct 26 2012 at 11:05 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
****
4,864 posts
rdmcandie wrote:
Nice gotta get me some powder boots.


Buy them now.

You'll thank me later
____________________________
Carbuncle


#42 Oct 29 2012 at 8:29 AM Rating: Good
Sage
**
742 posts
rdmcandie wrote:
Nice gotta get me some powder boots.

I'm seeing my favorite market item about to explode in popularity.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
____________________________
90PLD/90WAR/90THF/90BLM/90BLU/90BST/90MNK/90WHM
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 104 All times are in CDT
Camiie, Meldi, Tahlreth, Anonymous Guests (101)